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[email protected] ssmusic214@gmail.com is offline
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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

On Monday, July 29, 2013 5:16:47 PM UTC-5, Bob Quintal wrote:
" wrote in

:



on the board. Everything is soldered on one single board. There


is nothing and bench technician can do to fix the problem




Baloney!








Competent bench technicians can repair solder joints, and replace


bad




components soldered to printed circuit boards.








If the problem is diagnosed as a RoHS compliant (e.g. brittle)


solder




joint, it may be easy for a competent technician to fix.








If the problem is diagnosed as a bad resistor, it may be easy for


a




competent technician to fix.








Q








Dah..........


And how exactly bad solder joint can cause EXACTLY THE SAME


PROBLEM in 4 different units?






One of many possibilities is that one batch of a part (resistor,

capacitor or IC) may have a defect in that a solder pad on that lot

of devices was contaminated with some oil. That part is used in one

place on each board. so each board will have the same problem after

the solder joint corrodes about 4 years after being soldered.



I've seen it happen.



--

Bob Q.

PA is y I've altered my address.


I've seen it happen too many times. And in all those cases I was able to quickly find the problem by lightly tapping on the board and re-solder the joint. Not this time.
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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

On Monday, July 29, 2013 5:31:49 PM UTC-5, Mike Rivers wrote:
On 7/29/2013 2:53 PM, wrote:



There is no separate FX circuit board inside. And no plug in chips on the board.


Everything is soldered on one single board. There is nothing and bench technician can do to fix the problem




Replace a chip, maybe?





--

For a good time, call
http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com


Replace it with what? Another chip with same problem?
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On Monday, July 29, 2013 5:38:23 PM UTC-5, Mike Rivers wrote:
On 7/29/2013 4:15 PM, wrote:

....

Somebody from Behringer website just posted on my video with the promise to solve the problem to my satisfaction.




Hopefully he gave you explicit instructions on how to get the mixer from

your place to theirs. And sent you a prepaid shipping label. Keep us

posted.





--

For a good time, call
http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com


If they pay shipping for out of warranty gear, it's perfectly fine with me.
But I am not spending any more money on those things.
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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

On Mon, 29 Jul 2013 07:26:19 +0100 "Peter Larsen"
wrote in article

skrev i en meddelelse
...

Exactly the same problem in 3 different units? Because of bad solder
joint?
All bought far apart in time!
Far out!
I have 2 of them:
RX1202FX (Serial # N1000158486, Date Code 1001)
RX1202FX (Serial # S1006617486, Date Code 1012)
with EXACTLY THE SAME PROBLEM!

No pots or sliders or switches on the unit have ANY EFFECT ON THE PROBLEM
(tried every single one 100x). Only FX master knob even on min volume (And
master volume slider, of course).
Stores do not stock them and trying one in the store won't work since the
problem appears intermittently for no apparent reason.


Send in for warranty repair then or return for a refund and move on in your
life.

Kind regards

Peter Larsen

On Sunday, July 28, 2013 1:20:48 PM UTC-5, wrote:
Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ddwGDdhTdY

please post.



I took a look at the YouTube video. There's a recent (4 hours old)
comment from a user "berhinger" promising help.
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wrote in message
...
For a good time, call http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com


Replace it with what? Another chip with same problem?


Well wht do you think ? Maybe another chip that doesn't have the same
problem. Or maybe the problem is in the attachment.

geoff




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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

Ron C wrote:

On 7/29/2013 1:15 PM, Les Cargill wrote:
Mike Rivers wrote:
On 7/29/2013 8:15 AM, Les Cargill wrote:

Software isn't intermittent.
Yes, it is. Frequently.

No, it isn't. The environment is intermittent.




*Sigh* Software can be, and frequently is intermittent.
Trust me on this...

Examples please.


Read the manufacturers notes on a computer bios upgrade and remember: all
hardware is ultimately analog, Dave Haynie said so, so it is correct.

Kind regards

Peter Larsen

==
Later...
Ron Capik


--

Peter Larsen
Langeås 20
4281 Gørlev
3582 1612


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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

wrote:

On Sunday, July 28, 2013 1:20:48 PM UTC-5, wrote:
Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ddwGDdhTdY

please post.


No, we are not gonna go viral with your witchhunt, cut it, forget it, would
you yourself Sir be so kind as to please behave in a professional manner,
thank you very much!

If you paid attention to the video there was NOTHING plugged into the
mixer and all the sliders and trim pots at "0". It sounds EXACTLY the
same even when I unplug XLR OUTs and listen via headphone output. Any
possibility of ground loop is ZERO, ZILCH, NADA!


It can be helpful to simply describe the problemm and the circumstances that
accompany it and leaving it at that. Theorizing is not always a good idea.
You first fix to try is to take some plugs of whatever type that plugs into
the contraption and short them, so that hot, cold and ground is tied
together inside the plug, insert them and see if the problem is solved. IF
so, then you have a clear and simple trouble report to Behringer with actual
facts about how the problem behaves AND you yourself have walked one extra
mile, the next extra mile is to pay for shipment.

Put some positive energy into this instead of bashing Behringer all over
cyberspace, yeah - it is almost shamanism, but what you send out comes back
to you, so all that negative energy aint gonna help you no ****, fix your
attitude. And if you don't want to do all of that, then commit the units to
recycling and move on with your life, don't stay stuck in anger over having
bought something cheap that was too cheap for your use.

Any manufacturer wants to solve such issues, they want happy campers, but
give them a chance for doing it. Behringer has in fact been highly
professional to the extent their actions on usenet has been visible over the
years.

Kind regards

Peter Larsen




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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

wrote:

There is no daughter board inside. Not even single chip socket.
Everything is on one single motherboard soldered in solid. I even
cleaned every possible plug in connector. And I used both units in
dozens of different venues with same results. There are already 4
units out there (and still counting) with EXACTLY THE SAME PROBLEM.
Need more evidence of design flaw?


OK, so you have used these units in a dozen of venues in spite of them being
faulty and presumeably thus ruining your show? - I don't know about you, but
I do not like hardware to damage my credibility, it either works or goes
somewhere else. Here is why: you can buy hardware if you have money -
obviously you have to make budget and wishes meet, but you can only earn
credibility and it takes 30 years to so do.

I have made sound recordings since 1970, and yes, I have goofed, some of
them have been atrociously poor, I have had to drive home for another ReVox
and make a recording on a quarter track machine, I have had to record a
recital in mono because of equipment failure - I could have raced home for
something else and solved it, but chose not to so as to not disrupt the
pre-concert rehearsal gambling it would be the right choice and had the
quartett say that it so was because the recording was for them and the
concert was for the audience and I have had to call a now late friend and
ask him help because I had forgotten my R44 PSU, I could have run on
batteries, but it would have been a pestulence to have to rush to a gas
station or kiosk and get enough to feel comfy and would have disturbed
pre-concert rehearsal, something I have become very careful about avoiding
since my Microsoft certification exams and starting as a Storyteller.

And you have done "dozens of shows" with broken stuff with a valid warranty
instead of sending it in for repairs?

Kind regards

Peter Larsen










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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

On Tuesday, July 30, 2013 1:54:57 AM UTC-5, Peter Larsen wrote:
wrote:



There is no daughter board inside. Not even single chip socket.


Everything is on one single motherboard soldered in solid. I even


cleaned every possible plug in connector. And I used both units in


dozens of different venues with same results. There are already 4


units out there (and still counting) with EXACTLY THE SAME PROBLEM.


Need more evidence of design flaw?




OK, so you have used these units in a dozen of venues in spite of them being

faulty and presumeably thus ruining your show? - I don't know about you, but

I do not like hardware to damage my credibility, it either works or goes

somewhere else. Here is why: you can buy hardware if you have money -

obviously you have to make budget and wishes meet, but you can only earn

credibility and it takes 30 years to so do.



I have made sound recordings since 1970, and yes, I have goofed, some of

them have been atrociously poor, I have had to drive home for another ReVox

and make a recording on a quarter track machine, I have had to record a

recital in mono because of equipment failure - I could have raced home for

something else and solved it, but chose not to so as to not disrupt the

pre-concert rehearsal gambling it would be the right choice and had the

quartett say that it so was because the recording was for them and the

concert was for the audience and I have had to call a now late friend and

ask him help because I had forgotten my R44 PSU, I could have run on

batteries, but it would have been a pestulence to have to rush to a gas

station or kiosk and get enough to feel comfy and would have disturbed

pre-concert rehearsal, something I have become very careful about avoiding

since my Microsoft certification exams and starting as a Storyteller.



And you have done "dozens of shows" with broken stuff with a valid warranty

instead of sending it in for repairs?



Kind regards



Peter Larsen


Entire problem limited to FX processor ONLY.
As long as I don't use it, Mixer section works fine to my satisfaction,
Still perfectly useable as the submixers for live gigs.
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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

On Monday, July 29, 2013 8:35:28 PM UTC-5, Scott Dorsey wrote:
wrote:

There is no daughter board inside. Not even single chip socket. Everything =


is on one single motherboard soldered in solid. I even cleaned every possib=


le plug in connector.




That's how cheap gear is made today. The Mackie 8-buss console is all one

huge board. But that does not mean it cannot be repaired or modified, it

just means it's a bit more work.



If you don't like it, pony up and buy an ATI. There is a reason why the

Behringer costs a tiny fraction of the cost of a professional console.



And I used both units in dozens of different venues w=


ith same results. There are already 4 units out there (and still counting) =


with EXACTLY THE SAME PROBLEM. Need more evidence of design flaw?




Yes, but do you have the same problem with a terminated input or only

when the input is disconnected?



Or are you routing the output of the effects unit into the same buss that

is driving it?

--scott



--

"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."


I tried it every possible way. Nothing that I do in mixer section has any effect on FX processor. And there is no way to route FX anywhere. FX processor is hard wired to Mains/Control room. There is only SOLO button that lets you listen FX only on Control outs. It has no effect on the problem.
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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

On Monday, July 29, 2013 8:35:28 PM UTC-5, Scott Dorsey wrote:
wrote:

There is no daughter board inside. Not even single chip socket. Everything =


is on one single motherboard soldered in solid. I even cleaned every possib=


le plug in connector.




That's how cheap gear is made today. The Mackie 8-buss console is all one

huge board. But that does not mean it cannot be repaired or modified, it

just means it's a bit more work.



If you don't like it, pony up and buy an ATI. There is a reason why the

Behringer costs a tiny fraction of the cost of a professional console.



And I used both units in dozens of different venues w=


ith same results. There are already 4 units out there (and still counting) =


with EXACTLY THE SAME PROBLEM. Need more evidence of design flaw?




Yes, but do you have the same problem with a terminated input or only

when the input is disconnected?



Or are you routing the output of the effects unit into the same buss that

is driving it?

--scott



--

"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."


I don't see how any ATI gear would be any help. It has no built in FX processors. And that's where the problem is. With FX off Mixer section works perfectly fine. Still very useable as submixer on any gig.
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John Williamson John Williamson is offline
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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

Scott Dorsey wrote:
John Williamson wrote:
geoff wrote:
"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
If you don't like it, pony up and buy an ATI. There is a reason why the
Behringer costs a tiny fraction of the cost of a professional console.
But it says "Pro" in the name ;-)

That's as may be, but this side of the Atlantic, "Pro" doesn't always
mean "professional", there's another word that starts the same way....


Prolapsis?

Grin Let's just say that some women are pro's in both senses of the word.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.
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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

On Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:52:05 AM UTC-5, Mike Rivers wrote:
On 7/29/2013 6:55 PM, wrote:



Replace a chip, maybe?


Replace it with what? Another chip with same problem?




No, another chip that's soldered in by hand and carefully inspected. And

while he's at it, inspect the rest of the board for bad solder joints.





--

For a good time, call
http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com


And how bench technician at repair center can "inspect" the chip that has known intermittent design flaws? Clairvoyance?
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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?


wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:52:05 AM UTC-5, Mike Rivers wrote:
On 7/29/2013 6:55 PM, wrote:



Replace a chip, maybe?


Replace it with what? Another chip with same problem?




No, another chip that's soldered in by hand and carefully inspected. And

while he's at it, inspect the rest of the board for bad solder joints.


For a good time, call
http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com

And how bench technician at repair center can "inspect" the chip that has
known intermittent design flaws? Clairvoyance?


If the design flaw is known, then it often relates to a batch of chips that
were made with the same flaw. Chips are made in batches that are essentially
identical. The exterior of the chip can have a batch number, lot number,
date code, some kind of marking that is unique to chips that were made the
same. If you look at a chip it has a number of markings in addition to the
type number and manufacturer's name. Some of them relate to the batch that
the chip is a member of.

Someone in the know sends out a memo with the code number, and the technican
inspects the chip to see if it has that marking.


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On Tuesday, July 30, 2013 11:21:57 AM UTC-5, Arny Krueger wrote:
wrote in message

...

On Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:52:05 AM UTC-5, Mike Rivers wrote:


On 7/29/2013 6:55 PM, wrote:








Replace a chip, maybe?




Replace it with what? Another chip with same problem?








No, another chip that's soldered in by hand and carefully inspected. And




while he's at it, inspect the rest of the board for bad solder joints.




For a good time, call
http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com



And how bench technician at repair center can "inspect" the chip that has


known intermittent design flaws? Clairvoyance?




If the design flaw is known, then it often relates to a batch of chips that

were made with the same flaw. Chips are made in batches that are essentially

identical. The exterior of the chip can have a batch number, lot number,

date code, some kind of marking that is unique to chips that were made the

same. If you look at a chip it has a number of markings in addition to the

type number and manufacturer's name. Some of them relate to the batch that

the chip is a member of.



Someone in the know sends out a memo with the code number, and the technican

inspects the chip to see if it has that marking.


That's why I emailed Behringer twice with description of the problem and the question if the chip problem was identified and fixed. Got only auto-responce: "Send the unit in repair center".
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On Tue, 30 Jul 2013 09:28:55 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

That's why I emailed Behringer twice with description of the problem and the question if the chip problem was identified and fixed. Got only auto-responce: "Send the unit in repair center".


Which is, of course, precisely what you should have done.

d
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Default Anybody having same problems with Behringer mixers?

On Tuesday, July 30, 2013 12:18:12 PM UTC-5, Don Pearce wrote:
On Tue, 30 Jul 2013 09:28:55 -0700 (PDT), "

wrote:



That's why I emailed Behringer twice with description of the problem and the question if the chip problem was identified and fixed. Got only auto-responce: "Send the unit in repair center".




Which is, of course, precisely what you should have done.



d


Brilliant idea!
Just waste money and time without any results.
'been there, done that too many times.....
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On Mon, 29 Jul 2013 11:29:11 -0700, (hank alrich)
wrote:

Mike Rivers wrote:

On 7/29/2013 10:40 AM,
wrote:

And when I posted the problem on Behriner users forum another guy
reported EXACTLY THE SAME PROBLEM! The unit I bought brand new just ran
out of warranty, so I am stuck with 2 lemmons from Behringer.


You got a response (two, actually) from a customer support person at
Behringer. They want your unit (or units) to study the problem. Don't
worry about them being just out of warranty. Get them into the hands of
the people who can help. They aren't doing you any good, and we sure
can't help you.

If you didn't get a useful reply from
try again.
Point them to the forum thread and ask where and how to ship your units
off to get the suspicious board replaced. Don't tell them they have a
design problem. There may be a manufacturing engineering problem that
causes the intermittent behavior, and the best way they can fix that is
to study known defective units.

Don't waste your time bitching here, do something pro-active to help
yourself and other users of Behringer products that share the same
effects circuit board.


What Mike said. Keep in mind that one's behavior may generate a positive
or negative response from those capable of offering assistance. A good
attitude and restraint in thinking one is qualified to assess the root
of a problem can go a long way in the direction of satisfactory
resolution.

All Behringer kit is not created alike. Years ago Behringer replaced a
couple of DEQ2496's I'd installed in a dance studio, which failed just
out of warranty. The replacement units are still working, as are the
others that were installed. This is roughly six years of 12 to 16 hour
days, 360+ days a year.

A wide variety of causes may underlie this type of repeated failure. The
Great Capacitor Formula Robbery comes to mind, a situation that affected
electronics of very many types from lots of manufacturers, for a long
time.

Diagnosis is unlikely if one does not have the failed examples to
examine. Short of that it's guesswork, and welcome to the innernut.



There was one Behringer unit from the bad electrolyte days that I
looked at that had over 50 bad electrolytics. It went into the trash.
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wrote in message
...

Behringer offered help AFTER I uploaded the video.
Before that I didn't get much response from them. And they even closed the
thread on the subject I put up on their users forum.
http://forum.behringer.com/showthrea...-with-RX1202FX


I wonder why ....

Where you bullied as a child ?

geoff


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wrote in message
...
I tried it every possible way. Nothing that I do in mixer section has any
effect on FX processor. And there is no way to route FX anywhere. FX
processor is hard wired to Mains/Control room. There is only SOLO button
that lets you listen FX only on Control outs. It has no effect on the
problem.


I'd suggest you send it/them in and get them fixed. Or throw them away and
get something else.

What do you hope to acheive by continuing your seemingly increasingly
pointless crusade here ?

geoff


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"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...

But it says "Pro" in the name ;-)

That's as may be, but this side of the Atlantic, "Pro" doesn't always
mean "professional", there's another word that starts the same way....


Prolapsis?
--scott



Prosecute. We must prosecute those nasty B-people !

Or maybe prod or proctoloise them.

geoff


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wrote in message
...
Someone in the know sends out a memo with the code number, and the
technican

inspects the chip to see if it has that marking.


That's why I emailed Behringer twice with description of the problem and
the question if the chip problem was identified and fixed. Got only
auto-responce: "Send the unit in repair center".


So maybe that's what you should do then.

geoff


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