[Stewart[_2_]]

Hello all. I hope this is an appropriate question for this newsgroup.

I am a member of a small group that mainly does medieval and renaissance
music. I need to record the group for rehearsal feedback purposes, and
the occasional use on local radio etc. My old Tascam analogue recording
deck has died and I have been able to borrow a friend's HDD digital deck
a couple of times but need to acquire one of my own. It will only be
used for recording from microphones. I've spent some time looking around
on eBay and there seem to be quite a few devices available, most of
which with features I do not need. What I need is:

4 mic inputs
stereo PCM output
44.1 kHz or better sampling
stereo RCA and headphone output
some means of digital output that will enable me to transfer files to a
modern PC: USB, Firewire, SD or even CD-R

I guess that RCA stereo line input would be acceptable as I have a 4-2
mic mixer lying about somewhere.

What I don't need is on-device editing, lots of fancy digital effects,
track bouncing, a drum machine etc etc.

Grateful for any recommendations.

Stewart

[Martin Doppelbauer]

Hello Steve,
I was facing a very similar list of requirements a few months ago and I have
decided to get the Edirol R-4.
It has 4 mic inputs and records to 40 GB internal hard-disk (up to 24 bit /
96 khz). Transfer can then be made to Compact-Flash card or via USB 2.0 to
any connected computer (the internal hard-drive will just show up as a new
storage device of the computer - very simple).
Some (few) effects are built in but strictly for enhancing the recording -
no fancy features like drum machines, track bouncing etc.
Operation is very easy and the device is even portable (takes 8 AA batteries
or rechargeables for 2-3 hours of operating time).
The quality of the mic-preamps is good (though not outstanding).

Martin


"Stewart" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
Hello all. I hope this is an appropriate question for this newsgroup.

I am a member of a small group that mainly does medieval and renaissance
music. I need to record the group for rehearsal feedback purposes, and the
occasional use on local radio etc. My old Tascam analogue recording deck
has died and I have been able to borrow a friend's HDD digital deck a
couple of times but need to acquire one of my own. It will only be used
for recording from microphones. I've spent some time looking around on
eBay and there seem to be quite a few devices available, most of which
with features I do not need. What I need is:

4 mic inputs
stereo PCM output
44.1 kHz or better sampling
stereo RCA and headphone output
some means of digital output that will enable me to transfer files to a
modern PC: USB, Firewire, SD or even CD-R

I guess that RCA stereo line input would be acceptable as I have a 4-2
mic mixer lying about somewhere.

What I don't need is on-device editing, lots of fancy digital effects,
track bouncing, a drum machine etc etc.

Grateful for any recommendations.

Stewart

[Laurence Payne]

On Sun, 22 Apr 2007 13:31:43 +1000, Stewart wrote:

I am a member of a small group that mainly does medieval and renaissance
music. I need to record the group for rehearsal feedback purposes, and
the occasional use on local radio etc. My old Tascam analogue recording
deck has died and I have been able to borrow a friend's HDD digital deck
a couple of times but need to acquire one of my own. It will only be
used for recording from microphones. I've spent some time looking around
on eBay and there seem to be quite a few devices available, most of
which with features I do not need. What I need is:

4 mic inputs
stereo PCM output
44.1 kHz or better sampling
stereo RCA and headphone output
some means of digital output that will enable me to transfer files to a
modern PC: USB, Firewire, SD or even CD-R

I guess that RCA stereo line input would be acceptable as I have a 4-2
mic mixer lying about somewhere.

What I don't need is on-device editing, lots of fancy digital effects,
track bouncing, a drum machine etc etc.

Grateful for any recommendations.

Your mixer will take care of the eadphone output, I expect. The exact
types of connectors are hardly important, adaptors can easily be made
up. So it looks as if you just need a simple stereo digital recorder.
I often use my iRiver H320 for this sort of job. Sometimes a portable
MiniDisk machine (I know it's a compressed audio format, but in
practice it sounds very good.) Or maybe you already own a laptop
computer? The internal audio system is unlikely to be very good
(though you should try the Line In before jumping to conclusions). But
adding a USB or Firewire audio interface is easy and affordable.

[Richard Crowley]

"Martin Doppelbauer" wrote ...
Hello Steve,
I was facing a very similar list of requirements a few months ago and
I have decided to get the Edirol R-4.
It has 4 mic inputs and records to 40 GB internal hard-disk (up to 24
bit / 96 khz). Transfer can then be made to Compact-Flash card or via
USB 2.0 to any connected computer (the internal hard-drive will just
show up as a new storage device of the computer - very simple).
Some (few) effects are built in but strictly for enhancing the
recording - no fancy features like drum machines, track bouncing etc.
Operation is very easy and the device is even portable (takes 8 AA
batteries or rechargeables for 2-3 hours of operating time).
The quality of the mic-preamps is good (though not outstanding).

Appears to be discontinued.
At least here in the US.

[Mike Rivers]

On Apr 21, 11:31 pm, Stewart wrote:

I am a member of a small group that mainly does medieval and renaissance
music. I need to record the group for rehearsal feedback purposes, and
the occasional use on local radio etc. My old Tascam analogue recording
deck has died and I have been able to borrow a friend's HDD digital deck

There are several approaches to this. What (exactly) is your old
analog unit, what (exactly) did you borrow from your friend, and how
well did those suit your needs or not?

4 mic inputs
stereo PCM output
44.1 kHz or better sampling
stereo RCA and headphone output
some means of digital output that will enable me to transfer files to a
modern PC: USB, Firewire, SD or even CD-R

What I don't need is on-device editing, lots of fancy digital effects,
track bouncing, a drum machine etc etc.

You have quite a mishmash of needs, but the truth is that you'll have
to take what you can get, or put together a system from individual
components to customize it to your needs.

You say you need four mic inputs. Is this because there are four
members of the group? Or do you have a successful way of recording the
group in stereo using four mics and a mixer? Is the group well
balanced so that they could be recorded direct to stereo with a pair
of properly placed mics?

I'm thinking that you probably shouldn't be looking on eBay because
you don't really know what you need yet. You should be looking in a
well stocked music store, at least to get some ideas as to feature
sets, makes and models, and price ranges. They come in all shapes and
sizes.

The way I'd do what I think you're describing is to use one of the new
flash memory card recorders. For example the Zoom H4 has a built-in
pair of mics that reports range from blah to good (but you can plug in
better mics if you have them, or even a mixer if you want to use four
mics and mix them to stereo as you record), it costs less than $300,
and will fit in a jacket pocket - no setup hassles other than to put
it someplace where it can adequately "hear" the group. You can connect
it to a computer via USB, do your "production" there, and burn your
CDs.

You might find one fo the current TASCAM 8-track digital workstations
to be a good replacement for your old recorder if that's sort of what
you had that used cassettes, but they have their limitations, too.

[tmaki]

Stewart wrote:

I am a member of a small group
I need to record the group
I have been able to borrow a friend's HDD digital deck
a couple of times but need to acquire one of my own.
Grateful for any recommendations.


Have a look at the Fostex FR-2LE

http://www.fostex.com/index.php?file=products/pfr/fr2le

I saw it at NAB last week, and when the Fostex folks at the booth
mentioned it was selling for $600, I thought that was quite attractive.
You can buy it from Musician's Friend for $500 and they'll throw in Sony
MDR 7502 headphones with it.

If your budget allows, park a MOTU Traveler next to it, and you've got a
pretty nice setup for what you want to do. I use a Traveler with a
Marantz PMD 670 (or whichever recorder I happen to be taking for the
job) and am quite pleased. The Traveler is a little fiddly, but once you
get the hang of it, no problem.

And just a note: If you buy a CF recorder, be sure to use good quality,
name brand CF cards. I cheaped out once and got a card from Two Hung Lo
discount computer supply or somebody like that. LSS, spend the money,
get the good stuff.

Good luck.



TM

[Baabin]

Try
http://www.swee****er.com/store/detail/R4Edirol/


"Richard Crowley" wrote in message
...
"Martin Doppelbauer" wrote ...
Hello Steve,
I was facing a very similar list of requirements a few months ago and
I have decided to get the Edirol R-4.
It has 4 mic inputs and records to 40 GB internal hard-disk (up to 24
bit / 96 khz). Transfer can then be made to Compact-Flash card or via
USB 2.0 to any connected computer (the internal hard-drive will just
show up as a new storage device of the computer - very simple).
Some (few) effects are built in but strictly for enhancing the
recording - no fancy features like drum machines, track bouncing etc.
Operation is very easy and the device is even portable (takes 8 AA
batteries or rechargeables for 2-3 hours of operating time).
The quality of the mic-preamps is good (though not outstanding).

Appears to be discontinued.
At least here in the US.

[Mike Rivers]

On Apr 22, 12:17 pm, "Baabin" wrote:
I have decided to get the Edirol R-4.

Appears to be discontinued.
At least here in the US.

They came up with the R4-Pro or something like that, which has
SMPTE time code. It's possible that they dropped distribution of that
model in the US because they couldn't sell it against the Fostex
models that have time code. But it's true that it no longer appears
(at least not obviously) on the Edirol.com website.

Pity. I was always kind of interested in that model for myself, but I
heard enough cranky things about it (don't ask - I don't remember)
that my interest eventually cooled off. Now I'm waiting for the Korg
MR-1000.

[Mike Rivers]

On Apr 22, 11:36 am, tmaki wrote:

Have a look at the Fostex FR-2LE
I saw it at NAB last week, and when the Fostex folks at the booth
mentioned it was selling for $600, I thought that was quite attractive.
You can buy it from Musician's Friend for $500 and they'll throw in Sony
MDR 7502 headphones with it.

You can't buy it yet because they told me it wouldn't be shipping
until May. But like just about everything in that category these
days, it records to a compact flash card rather than a disk drive. I
don't want that, though the original poster might be able to work with
it.

[Richard Crowley]

"Baabin" wrote ...
"Richard Crowley" wrote ...
"Martin Doppelbauer" wrote ...
Hello Steve,
I was facing a very similar list of requirements a few months ago and
I have decided to get the Edirol R-4.
It has 4 mic inputs and records to 40 GB internal hard-disk (up to 24
bit / 96 khz). Transfer can then be made to Compact-Flash card or via
USB 2.0 to any connected computer (the internal hard-drive will just
show up as a new storage device of the computer - very simple).
Some (few) effects are built in but strictly for enhancing the
recording - no fancy features like drum machines, track bouncing etc.
Operation is very easy and the device is even portable (takes 8 AA
batteries or rechargeables for 2-3 hours of operating time).
The quality of the mic-preamps is good (though not outstanding).

Appears to be discontinued.
At least here in the US.


Try
http://www.swee****er.com/store/detail/R4Edirol/

Better order quick if you want one. Most other retailers list it
as discontinued. Dunno whether I would consider buying a
discontinued product.

[tmaki]

Mike Rivers wrote:
On Apr 22, 11:36 am, tmaki wrote:

Have a look at the Fostex FR-2LE
I saw it at NAB last week, and when the Fostex folks at the booth
mentioned it was selling for $600, I thought that was quite attractive.
You can buy it from Musician's Friend for $500 and they'll throw in Sony
MDR 7502 headphones with it.

You can't buy it yet because they told me it wouldn't be shipping
until May.

Right, although they hinted to me that maybe next week, which is pretty
much the same as May.

But like just about everything in that category these
days, it records to a compact flash card rather than a disk drive. I
don't want that

Well, everybody has their own reasons for their preferences, but I, too,
had misgivings about CF. When I lost an important recording using a 2Gb
CF (the Two Hung Lo brand), I contacted Doug Oade for his advice
thinking perhaps there might be a firmware upgrade for the PMD 670 that
might solve the problem. His advice was to use either Lexar or Sandisk
CF. I bought Lexar on that advice, and haven't had a problem since.

I have a microdrive as well, and strangely, it won't play back in the
machine. I have to plug it into the card reader in the computer. I've
decided to use it for computer data chores.

The only HD failure I've ever experienced in a recorder was in one of my
Fostex D1624s. It wasn't the machine's fault -- the drive just went TU,
like they all do. So, ya never know.

I'm still not betting everything on CF. Just Friday I did a 2to2 and
used the laptop as backup. But the CF performed flawlessly.

A professional photographer colleague just yesterday was telling how his
life has changed using CF in his Canon cameras. Photo guys have as much
at stake as recording guys, and they seem to be getting comfortable with
CF. Several of the respected recorder brands are going to CF. I don't
remember if it was Zaxcom or SD that was showing models with CF (we
blasted through the whole show on Monday, and were probably among the
last ones out of South Hall at 6:15 PM, so recollectible details are
fuzzy), but it seems to becoming quite acceptable as a stable medium.

Nevertheless, I've still got 145 10" reels of Ampex 456 and 457 on the
shelf, so I can always go back to analog R/R.

Take care.



TM

[[email protected]]

On Apr 22, 9:32 am, Mike Rivers wrote:
On Apr 22, 12:17 pm, "Baabin" wrote:

I have decided to get the Edirol R-4.
Appears to be discontinued.
At least here in the US.

They came up with the R4-Pro or something like that, which has
SMPTE time code. It's possible that they dropped distribution of that
model in the US because they couldn't sell it against the Fostex
models that have time code. But it's true that it no longer appears
(at least not obviously) on the Edirol.com website.

Pity. I was always kind of interested in that model for myself, but I
heard enough cranky things about it (don't ask - I don't remember)
that my interest eventually cooled off. Now I'm waiting for the Korg
MR-1000.

Both the EDIROL R-4 and the R-4 Pro are readily available in the US
and neither are discontinued.
The R-4 unit works very well for those that do use time code and as a
result it is a few hundred dollars less than the R-4 Pro (which does
have int/ext time code).
Full R-4 info is up on the EDIROL web site at
http://www.edirol.com/index.php?opti...6&Itemi d=385
R-4 Pro at http://www.edirol.com/index.php?opti...0&Itemi d=385

Hope that helps,
John Broadhead
Roland Systems Group

[Mike Rivers]

On Apr 22, 11:16 pm, wrote:

Both the EDIROL R-4 and the R-4 Pro are readily available in the US
and neither are discontinued.

Nice to have you lurking here, John. I missed the R-4 on the web site
because I didn't look under Video (since it isn't video). You might
want to suggest to your web designer that he put a link to the R-4
page along with the link to "Audio Capture" on the Interfaces section
where the other recorders are listed. It's easy to miss otherwise if
you know you're looking for a recorder.

[Stewart[_2_]]

Thanks to all who replied with advice. In the end I went with a Zoom H4.
I have access to a studio if I need anything fancier.



Stewart wrote:
Hello all. I hope this is an appropriate question for this newsgroup.

I am a member of a small group that mainly does medieval and renaissance
music. I need to record the group for rehearsal feedback purposes, and
the occasional use on local radio etc. My old Tascam analogue recording
deck has died and I have been able to borrow a friend's HDD digital deck
a couple of times but need to acquire one of my own. It will only be
used for recording from microphones. I've spent some time looking around
on eBay and there seem to be quite a few devices available, most of
which with features I do not need. What I need is:

4 mic inputs
stereo PCM output
44.1 kHz or better sampling
stereo RCA and headphone output
some means of digital output that will enable me to transfer files to a
modern PC: USB, Firewire, SD or even CD-R

I guess that RCA stereo line input would be acceptable as I have a 4-2
mic mixer lying about somewhere.

What I don't need is on-device editing, lots of fancy digital effects,
track bouncing, a drum machine etc etc.

Grateful for any recommendations.

Stewart