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#41
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Recording clarinet/piano
It will be hard to obtain a good sound from both piano and clarinet using a single stereo pair IMO. But if you have the time, why not try both methods during set up? Remember recording the instruments largely to separate tracks will give you a lot more options in post production though. TonyP. No it isn't hard to obtain a good sound from both clarinet & piano from a single stereo pair. It just takes a few minutes of experimentation and decent ears. Tthe original poster had indicated that this was for an audition and in that instance I am presuming classical music. A slight tendency toward a distant sound is what is generally preferred. A clarinet sounds like crap when close mic'd. There is breath noise coupled with key noise and the sound tends to be very uneven. Richard H. Kuschel "I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty |
#42
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Recording clarinet/piano
"Richard Kuschel" wrote in message ... A clarinet sounds like crap when close mic'd. There is breath noise coupled with key noise and the sound tends to be very uneven. Agreed, but you can get a better piano tone if you are not forced to deal with both at the same position, and somewhere the levels balance, that's all. TonyP. |
#43
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Recording clarinet/piano
"Richard Kuschel" wrote in message ... A clarinet sounds like crap when close mic'd. There is breath noise coupled with key noise and the sound tends to be very uneven. Agreed, but you can get a better piano tone if you are not forced to deal with both at the same position, and somewhere the levels balance, that's all. TonyP. |
#44
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Recording clarinet/piano
"Richard Kuschel" wrote in message ... A clarinet sounds like crap when close mic'd. There is breath noise coupled with key noise and the sound tends to be very uneven. Agreed, but you can get a better piano tone if you are not forced to deal with both at the same position, and somewhere the levels balance, that's all. TonyP. |
#45
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Recording clarinet/piano
"Richard Kuschel" wrote in message ... A clarinet sounds like crap when close mic'd. There is breath noise coupled with key noise and the sound tends to be very uneven. Agreed, but you can get a better piano tone if you are not forced to deal with both at the same position, and somewhere the levels balance, that's all. TonyP. |
#46
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Recording clarinet/piano
"Richard Kuschel" wrote in message
It will be hard to obtain a good sound from both piano and clarinet using a single stereo pair IMO. But if you have the time, why not try both methods during set up? Remember recording the instruments largely to separate tracks will give you a lot more options in post production though. No it isn't hard to obtain a good sound from both clarinet & piano from a single stereo pair. Depends on the room, and it depends on what you call "a good sound". It just takes a few minutes of experimentation and decent ears. Yep, that's playing nice. Anybody who disagrees with you lacks what you call and I quote: "decent ears". The original poster had indicated that this was for an audition and in that instance I am presuming classical music. A slight tendency toward a distant sound is what is generally preferred. Thanks for finally admitting that your recommendation tends to produce distant-sounding recordings. IME many musos like distant-sounding recordings because they tend to mask any errors they make when they play or sing. Also, certain genres of music have historically listened to in big echoey rooms. Musical genre is one factor that can tip the preferred style of recording one way or the other. A clarinet sounds like crap when close mic'd. There is breath noise coupled with key noise and the sound tends to be very uneven. Depends on what you call "close". At a foot or two, this sort of thing happens. At 3-6 feet, it probably doesn't. A 2-mic recording of two instruments can easily find the mics out at 12-15 feet. Therefore the mic at 3-6 feet provides an effective tool for varying the sonic perspective of the clarinet, to suit. In some cases, a dab of breath noise and key noise is considered to be a plus. Nice job of ignoring the fact that a piano is also being recorded. Pianos often benefit from being recorded close up. The classic approaches to micing a piano close-up involve finding a mic location where the high range of the piano is emphasized, and putting a mic there. The second mic goes in a place where the lower range of the piano is emphasized. These vary with the type of the piano. Your minimalist pair provides a more-or-less balanced perspective on the piano. Mix and match these three ingredients as desired. The one-size-fits-all way to record a live performance is to make a good minimalist recording i.e., Jecklin, M/S, ORTF, spaced omnis, X/Y; depending on your preferences and audio religious beliefs, and layer close miced spot mics on top of it as required to get the sound you prefer. If you have a number of mic feeds to work with, you can generally pick the take with the best musical performance, and then adjust the recording at mix-down, to suit. |
#47
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Recording clarinet/piano
"Richard Kuschel" wrote in message
It will be hard to obtain a good sound from both piano and clarinet using a single stereo pair IMO. But if you have the time, why not try both methods during set up? Remember recording the instruments largely to separate tracks will give you a lot more options in post production though. No it isn't hard to obtain a good sound from both clarinet & piano from a single stereo pair. Depends on the room, and it depends on what you call "a good sound". It just takes a few minutes of experimentation and decent ears. Yep, that's playing nice. Anybody who disagrees with you lacks what you call and I quote: "decent ears". The original poster had indicated that this was for an audition and in that instance I am presuming classical music. A slight tendency toward a distant sound is what is generally preferred. Thanks for finally admitting that your recommendation tends to produce distant-sounding recordings. IME many musos like distant-sounding recordings because they tend to mask any errors they make when they play or sing. Also, certain genres of music have historically listened to in big echoey rooms. Musical genre is one factor that can tip the preferred style of recording one way or the other. A clarinet sounds like crap when close mic'd. There is breath noise coupled with key noise and the sound tends to be very uneven. Depends on what you call "close". At a foot or two, this sort of thing happens. At 3-6 feet, it probably doesn't. A 2-mic recording of two instruments can easily find the mics out at 12-15 feet. Therefore the mic at 3-6 feet provides an effective tool for varying the sonic perspective of the clarinet, to suit. In some cases, a dab of breath noise and key noise is considered to be a plus. Nice job of ignoring the fact that a piano is also being recorded. Pianos often benefit from being recorded close up. The classic approaches to micing a piano close-up involve finding a mic location where the high range of the piano is emphasized, and putting a mic there. The second mic goes in a place where the lower range of the piano is emphasized. These vary with the type of the piano. Your minimalist pair provides a more-or-less balanced perspective on the piano. Mix and match these three ingredients as desired. The one-size-fits-all way to record a live performance is to make a good minimalist recording i.e., Jecklin, M/S, ORTF, spaced omnis, X/Y; depending on your preferences and audio religious beliefs, and layer close miced spot mics on top of it as required to get the sound you prefer. If you have a number of mic feeds to work with, you can generally pick the take with the best musical performance, and then adjust the recording at mix-down, to suit. |
#48
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Recording clarinet/piano
"Richard Kuschel" wrote in message
It will be hard to obtain a good sound from both piano and clarinet using a single stereo pair IMO. But if you have the time, why not try both methods during set up? Remember recording the instruments largely to separate tracks will give you a lot more options in post production though. No it isn't hard to obtain a good sound from both clarinet & piano from a single stereo pair. Depends on the room, and it depends on what you call "a good sound". It just takes a few minutes of experimentation and decent ears. Yep, that's playing nice. Anybody who disagrees with you lacks what you call and I quote: "decent ears". The original poster had indicated that this was for an audition and in that instance I am presuming classical music. A slight tendency toward a distant sound is what is generally preferred. Thanks for finally admitting that your recommendation tends to produce distant-sounding recordings. IME many musos like distant-sounding recordings because they tend to mask any errors they make when they play or sing. Also, certain genres of music have historically listened to in big echoey rooms. Musical genre is one factor that can tip the preferred style of recording one way or the other. A clarinet sounds like crap when close mic'd. There is breath noise coupled with key noise and the sound tends to be very uneven. Depends on what you call "close". At a foot or two, this sort of thing happens. At 3-6 feet, it probably doesn't. A 2-mic recording of two instruments can easily find the mics out at 12-15 feet. Therefore the mic at 3-6 feet provides an effective tool for varying the sonic perspective of the clarinet, to suit. In some cases, a dab of breath noise and key noise is considered to be a plus. Nice job of ignoring the fact that a piano is also being recorded. Pianos often benefit from being recorded close up. The classic approaches to micing a piano close-up involve finding a mic location where the high range of the piano is emphasized, and putting a mic there. The second mic goes in a place where the lower range of the piano is emphasized. These vary with the type of the piano. Your minimalist pair provides a more-or-less balanced perspective on the piano. Mix and match these three ingredients as desired. The one-size-fits-all way to record a live performance is to make a good minimalist recording i.e., Jecklin, M/S, ORTF, spaced omnis, X/Y; depending on your preferences and audio religious beliefs, and layer close miced spot mics on top of it as required to get the sound you prefer. If you have a number of mic feeds to work with, you can generally pick the take with the best musical performance, and then adjust the recording at mix-down, to suit. |
#49
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Recording clarinet/piano
"Richard Kuschel" wrote in message
It will be hard to obtain a good sound from both piano and clarinet using a single stereo pair IMO. But if you have the time, why not try both methods during set up? Remember recording the instruments largely to separate tracks will give you a lot more options in post production though. No it isn't hard to obtain a good sound from both clarinet & piano from a single stereo pair. Depends on the room, and it depends on what you call "a good sound". It just takes a few minutes of experimentation and decent ears. Yep, that's playing nice. Anybody who disagrees with you lacks what you call and I quote: "decent ears". The original poster had indicated that this was for an audition and in that instance I am presuming classical music. A slight tendency toward a distant sound is what is generally preferred. Thanks for finally admitting that your recommendation tends to produce distant-sounding recordings. IME many musos like distant-sounding recordings because they tend to mask any errors they make when they play or sing. Also, certain genres of music have historically listened to in big echoey rooms. Musical genre is one factor that can tip the preferred style of recording one way or the other. A clarinet sounds like crap when close mic'd. There is breath noise coupled with key noise and the sound tends to be very uneven. Depends on what you call "close". At a foot or two, this sort of thing happens. At 3-6 feet, it probably doesn't. A 2-mic recording of two instruments can easily find the mics out at 12-15 feet. Therefore the mic at 3-6 feet provides an effective tool for varying the sonic perspective of the clarinet, to suit. In some cases, a dab of breath noise and key noise is considered to be a plus. Nice job of ignoring the fact that a piano is also being recorded. Pianos often benefit from being recorded close up. The classic approaches to micing a piano close-up involve finding a mic location where the high range of the piano is emphasized, and putting a mic there. The second mic goes in a place where the lower range of the piano is emphasized. These vary with the type of the piano. Your minimalist pair provides a more-or-less balanced perspective on the piano. Mix and match these three ingredients as desired. The one-size-fits-all way to record a live performance is to make a good minimalist recording i.e., Jecklin, M/S, ORTF, spaced omnis, X/Y; depending on your preferences and audio religious beliefs, and layer close miced spot mics on top of it as required to get the sound you prefer. If you have a number of mic feeds to work with, you can generally pick the take with the best musical performance, and then adjust the recording at mix-down, to suit. |
#50
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Recording clarinet/piano
Agreed, but you can get a better piano tone if you are not forced to deal with both at the same position, and somewhere the levels balance, that's all. TonyP. That depends upon your definition of piano tone. My recordings are from audience perspective and that is what is desired for audition tapes. It is amazing what can be done using a single pair of microphones that are placed correctly. My current favorites for this type of work are a pair of Schoeps cmc6/MK2S on a Jecklin disc, but this requires a very good room. In a not so good room I use a pair of CMC6/KM41super cardioids. Richard H. Kuschel "I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty |
#51
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Recording clarinet/piano
Agreed, but you can get a better piano tone if you are not forced to deal with both at the same position, and somewhere the levels balance, that's all. TonyP. That depends upon your definition of piano tone. My recordings are from audience perspective and that is what is desired for audition tapes. It is amazing what can be done using a single pair of microphones that are placed correctly. My current favorites for this type of work are a pair of Schoeps cmc6/MK2S on a Jecklin disc, but this requires a very good room. In a not so good room I use a pair of CMC6/KM41super cardioids. Richard H. Kuschel "I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty |
#52
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Recording clarinet/piano
Agreed, but you can get a better piano tone if you are not forced to deal with both at the same position, and somewhere the levels balance, that's all. TonyP. That depends upon your definition of piano tone. My recordings are from audience perspective and that is what is desired for audition tapes. It is amazing what can be done using a single pair of microphones that are placed correctly. My current favorites for this type of work are a pair of Schoeps cmc6/MK2S on a Jecklin disc, but this requires a very good room. In a not so good room I use a pair of CMC6/KM41super cardioids. Richard H. Kuschel "I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty |
#53
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Recording clarinet/piano
Agreed, but you can get a better piano tone if you are not forced to deal with both at the same position, and somewhere the levels balance, that's all. TonyP. That depends upon your definition of piano tone. My recordings are from audience perspective and that is what is desired for audition tapes. It is amazing what can be done using a single pair of microphones that are placed correctly. My current favorites for this type of work are a pair of Schoeps cmc6/MK2S on a Jecklin disc, but this requires a very good room. In a not so good room I use a pair of CMC6/KM41super cardioids. Richard H. Kuschel "I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty |
#54
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Recording clarinet/piano
Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie
and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? |
#55
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Recording clarinet/piano
Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie
and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? |
#56
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Recording clarinet/piano
Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie
and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? |
#57
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Recording clarinet/piano
Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie
and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? |
#58
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Recording clarinet/piano
RL wrote:
Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? See my site. I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? -- ******************************************* * My site is at: http://www.muyiovatki.dk * ******************************************* |
#59
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Recording clarinet/piano
RL wrote:
Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? See my site. I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? -- ******************************************* * My site is at: http://www.muyiovatki.dk * ******************************************* |
#60
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Recording clarinet/piano
RL wrote:
Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? See my site. I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? -- ******************************************* * My site is at: http://www.muyiovatki.dk * ******************************************* |
#61
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Recording clarinet/piano
RL wrote:
Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? See my site. I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? -- ******************************************* * My site is at: http://www.muyiovatki.dk * ******************************************* |
#62
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Recording clarinet/piano
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#63
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Recording clarinet/piano
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#64
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Recording clarinet/piano
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#66
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Recording clarinet/piano
"RL" wrote in message
m Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? Let suggest www.google.com The response for the word ortf, was overwhelming and appropriate. I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. If it ain't broken... would it be better to use them? I'm also very happy with the recordings I've made with NJB3. Last week I picked up a Berhinger MXB1002 as an adjunct to my jukebox and mics, and was very pleased with first outing with them and a few mics, this weekend. |
#67
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Recording clarinet/piano
"RL" wrote in message
m Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? Let suggest www.google.com The response for the word ortf, was overwhelming and appropriate. I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. If it ain't broken... would it be better to use them? I'm also very happy with the recordings I've made with NJB3. Last week I picked up a Berhinger MXB1002 as an adjunct to my jukebox and mics, and was very pleased with first outing with them and a few mics, this weekend. |
#68
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Recording clarinet/piano
"RL" wrote in message
m Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? Let suggest www.google.com The response for the word ortf, was overwhelming and appropriate. I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. If it ain't broken... would it be better to use them? I'm also very happy with the recordings I've made with NJB3. Last week I picked up a Berhinger MXB1002 as an adjunct to my jukebox and mics, and was very pleased with first outing with them and a few mics, this weekend. |
#69
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Recording clarinet/piano
"RL" wrote in message
m Thanks for the replies. I should have stated that I am a total newbie and I use the mics I have primarily for sound reinforcement of my choirs. I thought I would have a better shot at a decent recording than the student just using an old cassete player/recorder. It is classical music and they have hired an accompanist so experimentation will probably not be practical. By the way, what is ORTF? Let suggest www.google.com The response for the word ortf, was overwhelming and appropriate. I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. If it ain't broken... would it be better to use them? I'm also very happy with the recordings I've made with NJB3. Last week I picked up a Berhinger MXB1002 as an adjunct to my jukebox and mics, and was very pleased with first outing with them and a few mics, this weekend. |
#70
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Recording clarinet/piano
I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? Now you're getting it! Quite possibly the "binaural" system would work quite well. One problem is that true binaural really sounds good through headphones only. Neumann Fritz head and B&K torso are such examples and really expensive. If you are using something like the Core sound system that clips to glasses, then it is not binaural in the purist sense, but a pair of spaced omnis seperated by your head. You could mount the microphones to a Jecklin disc, (www.josephson.com) which is easily built so you don't have to keep your head still during the performance. Depending upon the room, your placement will be about 6- 10 feet from the piano & clarinetist about 2- 4 feet above the clarinetist's head. . I am assuming that you are using a grand, not a n upright. Richard H. Kuschel "I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty |
#71
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Recording clarinet/piano
I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? Now you're getting it! Quite possibly the "binaural" system would work quite well. One problem is that true binaural really sounds good through headphones only. Neumann Fritz head and B&K torso are such examples and really expensive. If you are using something like the Core sound system that clips to glasses, then it is not binaural in the purist sense, but a pair of spaced omnis seperated by your head. You could mount the microphones to a Jecklin disc, (www.josephson.com) which is easily built so you don't have to keep your head still during the performance. Depending upon the room, your placement will be about 6- 10 feet from the piano & clarinetist about 2- 4 feet above the clarinetist's head. . I am assuming that you are using a grand, not a n upright. Richard H. Kuschel "I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty |
#72
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Recording clarinet/piano
I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? Now you're getting it! Quite possibly the "binaural" system would work quite well. One problem is that true binaural really sounds good through headphones only. Neumann Fritz head and B&K torso are such examples and really expensive. If you are using something like the Core sound system that clips to glasses, then it is not binaural in the purist sense, but a pair of spaced omnis seperated by your head. You could mount the microphones to a Jecklin disc, (www.josephson.com) which is easily built so you don't have to keep your head still during the performance. Depending upon the room, your placement will be about 6- 10 feet from the piano & clarinetist about 2- 4 feet above the clarinetist's head. . I am assuming that you are using a grand, not a n upright. Richard H. Kuschel "I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty |
#73
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Recording clarinet/piano
I also have a pair of binaural mics that I use to record choral concerts with (using my Jukebox 3) and I have been really pleased with these recordings. Would it be better to use them? Now you're getting it! Quite possibly the "binaural" system would work quite well. One problem is that true binaural really sounds good through headphones only. Neumann Fritz head and B&K torso are such examples and really expensive. If you are using something like the Core sound system that clips to glasses, then it is not binaural in the purist sense, but a pair of spaced omnis seperated by your head. You could mount the microphones to a Jecklin disc, (www.josephson.com) which is easily built so you don't have to keep your head still during the performance. Depending upon the room, your placement will be about 6- 10 feet from the piano & clarinetist about 2- 4 feet above the clarinetist's head. . I am assuming that you are using a grand, not a n upright. Richard H. Kuschel "I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty |
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