Good microphone for recording trumpet in smooth jazz?

[TysonjM]

I'm a trumpet player, who does recording at home, mainly as a hobby.
But of course, I'm a perfectionist and want the best quality I can
get. I have a clear, rich, warm sound that I'd want to accurately
capture when recording jazz and smooth jazz material. If you've heard
Chris Botti recordings, it is this quality of sound I'm after. I'm
sure effects are added during mixing, but I'm guessing a particular
mic was chosen to cater to and compliment his darker, etherial tone.
What kind of mic would this be?

I'm new to the many different types and manufacturers of microphones
out there, so anyone in production and/or a trumpet player who has
suggestions would be appreciated. i.e. Would a condenser mic be my
best bet because it's more sensitive and will capture my true sound
better? Or would a dynamic mic, one that does well with recording the
"low" (warmer)end of a sound work as well? I probably have a budget of
$200-300.

I did find a picture of Chris Botti in a studio. It appears he's
playing into an older microphone. Possibly ribbon type? Anyone
recognize this mic and why he might use this older type?
http://www.bottiology.com/interview3.html

Thanks for suggestions, tips, or knowledge you can send my way.

[Benjamin Maas]

The short answer is you aren't going to find what you are looking for at
that price point. $300 might find you a used Sennheiser 441 (which would do
a pretty decent job). I wouldn't go with any condenser mic at that price
point if you want warmth.

The mic you see in that picture is an AKG C-12VR. To get that, you're
looking at about $3K. A Coles 4038 will sound great ($1000+), RCA 77s sound
great when you find one that works. The Royer 121 also is a great trumpet
mic. My favorite trumpet mic is a Neumann UM57 tube mic which can be had in
good shape these days for about $2K.

--Ben

--
Benjamin Maas
Fifth Circle Audio
Los Angeles, CA
http://www.fifthcircle.com

[Scott Dorsey]

TysonjM > wrote:
>I'm a trumpet player, who does recording at home, mainly as a hobby.
>But of course, I'm a perfectionist and want the best quality I can
>get. I have a clear, rich, warm sound that I'd want to accurately
>capture when recording jazz and smooth jazz material. If you've heard
>Chris Botti recordings, it is this quality of sound I'm after. I'm
>sure effects are added during mixing, but I'm guessing a particular
>mic was chosen to cater to and compliment his darker, etherial tone.
>What kind of mic would this be?

Go out and try some ribbon mikes. Get a couple hours in a local studio
and try out an old RCA 77DX, an RCA 44, the Royer ribbons, and also
the Beyers.

You may also like some of the better dynamic mikes, like the Sennheiser 421L,
the EV RE-20, and the Shure SM-7 (not the same thing as the 57).

>I'm new to the many different types and manufacturers of microphones
>out there, so anyone in production and/or a trumpet player who has
>suggestions would be appreciated. i.e. Would a condenser mic be my
>best bet because it's more sensitive and will capture my true sound
>better? Or would a dynamic mic, one that does well with recording the
>"low" (warmer)end of a sound work as well? I probably have a budget of
>$200-300.

I dunno without hearing your horn. Spend a little money getting some time
in a local studio just to audition mikes. If you only want an hour or so,
they will probably make you a good deal on the hourly rate because they can
stick you in-between bookings.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Mike Rivers]

In article <K0USa.113947$H17.35271@sccrnsc02> writes:

> A Coles 4038 will sound great ($1000+), RCA 77s sound
> great when you find one that works.

I wonder how the new AEA $1000 long ribbon mic works on trumpet. I've
only heard it on voice.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

[clamnebula]

Try a used EV RE-20, which can be had for $200-300, and can be used on lots of
other stuff, too (kick drum, low toms, bass amps, guitar amps, sax, radio
voice-overs, etc, etc....)
-Neb

"TysonjM" > wrote in message
om...
> I'm a trumpet player, who does recording at home, mainly as a hobby.
> But of course, I'm a perfectionist and want the best quality I can
> get. I have a clear, rich, warm sound that I'd want to accurately
> capture when recording jazz and smooth jazz material. If you've heard
> Chris Botti recordings, it is this quality of sound I'm after. I'm
> sure effects are added during mixing, but I'm guessing a particular
> mic was chosen to cater to and compliment his darker, etherial tone.
> What kind of mic would this be?
>
> I'm new to the many different types and manufacturers of microphones
> out there, so anyone in production and/or a trumpet player who has
> suggestions would be appreciated. i.e. Would a condenser mic be my
> best bet because it's more sensitive and will capture my true sound
> better? Or would a dynamic mic, one that does well with recording the
> "low" (warmer)end of a sound work as well? I probably have a budget of
> $200-300.
>
> I did find a picture of Chris Botti in a studio. It appears he's
> playing into an older microphone. Possibly ribbon type? Anyone
> recognize this mic and why he might use this older type?
> http://www.bottiology.com/interview3.html
>
> Thanks for suggestions, tips, or knowledge you can send my way.

[Garthrr]

In article >,
(TysonjM) writes:

>I'm a trumpet player, who does recording at home, mainly as a hobby.
>But of course, I'm a perfectionist and want the best quality I can
>get. I have a clear, rich, warm sound that I'd want to accurately
>capture when recording jazz and smooth jazz material. If you've heard
>Chris Botti recordings, it is this quality of sound I'm after.

I love Botti's tone. I think much of what youre hearing in the tone is his
choice of horn, mouthpiece and his playing. I usually put up a Royer ribbon mic
on trumpet because of its warm, rich sound. I have also gotten a pretty decent
sound on a muted trumpet with an SM56. Just make sure that whatever you choose
can handle high SPL without breaking up.
Garth~


"I think the fact that music can come up a wire is a miracle."
Ed Cherney

[James Boyk]

Can't get what you're looking for for $300. I suggest judging by
listening yourself, not by trying to reason from false premises (such as
condenser "more sensitive"). If you really want to record yourself well,
it's a high-budget proposition; and you certainly cannot do it at home,
because your home is too noisy. I'm speaking of recordings for release.
If you mean decent-quality (not great) recordings of practice, lessons
and rehearsals for self-study purposes, that's a horse of another color
and is very possible, though still not for so little money as you're
hoping for.

James Boyk

[Fill X]

Oops, I didn't see the price point in your post. I like ribbons on horns and
many things "self_amplifying" like guitar amps, and resnonator guitars because
ribbons tend to be "fast". An re-20 is a fine trumpet mic in your price range
though.


P h i l i p

______________________________

"I'm too ****ing busy and vice-versa"

- Dorothy Parker

[Jim Williams]

(TysonjM) wrote in message >...
> I'm a trumpet player, who does recording at home, mainly as a hobby.
> But of course, I'm a perfectionist and want the best quality I can
> get. I have a clear, rich, warm sound that I'd want to accurately
> capture when recording jazz and smooth jazz material. If you've heard
> Chris Botti recordings, it is this quality of sound I'm after. I'm
> sure effects are added during mixing, but I'm guessing a particular
> mic was chosen to cater to and compliment his darker, etherial tone.
> What kind of mic would this be?
>
> I'm new to the many different types and manufacturers of microphones
> out there, so anyone in production and/or a trumpet player who has
> suggestions would be appreciated. i.e. Would a condenser mic be my
> best bet because it's more sensitive and will capture my true sound
> better? Or would a dynamic mic, one that does well with recording the
> "low" (warmer)end of a sound work as well? I probably have a budget of
> $200-300.
>
> I did find a picture of Chris Botti in a studio. It appears he's
> playing into an older microphone. Possibly ribbon type? Anyone
> recognize this mic and why he might use this older type?
> http://www.bottiology.com/interview3.html
>
> Thanks for suggestions, tips, or knowledge you can send my way.

Jazz trumpeter Rick Braun is using a hot-rodded AKG 414 B-ULS. He
specializes with the muted trumpet sound which can sound more like a
kazoo with some condenser mics. This mic repros the harmonics well
without the strident quality found in many condenser mics. It lets out
the trumpet bite without the top end roll-off that can occur with
certain ribbon mics. Check out the duet "Grazin' In The Grass" with
Boney James for an example.
Jim Williams Audio Upgrades

[Luke Kaven]

(Jim Williams) wrote:

(TysonjM) wrote in message >...
>> I'm a trumpet player, who does recording at home, mainly as a hobby.
>> But of course, I'm a perfectionist and want the best quality I can
>> get. I have a clear, rich, warm sound that I'd want to accurately
>> capture when recording jazz and smooth jazz material. If you've heard
>> Chris Botti recordings, it is this quality of sound I'm after. I'm
>> sure effects are added during mixing, but I'm guessing a particular
>> mic was chosen to cater to and compliment his darker, etherial tone.
>> What kind of mic would this be?
[...]

>Jazz trumpeter Rick Braun is using a hot-rodded AKG 414 B-ULS. He
>specializes with the muted trumpet sound which can sound more like a
>kazoo with some condenser mics. This mic repros the harmonics well
>without the strident quality found in many condenser mics. It lets out
>the trumpet bite without the top end roll-off that can occur with
>certain ribbon mics. Check out the duet "Grazin' In The Grass" with
>Boney James for an example.
>Jim Williams Audio Upgrades

Did you do the modifications, Jim? Does it require an original CK12
capsule, or does it work with the "replacement"?

[Fletcher]

TysonjM wrote:

> I'm a trumpet player, who does recording at home, mainly as a hobby.
> But of course, I'm a perfectionist and want the best quality I can
> get. I have a clear, rich, warm sound that I'd want to accurately
> capture when recording jazz and smooth jazz material. <snip happens> I
> probably have a budget of
> $200-300.

Well... there have been a couple of good suggestions in your budget range
[used Sennheiser MD-441, RE-20, etc.]... but I really don't think they'll
warm up to your 'perfectionist' tendencies. FWIW the two mics I have
found to work best on trumpet are the Sony C-37p [there will be a
Josephson mic on the market with similar characteristics to the C-37p in a
few months... until then, you're going to be looking for a used C-37p] and
the Royer SF-1.

Both a very opulent sounding, both have a nice clear top without getting
shrill. The Royer is a ribbon, the Sony a FET condenser...

Best of luck with your search.
--
Fletcher
Mercenary Audio
TEL: 508-543-0069
FAX: 508-543-9670
http://www.mercenary.com
"this is not a problem"

[Fletcher]

Mike Rivers wrote:

>
> I wonder how the new AEA $1000 long ribbon mic works on trumpet. I've
> only heard it on voice.

It's OK... but I quite preferred the Royer SF-1 in the same application. The AEA
R-84 does do an absolutely wonderful job on tenor and alto saxophones.
--
Fletcher
Mercenary Audio
TEL: 508-543-0069
FAX: 508-543-9670
http://www.mercenary.com
"this is not a problem"

[Luke Kaven]

Fletcher > wrote:

[...]
> FWIW the two mics I have
>found to work best on trumpet are the Sony C-37p [there will be a
>Josephson mic on the market with similar characteristics to the C-37p in a
>few months... until then, you're going to be looking for a used C-37p] and
>the Royer SF-1.

Baker told me about the C37p. He said it positively had to be a "P".
What is the distinction?