Comparison of Quiet PC's & US Vendors of Quiet PC's

[Jim Mitchell]

Can anyone recommend a source that compares vendor's PC's including
ISO 9296 ratings at the operator position? I've found that Dell has
those ratings available, but buries them in its website machine by
machine.
http://www.dell.com/us/en/gen/corporate/vision_datasheets_environ.htm

I'd hope that someone has gathered the data not only from Dell, but
other manufacturers (or measured it themselves I suppose) so that
those of us not wishing to assemble a machine from scratch could
include sound level as part of the purchase criteria.


Related Question:
Does anyone have a list of vendors who will assemble a quiet PC for
the US Market. I've identified only the following so far. Their
websites don't give any actual numbers on what they mean by "quiet"

ARM Systems - http://www.armsystems.com/html/stealth_quiet_or_silent_pc.html
Directron - http://www.directron.com/silence.html


Jim Mitchell - Philadelphia, PA USA

[Jason McClelland]

"Jim Mitchell" > wrote in message
om...


Central Computers http://www.centralcomputers.com which is near me also
assembles "qiuet" DAWs for a pretty decent price, you could content them to
see what they mean by quiet,

Good luck!

~j

[Josh Snider]

in article , Jim Mitchell at
wrote on 9/14/03 09.24:

> Can anyone recommend a source that compares vendor's PC's including
> ISO 9296 ratings at the operator position? I've found that Dell has
> those ratings available, but buries them in its website machine by
> machine.
> http://www.dell.com/us/en/gen/corporate/vision_datasheets_environ.htm
>
> I'd hope that someone has gathered the data not only from Dell, but
> other manufacturers (or measured it themselves I suppose) so that
> those of us not wishing to assemble a machine from scratch could
> include sound level as part of the purchase criteria.
>
>
> Related Question:
> Does anyone have a list of vendors who will assemble a quiet PC for
> the US Market. I've identified only the following so far. Their
> websites don't give any actual numbers on what they mean by "quiet"
>
> ARM Systems - http://www.armsystems.com/html/stealth_quiet_or_silent_pc.html
> Directron - http://www.directron.com/silence.html
>
>
> Jim Mitchell - Philadelphia, PA USA


IMO, why would you worry about the spec on the PC for noise as a selling
point? I buy the computer I want, based on the speed/features that I need,
then spend an extra $250 and build myself an Iso box to put it in.

Size? Not an issue, I live in a very small room for my studio. I mean,
very small. And my box is sufficient for a bunch of rack gear and external
drives as well. Without taking up to much room.

Cost? An extra couple hundred bucks for materials, and you get a custom
built box that (quite frankly) is quieter then most commercial boxes I've
seen.

Skill? Its a box. A few hours of work with some basic woodworking skills
and a trip to Home Despot and anyone can do it. Its even a simple job to
set a piece of lexan in the door. Looks pretty too.

The plus is you can design a cabinet however you want with shelves, rack
spaces, castors, cable ports, power supply, lighting etc... And kill two
birds with one stone. Get all of your gear (and whatever else you want to
design into it) into a box, clean up your space, and have a pretty much
completely silent system. The only limit on the design is, really, your
imagination.

Buy the system you want. Don¹t limit yourself to a "quiet" pc. Then
soundproof it. And you get a nice cabinet to put things in as well.

But that¹s just IMO

J

--
josh.snider
cave.productions
416.524.6927

[nicholas yu]

Josh Snider > wrote in message >...
> > Can anyone recommend a source that compares vendor's PC's including
> > ISO 9296 ratings at the operator position? I've found that Dell has
> > those ratings available, but buries them in its website machine by
> > machine.
> > http://www.dell.com/us/en/gen/corporate/vision_datasheets_environ.htm
> >
> > I'd hope that someone has gathered the data not only from Dell, but
> > other manufacturers (or measured it themselves I suppose) so that
> > those of us not wishing to assemble a machine from scratch could
> > include sound level as part of the purchase criteria.
>
> IMO, why would you worry about the spec on the PC for noise as a selling
> point? I buy the computer I want, based on the speed/features that I need,
> then spend an extra $250 and build myself an Iso box to put it in.

hi Jim, i've thought about this problem a lot. i've come to the same
conclusion, that it makes more sense to not worry about a "quiet" PC,
rather worry about a powerful PC and then build an isolation box
later. it seems that decrease in SPL that a quiet PC can give you, is
much less impresssive than what a tightly built isolation box can give
you.

one additional advantage that i'd like that add, is that if you build
a separate isolation box, when you upgrade to a faster machine, which
will inevitably happen, you can put it in the old isolation box (of
course, removing the old computer)

[Josh Snider]

> Lots of people here can't solder much less make a square box, and they
> want plans for everything. Why don't you write an article for one of
> the trade magazines on how to build a silencer box? It would be
> welcome.

I'm just a lowly working-class engineer. Which mag would want to hear from
me?

What I might do however is post the plans and method here. But Like I said
imagination is the only limit, it could be built so many ways for so many
needs... Perhaps I'll post it here and see how it's received. Maybe I
could sell the article for a few bucks... *g*


J

[Steve L.]

http://www.studiocat.com/daw.htm
http://www.liquiddaw.com

Jim Roseberry is at Studiocat and Scott Reams is at LiquidDaw.
They both make turnkey DAWs that are quiet and fast.
Scott also has a consultation service if you want to go it alone.

"Jim Mitchell" > wrote in message om...
| Can anyone recommend a source that compares vendor's PC's including
| ISO 9296 ratings at the operator position? I've found that Dell has
| those ratings available, but buries them in its website machine by
| machine.
| http://www.dell.com/us/en/gen/corporate/vision_datasheets_environ.htm
|
| I'd hope that someone has gathered the data not only from Dell, but
| other manufacturers (or measured it themselves I suppose) so that
| those of us not wishing to assemble a machine from scratch could
| include sound level as part of the purchase criteria.
|
|
| Related Question:
| Does anyone have a list of vendors who will assemble a quiet PC for
| the US Market. I've identified only the following so far. Their
| websites don't give any actual numbers on what they mean by "quiet"
|
| ARM Systems - http://www.armsystems.com/html/stealth_quiet_or_silent_pc.html
| Directron - http://www.directron.com/silence.html
|
|
| Jim Mitchell - Philadelphia, PA USA

[Dudleys100]

I am curious about the box you have made. How big is it and how do
you possition your racks within? What materials do you use? IS there
a website with a DIY model? Please fill us in. Thanks. ken

[Mike Rivers]

Josh Snider > wrote in message >...

> I'm just a lowly working-class engineer. Which mag would want to hear from
> me?

I'm sure that Recording (several of us rec.audio.pro regulars write
for them) would be happy to publish it. But to be honest, I've
suggested this a few times over the past couple of years to people
who, like you, have said "it's easy" and nobody has come up with an
article yet.

To write an acceptable article, you need to do more than say "just
build a box about this size out of whatever material you have."
Decide on a good size and shape that will accoommodate a modern
computer (Remember that a lot of people are using the server-sized
cases which are a little too big to fit into the computer desks of 5
years ago - I know. I have one of each.) You need to come up with a
plan for cutting up a 4x8 sheet of material and specify the material.
You need to show how to make strong joints in the corners, how to vent
it, and how to make a door (or what to buy) and how to seal it so that
it's accessable.

[woolfy]

Dudleys100 wrote:
> I am curious about the box you have made. How big is it and how do
> you possition your racks within? What materials do you use? IS there
> a website with a DIY model? Please fill us in. Thanks. ken

The Quiet PC people do a box for this purpose....

http://www.quietpc.com/uk/cabinets.php

It ain't the cheapest thing on the market mind.

[Martin]

http://www.shortyshortfilms.com/photos/Tardis/

http://www.carsten-buschmann.de/indexe.htm

Martin

[SoundNgin]

>I'll try and write one this week and post it here for review and
>suggestions.
>I'd be happy to have it published if people find it useful.
>

Very good subject. I so far built a couple of open eguipment racks and now I am
working on a work station desk. All is made from birch 3/4 inch ply, oak 3/4
inch ply, and all solid hardwood trimmed. It a little work planning, building
and finishing but they came out beutiful. It look professional and custum. I
highly recommend poeple do it not only to save a lot of money but for a great
look. I love it.

Do the article, it will be surely appreciated by many!!!! Including me. I'm
headed out to the garage right now to continue working on that desk.

Ron

[DK]

I've been wrestling with this same topic for a long time too. I need
to get a seperate system to run GigaStudio. From all that I've read
and experienced, it would seem that the noise issue isn't just a
problem from an editing perspective. But the various fans and motors
inside the case pollute the audio signal while recording (unless of
course you are using an external audio interface.) By choosing a
fanless mobo and video card and quiet hard drives the noise floor
(without any audio signal) should be about 30dB quieter, if my math is
right.

- Dave K.

> IMO, why would you worry about the spec on the PC for noise as a selling
> point? I buy the computer I want, based on the speed/features that I need,
> then spend an extra $250 and build myself an Iso box to put it in.
>
> Size? Not an issue, I live in a very small room for my studio. I mean,
> very small. And my box is sufficient for a bunch of rack gear and external
> drives as well. Without taking up to much room.
>
> Cost? An extra couple hundred bucks for materials, and you get a custom
> built box that (quite frankly) is quieter then most commercial boxes I've
> seen.
>
> Skill? Its a box. A few hours of work with some basic woodworking skills
> and a trip to Home Despot and anyone can do it. Its even a simple job to
> set a piece of lexan in the door. Looks pretty too.
>
> The plus is you can design a cabinet however you want with shelves, rack
> spaces, castors, cable ports, power supply, lighting etc... And kill two
> birds with one stone. Get all of your gear (and whatever else you want to
> design into it) into a box, clean up your space, and have a pretty much
> completely silent system. The only limit on the design is, really, your
> imagination.
>
> Buy the system you want. Don1t limit yourself to a "quiet" pc. Then
> soundproof it. And you get a nice cabinet to put things in as well.
>
> But that1s just IMO
>
> J

[luk]

"Martin" > wrote in message >...
> http://www.shortyshortfilms.com/photos/Tardis/
>
> http://www.carsten-buschmann.de/indexe.htm
>
> Martin

Hi all,

another angle to all this is to use the remote desktop feature build
into XP.
One could use a cheap laptop (only renders remote screens) and a
wireless conneciton to your battery of remote gigastations. Done. No
noise.

ellle

[Brian Takei]

Mike Rivers ) wrote:
>
> In article > writes:
>
> > another angle to all this is to use the remote desktop feature build
> > into XP.
> > One could use a cheap laptop (only renders remote screens) and a
> > wireless conneciton to your battery of remote gigastations. Done. No
> > noise.
>
> I don't understand what you're describing here, but it sounds
> interesting. I've never heard of the remote desktop feature. What does
> it do and how is it accessed?

Are you familiar with PC Anywhere and the like? Remote Desktop is the
same sort of remote-control kind of thing, built-in to XP. You'll find
it at Programs>Accessories>Comm>Remote Desktop (aka. mstsc.exe, aka.
Terminal Services Client), which is the client program run on the
'controlling' computer. You also need to permit Remote Desktop access
to the to-be-controlled computer, under its System Properties' Remote
tab.

It can be pretty useful, but I've never used it for much DAW work. I
just run KVM cable to the closet switch, which just plain works with no
processing overhead for the boxes, and certainly cheaper than the
cheapest laptop, and more reliable than the most expensive desktop.
I've contrived DAW applications where I might use/try it (e.g. doing
sessions 'downstairs'), but they just haven't actually come up yet.

Ellle, have you used Remote Desktop for long DAW sessions, and if so,
have you ever had any problems/glitches with it?

- Brian

[Analogeezer]

Brian Takei > wrote in message >...
> Mike Rivers ) wrote:
> >
> > In article > writes:
> >
> > > another angle to all this is to use the remote desktop feature build
> > > into XP.
> > > One could use a cheap laptop (only renders remote screens) and a
> > > wireless conneciton to your battery of remote gigastations. Done. No
> > > noise.
> >
> > I don't understand what you're describing here, but it sounds
> > interesting. I've never heard of the remote desktop feature. What does
> > it do and how is it accessed?
>
> Are you familiar with PC Anywhere and the like? Remote Desktop is the
> same sort of remote-control kind of thing, built-in to XP. You'll find
> it at Programs>Accessories>Comm>Remote Desktop (aka. mstsc.exe, aka.
> Terminal Services Client), which is the client program run on the
> 'controlling' computer. You also need to permit Remote Desktop access
> to the to-be-controlled computer, under its System Properties' Remote
> tab.
>
> It can be pretty useful, but I've never used it for much DAW work. I
> just run KVM cable to the closet switch, which just plain works with no
> processing overhead for the boxes, and certainly cheaper than the
> cheapest laptop, and more reliable than the most expensive desktop.
> I've contrived DAW applications where I might use/try it (e.g. doing
> sessions 'downstairs'), but they just haven't actually come up yet.
>
> Ellle, have you used Remote Desktop for long DAW sessions, and if so,
> have you ever had any problems/glitches with it?
>
> - Brian

Yeah I totally agree, I use a $159 KVM extender and it is extremely
easy to setup and use.

My unit has a range of up to 500 feet but I have the CPU about 30 feet
away.

I'm not totally sure about this but I believe your noise would fall
off as the square of the distance away from the CPU so distance is
your friend.

A KVM extender is a lot easier and simpler than building a box....I
hate woodworking. I've made a bunch of racks and speaker cabs over the
years but by the time you add up your materials, multiple trips to the
hardware store and your own labor it's really not very cost effective
(well compared to spending $1200 on a stupid iso box it is).

Most of my friends in building construction are missing parts of
fingers from getting them stuck in saws and planers....did I say I
hate building ****?

Analogeezer

[Mike Rivers]

In article > writes:

> Are you familiar with PC Anywhere and the like? Remote Desktop is the
> same sort of remote-control kind of thing, built-in to XP. You'll find
> it at Programs>Accessories>Comm>Remote Desktop

Gee, I wonder what other interesting stuff there might be on here that
I've never heard of. I only have one computer with XP on it so I guess
it doesn't do me any good yet, but it's nice to know that it's there.

I think the context of this thread is that you could use it to control
a noisy DAW computer in a closet somewhere with a quieter computer in
the control room. But still, you have a computer in the control room,
and if you can build the controller quiet, you probably could build
the DAW just as quiet.

I believe a laptop was suggested. My laptop has an annoying fan that
goes on and off and on and off.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

[Mike Rivers]

In article > writes:

> XP Remote Desktop requires an XP Pro host computer with the feature enabled.
> A userid on the host must be created for the remote client user.

> The client can be running any flavor of XP, 2000, Win98, and Win95. The two
> machines are interconnected via normal networking.

I took a quick look at it on the XP computer, but I couldn't tell if
that was to set up the computer as a host or if it was the client,
looking for a computer it could control.

The other computer on the network is running Win2000 and I didn't find
a similar program under Programs/Accessories/Communications.

I wish these things came with instructions.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

[Mike Rivers]

In article > writes:

> Yeah I totally agree, I use a $159 KVM extender and it is extremely
> easy to setup and use.
>
> My unit has a range of up to 500 feet but I have the CPU about 30 feet
> away.

> A KVM extender is a lot easier and simpler than building a box....

I agree, but the fallicy is that you HAVE to build a box or extend the
cables (or live with the mechanical noise). One more thing on my list
of "things they forgot" that we have to do ourselves.

Another consideration when moving a computer out of earshot is with
the audio connections. Running analog cables 50 feet or more is no
problem, but you can't do that reliably with TOSLink optical cables,
and 24 channels of AES/EBU I/O is often more expensive than what it is
that you're connecting.

I guess that the compromise that most people are accepting is to move
the noisemaker within 10 meters of the interface and do the best you
can, maybe gaining a couple more meters by putting the computer I/O
box as far away as its cable will allow. But that makes for a pretty
scattered "tape machine."




--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

[Arny Krueger]

"Mike Rivers" > wrote in message
news:znr1064371052k@trad...
>
> In article >
writes:
>
> > Are you familiar with PC Anywhere and the like? Remote Desktop is the
> > same sort of remote-control kind of thing, built-in to XP. You'll find
> > it at Programs>Accessories>Comm>Remote Desktop
>
> Gee, I wonder what other interesting stuff there might be on here that
> I've never heard of. I only have one computer with XP on it so I guess
> it doesn't do me any good yet, but it's nice to know that it's there.
>
> I think the context of this thread is that you could use it to control
> a noisy DAW computer in a closet somewhere with a quieter computer in
> the control room. But still, you have a computer in the control room,
> and if you can build the controller quiet, you probably could build
> the DAW just as quiet.
>
> I believe a laptop was suggested. My laptop has an annoying fan that
> goes on and off and on and off.

The computer power requirements of the client computer are pretty minimal. A
old-tech laptop or an low-end ITX-based desktop could do the job.

[Analogeezer]

(Mike Rivers) wrote in message news:<znr1064404788k@trad>...
> In article > writes:
>
> > Yeah I totally agree, I use a $159 KVM extender and it is extremely
> > easy to setup and use.
> >
> > My unit has a range of up to 500 feet but I have the CPU about 30 feet
> > away.
>
> > A KVM extender is a lot easier and simpler than building a box....
>
> I agree, but the fallicy is that you HAVE to build a box or extend the
> cables (or live with the mechanical noise). One more thing on my list
> of "things they forgot" that we have to do ourselves.
>
> Another consideration when moving a computer out of earshot is with
> the audio connections. Running analog cables 50 feet or more is no
> problem, but you can't do that reliably with TOSLink optical cables,
> and 24 channels of AES/EBU I/O is often more expensive than what it is
> that you're connecting.
>
> I guess that the compromise that most people are accepting is to move
> the noisemaker within 10 meters of the interface and do the best you
> can, maybe gaining a couple more meters by putting the computer I/O
> box as far away as its cable will allow. But that makes for a pretty
> scattered "tape machine."

Actually what I do is have the CPU in the corner, and then a long
cable to the rack unit for the audio interface. That puts the rack and
audio patching right in my patch bay.

I figure getting a quiet computer (or making yours more quiet) and
getting it 20 feet away gets rid of enough noise for more
environments. I need a giant Iso box for my HVAC frankly <g>

Analogeezer

[Arny Krueger]

"Analogeezer" > wrote in message
om...
> (Mike Rivers) wrote in message
news:<znr1064404788k@trad>...
> > In article >
writes:
> >
> > > Yeah I totally agree, I use a $159 KVM extender and it is extremely
> > > easy to setup and use.
> > >
> > > My unit has a range of up to 500 feet but I have the CPU about 30 feet
> > > away.
> >
> > > A KVM extender is a lot easier and simpler than building a box....

> > I agree, but the fallicy is that you HAVE to build a box or extend the
> > cables (or live with the mechanical noise). One more thing on my list
> > of "things they forgot" that we have to do ourselves.

I've fought the quiet PC battle lots, and find that KVM and other extension
cables are the simplest, most effective, cost-effective way to go.

> > Another consideration when moving a computer out of earshot is with
> > the audio connections. Running analog cables 50 feet or more is no
> > problem, but you can't do that reliably with TOSLink optical cables...

Plan B: a pair of coax/toslink converters and coax to suit

Plan C: a pair of coax/toslink converters as signal regenerators and more
Toslink.