[Richard]

I would like to get started recording myself playing classical guitar in my
home using my computer to create a promo cd.

What might be some recommedations for me to do this?

Regards,

Rick

[Steven Sena]

A microphone, a microphone preamplifier, a sound card and a recording
program...

--
Steven Sena


"Richard" wrote in message
...
I would like to get started recording myself playing classical guitar in my
home using my computer to create a promo cd.

What might be some recommedations for me to do this?

Regards,

Rick

[Six String Stu]

Actually he should use two mics.
This has been covered lots of times and there should be a good faq at home
recording dot com.
Or he could search through all of these posts here.
Somewhere they will discuss positioning of the mics (one pointed at sound
hole and the other somewhere near where the neck meets the body) I think.
--
remove "spamtrap" in return address for replys.
http://web.nccray.net/jshodges/mommasaid/sss.htm
20% of all sales goes to the local food pantry.
Accepting any and all donations of pro audio equipment.
Thanks so much to those who have responded.
"Steven Sena" wrote in message
. ..
A microphone, a microphone preamplifier, a sound card and a recording
program...

--
Steven Sena


"Richard" wrote in message
...
I would like to get started recording myself playing classical guitar in
my home using my computer to create a promo cd.

What might be some recommedations for me to do this?

Regards,

Rick

[Paul Stamler]

"Steven Sena" wrote in message
. ..
A microphone, a microphone preamplifier, a sound card and a recording
program...

Well, a pair of mics (or a stereo mic) and a two-channel preamplifier. And
almost certainly a good deal of room treatment.

Peace,
Paul

[Richard]

Looks like I lack a microphone preamplifier

"Steven Sena" wrote in message
. ..
A microphone, a microphone preamplifier, a sound card and a recording
program...

--
Steven Sena


"Richard" wrote in message
...
I would like to get started recording myself playing classical guitar in
my home using my computer to create a promo cd.

What might be some recommedations for me to do this?

Regards,

Rick

[Bigguy]

For a 'natural' acoustic tone the most important thing is the space/room you
are recording in...
then the quality of playing and the guitar tone...
and finally the recording equipment....

With acoustic instruments small spaces and close miking with reverb added by
plugin will not sound nearly as good as a couple of good mics in an
excellent room.... people generally ignore this advice and use their
bathroom with predictable results....

You may be able to use a medium/large room of suitable shape (not square)
and get acceptable results without too much early reflections.

Small rooms force you to close mic and this does not capture the guitar's
full tone and will pick up fingering noise - it can sound OK in a mix but as
a solo instrument a large room with one mic about 3-4 feet from the tail end
and another around the twelfth fret area is a good place to start.
Closer miking will get more, dryer guitar and less 'room' sound - far miking
gets 'fuller' guitar and more room sound... use your ears to get the ideal
balance.

A pair of Rode NT5, AKG C451, AKG 414 or Nuemann KM180 (!) will work (as
will many other mics).... a pair of Shure SM57s in a great room can work.

A USB dual mic pre (M-Audio, Edirol, Tascam, RME etc. etc.) will be needed.

All depends on your budget, how good it has to sound, how much time you wish
to spend etc..

Cheapest setup: $450 approx
2 x SM57 OR 2 x Audio Technica AT2020 etc.
Edirol UA-25

Better: $650 approx
2 x Rode NT5
Edirol UA-25

Better: $850 approx
2 x Rode NT5
RME Multiface 24/96

Better: $1,500 approx
2 x AKG C 451 B
RME Multiface 24/96

?Best?: $2,000 approx ;-)
2 x Nuemann KM-184
RME Multiface 24/96

All IM very HO - I'm sure there will be other opinions ;-)

Guy


Richard wrote:
I would like to get started recording myself playing classical guitar
in my home using my computer to create a promo cd.

What might be some recommedations for me to do this?

Regards,

Rick

[Richard]

How did Bream do it?

"Paul Stamler" wrote in message
...
"Steven Sena" wrote in message
. ..
A microphone, a microphone preamplifier, a sound card and a recording
program...

Well, a pair of mics (or a stereo mic) and a two-channel preamplifier. And
almost certainly a good deal of room treatment.

Peace,
Paul

[Peter Larsen]

Richard wrote:

How did Bream do it?

He said: "yes, I want to do that record, where? - oh, how's the
parking?"

Went there.

Sat down and played.

Went home.


Peter Larsen

[Richard]

I was thinking of getting a stereo pair of AKG 414's or even a Neumann 84i.
How they compare with the 451 B's or others?

I'm also not too sure investing in as good a pair of microphones as AKG's or
Neumanns would be compatible with a $100 Santa Cruz sound card. Perhaps it's
time to step up to a real recorder such as an old Scully.

How are those external sound cards by apple macintosh that can be plugged
into either a mac or a pc? Would that help?

It sounds like the room is the most important element here and I don't want
to have to pack up my PC and take it somewhere only to unpack it.

Rick

"Bigguy" wrote in message
...
For a 'natural' acoustic tone the most important thing is the space/room
you are recording in...
then the quality of playing and the guitar tone...
and finally the recording equipment....

With acoustic instruments small spaces and close miking with reverb added
by plugin will not sound nearly as good as a couple of good mics in an
excellent room.... people generally ignore this advice and use their
bathroom with predictable results....

You may be able to use a medium/large room of suitable shape (not square)
and get acceptable results without too much early reflections.

Small rooms force you to close mic and this does not capture the guitar's
full tone and will pick up fingering noise - it can sound OK in a mix but
as a solo instrument a large room with one mic about 3-4 feet from the
tail end and another around the twelfth fret area is a good place to
start.
Closer miking will get more, dryer guitar and less 'room' sound - far
miking gets 'fuller' guitar and more room sound... use your ears to get
the ideal balance.

A pair of Rode NT5, AKG C451, AKG 414 or Nuemann KM180 (!) will work (as
will many other mics).... a pair of Shure SM57s in a great room can work.

A USB dual mic pre (M-Audio, Edirol, Tascam, RME etc. etc.) will be
needed.

All depends on your budget, how good it has to sound, how much time you
wish to spend etc..

Cheapest setup: $450 approx
2 x SM57 OR 2 x Audio Technica AT2020 etc.
Edirol UA-25

Better: $650 approx
2 x Rode NT5
Edirol UA-25

Better: $850 approx
2 x Rode NT5
RME Multiface 24/96

Better: $1,500 approx
2 x AKG C 451 B
RME Multiface 24/96

?Best?: $2,000 approx ;-)
2 x Nuemann KM-184
RME Multiface 24/96

All IM very HO - I'm sure there will be other opinions ;-)

Guy


Richard wrote:
I would like to get started recording myself playing classical guitar
in my home using my computer to create a promo cd.

What might be some recommedations for me to do this?

Regards,

Rick

[Peter Larsen]

Richard topposted yet again so that the context got lost for those that
rely on synthetic speech .... so here is an example of how to write a
followup efficiently, he hadn't got one if it had not been for that
objective.

I was thinking of getting a stereo pair of AKG 414's or even
a Neumann 84i. How they compare with the 451 B's or others?

The sound is different, for a veree broad over simplified
generalisation: small capsules have a cleaner high range than large
capsules. For a classical guitar in a classical context something small
comes to mind, in a rock context something large.

I'm also not too sure investing in as good a pair of microphones
as AKG's or Neumanns would be compatible with a $100 Santa Cruz
sound card.

My recollection is that it is from when consumer cards had just stopped
being horrible.

Perhaps it's time to step up to a real recorder such as
an old Scully.

M-audio Audiophile pci card comes to mind. Analog taperecorders have
their virtues, they are the audio world equivalent of White Steamers.

How are those external sound cards by apple macintosh that can be plugged
into either a mac or a pc? Would that help?

Dunno, I stick with the suggestion above.

It sounds like the room is the most important element here

Nah, the guitar .... it is the real primadonna, next the mic and THEN
the room. Yes, room sound matters, but a standard living room is not all
that bad by itself.

and I don't want to have to pack up my PC and take it somewhere
only to unpack it.

Understood. Last time I recorded my Barslev guitar in my living room I
used a near stereo pair of MD 413's and a far stereo pair of MD 421's.
Well positioned good dynamics will outperform poorly positioned
condensers, but condenser ARE getting to be the cheaper alternative.

And of course, the performance has to be worth recording ....

Rick


Peter Larsen

[Richard Kuschel]

Richard wrote:
I was thinking of getting a stereo pair of AKG 414's or even a Neumann 84i.
How they compare with the 451 B's or others?

I'm also not too sure investing in as good a pair of microphones as AKG's or
Neumanns would be compatible with a $100 Santa Cruz sound card. Perhaps it's
time to step up to a real recorder such as an old Scully.

How are those external sound cards by apple macintosh that can be plugged
into either a mac or a pc? Would that help?

It sounds like the room is the most important element here and I don't want
to have to pack up my PC and take it somewhere only to unpack it.

SNIP

I'd skip the 414's. I have 5 of them and I have never gotten a decent
sound on classical guitar with them. I consider my 451's too brittle
also. I haven't used the newer incarnation.

KM84's are better (Not 184's), but I have a real love for a set of
Neuman (Gefell) tube micropnones. One is a cmv563 and the other is a
highly modified UM57 set up in a dual mono arrangement.

If I am out of the studio-Those mics don't travel-I use a pair of
Schoeps cmc6/2S with a Jecklin disc in a decent concert hall.

I use either a Millenia or Great River preamp into the A/D convertors.

[Richard]

And of course, the performance has to be worth recording ....

Rick


Peter Larsen

Was that really necessary?

[Peter Larsen]

Richard wrote:

And of course, the performance has to be worth recording ....

Rick

Peter Larsen

Was that really necessary?

What is the problem with this Richard? - don't you recall the slogan on
the Ampex tape boxes? - however in case someone misreads it as a priori
critique, no it is not so intended. It is of course for whomsoever pays
a cost to decide its relevance.

Listening to the final stereo version of my quad recording yesterday I
can enjoy the benefits for an amateur ensemble of having all their
concerts recorded for more than 20 years.


Peter Larsen

[Nick Brown]

Richard wrote:

And of course, the performance has to be worth recording ....
Peter Larsen

Was that really necessary?

Well, the first thing I discovered when I started recording myself
playing classical was that my playing wasn't up to scratch, but if your
playing's fine then great.

The best sound I've had so far was from a Beyer M260 ribbon mic, which
has a hypercardioid pattern and keeps quite a bit of the room sound
out. However, it's sensitivity (output level) is very low, and it
really demands a quieter preamp than I've currently got.

I recently had the chance to try it against a Schoeps CMC5 + MK6, and
found that I prefer the sound from the Beyer. The best sound I could
get with the Schoeps was with the omni pattern, but of course it picked
up a lot more of the room (and the outside world). I wasn't able to try
the MK41 hypercardioid, though I'd like to at some point. Background
noise (i.e. hiss) wasn't even close to being an issue with the Schoeps,
except for the rather unsettling moment when I turned up the volume to
the headphones and discovered the astonishing clarity with which I
could hear myself breathing...

Cheers,
Nick

[Richard]

"Richard Kuschel" wrote in message
oups.com...

Richard wrote:
I was thinking of getting a stereo pair of AKG 414's or even a Neumann
84i.
How they compare with the 451 B's or others?

I'm also not too sure investing in as good a pair of microphones as AKG's
or
Neumanns would be compatible with a $100 Santa Cruz sound card. Perhaps
it's
time to step up to a real recorder such as an old Scully.

How are those external sound cards by apple macintosh that can be plugged
into either a mac or a pc? Would that help?

It sounds like the room is the most important element here and I don't
want
to have to pack up my PC and take it somewhere only to unpack it.

SNIP

I'd skip the 414's. I have 5 of them and I have never gotten a decent
sound on classical guitar with them. I consider my 451's too brittle
also. I haven't used the newer incarnation.

KM84's are better (Not 184's), but I have a real love for a set of
Neuman (Gefell) tube micropnones. One is a cmv563 and the other is a
highly modified UM57 set up in a dual mono arrangement.

If I am out of the studio-Those mics don't travel-I use a pair of
Schoeps cmc6/2S with a Jecklin disc in a decent concert hall.

I use either a Millenia or Great River preamp into the A/D convertors.

Is classical guitar all you mic with your microphones?
Rick

[Paul Stamler]

"Richard" wrote in message
...
How did Bream do it?


Well, a pair of mics (or a stereo mic) and a two-channel preamplifier.
And
almost certainly a good deal of room treatment.

Bream almost certainly recorded in a professional studio (with carefully
designed acoustics) or a small concert hall (ditto). Not certain of the
miking, but if I had to guess I'd say Neumann U-47s, run through custom-made
tubed preamplifiers (not terribly different from Universal Audio's designs)
into Ampex recorders, probably 350s or 351s, or AG440s in later years.

Peace,
Paul

[hank alrich]

Richard wrote:

How are those external sound cards by apple macintosh that can be plugged
into either a mac or a pc? Would that help?

Depending on your budget you might appreciate the Metric Halo ULN2, a
very good preamp coupled with good conversion. It connects to the
computer via Firewire. Runs only on Macs. I use their MIO 2882+DSP and
like the conversion quite well.

--
ha

[Richard]

"hank alrich" wrote in message
.. .
Richard wrote:

How are those external sound cards by apple macintosh that can be plugged
into either a mac or a pc? Would that help?

Depending on your budget you might appreciate the Metric Halo ULN2, a
very good preamp coupled with good conversion. It connects to the
computer via Firewire. Runs only on Macs. I use their MIO 2882+DSP and
like the conversion quite well.

--
ha

I've been thinking of buying a mac, just for ease, practicality and
functionality, mostly to record music. Would you know what mac you might
recommend for recording, sampling, ie: tracking layers of original music,
using real instruments?

I own only a sure sm57, and I have some but not too much experience using
programs like fasoft's n-track studio, goldwave, cakewalk, and a program I
bought called Melody or Harmony Assistant. It's made in France I think.

[Geoff]

Richard wrote:
"hank alrich" wrote in message
.. .
Richard wrote:

How are those external sound cards by apple macintosh that can be
plugged into either a mac or a pc? Would that help?

Depending on your budget you might appreciate the Metric Halo ULN2, a
very good preamp coupled with good conversion. It connects to the
computer via Firewire. Runs only on Macs. I use their MIO 2882+DSP
and like the conversion quite well.

--
ha

I've been thinking of buying a mac, just for ease, practicality and
functionality, mostly to record music. Would you know what mac you
might recommend for recording, sampling, ie: tracking layers of
original music, using real instruments?

I own only a sure sm57, and I have some but not too much experience
using programs like fasoft's n-track studio, goldwave, cakewalk, and
a program I bought called Melody or Harmony Assistant. It's made in
France I think.

Despite what Apple might like you to thing, a Mac won't make you creative.

Keep what you have now, use N-Track studio (or whatever) , and spend the $$$
on mics.

geoff

[Richard]

What soundcards are out there that you might recommend?

Thanks Big Guy

"Bigguy" wrote in message
...
For a 'natural' acoustic tone the most important thing is the space/room
you are recording in...
then the quality of playing and the guitar tone...
and finally the recording equipment....

With acoustic instruments small spaces and close miking with reverb added
by plugin will not sound nearly as good as a couple of good mics in an
excellent room.... people generally ignore this advice and use their
bathroom with predictable results....

You may be able to use a medium/large room of suitable shape (not square)
and get acceptable results without too much early reflections.

Small rooms force you to close mic and this does not capture the guitar's
full tone and will pick up fingering noise - it can sound OK in a mix but
as a solo instrument a large room with one mic about 3-4 feet from the
tail end and another around the twelfth fret area is a good place to
start.
Closer miking will get more, dryer guitar and less 'room' sound - far
miking gets 'fuller' guitar and more room sound... use your ears to get
the ideal balance.

A pair of Rode NT5, AKG C451, AKG 414 or Nuemann KM180 (!) will work (as
will many other mics).... a pair of Shure SM57s in a great room can work.

A USB dual mic pre (M-Audio, Edirol, Tascam, RME etc. etc.) will be
needed.

All depends on your budget, how good it has to sound, how much time you
wish to spend etc..

Cheapest setup: $450 approx
2 x SM57 OR 2 x Audio Technica AT2020 etc.
Edirol UA-25

Better: $650 approx
2 x Rode NT5
Edirol UA-25

Better: $850 approx
2 x Rode NT5
RME Multiface 24/96

Better: $1,500 approx
2 x AKG C 451 B
RME Multiface 24/96

?Best?: $2,000 approx ;-)
2 x Nuemann KM-184
RME Multiface 24/96

All IM very HO - I'm sure there will be other opinions ;-)

Guy


Richard wrote:
I would like to get started recording myself playing classical guitar
in my home using my computer to create a promo cd.

What might be some recommedations for me to do this?

Regards,

Rick

[Richard Crowley]

"Richard" wrote ...
What soundcards are out there that you might recommend?

"Bigguy" wrote ...
....
Cheapest setup: $450 approx
Edirol UA-25

Better: $650 approx
Edirol UA-25

Better: $850 approx
RME Multiface 24/96

Better: $1,500 approx
RME Multiface 24/96

?Best?: $2,000 approx ;-)
RME Multiface 24/96

He identifed two in the messsage you replied to. (Edirol UA-25
& RME Multiface 24/96) Do you not like those? Not clear why
you are you seeking recommendations for others?

[Richard]

That's great Richard, the description on the interenet were not clear to me
that there was a sound card inside those preamps.
Anyway, for $239, that's not a bad start. I was going to take Peter's
recommendation for an M-Audio Audiophile pci card for, what is it, $120 to
take the place of my Santa Cruz card. As far as the mic went, recommended
smaller capsules for classical guitar recording I'm not so sure is because
of a lack of the lower frequencies as much as more of an emphasis on high
frequencies.

Rick

"Richard Crowley" wrote in message
...
"Richard" wrote ...
What soundcards are out there that you might recommend?

"Bigguy" wrote ...
...
Cheapest setup: $450 approx
Edirol UA-25

Better: $650 approx
Edirol UA-25

Better: $850 approx
RME Multiface 24/96

Better: $1,500 approx
RME Multiface 24/96

?Best?: $2,000 approx ;-)
RME Multiface 24/96

He identifed two in the messsage you replied to. (Edirol UA-25
& RME Multiface 24/96) Do you not like those? Not clear why
you are you seeking recommendations for others?

[Ty Ford]

On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 10:03:26 -0500, Nick Brown wrote
(in article .com):


Richard wrote:

And of course, the performance has to be worth recording ....
Peter Larsen

Was that really necessary?

Well, the first thing I discovered when I started recording myself
playing classical was that my playing wasn't up to scratch, but if your
playing's fine then great.

The best sound I've had so far was from a Beyer M260 ribbon mic, which
has a hypercardioid pattern and keeps quite a bit of the room sound
out. However, it's sensitivity (output level) is very low, and it
really demands a quieter preamp than I've currently got.

I recently had the chance to try it against a Schoeps CMC5 + MK6, and
found that I prefer the sound from the Beyer. The best sound I could
get with the Schoeps was with the omni pattern, but of course it picked
up a lot more of the room (and the outside world). I wasn't able to try
the MK41 hypercardioid, though I'd like to at some point. Background
noise (i.e. hiss) wasn't even close to being an issue with the Schoeps,
except for the rather unsettling moment when I turned up the volume to
the headphones and discovered the astonishing clarity with which I
could hear myself breathing...

Cheers,
Nick


I very much like a Schoeps cmc641. On classical, it's usually important to
NOT use a mic with a peaky top because it makes the 1 and 2 strings sound
more plasticky than they really are. The CMC641 doesn't accentuate the top
end. It also doesn't hear the room as much.

I was surprised recently to see that Schoeps actually considers it a
supercardioid and not a hypercardioid.

I recorded a classical guitar chap here some years back who was looking for a
place to do a lot of recording. We did a trial recording. I burned a CD. He
contacted me later, complaining about noise in the recording, giving me
precise times in each cut. I listened. The noises were his nose snorts.

Regards,

Ty Ford


-- Ty Ford's equipment reviews, audio samples, rates and other audiocentric
stuff are at www.tyford.com

[Richard]

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
Richard wrote:
"hank alrich" wrote in message
.. .
Richard wrote:

How are those external sound cards by apple macintosh that can be
plugged into either a mac or a pc? Would that help?

Depending on your budget you might appreciate the Metric Halo ULN2, a
very good preamp coupled with good conversion. It connects to the
computer via Firewire. Runs only on Macs. I use their MIO 2882+DSP
and like the conversion quite well.

--
ha

I've been thinking of buying a mac, just for ease, practicality and
functionality, mostly to record music. Would you know what mac you
might recommend for recording, sampling, ie: tracking layers of
original music, using real instruments?

I own only a sure sm57, and I have some but not too much experience
using programs like fasoft's n-track studio, goldwave, cakewalk, and
a program I bought called Melody or Harmony Assistant. It's made in
France I think.

Despite what Apple might like you to thing, a Mac won't make you creative.

Keep what you have now, use N-Track studio (or whatever) , and spend the
$$$ on mics.

geoff

According to a lot of people I've personally spoken to, owning a mac versus
a pc is at least one more layer of problems that they can eliminate. Like so
many other folks, I'm tired of babying my pc every time I need to use it for
something new. I'm also tired of running into the limitations of the
software I use on my pc. It's just not been effective.

For example, a few years back I bought a notation program that came highly
recommended from the internet, I forget where on the internet now, but, it
is called harmony assistant. The very first time I used it, all was well,
punching in a transcription that I had written down on paper from years ago,
that is, until I hit an upper register limit. At that point the software
company gave me a whole lot of chores to do on my computer that involved
configuring my computer. It was like programing and installing or selecting
different drivers. It was so typical of pc's - the whys of the instructions
were were not explained but expected to be followed, so that if the
instructions didn't map out every step for me, which instructions rarely do,
the configuration would fail. So, this is not the first time I've had a big
headache with my pc. It's time. I can get it working. But is it worth the
time?, time that I could be spending doing creative work.

Rick

[Mike Rivers]

Richard wrote:
That's great Richard, the description on the interenet were not clear to me
that there was a sound card inside those preamps.

It would be so nice if people would stop using the term "sound card"
generically. If it looks like a card and has audio inputs and outputs
on it (or on a simple breakout cable or box) then it's a "sound card."

If it looks like a card but connects to an external box that has things
like preamps or A/D and D/A converters in it, then it's a "host card"
and the audio I/O is actually in the external box. I call the whole
system and "audio interface" and the card part can be a PCI bus card or
a PCMCIA (or whatever they call it now) card that goes in an externa
slot.

If it's a box that has audio inputs and outputs and connects to the
computer via USB or Fireiwre, then it's an "audio interface." No card
involved at all.

[Richard]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
ups.com...

Richard wrote:
That's great Richard, the description on the interenet were not clear to
me
that there was a sound card inside those preamps.

It would be so nice if people would stop using the term "sound card"
generically. If it looks like a card and has audio inputs and outputs
on it (or on a simple breakout cable or box) then it's a "sound card."

If it looks like a card but connects to an external box that has things
like preamps or A/D and D/A converters in it, then it's a "host card"
and the audio I/O is actually in the external box. I call the whole
system and "audio interface" and the card part can be a PCI bus card or
a PCMCIA (or whatever they call it now) card that goes in an externa
slot.

If it's a box that has audio inputs and outputs and connects to the
computer via USB or Fireiwre, then it's an "audio interface." No card
involved at all.

Well, yeah.

This sounds like a more useful piece of equipment than a direct input box to
step up the voltage of an electric guitar. Some come with lots of effects,
for example by companies like POD. Would it be safe to say that the audio
interface also steps up the signal of an electric guitar should I want to
plug directly into it? I don't really need all those effects and long term I
would like to multi-track my own music using my electric. I could always mic
my electric guitar from my amp's speakers. In either case, would I be
correct to understand that an audio interface does what a line level "direct
input box" does in raising the input signal level of an electric guitar
high enough to match the input impediance of the computer's audio circuit?
(notice I deliberately avoided using the term "sound card") If this is
correct, then it would be safe to say that I would not need a direct input
box.

As far as microphones go, and given the fact that it would be great to buy
mics that I could use for both electric and classical guitar, I read a while
back a recommendation on mics by Steve Howe of Yes that I would like to run
by the group for my own clarification./edification before buying a pair of
mics. I presently own ownly a sure sm57.

I'm interested in the various studio and live micing techniques you may use
to get the "real" sound from your guitars to your audience's ears. Steel
string, classical, electric/clean, and electric/dirty. What mics? Do you DI?

"I use about three or four different mics. I use the AKG 414, I use a stereo
pair of those, a stereo pair of Electrovoice RE22, and also some Shure
Unidyne and also a Sennheiser MD-120 or something, not sure of the number.
I'll use different mics and I just make do. I mean you can go somewhere and
use fancy old valve mics, and sometimes they hum. But if you're going to buy
some mics right now get some Mylab mics, they make very small kind of
reproductions of the great mics, they're smaller and they're fantastic to
use, so get a Mylab. I use the Applied Acoustic system from GRAND SCHEME OF
THINGS onwards: NOT NECESSARILY ACOUSTIC, KEYS TO ASCENSION, the new Yes
album, forthcoming works, I use the Applied Acoustic system which is
available from the Netherlands."





I never liked his sound from the Grand Scheme of Things onwards, only from
his work in the

70's, as his recent work sounds too thin and brittle to my ears. So, my
question would be about the mics in the first part of this paragraph,
although, I would like to know if anyone in this group has any experiences
with Milab's reproductions of the old classic microphones. By the way, check
the spelling; it's really Milab with an i not a y.



http://www.milabmic.com/welcome.asp



Rick

[Laurence Payne]

On Tue, 28 Nov 2006 08:53:05 -0500, "Richard"
wrote:

According to a lot of people I've personally spoken to, owning a mac versus
a pc is at least one more layer of problems that they can eliminate. Like so
many other folks, I'm tired of babying my pc every time I need to use it for
something new. I'm also tired of running into the limitations of the
software I use on my pc. It's just not been effective.

For example, a few years back I bought a notation program that came highly
recommended from the internet, I forget where on the internet now, but, it
is called harmony assistant. The very first time I used it, all was well,
punching in a transcription that I had written down on paper from years ago,
that is, until I hit an upper register limit. At that point the software
company gave me a whole lot of chores to do on my computer that involved
configuring my computer. It was like programing and installing or selecting
different drivers. It was so typical of pc's - the whys of the instructions
were were not explained but expected to be followed, so that if the
instructions didn't map out every step for me, which instructions rarely do,
the configuration would fail. So, this is not the first time I've had a big
headache with my pc. It's time. I can get it working. But is it worth the
time?, time that I could be spending doing creative work.


Did the Mac version of Harmony Assistant have a different upper
register limit? Was it configurable at all? :-)

[Laurence Payne]

On 28 Nov 2006 06:24:06 -0800, "Mike Rivers"
wrote:


It would be so nice if people would stop using the term "sound card"
generically

Too late, I fear :-)

[Richard]

I don't know anything about which programs are used with a mac and the only
version of harmony assistant I know of is the one for pc that I have.
Rick

"Laurence Payne" lpayne1NOSPAM@dslDOTpipexDOTcom wrote in message
news
On Tue, 28 Nov 2006 08:53:05 -0500, "Richard"
wrote:

According to a lot of people I've personally spoken to, owning a mac
versus
a pc is at least one more layer of problems that they can eliminate. Like
so
many other folks, I'm tired of babying my pc every time I need to use it
for
something new. I'm also tired of running into the limitations of the
software I use on my pc. It's just not been effective.

For example, a few years back I bought a notation program that came highly
recommended from the internet, I forget where on the internet now, but, it
is called harmony assistant. The very first time I used it, all was well,
punching in a transcription that I had written down on paper from years
ago,
that is, until I hit an upper register limit. At that point the software
company gave me a whole lot of chores to do on my computer that involved
configuring my computer. It was like programing and installing or
selecting
different drivers. It was so typical of pc's - the whys of the
instructions
were were not explained but expected to be followed, so that if the
instructions didn't map out every step for me, which instructions rarely
do,
the configuration would fail. So, this is not the first time I've had a
big
headache with my pc. It's time. I can get it working. But is it worth the
time?, time that I could be spending doing creative work.


Did the Mac version of Harmony Assistant have a different upper
register limit? Was it configurable at all? :-)

[Geoff]

Richard wrote:

I'm interested in the various studio and live micing techniques you
may use to get the "real" sound from your guitars to your audience's
ears. Steel string, classical, electric/clean, and electric/dirty.
What mics? Do you DI?

Richard,

If you know so little about computers, music technology, etc., I suggest
the first thing you should buy is about six months worth of industry
magasines, and some books. I suggest Sound On Sound and Recording. These
mags apretty much down to earth, and address musical and technical issues
rather than computer religon.

geoff

[Geoff]

Richard wrote:
That's great Richard, the description on the interenet were not clear
to me that there was a sound card inside those preamps.
Anyway, for $239, that's not a bad start. I was going to take Peter's
recommendation for an M-Audio Audiophile pci card for, what is it,
$120 to take the place of my Santa Cruz card. As far as the mic went,
recommended smaller capsules for classical guitar recording I'm not
so sure is because of a lack of the lower frequencies as much as
more of an emphasis on high frequencies.

Rick

"Richard Crowley" wrote in message
...
"Richard" wrote ...
What soundcards are out there that you might recommend?

"Bigguy" wrote ...
...
Cheapest setup: $450 approx
Edirol UA-25

Better: $650 approx
Edirol UA-25

Better: $850 approx
RME Multiface 24/96

Better: $1,500 approx
RME Multiface 24/96

?Best?: $2,000 approx ;-)
RME Multiface 24/96

He identifed two in the messsage you replied to. (Edirol UA-25
& RME Multiface 24/96) Do you not like those? Not clear why
you are you seeking recommendations for others?

[Geoff]

Richard wrote:

According to a lot of people I've personally spoken to, owning a mac
versus a pc is at least one more layer of problems that they can
eliminate. Like so many other folks, I'm tired of babying my pc every
time I need to use it for something new. I'm also tired of running
into the limitations of the software I use on my pc. It's just not
been effective.

Let's see - you where speaking to Mac owners with the usual compulsion to
justify their investment.



For example, a few years back I bought a notation program that came
highly recommended from the internet, I forget where on the internet
now, but, it is called harmony assistant. The very first time I used
it, all was well, punching in a transcription that I had written down
on paper from years ago, that is, until I hit an upper register
limit. At that point the software company gave me a whole lot of
chores to do on my computer that involved configuring my computer.

That's the application - not the platform or OS.

It
was like programing and installing or selecting different drivers. It
was so typical of pc's - the whys of the instructions were were not
explained but expected to be followed, so that if the instructions
didn't map out every step for me, which instructions rarely do, the
configuration would fail. So, this is not the first time I've had a
big headache with my pc. It's time. I can get it working. But is it
worth the time?, time that I could be spending doing creative work.

"Creative". Oh, you need a Mac then.


geoff

[Richard]

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
Richard wrote:

According to a lot of people I've personally spoken to, owning a mac
versus a pc is at least one more layer of problems that they can
eliminate. Like so many other folks, I'm tired of babying my pc every
time I need to use it for something new. I'm also tired of running
into the limitations of the software I use on my pc. It's just not
been effective.

Let's see - you where speaking to Mac owners with the usual compulsion to
justify their investment.



For example, a few years back I bought a notation program that came
highly recommended from the internet, I forget where on the internet
now, but, it is called harmony assistant. The very first time I used
it, all was well, punching in a transcription that I had written down
on paper from years ago, that is, until I hit an upper register
limit. At that point the software company gave me a whole lot of
chores to do on my computer that involved configuring my computer.

That's the application - not the platform or OS.

It
was like programing and installing or selecting different drivers. It
was so typical of pc's - the whys of the instructions were were not
explained but expected to be followed, so that if the instructions
didn't map out every step for me, which instructions rarely do, the
configuration would fail. So, this is not the first time I've had a
big headache with my pc. It's time. I can get it working. But is it
worth the time?, time that I could be spending doing creative work.

"Creative". Oh, you need a Mac then.


geoff

Then I ask you. Is it true what I hear, that there fewer programs written
for mac only, but in order to use these programs one doesn't require a
degree in computer programming?

Thanks,
Rick

[Geoff]

Richard wrote:

Then I ask you. Is it true what I hear, that there fewer programs
written for mac only, but in order to use these programs one doesn't
require a degree in computer programming?

Everybody that uses anything other than a Mac requires a degree in computer
programming ? Better tell that to 90% of computer users.

Might help if you want to write programs, but not even necessary then...

geoff

[Laurence Payne]

On Tue, 28 Nov 2006 15:19:51 -0500, "Richard"
wrote:

geoff

Then I ask you. Is it true what I hear, that there fewer programs written
for mac only, but in order to use these programs one doesn't require a
degree in computer programming?

If you stick to Mac's "lifestyle" applications, supplied with the
machine, you'll very likely find life pretty easy. When you want to
go further, or add more hardware, you'll find both platforms can be
pigs to set up. Or everything may be smooth "plug and play". You
never can tell.

Once you're actually running a program, you won't know which platform
you're using, apart from cosmetic quirks.

[Mike Rivers]

Geoff wrote:

If you know so little about computers, music technology, etc., I suggest
the first thing you should buy is about six months worth of industry
magasines, and some books.

I'd say that he forget about computers and record with a recorder.
He'll get a lot more done. I don't understand why people who are
aritistically creative (or think they are) bog themselves down in
technology when there are much easier solutions. Heck, he could even go
to a studio and pay someone else to worry about the technology.

[Richard]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
ups.com...

Geoff wrote:

If you know so little about computers, music technology, etc., I suggest
the first thing you should buy is about six months worth of industry
magasines, and some books.

I'd say that he forget about computers and record with a recorder.
He'll get a lot more done. I don't understand why people who are
aritistically creative (or think they are) bog themselves down in
technology when there are much easier solutions. Heck, he could even go
to a studio and pay someone else to worry about the technology.


I'm not that removed from the 21st century, otherwise I wouldn't be looking
into computer based recording. It's just a pain in the ass we all learn to
deal with, put up with. At the point we don't anymore is the point when we
decide to use different solutions.

[Ray Thomas]

Richard,

This may be out of your price range ...but then again look at what you get
in the package bargain: mic preamps, soundcard/interface/AD converter,
recorder, phantom power source, external storage drive, firewire connection
to a computer (mac or PC). All you need in addition is a pair of good mics,
a mic stand, pair of mic cables.....oh, and a computer to burn your final CD
Link is http://sounddevices.com/download/ste...le-reprint.pdf
Wish I had the 4 track version........!

Ray

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
Richard wrote:

I'm interested in the various studio and live micing techniques you
may use to get the "real" sound from your guitars to your audience's
ears. Steel string, classical, electric/clean, and electric/dirty.
What mics? Do you DI?

Richard,

If you know so little about computers, music technology, etc., I suggest
the first thing you should buy is about six months worth of industry
magasines, and some books. I suggest Sound On Sound and Recording. These
mags apretty much down to earth, and address musical and technical issues
rather than computer religon.

geoff

[Richard]

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
Richard wrote:

I'm interested in the various studio and live micing techniques you
may use to get the "real" sound from your guitars to your audience's
ears. Steel string, classical, electric/clean, and electric/dirty.
What mics? Do you DI?

Richard,

If you know so little about computers, music technology, etc., I suggest
the first thing you should buy is about six months worth of industry
magasines, and some books. I suggest Sound On Sound and Recording. These
mags apretty much down to earth, and address musical and technical issues
rather than computer religon.

geoff

That was a quote from someone asking Howe a question and not mine. Read the
post again.

Rick

[[email protected]]

Despite what Apple might like you to thing, a Mac won't make you creative.

Keep what you have now, use N-Track studio (or whatever) , and spend the $$$
on mics.

geoff

Very true, but let's assume we're *all* creative here. Mac presents
fewer obstacles for expressing that creativity -- right out of the box.

I use both platforms. I appreciate the Mac because when I install new
programs and plug in my new gear, everything works. Not true on my PC.
However, I do appreciate how my PC keeps my troubleshooting and
problem-solving skills honed.