[Chu Gai]

Any thoughts on what's presented in this link?
http://www.gr-research.com/burnin.htm

[Geoff]

Chu Gai wrote:
Any thoughts on what's presented in this link?
http://www.gr-research.com/burnin.htm

All fine, except the drivel about 'electrical burn-in".

geoff

[Eeyore]

Geoff wrote:

Chu Gai wrote:
Any thoughts on what's presented in this link?
http://www.gr-research.com/burnin.htm

All fine, except the drivel about 'electrical burn-in".

Quite !

The idea that capacitors and wire needing 'burn in' is the kind of berserk
******** that's all too common from the audiophools.

Graham

[Geoff]

Eeyore wrote:
Geoff wrote:

Chu Gai wrote:
Any thoughts on what's presented in this link?
http://www.gr-research.com/burnin.htm

All fine, except the drivel about 'electrical burn-in".

Quite !

The idea that capacitors and wire needing 'burn in' is the kind of
berserk ******** that's all too common from the audiophools.

Not to mention 'wire and voice-coils'.

geoff

[Eeyore]

Chu Gai wrote:

Any thoughts on what's presented in this link?
http://www.gr-research.com/burnin.htm

Most of it is utter ********.

A driver does indeed 'loosen up' a bit in the first few hours of use however
with most likely the greatest effect in the low bass. See their results for Fs.
A little like 'running in' a car engine.

There may well be something to it in having an extended 'running in' too
including at quite high power levels. Note that running in a car engine is not
dissimilar again. Take it easy at first and then carefully run it up and down
through its performance range.

Graham

[Mr.T]

"Eeyore" wrote in
message ...
Any thoughts on what's presented in this link?
http://www.gr-research.com/burnin.htm

Most of it is utter ********.

Agreed, so why why do you then say.....

A driver does indeed 'loosen up' a bit in the first few hours of use
however
with most likely the greatest effect in the low bass. See their results
for Fs.
A little like 'running in' a car engine.

Except a car engine stays that way, whereas the speaker will "stiffen" up
again when unused.
So maybe it's more like just bringing a car engine up to normal operating
temperature, rather than running it in.

There may well be something to it in having an extended 'running in' too
including at quite high power levels. Note that running in a car engine is
not
dissimilar again. Take it easy at first and then carefully run it up and
down
through its performance range.

A car engine actually wears metal surfaces. A speaker does not, and I can
see no proof for carefully running a speaker up and down it's range, other
than to establish what it's performance limits are without blowing it up.
Those limits are not likely to increase with time, more likely the reverse.

MrT.

[Arny Krueger]

"Mr.T" MrT@home wrote in message
u...

"Eeyore" wrote in
message ...
Any thoughts on what's presented in this link?
http://www.gr-research.com/burnin.htm

Most of it is utter ********.

Agreed, so why why do you then say.....

A driver does indeed 'loosen up' a bit in the first few hours of use
however
with most likely the greatest effect in the low bass. See their results
for Fs.
A little like 'running in' a car engine.

Most of the changes happen in the first few seconds, and tend to reverse
themselves when the speaker is not used for a while.

But back to the claim that the posted URL points to ********.

Let's take some opening paragraphs:

"Typical observations regarding speaker burn in involves an opening up or
relaxing of the presentation."

Well its true among a few audiophiles, its not a reliably observable effect,
and most people don't notice this sort of thing unless they are "educated"
to.

" Vocals will appear less strained or congested."

********, what little that happens is in the bass.

"The sound smooths out."

If anything happens, the bass becomes less smooth.

"Bass response appears cleaner, tighter, less distorted, and even deeper."

Pretty much the opposite of what happens.

"These same observations are reported day in and day out by people all over
the world and is very consistent."

Well yes, the evangelists of the break-in myth have pretty well spread all
over the world. But the consistency is not there because break-in is mostly
only discussed among high end audiophiles.

"Still there are those who claim that it is the listener that does the
burning in as one gets used to the sound."

Mainly because this is the far stronger effect.

"Funny thing is that if a speaker has a bright, edgy, or fatiguing sound to
it, you will be more fatigued the longer that you listen to it not less
fatigued the longer you listen."

A true statement, but mostly irrelevant to break-in. I've never seen a
speaker stop being bright or edgy due to true physical break-in. The highs
are pretty much unaffected by break in.

[Chu Gai]

I think the measurements were made on a single driver. If one were to
obtain several drivers, how much would the measurements vary? IOW, does
anyone know what's the inherent variability due to manufacturing,
realizing that it probably differs to some degree. How much variance
for say a woofer would be considered acceptable?

[Eeyore]

Chu Gai wrote:

I think the measurements were made on a single driver. If one were to
obtain several drivers, how much would the measurements vary? IOW, does
anyone know what's the inherent variability due to manufacturing,
realizing that it probably differs to some degree. How much variance
for say a woofer would be considered acceptable?

I just replaced a driver in an SR cabinet.

The 'new driver' had 4.1 Ohms DC resistance and the 'old' one had 4.8.
Manufacturing tolerances I imagine.

Graham

[James Lehman]

The temperature of the driver can cause a lot of difference in the stiffness
of the suspension. A voice coil can be quite a heater. I'm not sure I would
want to rely on that though. If you have the means to measure Fs accurately,
try measuring it after the driver has been in the freezer for a while. The
measure it again, after it warms up.

James. )


"Chu Gai" wrote in message
ups.com...
Any thoughts on what's presented in this link?
http://www.gr-research.com/burnin.htm

[Eeyore]

James Lehman wrote:

The temperature of the driver can cause a lot of difference in the stiffness
of the suspension. A voice coil can be quite a heater. I'm not sure I would
want to rely on that though. If you have the means to measure Fs accurately,
try measuring it after the driver has been in the freezer for a while. The
measure it again, after it warms up.

All such measurements should be made at room temp after 'temperature
equalisation'

Incidentally UK pro-audio louspeaker manufacturer quotes Thiele-Small parameters
thus......

Notes
3. Thiele - Small Parameters follow a 300 Watt preconditioning period.
http://www.precisiondevices.co.uk/as...ds/super/8.pdf

Graham

[James Lehman]

All such measurements should be made at room temp after 'temperature
equalisation'

Incidentally UK pro-audio louspeaker manufacturer quotes Thiele-Small
parameters
thus......

Notes
3. Thiele - Small Parameters follow a 300 Watt preconditioning period.
http://www.precisiondevices.co.uk/as...ds/super/8.pdf

Graham


Agreed. But what exactly is "room temperature"? What if your speaker is near
an air duct? All I'm saying is that of all of the things that can have a
real effect on the parameters of a woofer, temperature is a big one.

James. )

[Eeyore]

James Lehman wrote:

All such measurements should be made at room temp after 'temperature
equalisation'

Incidentally UK pro-audio louspeaker manufacturer quotes Thiele-Small
parameters thus......

Notes
3. Thiele - Small Parameters follow a 300 Watt preconditioning period.
http://www.precisiondevices.co.uk/as...ds/super/8.pdf

Graham

Agreed. But what exactly is "room temperature"? What if your speaker is near
an air duct? All I'm saying is that of all of the things that can have a
real effect on the parameters of a woofer, temperature is a big one.

Mostly such measurements are made at 20 or 25 C.

What's an 'air duct' got to do with it ?

Graham

[James Lehman]

What's an 'air duct' got to do with it ?

Graham


I live in Northeast Ohio. We have weather here; air conditioning, heating.
Room temperature is hardly anything constant.

James. )

[Mr.T]

"James Lehman" wrote in message
...
Agreed. But what exactly is "room temperature"?

For the purposes of measurement procedure it is usually accepted as a
constant 20 degC - 23degC. Humidity must also be fixed.
Of course *anything* can be used, IF it is accurately specified, and not
governed by any accepted test procedure you are claiming to follow.

The thing about speaker measurements is that they are rarely done
accurately, and *very rarely* provide proper test conditions or uncertainty
calculations.
A large mountain of salt is often required to accept most figures quoted.

MrT.