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#1
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Old school, old dog, goes back to school
Teaching an old dog new tricks. If you have ever tried it, it can be
frustrating; especially if your the dog. I have an old-school engineering background, large format console, lots of channels, EQ's, insert for processing, then bussing to those lovely 2" behemoths. Inline monitoring design... it was all so easy.. right there in front of you.. all hands on. Now I need to set up a digistudio around a ProTools HD system and I find myself pulling out my hair to know what to put around it. I have been a faithful MOTU DP user in my last few years. But never needing to record more than one or two live tracks at a time, a couple of nice channel strips have served me well. But now I need at least 16 simultaneous inputs, and I hate mouse mixing. So I want some kind of front end where I can use EQ and Dynamics on each input BEFORE it hits the digital realm, easy to use foldback system, then have some tactile controller to mix and control the DAW with. It there such a beast? or am I looking at a rack full of pre's, and eq's and comp's and some control surface for the back end? Is there a digital mixer where the eq and dynamics won't induce a perceived latency that you have found that works and sounds great? I am just not savvy on the new stuff to know. Your expert advice is appreciated. Ron |
#2
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"Guitrzman" wrote in
message Teaching an old dog new tricks. If you have ever tried it, it can be frustrating; especially if your the dog. I have an old-school engineering background, large format console, lots of channels, EQ's, insert for processing, then bussing to those lovely 2" behemoths. Inline monitoring design... it was all so easy.. right there in front of you.. all hands on. Now I need to set up a digistudio around a ProTools HD system and I find myself pulling out my hair to know what to put around it. I have been a faithful MOTU DP user in my last few years. But never needing to record more than one or two live tracks at a time, a couple of nice channel strips have served me well. But now I need at least 16 simultaneous inputs, and I hate mouse mixing. So I want some kind of front end where I can use EQ and Dynamics on each input BEFORE it hits the digital realm, easy to use foldback system, then have some tactile controller to mix and control the DAW with. It there such a beast? or am I looking at a rack full of pre's, and eq's and comp's and some control surface for the back end? If you want some preamps, some eq, some dynamics, some EFX, and what looks like a lot like a mixer's front panel in one fairly-priced box, then you've just described any of a number of different digital mixers. Is there a digital mixer where the eq and dynamics won't induce a perceived latency that you have found that works and sounds great? Most people with digital mixers seem to think they have eq and dynamics doesn't induce a perceived latency. FWIW I've hooked a good mic up to my 02r96 and talked into it and listened to it with headphones and I didn't perceive any delay. I've done the same with a simple analog console many time and it really didn't sound much different. My voice sucks either way! ;-) I don't think the people who buy digital mixers @ $80,000 and up are doing so to get bad sound. But you don't need to spend $80,000 to do what you want to do. But, in terms of raw signal processing power, latency and the like, digital mixers seem to be in a kind of a flat hierarchy, if you know what I mean. |
#3
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#4
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"Guitrzman" wrote in message ... or am I looking at a rack full of pre's, and eq's and comp's and some control surface for the back end? I don't really understand. It seems to me that you either use a computer interrface to control all 16 channels, or you need an individual set of controls for each channel. Let's take a scenario. Suppose you've recorded some tracks, and you find that in the mix, you want to cut the bass guitar by 3dB around 200hz. What interface do you want to use to achieve this? Tim |
#5
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I don't really understand. It seems to me that you either use a computer interrface to control all 16 channels, or you need an individual set of controls for each channel. Let's take a scenario. Suppose you've recorded some tracks, and you find that in the mix, you want to cut the bass guitar by 3dB around 200hz. What interface do you want to use to achieve this? Tim Tim, thanks for the question. On the backend(mix) there is no problem other than just having some kind of tactile control like a Mackie HUI or whatever because I'll be using the Protools or MOTU plug-ins and such to mix within the computer. It more the input side that I have questions about and wanting it all in the same console/controller. But the feedback and further research leads me to think I am looking at something like a Control 24 or 02R, or the like. That serves both as a multi-input console and DAW control Surface. What have you found to be succesful? |
#6
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In article ,
Guitrzman wrote: I don't really understand. It seems to me that you either use a computer interrface to control all 16 channels, or you need an individual set of controls for each channel. Let's take a scenario. Suppose you've recorded some tracks, and you find that in the mix, you want to cut the bass guitar by 3dB around 200hz. What interface do you want to use to achieve this? Tim Tim, thanks for the question. On the backend(mix) there is no problem other than just having some kind of tactile control like a Mackie HUI or whatever because I'll be using the Protools or MOTU plug-ins and such to mix within the computer. It more the input side that I have questions about and wanting it all in the same console/controller. But the feedback and further research leads me to think I am looking at something like a Control 24 or 02R, or the like. That serves both as a multi-input console and DAW control Surface. What have you found to be succesful? AS a follow up, What are most you Protools guys using when you have a rhythm section session, orchestra or other session that requires multiple inputs? And are you just going out of a bunch of rack mounted pre's into the digi interface? Just trying to educate myself on the options out there! Thanks! Ron |
#7
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"Guitrzman" wrote in message ... "What have you found to be succesful?" I use a mouse. I don't do any processing of the signal on input. Once all the tracks are recorded in 24-bit audio, then I apply any signal processing. (I don't use Pro Tools, by the way; I use Cubasis and Cubase.) Tim |
#8
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On Fri, 09 Sep 2005 18:48:12 GMT, Guitrzman
wrote: Tim, thanks for the question. On the backend(mix) there is no problem other than just having some kind of tactile control like a Mackie HUI or whatever because I'll be using the Protools or MOTU plug-ins and such to mix within the computer. It more the input side that I have questions about and wanting it all in the same console/controller. But the feedback and further research leads me to think I am looking at something like a Control 24 or 02R, or the like. That serves both as a multi-input console and DAW control Surface. What have you found to be succesful? You could use the Mackie or Protools controllers for mixing, but I think what you really want is a Euphonics board. They have boards that are all analogue components but control digital systems. They have a knob for each function so you can grab and turn them like you expect on a real board. This works for both the front end and mixing. http://www.euphonix.com/music/produc...5/system_5.htm I only used it on one project, but I was impressed. It wasn't completely intuitive, but it is thousands of times better that a mouse. I personally have the Mackie controller which I half use. It didn't integrate as well with Nuendo as I hoped, and is currently crashing my system when I open and older file, since I've updated to XP. |
#9
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"Tim Martin" wrote in message ... "Guitrzman" wrote in message ... "What have you found to be succesful?" I use a mouse. I don't do any processing of the signal on input. Once all the tracks are recorded in 24-bit audio, then I apply any signal processing. (I don't use Pro Tools, by the way; I use Cubasis and Cubase.) Tim I currently do exactly the same but I use Logic. However, I'm shortly upgrading to multiple inputs (8 is about the most I can afford) and I'm looking seriously at the Tascam FW-1884. I think you can chain a few together to get more channels, and it seems like a pretty good control surface with inserts etc. Not sure if it's compatible with ProTools. http://www.dv247.com/invt/17449?sour...gn=uk&ad=17449 -- Lynn Wobbly Music "Supporting the Mature Artist" ============================= http://www.wobblymusic.net Latest Release... "Friends" by John McKeon Order your copy now and get 2 FREE bonus tracks! http://www.johnmckeon.wobblymusic.net |
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