How to record a tambourine?

[Kevin_Darbro]

Hey there. I searched the RAP archives, and didn't find so much on
this topic, so I'm asking for your help.

I'm working on a song with my neighbor, and there's a couple of times
in the song that we want to have a tambourine part. We recorded it
"for placement only" with the Nady Tube Mic we were using for vocals,
but it doesn't sound crisp.

The part is going "shika shika PAP! shika shika PAP!" with the PAP!
being the tambourine hit on the palm, and the shika being shakes of
the tambourine. The hastily recorded "for idea's sake" tamb part is
functional at best, but I know we can get a better recording of it
with some suggestions from you folks.

Here's what we have at our disposal:

Sure SM57's (lots)
Oktava MC 012 (cardioid, hypercardioid, omni)
Nakamichi C-100 (cardioid, omni)
Nady Tube mic (don't remember the model - inexpensive)
Steadman C-15

Going into eMagic Logic 5 through a Mackie 1604 VLZ and an M audio
Delta 1010 with an RNC patched in there for good measure.

Any hints on placement and mic choices? We were recording the part in
the vocal booth (closet full of clothes, blankets and towels), but I'm
wondering if recording it in the "live room" (just in front of my
door) would be better. I'm also wondering if stereo recording would
be in order. How far away, and where do you recommend I capture the
best sound I can with the tools I have?

Thank you for your wisdom.

- Mr. Tambourine Man

[John Noll]

Kevin_Darbro wrote:
>
> I'm working on a song with my neighbor, and there's a couple of times
> in the song that we want to have a tambourine part. We recorded it
> "for placement only" with the Nady Tube Mic we were using for vocals,
> but it doesn't sound crisp.

> Any hints on placement and mic choices? We were recording the part in
> the vocal booth (closet full of clothes, blankets and towels), but I'm
> wondering if recording it in the "live room" (just in front of my
> door) would be better. I'm also wondering if stereo recording would
> be in order. How far away, and where do you recommend I capture the
> best sound I can with the tools I have?


> - Mr. Tambourine Man


Mr. T,

Definitely get some room sound in there. Move back about 3-6 feet. Use a
small dyaphram (sp?) condenser. Be conservative with levels. Those
transients might be 5-10 db hotter than your meters are showing.
--
--
John Noll
Retromedia Sound Studios
Red Bank, NJ 07701

Phone: 732-842-3853 Fax: 732-842-5631

http://www.retromedia.net

[Justin Ulysses Morse]

My best advice is to leave the tambourine part out of the recording.
That's the best way to clean up a mix I know of.

Barring that, try this: Use the Oktava MC012 at a distance of maybe 5
feet. Record it without compression or any such thing. Most any meter
will lie to you about the level you're getting so you have to watch
your peaks. After it's recorded, use a HP filter to cut off everything
below about 500Hz, and depending on the tambourine you may need to suck
out some midrange and/or jack up the high end. But the most important
thing is to turn the tambourine track down about 15dB quieter than you
think it should be. I know I sound like an anti-tambourine poop but I
have been less-so since I learned how to put it in the mix where it
belongs, which is way down there. A little goes a long way.

ulysses


In article >,
Kevin_Darbro > wrote:

> Hey there. I searched the RAP archives, and didn't find so much on
> this topic, so I'm asking for your help.
>
> I'm working on a song with my neighbor, and there's a couple of times
> in the song that we want to have a tambourine part. We recorded it
> "for placement only" with the Nady Tube Mic we were using for vocals,
> but it doesn't sound crisp.
>
> The part is going "shika shika PAP! shika shika PAP!" with the PAP!
> being the tambourine hit on the palm, and the shika being shakes of
> the tambourine. The hastily recorded "for idea's sake" tamb part is
> functional at best, but I know we can get a better recording of it
> with some suggestions from you folks.
>
> Here's what we have at our disposal:
>
> Sure SM57's (lots)
> Oktava MC 012 (cardioid, hypercardioid, omni)
> Nakamichi C-100 (cardioid, omni)
> Nady Tube mic (don't remember the model - inexpensive)
> Steadman C-15
>
> Going into eMagic Logic 5 through a Mackie 1604 VLZ and an M audio
> Delta 1010 with an RNC patched in there for good measure.
>
> Any hints on placement and mic choices? We were recording the part in
> the vocal booth (closet full of clothes, blankets and towels), but I'm
> wondering if recording it in the "live room" (just in front of my
> door) would be better. I'm also wondering if stereo recording would
> be in order. How far away, and where do you recommend I capture the
> best sound I can with the tools I have?
>
> Thank you for your wisdom.
>
> - Mr. Tambourine Man

[Wayne]

>Any hints on placement and mic choices? We were recording the part in
>the vocal booth (closet full of clothes, blankets and towels), but I'm
>wondering if recording it in the "live room" (just in front of my
>door) would be better. I'm also wondering if stereo recording would
>be in order. How far away, and where do you recommend I capture the
>best sound I can with the tools I have?
>
>Thank you for your wisdom.
>
>- Mr. Tambourine Man
>
>

I seem to have more success with dynamic mics than SD condensers. I'd use an
SM57, 4-5 feet away, use ears for levels(not meters), no compression and record
in the larger room. That thing needs some air around it.

Play around the mechanics. Try a stick on the skin, etc. Keep at it unitl you
find what you're hearing in your head. If that doesn't work, get a new head.
<gr>

Wayne

[Jeffrey Landgraf]

"Kevin_Darbro" > wrote in message
om...
> Hey there. I searched the RAP archives, and didn't find so much on
> this topic, so I'm asking for your help.
>
> I'm working on a song with my neighbor, and there's a couple of times
> in the song that we want to have a tambourine part. We recorded it
> "for placement only" with the Nady Tube Mic we were using for vocals,
> but it doesn't sound crisp.
>
>
> Sure SM57's (lots)
> Oktava MC 012 (cardioid, hypercardioid, omni)
> Nakamichi C-100 (cardioid, omni)
> Nady Tube mic (don't remember the model - inexpensive)
> Steadman C-15
>
>
> - Mr. Tambourine Man

I once recorded a tambourine and had the player stand in the shower stall
with the glass door open. I used a small diaphragm mic (AKG C451 with
cardioid capsule) at about 4-5 feet outside the stall. No compression, no
EQ. It sounded absolutely great! Use the Octava.

Jeff

[Kevin_Darbro]

Thanks everyone for your help. Will take your suggestions into effect
next weekend when we have some time.

I'll put up both a 57 and the Oktava and go from there.

As for the inclusion of the tambourine, it's the first time I've ever
worked on a song that felt like it could use it, and I'll be careful
not to have it too high in the mix. (as it is right now with the rough
mix)

Thanks again and best regards,

- Kevin

[Charles Thomas]

In article >,
Justin Ulysses Morse > wrote:

> Record it without compression or any such thing.

> After it's recorded, use a HP filter to cut off everything
> below about 500Hz

> depending on the tambourine you may need to suck
> out some midrange and/or jack up the high end.

> turn the tambourine track down about 15dB quieter than you
> think it should be.


These four things are exactly what I would have written. Do this and
you won't go far wrong. #4 is especially insightful. In most pop/rock
music tambourines are almost subliminal in a mix. They add a certain
energy and momentum to parts, but shouldn't ever draw attention to
themselves.

The only other thing I would have mentioned is that cheap preamps (in
your mixer) can make a tambourine sound crappy. I think it's the huge
dynamic range they use up between the "shicka"s and the "PAP"s. I
noticed a huge improvement in tambourine sound when I bought a
stand-alone mic preamp. Until then the "PAP"s always sounded flattened
and not crisp.


CT

[James Boyk]

We have in my lab a thing vaguely like a tambourine, without the drumhead (makes
it not at ALL like a tamb., eh?) but with the little pairs of 'cymbals' all
around. Do regular tambourines have the mini-cymbals? If so, this is EXTREMELY
difficult to record. It needs a very good mike and a superb mike preamp. The
best preamp we've tried in 20 years does an OK, not great, job of it (where
we're comparing live with direct-feed from one room to an adjacenet room with no
recording).


Not being familiar w/ your equipment, I can't recommend; but if you really want
to capture this instrument, don't expect it to be easy, and maybe rent the very
best gear you can afford.


James Boyk

[John Cafarella]

"Harvey Gerst" > wrote in message
...
> You had Jack Ashford in your place? Omygod!! He rocks beyond belief.
After
> watching "Standing In The Shadow Of Motown", I had to add Jack Ashford to
my
> list of amazing musicians. That guy makes tambourine a solo instrument.

> Harvey Gerst
> Indian Trail Recording Studio

Until I saw the movie I never knew that tambourine could be played like
that. I was gobsmacked with the way the tamb helped lock the groove down.

--
John Cafarella
EOR Studio
Melbourne Australia
[ cafarellaj at powertel dot com dot au ]

[Kurt Albershardt]

Kevin_Darbro wrote:
> Thanks everyone for your help. Will take your suggestions into effect
> next weekend when we have some time.
>
> I'll put up both a 57 and the Oktava and go from there.


And do see if you can borrow a better preamp. Those transients take a
very capable preamp to capture without crushing.

[t fitzgerald]

Having a couple tamborines to try is nice too. I have been using an
older Ludwig tambo with a head and it sounds great in a mix. I have been
turning it up in my mixes lately. A little compression has been good
for me depending on the player.

Todd Fitzgerald
Chief Engineer
OarFin Studios Minneapolis
www.oarfinrecords.com

[Laurence Payne]

>I'm working on a song with my neighbor, and there's a couple of times
>in the song that we want to have a tambourine part. We recorded it
>"for placement only" with the Nady Tube Mic we were using for vocals,
>but it doesn't sound crisp.
>

Stand back from the mic.
Don't record too hot.

Most important, play it well. It's not as easy as it may look.

[PVP9847]

check out the Monkees tune "Valerie" - could possibly be the loudest tambourine
on record

[Roger W. Norman]

You're going to hate this, so I'm not going to tell you! <g>

Actually, why not just slap up a few mics in different positions and try
them all on one pass. Pick the best, mix the two best, whatever. The idea
being that the technique isn't as memorable if you get it from somewhere
else. It stays with you a lot longer if you have to hunt for it. A
technique someone else suggests just becomes a bit of data that probably
won't present itself again when you need it. Or at least not as readily as
something you discovered on your own.

Besides, there's **** we can't hear, like what the room sounds like, what
the tambourine actually sounds like, etc. Sure, we've all heard A
tambourine, but not THAT tambourine.

Then again, tube mics don't seem to be all that crisp anyway, in general,
which is part of their purpose and why people use them for smoothing out
vocals. Try an AKG 414 or if you really want it crispy try a C1000S! <g>

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio
Purchase your copy of the Fifth of RAP CD set at www.recaudiopro.net.
See how far $20 really goes.




"Kevin_Darbro" > wrote in message
om...
> Hey there. I searched the RAP archives, and didn't find so much on
> this topic, so I'm asking for your help.
>
> I'm working on a song with my neighbor, and there's a couple of times
> in the song that we want to have a tambourine part. We recorded it
> "for placement only" with the Nady Tube Mic we were using for vocals,
> but it doesn't sound crisp.
>
> The part is going "shika shika PAP! shika shika PAP!" with the PAP!
> being the tambourine hit on the palm, and the shika being shakes of
> the tambourine. The hastily recorded "for idea's sake" tamb part is
> functional at best, but I know we can get a better recording of it
> with some suggestions from you folks.
>
> Here's what we have at our disposal:
>
> Sure SM57's (lots)
> Oktava MC 012 (cardioid, hypercardioid, omni)
> Nakamichi C-100 (cardioid, omni)
> Nady Tube mic (don't remember the model - inexpensive)
> Steadman C-15
>
> Going into eMagic Logic 5 through a Mackie 1604 VLZ and an M audio
> Delta 1010 with an RNC patched in there for good measure.
>
> Any hints on placement and mic choices? We were recording the part in
> the vocal booth (closet full of clothes, blankets and towels), but I'm
> wondering if recording it in the "live room" (just in front of my
> door) would be better. I'm also wondering if stereo recording would
> be in order. How far away, and where do you recommend I capture the
> best sound I can with the tools I have?
>
> Thank you for your wisdom.
>
> - Mr. Tambourine Man

[paul tumolo]

My vote would go for "Green Tambourine".

"PVP9847" > wrote in message
...
> check out the Monkees tune "Valerie" - could possibly be the loudest
tambourine
> on record
>

[NeilH011]

>My vote would go for "Green Tambourine".

I thought "Green Tambourine" needed more cowbell. : )

NeilH

[Bill]

I had good luck using an EV-635a omni dynamic (about a foot away) into
a UA 2-610 pre through a UA 1176 comp (4-1 ratio, maybe 3-5 db
compression).

Bill

[Peter L. Pollack]

In article >,
says...
> Hey there. I searched the RAP archives, and didn't find so much on
> this topic, so I'm asking for your help.
>
> I'm working on a song with my neighbor, and there's a couple of times
> in the song that we want to have a tambourine part. We recorded it
> "for placement only" with the Nady Tube Mic we were using for vocals,
> but it doesn't sound crisp.
>
> The part is going "shika shika PAP! shika shika PAP!" with the PAP!
> being the tambourine hit on the palm, and the shika being shakes of
> the tambourine. The hastily recorded "for idea's sake" tamb part is
> functional at best, but I know we can get a better recording of it
> with some suggestions from you folks.

I kind of like an omni on a tambourine...

-Pete Pollack

[david]

I'll usually use an Amek/Neve 9098 and a Purple 1176 to bring out a
tone or tones that work with the track. Screwing with the Purple makes
it easier when it comes time to mix as well.

The mic will be whatever nice mic is already plugged in nearby.



David Correia
Celebration Sound
Warren, Rhode Island


www.CelebrationSound.com

[transducr]

(NeilH011) wrote in message >...
> >My vote would go for "Green Tambourine".
>
> I thought "Green Tambourine" needed more cowbell. : )
>
> NeilH

no, you're thinking of "Don't Fear The Reaper" by Blue Oyster Cult... :)

[transducr]

(Kevin_Darbro) wrote in message >...
> Any hints on placement and mic choices? We were recording the part in
> the vocal booth (closet full of clothes, blankets and towels), but I'm
> wondering if recording it in the "live room" (just in front of my
> door) would be better. I'm also wondering if stereo recording would
> be in order. How far away, and where do you recommend I capture the
> best sound I can with the tools I have?

of late, when i've recorded tambourine i've had a nice big space to
use and i've had the tambo' player walk around the room playing to the
track until it sounds like a nice good spot that sits in the track
well with the room ambience...i do it in mono and pan wherever it
sounds good.

the places i've found i like the best are usually more like 8-10 ft.
from the mic. but i like it to sound a little more distant anyway...i
think the depth sounds flattering and i think getting a good bit of
room sound on the track itself sounds nicer than adding 'verb to it
later.

i use various condensors...although a 57 might not be a bad choice if
you were micing a little closer up (never tried it)...might round it
off a little in a nice way...of course, that might not be what your
looking for...

[Rob Adelman]

I heard an old Beatles tune the other day while working out at the
health club. Not sure what song. But it had tambourine and it was really
loud, in fact as loud as all the other instruments and vocals combined.

Shorty Blackwell wrote:

> "paul tumolo" > wrote in message >...
>
>>My vote would go for "Green Tambourine".
>
>
> The aforementioned is exquisite indeed.
>
>
>>"PVP9847" > wrote in message
...
>>
>>>check out the Monkees tune "Valerie" - could possibly be the loudest
>>
>> tambourine
>>
>>>on record

[Shorty Blackwell]

Rob Adelman > wrote in message >...
> I heard an old Beatles tune the other day while working out at the
> health club. Not sure what song. But it had tambourine and it was really
> loud, in fact as loud as all the other instruments and vocals combined.

I wonder which it was... Betcha it was hard days night era.

[R Krizman]

<< I heard an old Beatles tune the other day while working out at the
health club. Not sure what song. But it had tambourine and it was really
loud, in fact as loud as all the other instruments and vocals combined. >>

"We Can Work it Out"?

-R

[Rob Adelman]

R Krizman wrote:

> << I heard an old Beatles tune the other day while working out at the
> health club. Not sure what song. But it had tambourine and it was really
> loud, in fact as loud as all the other instruments and vocals combined. >>
>
> "We Can Work it Out"?

No, I know that one <g> This one was old and more obscure. I didn't
really recognize it, but I am sure it was the Beatles. They did write a
lot of songs.

[Shorty Blackwell]

Rob Adelman > wrote in message >...
> R Krizman wrote:
>
> > << I heard an old Beatles tune the other day while working out at the
> > health club. Not sure what song. But it had tambourine and it was really
> > loud, in fact as loud as all the other instruments and vocals combined. >>
> >
> > "We Can Work it Out"?
>
> No, I know that one <g> This one was old and more obscure. I didn't
> really recognize it, but I am sure it was the Beatles. They did write a
> lot of songs.

Only song that keeps coming to my mind is When I Get Home, but that's a cow bell...

[Rob Adelman]

Shorty Blackwell wrote:
>
> Only song that keeps coming to my mind is When I Get Home, but that's a cow bell...

Do I ever feel dumb. (major brain fart) It was cow bell I was thinking
of, not tambourine. In fact when I heard it I was thinking of the more
cow bell thread. D'oh!

[Rob Adelman]

Shorty Blackwell wrote:

> Only song that keeps coming to my mind is When I Get Home, but that's a cow bell..

Shorty, I had a major brain fart. I was thinking cow bell. Don't know
why I responded to tambourine. Probably was the song you mentioned. D'oh!

[Shorty Blackwell]

Rob Adelman > wrote in message >...
> Shorty Blackwell wrote:
> >
> > Only song that keeps coming to my mind is When I Get Home, but that's a cow bell...
>
> Do I ever feel dumb. (major brain fart) It was cow bell I was thinking
> of, not tambourine.

Telepathy? Whoa! ;)

>In fact when I heard it I was thinking of the more
> cow bell thread. D'oh!

[Your Add Here!]

His playing is one of the elements that makes classic motown sound
like classic motown, inmho. It's no wonder that the motown sound is
often imitated but never duplicated - no one else I've ever heard
plays like that.

[S O'Neill]

"You've Got To Hide Your Love Away" from Help?


Rob Adelman wrote:
>
>
> R Krizman wrote:
>
>> << I heard an old Beatles tune the other day while working out at the
>> health club. Not sure what song. But it had tambourine and it was
>> really loud, in fact as loud as all the other instruments and vocals
>> combined. >>
>>
>> "We Can Work it Out"?
>
>
> No, I know that one <g> This one was old and more obscure. I didn't
> really recognize it, but I am sure it was the Beatles. They did write a
> lot of songs.
>

[Rob Adelman]

S O'Neill wrote:

> "You've Got To Hide Your Love Away" from Help?
>

No, I know that one too. And if you read my other post, this was a screw
up on my part. I was thinking cow bell but responded to tambourine. -ooops

[[email protected]]

The tamborines with the brass cymbals (jingles) are less shrill and
record the best for me. If your spending your time trying to tame the
hi freq, get one, it's easier.
I like small capsule mics for it.

see12mic

[[email protected]]

The tamborines with the brass cymbals (jingles) are less shrill and
record the best for me. If your spending your time trying to tame the
hi freq, get one, it's easier.
I like small capsule mics for it.

see12mic

[Shorty Blackwell]

Rob Adelman > wrote in message >...
> S O'Neill wrote:
>
> > "You've Got To Hide Your Love Away" from Help?
> >
>
> No, I know that one too. And if you read my other post, this was a screw
> up on my part. I was thinking cow bell but responded to tambourine. -ooops

That's OK. It's still fun brainstorming all the Beatles' songs that
utilize a tambourine prominently. :)

[Shorty Blackwell]

Rob Adelman > wrote in message >...
> S O'Neill wrote:
>
> > "You've Got To Hide Your Love Away" from Help?
> >
>
> No, I know that one too. And if you read my other post, this was a screw
> up on my part. I was thinking cow bell but responded to tambourine. -ooops

That's OK. It's still fun brainstorming all the Beatles' songs that
utilize a tambourine prominently. :)

[S O'Neill]

=whew=

Shorty Blackwell wrote:

> Rob Adelman > wrote in message >...
>
>>S O'Neill wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"You've Got To Hide Your Love Away" from Help?
>>>
>>
>>No, I know that one too. And if you read my other post, this was a screw
>>up on my part. I was thinking cow bell but responded to tambourine. -ooops
>
>
> That's OK. It's still fun brainstorming all the Beatles' songs that
> utilize a tambourine prominently. :)

[S O'Neill]

=whew=

Shorty Blackwell wrote:

> Rob Adelman > wrote in message >...
>
>>S O'Neill wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"You've Got To Hide Your Love Away" from Help?
>>>
>>
>>No, I know that one too. And if you read my other post, this was a screw
>>up on my part. I was thinking cow bell but responded to tambourine. -ooops
>
>
> That's OK. It's still fun brainstorming all the Beatles' songs that
> utilize a tambourine prominently. :)

[Shorty Blackwell]

(Shorty Blackwell) wrote in message >...

>
> That's OK. It's still fun brainstorming all the Beatles' songs that
> utilize a tambourine prominently. :)

(You Never Give Me Your Money, the end, in between "one two three four
five six seven..." & "...all good children go to heaven.")

[Shorty Blackwell]

(Shorty Blackwell) wrote in message >...

>
> That's OK. It's still fun brainstorming all the Beatles' songs that
> utilize a tambourine prominently. :)

(You Never Give Me Your Money, the end, in between "one two three four
five six seven..." & "...all good children go to heaven.")

[Shorty Blackwell]

Rob Adelman > wrote in message >...
> Shorty Blackwell wrote:
>
> > Only song that keeps coming to my mind is When I Get Home, but that's a cow bell..
>
> Shorty, I had a major brain fart. I was thinking cow bell. Don't know
> why I responded to tambourine. Probably was the song you mentioned. >D'oh!

My brain farts, too: I Call Your Name uses the cowbell. Duh!

[Shorty Blackwell]

Rob Adelman > wrote in message >...
> Shorty Blackwell wrote:
>
> > Only song that keeps coming to my mind is When I Get Home, but that's a cow bell..
>
> Shorty, I had a major brain fart. I was thinking cow bell. Don't know
> why I responded to tambourine. Probably was the song you mentioned. >D'oh!

My brain farts, too: I Call Your Name uses the cowbell. Duh!