So is Auralex worthless? Do the Lenrds and stuff really not do **** for the
sub lows and lows? Is treating a room with Auralex ineffective? Would going
with some mini traps from here www.realtraps.com be better?

The problem is that high frequency reflections aren't usually the problem.
Room modes don't occur at 6K (except in rooms 2 inches across).

So does this mean that if I want to control my low end, the auralex Lenrd's and
360's will be useless?

Just look at the specs for the specific models you're considering. They
usually list the frequency range they're effective in. If it's not in the
lower register, you know the deal.
"FrankDebro1" wrote in message
...
The problem is that high frequency reflections aren't usually the
problem.
Room modes don't occur at 6K (except in rooms 2 inches across).

So does this mean that if I want to control my low end, the auralex
Lenrd's and
360's will be useless?

In article writes:

So does this mean that if I want to control my low end, the auralex Lenrd's and
360's will be useless?

Depends on how much control you need or want. Of course they'll do
something, but they won't be as effective as a well designed and
properly installed bass trap system. You don't just carry these things
into the room and everything instantly sounds better. It's possible to
over-trap a room, and it's possible that the worst problems aren't in
the low end.

If you want an effective job, call in a consultant and get the help of
a studio architect. If you want an out-of-the-box solution, describe
your room (drawings and photos help) to the makers of acoustic
treatments, ask for their recommendation, and ask what you can expect
(and what you can't).

Nobody can tell you how effective any product is just from your simple
question. It's a complex field.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

Frank,

Do the Lenrds and stuff really not do **** for the sub lows and lows?

It's all a matter of degree. Yes, foam corner treatment works at low
frequencies. All absorbing materials have a linear fall-off as the frequency
lowers, so even one-inch thick foam does SOMETHING at the lowest
frequencies. What really matters is HOW MUCH a bass trap absorbs at the
various low frequencies. The biggest difference between products like a
LENRD versus a MiniTrap is the performance below about 200 Hz.

--Ethan

--------------------
www.realtraps.com
The acoustic treatment experts

FrankDebro1 wrote:
So is Auralex worthless? Do the Lenrds and stuff really not do **** for the
sub lows and lows? Is treating a room with Auralex ineffective? Would going
with some mini traps from here www.realtraps.com be better?

Foam isn't worthless, but it won't do anything for the low end. It's a
specific tool for a specific problem. It won't give you more diffusion,
it won't do a thing below 1 KC, but if you need high end absorption it's
a good idea.

What's wrong that you want to fix?
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Ethan Winer wrote:

The biggest difference between products like a
LENRD versus a MiniTrap is the performance below about 200 Hz.

Where it counts the most in typical rooms!

(FrankDebro1) wrote in message ...
So is Auralex worthless? Do the Lenrds and stuff really not do **** for the
sub lows and lows? Is treating a room with Auralex ineffective? Would going
with some mini traps from here www.realtraps.com be better?


Not completely worthless...just overpriced. Go here instead:
http://foambymail.com/soundproofing.html

I recently treated my room and received consultation from an
acoustician only after I had already purchased some "corner bass
absorbers" and 3" wedge foam from the above website (good service,
good prices). Rather than return the foam, he helped me make the most
out of it by telling me how to build somewhat complex framing panels
for the foam and telling where to place them in the room. As a result
the room sounds MUCH better - more balanced, stereo image is better,
etc.

Carey Carlan wrote in message .10...

Auralex does exactly what it's supposed to do--dampen high frequency
reflections. So would a set of heavy theatre curtains.



Where would I get theater curtains at?

Peter

Foam isn't worthless, but it won't do anything for the low end. It's a

specific tool for a specific problem. It won't give you more diffusion,
it won't do a thing below 1 KC, but if you need high end absorption it's
a good idea.

What's wrong that you want to fix?
--scott

It works a lot better (lower hz) if you space it with a frame away from the
wall.

I built squares from 1x2, glued the foam crap to those and hung them on the
wall like picture frames. Also put some stick-on weather strip on the back to
keep them from rattling. The 2 inch stuff is as effecive as the 4 inch stuff
when placed this way.

Spaced out a bit, they do help absorb sound down to around 500hz or so. I found
that a little helps a lot, more than a little just deadens the hell out of
everything.

The corner absorbers didn't really do much for me. The modes still build up,
there's really not much you can do to fight the physics of a 10x10x8 room. All
you can do is throw in the towel and get a 14x18x10 room when you can afford
it.


--
Dr. Nuketopia
Sorry, no e-Mail.
Spam forgeries have resulted in thousands of faked bounces to my address.

(FrankDebro1) wrote in message ...
The problem is that high frequency reflections aren't usually the problem.
Room modes don't occur at 6K (except in rooms 2 inches across).

So does this mean that if I want to control my low end, the auralex Lenrd's and
360's will be useless?

Most of the designs and products I have reviewed that are intended to
diminish bass frequencies have 1 or 2 things in common. They are very
dense, and usually fairly heavy, and they usually incorporate an air
gap either between the material and the wall, or built into the unit
itself.


Mike http://www.mmeproductions.com

Nuke,

there's really not much you can do to fight the physics of a 10x10x8 room.


Well, you could certainly do better than foam corners! Real bass traps can
make a room like that manageable, anyway.

--Ethan

------------------
www.realtraps.com
The acoustic treatment experts

(FrankDebro1) wrote in message ...
So is Auralex worthless? Do the Lenrds and stuff really not do **** for the
sub lows and lows? Is treating a room with Auralex ineffective? Would going
with some mini traps from here www.realtraps.com be better?

Well, they seem to absorb mostly highs and high mids. Ethan @ Real
Traps really seems to know his stuff.

Nathan Eldred
http://www.atlasproaudio.com

The corner absorbers didn't really do much for me. The modes still build up,
there's really not much you can do to fight the physics of a 10x10x8 room. All
you can do is throw in the towel and get a 14x18x10 room when you can afford
it.

I definitely agree with the Nuke guy... It's all about physical
dimensions of the room. Only if you are willing to give up some *real*
real-estate, you are going to get some meaningful low end control.

If not...Ethan Winer does know his stuff and has an excellent homepage
devoted to the argument... mandatory reading for the whole troop!

'Later...

Paul

Not completely worthless...just overpriced. Go here instead:
http://foambymail.com/soundproofing.html

Question is, how flame retardant is this stuff? The wrong kind of goes
up like crazy with the slightest flame. Part of the expense of the
real stuff is the fire retardant. You should take a small sample and
test it.

(Chris Coleman) wrote in message . com...
(FrankDebro1) wrote in message ...
So is Auralex worthless? Do the Lenrds and stuff really not do **** for the
sub lows and lows? Is treating a room with Auralex ineffective? Would going
with some mini traps from here www.realtraps.com be better?


Not completely worthless...just overpriced. Go here instead:
http://foambymail.com/soundproofing.html

I recently treated my room and received consultation from an
acoustician only after I had already purchased some "corner bass
absorbers" and 3" wedge foam from the above website (good service,
good prices). Rather than return the foam, he helped me make the most
out of it by telling me how to build somewhat complex framing panels
for the foam and telling where to place them in the room. As a result
the room sounds MUCH better - more balanced, stereo image is better,
etc.

Along with Ethan, I'd like to throw another name in the hat - D. Terry
Hazelrig. He's the guy who helped me out with my small room (9.5'W x
13'L x 7.5'H). He absolutely knows his stuff, is down to earth, is
easy to work with, his price is right, and he LOVES acoustics. He
also does differential calculus "on the fly" - smart guy, too. His
website is www.diyacoustics.com which, in and of itself, is very
informative and helpful. Give him a call - he'll be happy to help you
out.

"Ethan Winer" ethan at ethanwiner dot com wrote in message ...
Yuri,

Part of the expense of the real stuff is the fire retardant.

Actually, the "real" stuff is made with rigid fiberglass instead of foam. My
company's MiniTraps are Class A fire rated without special sprays or other
retardants. They also perform much better than any foam.

--Ethan

---------------------
www.realtraps.com
The acoustic treatment experts

Yup, Corning 700 series, Knauf or equivalent fiberglass is generally
that way. I was speaking in terms of the open cell foams. The big club
fire should have opened peoples eyes to what they're installing in
thier homes and businesses. A lot of foam products go up like crazy
from just a little flame.