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#1
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Fire-Eye Development now offers a very simple, completely featureless,
less costly version of the Red-Eye, called the Dee-Eye. Daren put this together in response to sound humans requesting it for venues. No battery, no boost, no high frequency control - phantom powered, tuner loop, input and output, in a very small box, built very stoutly. http://www.fire-eye.com/ -- shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/ http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri |
#2
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
hank alrich wrote:
Fire-Eye Development now offers a very simple, completely featureless, less costly version of the Red-Eye, called the Dee-Eye. Daren put this together in response to sound humans requesting it for venues. No battery, no boost, no high frequency control - phantom powered, tuner loop, input and output, in a very small box, built very stoutly. http://www.fire-eye.com/ Neat, thanks! Kind regards Peter Larsen |
#3
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Peter Larsen wrote:
hank alrich wrote: Fire-Eye Development now offers a very simple, completely featureless, less costly version of the Red-Eye, called the Dee-Eye. Daren put this together in response to sound humans requesting it for venues. No battery, no boost, no high frequency control - phantom powered, tuner loop, input and output, in a very small box, built very stoutly. http://www.fire-eye.com/ Neat, thanks! Daren comes to most o four shows when we play in Austin. He's a fan of acoustic music, even when, as this morning, it gets played in a packed and noisy brunch venue. He brought the very first Dee-Eye to show me, and left it with me as a demo unit. It is remarkably compact. -- shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/ http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri |
#5
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Fire-Eye Development now offers a very simple, completely featureless,
less costly version of the Red-Eye, called the Dee-Eye. Just in time for Christmas too.......they could have called it 'Rudolph', the Red-Eyed Rein-Dee-Eye. C. |
#6
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Steve Hawkins wrote:
(hank alrich) wrote in news:1kcukbr.1b4h9rp1r4yioyN% : Peter Larsen wrote: hank alrich wrote: Fire-Eye Development now offers a very simple, completely featureless, less costly version of the Red-Eye, called the Dee-Eye. Daren put this together in response to sound humans requesting it for venues. No battery, no boost, no high frequency control - phantom powered, tuner loop, input and output, in a very small box, built very stoutly. http://www.fire-eye.com/ Neat, thanks! Daren comes to most o four shows when we play in Austin. He's a fan of acoustic music, even when, as this morning, it gets played in a packed and noisy brunch venue. He brought the very first Dee-Eye to show me, and left it with me as a demo unit. It is remarkably compact. Do you know what the input impedance and gain specs are on these units? Greater the 1M ohm is not a spec and I'd like to know how much amplification they provide, 10dB, 20dB.....? He doesn't spec the input impedance beyond that statement. Once upon a time that might have put me off. Fortunately my first introduction to the device was during a soundcheck, when Mark Creaney noticed I had a guitar in one hand, a mandolin in the other, and a single PADI, and offered me another DI so I wouldn't have to swap instruments into the Baggs. I connected the mando, hit a chord and went "WTF???" They provide almost no amplification when not in boost mode, and even then, the output level is within what we would call mic level. Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. IME they also work extremely well with passive electromagnetic pickups, i.e., with Strats, Teles, Les Pauls, Jazz and P basses, Bill Lawrence pickups, etc. In fact, internally, once the signal is buffered at the input, the level is decreased in order to prevent clipping in the effect stomp boxes many players deploy. During his prototyping stage he found that he'd created a fine sounding device that often turned to crap when those effects were inserted. He bought a bunch of stomp boxes, hit his test bench with them and discovered that almost all of them clipped at a surprisingly low input level. Shaidri and I recently went to Daren's house and connected the walnut McC and her fiddle to a Red Eye Twin Mix, to see if we could clip it while feeding it both sources. The 'scope told us, "No way", and I heartily flogged the guitar, while she laid into the fiddle, which even with normal playing has much greater output than the K&K rig. The original Red-Eye Twin will be superseded by the Mix version once the original Twin stock has been sold. The Dee-Eye has even more headroom, and will not clip with a 5V input. -- shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/ http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri |
#7
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
hank alrich wrote:
Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? -- LP http://www.LarryPattis.com American Guitar Masters http://www.AmericanGuitarMasters.com |
#8
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060%
lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve Hawkins |
#9
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
(hank alrich) wrote in news:1kcvl84.n43bd81d7764cN%
: Steve Hawkins wrote: (hank alrich) wrote in news:1kcukbr.1b4h9rp1r4yioyN% : Peter Larsen wrote: hank alrich wrote: Fire-Eye Development now offers a very simple, completely featureless, less costly version of the Red-Eye, called the Dee-Eye. Daren put this together in response to sound humans requesting it for venues. No battery, no boost, no high frequency control - phantom powered, tuner loop, input and output, in a very small box, built very stoutly. http://www.fire-eye.com/ Neat, thanks! Daren comes to most o four shows when we play in Austin. He's a fan of acoustic music, even when, as this morning, it gets played in a packed and noisy brunch venue. He brought the very first Dee-Eye to show me, and left it with me as a demo unit. It is remarkably compact. Do you know what the input impedance and gain specs are on these units? Greater the 1M ohm is not a spec and I'd like to know how much amplification they provide, 10dB, 20dB.....? He doesn't spec the input impedance beyond that statement. Once upon a time that might have put me off. Fortunately my first introduction to the device was during a soundcheck, when Mark Creaney noticed I had a guitar in one hand, a mandolin in the other, and a single PADI, and offered me another DI so I wouldn't have to swap instruments into the Baggs. I connected the mando, hit a chord and went "WTF???" They provide almost no amplification when not in boost mode, and even then, the output level is within what we would call mic level. Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. IME they also work extremely well with passive electromagnetic pickups, i.e., with Strats, Teles, Les Pauls, Jazz and P basses, Bill Lawrence pickups, etc. In fact, internally, once the signal is buffered at the input, the level is decreased in order to prevent clipping in the effect stomp boxes many players deploy. During his prototyping stage he found that he'd created a fine sounding device that often turned to crap when those effects were inserted. He bought a bunch of stomp boxes, hit his test bench with them and discovered that almost all of them clipped at a surprisingly low input level. Shaidri and I recently went to Daren's house and connected the walnut McC and her fiddle to a Red Eye Twin Mix, to see if we could clip it while feeding it both sources. The 'scope told us, "No way", and I heartily flogged the guitar, while she laid into the fiddle, which even with normal playing has much greater output than the K&K rig. The original Red-Eye Twin will be superseded by the Mix version once the original Twin stock has been sold. The Dee-Eye has even more headroom, and will not clip with a 5V input. Thanks! If he ever decides to do a preamp, let me know. Steve Hawkins |
#10
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Larry Pattis wrote:
hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It's hit or miss there. Sometimes it works fine, and other times not well at all. For instance, with Al Evans' High Noon with active system begets a horrible result. With Andrew Hardin's Baggs UST and active system begets a better result than Andrew has otherwise experienced. I try to discourage those with active systems from buying, unless we get to try it first. -- shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/ http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri |
#11
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
fSteve Hawkins wrote:
Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve Hawkins He has no intention of taking a "next step" in that direction. He designed it to do a specfic thing and it does that better than anything else I've ever used. For the intended purpose preamplification happens at the console. IMO, in terms of sound quality for string instruments with passive systems the Countryman isn't even close. -- shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/ http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri |
#12
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Steve Hawkins wrote:
(hank alrich) wrote in news:1kcvl84.n43bd81d7764cN% : Steve Hawkins wrote: (hank alrich) wrote in news:1kcukbr.1b4h9rp1r4yioyN% : Peter Larsen wrote: hank alrich wrote: Fire-Eye Development now offers a very simple, completely featureless, less costly version of the Red-Eye, called the Dee-Eye. Daren put this together in response to sound humans requesting it for venues. No battery, no boost, no high frequency control - phantom powered, tuner loop, input and output, in a very small box, built very stoutly. http://www.fire-eye.com/ Neat, thanks! Daren comes to most o four shows when we play in Austin. He's a fan of acoustic music, even when, as this morning, it gets played in a packed and noisy brunch venue. He brought the very first Dee-Eye to show me, and left it with me as a demo unit. It is remarkably compact. Do you know what the input impedance and gain specs are on these units? Greater the 1M ohm is not a spec and I'd like to know how much amplification they provide, 10dB, 20dB.....? He doesn't spec the input impedance beyond that statement. Once upon a time that might have put me off. Fortunately my first introduction to the device was during a soundcheck, when Mark Creaney noticed I had a guitar in one hand, a mandolin in the other, and a single PADI, and offered me another DI so I wouldn't have to swap instruments into the Baggs. I connected the mando, hit a chord and went "WTF???" They provide almost no amplification when not in boost mode, and even then, the output level is within what we would call mic level. Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. IME they also work extremely well with passive electromagnetic pickups, i.e., with Strats, Teles, Les Pauls, Jazz and P basses, Bill Lawrence pickups, etc. In fact, internally, once the signal is buffered at the input, the level is decreased in order to prevent clipping in the effect stomp boxes many players deploy. During his prototyping stage he found that he'd created a fine sounding device that often turned to crap when those effects were inserted. He bought a bunch of stomp boxes, hit his test bench with them and discovered that almost all of them clipped at a surprisingly low input level. Shaidri and I recently went to Daren's house and connected the walnut McC and her fiddle to a Red Eye Twin Mix, to see if we could clip it while feeding it both sources. The 'scope told us, "No way", and I heartily flogged the guitar, while she laid into the fiddle, which even with normal playing has much greater output than the K&K rig. The original Red-Eye Twin will be superseded by the Mix version once the original Twin stock has been sold. The Dee-Eye has even more headroom, and will not clip with a 5V input. Thanks! If he ever decides to do a preamp, let me know. Steve Hawkins Ain't gonna happen. It differs from a typical DI in that is has no dedicated DI output, though one can use the send output of the effects insrt loop for that purpose. -- shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/ http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri |
#13
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
(hank alrich) wrote in news:1kcvqsn.1hvh9u5bcoo4yN%
: Larry Pattis wrote: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It's hit or miss there. Sometimes it works fine, and other times not well at all. For instance, with Al Evans' High Noon with active system begets a horrible result. With Andrew Hardin's Baggs UST and active system begets a better result than Andrew has otherwise experienced. I try to discourage those with active systems from buying, unless we get to try it first. Whoa, what do they think is causing that, overdriving the input or a tone/impedance mismatch thing? The onboard stuff is usually designed to be plugged directly into an amp or console. Steve Hawkins |
#14
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Steve Hawkins wrote:
Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve, bear with me, I'd like to understand what problem it is that it doesn't solve since it does the job of interfacing a high impedance source, be it inductive (magnetic) or a piezo, to a standard impedance balanced mic or line input. For me this just started with "Hey, nice to have", but it has led to the supplementary question: which pickups could/should I consider for a classical spanish guitar, if any? Steve Hawkins Kind regards Peter Larsen |
#15
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
"Peter Larsen" wrote in
k: Steve Hawkins wrote: Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve, bear with me, I'd like to understand what problem it is that it doesn't solve since it does the job of interfacing a high impedance source, be it inductive (magnetic) or a piezo, to a standard impedance balanced mic or line input. A good DI should be transparent, neither adding nor subtracting from the instrument's sound. It's purpose is to also allow Hi-z instruments and equipment to use long cable runs (100's of feet). I like to have control over the "color" of the signal I send to the board/amplifier. I prefer the sound dude just take care of feedback and leave the board EQ flat. I also use multiple guitars and want to be able to turn down the volume to switch guitars without needing some other device or flagging the sound dude to mute the signal. The preamp I currently use is matched to the pickups I use and has a DI output. Also, if I'm using a couple of effects pedals it's nice to have the extra gain and I can't tell you the number of times the Phase Switch has solved a feedback problem. For me this just started with "Hey, nice to have", but it has led to the supplementary question: which pickups could/should I consider for a classical spanish guitar, if any? Hank and I both use the passive version of the K&K Sound, Pure Western Mini pickup. No batteries, preamp or nest of wires inside the guitar. I use the K&K Sound, Pure XLR preamp with mine. The K&K pickup wants to see a 1M ohm input impedance. A lot of the preamps on the market are 10M ohm input for the UST pickups from Baggs, Fishman and such. If you're a "Classical" player I'm not sure any pickup will make you happy. The Classical guys I've done sound for all wanted to be mic'd and woe be unto me if the mic is a bright sounding one. If you just like the nylon sound I'd look into the K&K, they make a classical guitar version. http://www.kksound.com/pureclassic.html http://www.kksound.com/purexlrpreamp.html Steve Hawkins |
#16
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Steve Hawkins wrote in
31.10: "Peter Larsen" wrote in k: Steve Hawkins wrote: Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve, bear with me, I'd like to understand what problem it is that it doesn't solve since it does the job of interfacing a high impedance source, be it inductive (magnetic) or a piezo, to a standard impedance balanced mic or line input. A good DI should be transparent, neither adding nor subtracting from the instrument's sound. It's purpose is to also allow Hi-z instruments and equipment to use long cable runs (100's of feet). I like to have control over the "color" of the signal I send to the board/amplifier. I prefer the sound dude just take care of feedback and leave the board EQ flat. I also use multiple guitars and want to be able to turn down the volume to switch guitars without needing some other device or flagging the sound dude to mute the signal. The preamp I currently use is matched to the pickups I use and has a DI output. Also, if I'm using a couple of effects pedals it's nice to have the extra gain and I can't tell you the number of times the Phase Switch has solved a feedback problem. For me this just started with "Hey, nice to have", but it has led to the supplementary question: which pickups could/should I consider for a classical spanish guitar, if any? Hank and I both use the passive version of the K&K Sound, Pure Western Mini pickup. No batteries, preamp or nest of wires inside the guitar. I use the K&K Sound, Pure XLR preamp with mine. The K&K pickup wants to see a 1M ohm input impedance. A lot of the preamps on the market are 10M ohm input for the UST pickups from Baggs, Fishman and such. If you're a "Classical" player I'm not sure any pickup will make you happy. The Classical guys I've done sound for all wanted to be mic'd and woe be unto me if the mic is a bright sounding one. If you just like the nylon sound I'd look into the K&K, they make a classical guitar version. http://www.kksound.com/pureclassic.html http://www.kksound.com/purexlrpreamp.html Steve Hawkins Forgot to mention, Shoreline has the best prices on K7K gear. http://www.shorelinemusic.com/amplification/kk.shtml |
#17
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Peter Larsen wrote:
Steve Hawkins wrote: Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve, bear with me, I'd like to understand what problem it is that it doesn't solve since it does the job of interfacing a high impedance source, be it inductive (magnetic) or a piezo, to a standard impedance balanced mic or line input. Steve wants more control over the signal he's sending to the console than I require for most of my performances. Sometimes I'll ask for a change in monitor EQ that may or may not play well with EQ to the house. If I take care of it on stage I've left the operator no option for a different setting for the house. For performances where I'll need more control I have a variety of options, the most common of which is a two-space rack with a Great River MP2-MH preamp and a pair of Speck ASC-T EQ's. When I need to mute the Red-Eye I step on the tuner, currently a Sonic Research ST-200. Given that I am most often carrying only one guitar and a mandolin, the Red-Eye Twin has been a blessing in that I need only mute via the stompbox tuner, and then switch the Red-Eye to the other input, so I don't have to request that the operator mute the channel. The R-E Twin has gain adjustment for each source, to allow matching levels sent to the console, and thereby requiring only a single snake and board channel for the two instruments. I am satisfied with the tone of each instrument to the point that whatever EQ works for one in the house and in the stage monitors also works for the other instrument. If that was not the case this approach wouldn't work worth a darn. Several operators have commented that they hadn't needed to EQ anything for me, nor for Shaidri. For me this just started with "Hey, nice to have", but it has led to the supplementary question: which pickups could/should I consider for a classical spanish guitar, if any? Some time next year I plan to have K&K's Pure Classic pickup installed in my nylon string guitar, a late '60's H. Tamura & Sons instrument. http://www.kksound.com/pureclassic.html Steve Hawkins Kind regards Peter Larsen -- shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/ http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri |
#18
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Steve Hawkins wrote:
(hank alrich) wrote in news:1kcvqsn.1hvh9u5bcoo4yN% : Larry Pattis wrote: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It's hit or miss there. Sometimes it works fine, and other times not well at all. For instance, with Al Evans' High Noon with active system begets a horrible result. With Andrew Hardin's Baggs UST and active system begets a better result than Andrew has otherwise experienced. I try to discourage those with active systems from buying, unless we get to try it first. Whoa, what do they think is causing that, overdriving the input or a tone/impedance mismatch thing? The onboard stuff is usually designed to be plugged directly into an amp or console. I don't know, Steve. Daren has commented that his design is meant to receive the signal directly from a pickup and that in the case of active systems there should be no benefit. Sometimes that is the case, and sometimes not. He's not much interested in the active system scenario. -- shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/ http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri |
#19
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Steve Hawkins wrote:
Hank and I both ... Thanks guys! Kind regards Peter Larsen |
#20
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
On 12/26/2011 11:20 AM, Larry Pattis wrote:
So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? I'm not sure what a UST is (sounds like a weapon of mass destruction) but if it's a guitar with active electronics, the answer is "maybe." If you're plugging the guitar directly into an amplifier, then probably not. Any damage or damage control at the interface to the pickup has already been done by the instrument's electronics. If you need to run the guitar through 100 feet of cable and back to a mixer, then for sure. It gives you a balanced output that, to a mixer, looks like a microphone. It will probably do less damage at this job than a cheap DI box. I think that some of you need to understand the difference between a "guitar preamp" and a "DI." A preamp has voltage gain - it'll make it easier for you to overdrive an amplifier. But it can't have too much gain because instrument pickups have a pretty high level as is. Slam on a guitar and you can get 5 volts out of a pickup. Scream into a sensitive microphone and you might get a half a volt. A pickup doesn't quite make it to what we consider to be "line" level but it's much higher than mic level. Most line inputs can squeeze enough gain to get a usable signal if you were to plug a pickup directly in, but with a nominal line input impedance of 10k to 20k ohms, the pickup's inductance, if it's a magnetic pickup, will start to look like a high cut filter. And if it's a piezo pickup, the line input will try to draw too much current from the pickup and the level will go way down. A DI is an impedance matcher, and in this sense, it has current gain and actually voltage loss. You don't want to put 5 volts into a standard mic preamp (or mic input on a mixer), nor do you want to load a high impedance (which is why they have a pretty high output level) pickup output with a 1500 ohm mic preamp input impedance. No one box will solve all problems or improve anything that you connect to it. It depends. -- "Today's production equipment is IT based and cannot be operated without a passing knowledge of computing, although it seems that it can be operated without a passing knowledge of audio." - John Watkinson http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com - useful and interesting audio stuff |
#21
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Mike Rivers wrote:
On 12/26/2011 11:20 AM, Larry Pattis wrote: So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? I'm not sure what a UST is UST = Under Saddle Transducer SBT = Sound Board Transducer (sounds like a weapon of mass destruction) In some hands, yes. See Ty's recent comments about letting someone else abuse his Martin. but if it's a guitar with active electronics, the answer is "maybe." If you're plugging the guitar directly into an amplifier, then probably not. Any damage or damage control at the interface to the pickup has already been done by the instrument's electronics. If you need to run the guitar through 100 feet of cable and back to a mixer, then for sure. It gives you a balanced output that, to a mixer, looks like a microphone. It will probably do less damage at this job than a cheap DI box. I think that some of you need to understand the difference between a "guitar preamp" and a "DI." A preamp has voltage gain - it'll make it easier for you to overdrive an amplifier. But it can't have too much gain because instrument pickups have a pretty high level as is. Slam on a guitar and you can get 5 volts out of a pickup. Scream into a sensitive microphone and you might get a half a volt. A pickup doesn't quite make it to what we consider to be "line" level but it's much higher than mic level. Most line inputs can squeeze enough gain to get a usable signal if you were to plug a pickup directly in, but with a nominal line input impedance of 10k to 20k ohms, the pickup's inductance, if it's a magnetic pickup, will start to look like a high cut filter. And if it's a piezo pickup, the line input will try to draw too much current from the pickup and the level will go way down. A DI is an impedance matcher, and in this sense, it has current gain and actually voltage loss. You don't want to put 5 volts into a standard mic preamp (or mic input on a mixer), nor do you want to load a high impedance (which is why they have a pretty high output level) pickup output with a 1500 ohm mic preamp input impedance. No one box will solve all problems or improve anything that you connect to it. It depends. -- shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/ http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri |
#22
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
On 26 Dec 2011 19:56:17 GMT
Steve Hawkins wrote: "Peter Larsen" wrote in k: Steve Hawkins wrote: Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve, bear with me, I'd like to understand what problem it is that it doesn't solve since it does the job of interfacing a high impedance source, be it inductive (magnetic) or a piezo, to a standard impedance balanced mic or line input. A good DI should be transparent, neither adding nor subtracting from the instrument's sound. It's purpose is to also allow Hi-z instruments and equipment to use long cable runs (100's of feet). This is exactly what the Red-Eye products actually do We also find that the mix guys tend to leave our signal flat at the board and be happy about it. And the Twin allows us to match gain for a couple instruments, as you mention you need. Somehow, the seeming need to change 'colour' appears to melt in the mist once a Red-Eye is inserted in the signal chain - ya just want to play the insrument! So have one of us send you one to try, k? -- donh donh at audiosys dot com |
#23
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
don hindenach wrote in
: On 26 Dec 2011 19:56:17 GMT Steve Hawkins wrote: "Peter Larsen" wrote in k: Steve Hawkins wrote: Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve, bear with me, I'd like to understand what problem it is that it doesn't solve since it does the job of interfacing a high impedance source, be it inductive (magnetic) or a piezo, to a standard impedance balanced mic or line input. A good DI should be transparent, neither adding nor subtracting from the instrument's sound. It's purpose is to also allow Hi-z instruments and equipment to use long cable runs (100's of feet). This is exactly what the Red-Eye products actually do We also find that the mix guys tend to leave our signal flat at the board and be happy about it. And the Twin allows us to match gain for a couple instruments, as you mention you need. Somehow, the seeming need to change 'colour' appears to melt in the mist once a Red-Eye is inserted in the signal chain - ya just want to play the insrument! So have one of us send you one to try, k? Don, I appreciate the offer, but I require a true preamp and the control it gives me. There are too many situations where a Phase Switch saves the day in addition to dealing with rooms and sound systems that don't flatter the guitar. I know what the guitar sounds like, the sound dudes don't. If I trust them, I set my EQ flat, give them the gain they want and away we go. Heck, I feel pretty good about my little $150 K&K preamp after finding out Pierre Bensusan is using a $7K mixer onstage. :-) Happy New Year! Steve Hawkins |
#24
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
In article ,
don hindenach wrote: On 26 Dec 2011 19:56:17 GMT Steve Hawkins wrote: "Peter Larsen" wrote in k: Steve Hawkins wrote: Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve, bear with me, I'd like to understand what problem it is that it doesn't solve since it does the job of interfacing a high impedance source, be it inductive (magnetic) or a piezo, to a standard impedance balanced mic or line input. A good DI should be transparent, neither adding nor subtracting from the instrument's sound. It's purpose is to also allow Hi-z instruments and equipment to use long cable runs (100's of feet). This is exactly what the Red-Eye products actually do We also find that the mix guys tend to leave our signal flat at the board and be happy about it. And the Twin allows us to match gain for a couple instruments, as you mention you need. Somehow, the seeming need to change 'colour' appears to melt in the mist once a Red-Eye is inserted in the signal chain - ya just want to play the insrument! So have one of us send you one to try, k? Or just buy one as I have. Looking forward to its arrival, and will pass comment when I've had some time with it. MJRB |
#25
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
In article 0,
Steve Hawkins wrote: don hindenach wrote in : On 26 Dec 2011 19:56:17 GMT Steve Hawkins wrote: "Peter Larsen" wrote in k: Steve Hawkins wrote: Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve, bear with me, I'd like to understand what problem it is that it doesn't solve since it does the job of interfacing a high impedance source, be it inductive (magnetic) or a piezo, to a standard impedance balanced mic or line input. A good DI should be transparent, neither adding nor subtracting from the instrument's sound. It's purpose is to also allow Hi-z instruments and equipment to use long cable runs (100's of feet). This is exactly what the Red-Eye products actually do We also find that the mix guys tend to leave our signal flat at the board and be happy about it. And the Twin allows us to match gain for a couple instruments, as you mention you need. Somehow, the seeming need to change 'colour' appears to melt in the mist once a Red-Eye is inserted in the signal chain - ya just want to play the insrument! So have one of us send you one to try, k? Don, I appreciate the offer, but I require a true preamp and the control it gives me. There are too many situations where a Phase Switch saves the day in addition to dealing with rooms and sound systems that don't flatter the guitar. I know what the guitar sounds like, the sound dudes don't. If I trust them, I set my EQ flat, give them the gain they want and away we go. Heck, I feel pretty good about my little $150 K&K preamp after finding out Pierre Bensusan is using a $7K mixer onstage. :-) Happy New Year! Steve Hawkins I have a K&K and PADI, but neither give me a sound with which I am completely happy (and they are too damned complicated for the effect that they have). With a decent sound man on the desk I get a better sound putting the K&K straight into the desk, but I think that the Red Eye may give me that little bit of control that I sometimes need. Having listened to an assortment of comments, both here and on other sites I have ordered a Red Eye. MJRB |
#26
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
hank alrich wrote:
Mike Rivers wrote: On 12/26/2011 11:20 AM, Larry Pattis wrote: So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? I'm not sure what a UST is UST = Under Saddle Transducer SBT = Sound Board Transducer (sounds like a weapon of mass destruction) In some hands, yes. See Ty's recent comments about letting someone else abuse his Martin. *keyboard* You owe me a new laptop, Hank. It didn't enjoy the coffee as much as I do. ---Jeff |
#27
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
On 31 Dec 2011 04:44:26 GMT
Steve Hawkins wrote: don hindenach wrote in : On 26 Dec 2011 19:56:17 GMT Steve Hawkins wrote: "Peter Larsen" wrote in k: Steve Hawkins wrote: Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve, bear with me, I'd like to understand what problem it is that it doesn't solve since it does the job of interfacing a high impedance source, be it inductive (magnetic) or a piezo, to a standard impedance balanced mic or line input. A good DI should be transparent, neither adding nor subtracting from the instrument's sound. It's purpose is to also allow Hi-z instruments and equipment to use long cable runs (100's of feet). This is exactly what the Red-Eye products actually do We also find that the mix guys tend to leave our signal flat at the board and be happy about it. And the Twin allows us to match gain for a couple instruments, as you mention you need. Somehow, the seeming need to change 'colour' appears to melt in the mist once a Red-Eye is inserted in the signal chain - ya just want to play the insrument! So have one of us send you one to try, k? Don, I appreciate the offer, but I require a true preamp and the control it gives me. There are too many situations where a Phase Switch saves the day in addition to dealing with rooms and sound systems that don't flatter the guitar. I know what the guitar sounds like, the sound dudes don't. If I trust them, I set my EQ flat, give them the gain they want and away we go. Heck, I feel pretty good about my little $150 K&K preamp after finding out Pierre Bensusan is using a $7K mixer onstage. :-) Happy New Year! Steve Hawkins OK, send me the K&K and I'll open up the top end like crazy with a chip swap :-) If you don't hear the difference (you will!), you don't pay me(it ain't even all that much). -- donh donh at audiosys dot com |
#28
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
don hindenach wrote in
: On 31 Dec 2011 04:44:26 GMT Steve Hawkins wrote: don hindenach wrote in : On 26 Dec 2011 19:56:17 GMT Steve Hawkins wrote: "Peter Larsen" wrote in k: Steve Hawkins wrote: Larry Pattis wrote in news:261220110820512060% lid: hank alrich wrote: Their mission is to convert an unbalanced signal from a passive piezo pickup into a balanced mic feed. So, is there any use for this box with an internally pre-amped UST? It sounds like a high quality, active DI, like the Countryman and Radial offerings. It really isn't a preamp, IMHO. If they ever decide to take that next step, I'd be interested. Steve, bear with me, I'd like to understand what problem it is that it doesn't solve since it does the job of interfacing a high impedance source, be it inductive (magnetic) or a piezo, to a standard impedance balanced mic or line input. A good DI should be transparent, neither adding nor subtracting from the instrument's sound. It's purpose is to also allow Hi-z instruments and equipment to use long cable runs (100's of feet). This is exactly what the Red-Eye products actually do We also find that the mix guys tend to leave our signal flat at the board and be happy about it. And the Twin allows us to match gain for a couple instruments, as you mention you need. Somehow, the seeming need to change 'colour' appears to melt in the mist once a Red-Eye is inserted in the signal chain - ya just want to play the insrument! So have one of us send you one to try, k? Don, I appreciate the offer, but I require a true preamp and the control it gives me. There are too many situations where a Phase Switch saves the day in addition to dealing with rooms and sound systems that don't flatter the guitar. I know what the guitar sounds like, the sound dudes don't. If I trust them, I set my EQ flat, give them the gain they want and away we go. Heck, I feel pretty good about my little $150 K&K preamp after finding out Pierre Bensusan is using a $7K mixer onstage. :-) Happy New Year! Steve Hawkins OK, send me the K&K and I'll open up the top end like crazy with a chip swap :-) If you don't hear the difference (you will!), you don't pay me(it ain't even all that much). I'm not sure I'd want a brighter sounding guitar, I ussually cut the treble. Steve Hawkins |
#29
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
Steve Hawkins wrote:
don hindenach wrote in : On 31 Dec 2011 04:44:26 GMT Steve Hawkins wrote: Don, I appreciate the offer, but I require a true preamp and the control it gives me. There are too many situations where a Phase Switch saves the day in addition to dealing with rooms and sound systems that don't flatter the guitar. I know what the guitar sounds like, the sound dudes don't. If I trust them, I set my EQ flat, give them the gain they want and away we go. Heck, I feel pretty good about my little $150 K&K preamp after finding out Pierre Bensusan is using a $7K mixer onstage. :-) Happy New Year! Steve Hawkins OK, send me the K&K and I'll open up the top end like crazy with a chip swap :-) If you don't hear the difference (you will!), you don't pay me(it ain't even all that much). I'm not sure I'd want a brighter sounding guitar, I ussually cut the treble. Steve Hawkins I'd not assume that a linear extension of the top of the band would equal a "brighter" sound. It could turn out the opposite, especially if distortion in the 2KHz-10KHz region is reduced. -- shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/ http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri |
#30
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
(hank alrich) wrote in news:1kdcrfu.gaovnowrr02kN%
: Steve Hawkins wrote: don hindenach wrote in : On 31 Dec 2011 04:44:26 GMT Steve Hawkins wrote: Don, I appreciate the offer, but I require a true preamp and the control it gives me. There are too many situations where a Phase Switch saves the day in addition to dealing with rooms and sound systems that don't flatter the guitar. I know what the guitar sounds like, the sound dudes don't. If I trust them, I set my EQ flat, give them the gain they want and away we go. Heck, I feel pretty good about my little $150 K&K preamp after finding out Pierre Bensusan is using a $7K mixer onstage. :-) Happy New Year! Steve Hawkins OK, send me the K&K and I'll open up the top end like crazy with a chip swap :-) If you don't hear the difference (you will!), you don't pay me(it ain't even all that much). I'm not sure I'd want a brighter sounding guitar, I ussually cut the treble. Steve Hawkins I'd not assume that a linear extension of the top of the band would equal a "brighter" sound. It could turn out the opposite, especially if distortion in the 2KHz-10KHz region is reduced. Understood, but there is a such a thing as "too clean". Don, if you have one I can try, I'd be interested. Steve Hawkins |
#31
Posted to rec.audio.pro,rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
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New Basic Version of Red-Eye - the Dee-Eye
On 05 Jan 2012 01:56:57 GMT
Steve Hawkins wrote: (hank alrich) wrote in news:1kdcrfu.gaovnowrr02kN% : Steve Hawkins wrote: don hindenach wrote in : On 31 Dec 2011 04:44:26 GMT Steve Hawkins wrote: Don, I appreciate the offer, but I require a true preamp and the control it gives me. There are too many situations where a Phase Switch saves the day in addition to dealing with rooms and sound systems that don't flatter the guitar. I know what the guitar sounds like, the sound dudes don't. If I trust them, I set my EQ flat, give them the gain they want and away we go. Heck, I feel pretty good about my little $150 K&K preamp after finding out Pierre Bensusan is using a $7K mixer onstage. :-) Happy New Year! Steve Hawkins OK, send me the K&K and I'll open up the top end like crazy with a chip swap :-) If you don't hear the difference (you will!), you don't pay me(it ain't even all that much). I'm not sure I'd want a brighter sounding guitar, I ussually cut the treble. Steve Hawkins I'd not assume that a linear extension of the top of the band would equal a "brighter" sound. It could turn out the opposite, especially if distortion in the 2KHz-10KHz region is reduced. Understood, but there is a such a thing as "too clean". Don, if you have one I can try, I'd be interested. Steve Hawkins If I had one I'd send it, but they all got sold in favor of the Red-Eye. and yes, I never equated the high-end extension with "brighter", only with "smoother" -- donh donh at audiosys dot com |
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