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Donovan Digital Donovan Digital is offline
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Default entry-level mixer

I am about ready to buy my first live mixer. I've narrowed it down to
Soundcraft MFX20 and Mackie CFX20.

My 2 Questions;


the mackie has a subwoofer output which feeds an amped/powered
subwoofer system
with a 75hz low cut summed-stereo signal. Is there a way to recreate
this behavior on the soundcraft?


Is the only way to solo listen to a channel on the soundcraft to move
my headphone plug?


A distant third is a Yamaha MG206C-USB, because my associate has a
macbook which we could theoretically use for fx processing. I'm
guessing the latency is unacceptable though.


In general, what does everyone think about these units?


Thanks much


Joseph Stavitsky
Teachers Assistant - Computer Based Recording
Bergen Commuity College
201-951-6148

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Scott Dorsey Scott Dorsey is offline
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Default entry-level mixer

Donovan Digital wrote:
I am about ready to buy my first live mixer. I've narrowed it down to
Soundcraft MFX20 and Mackie CFX20.

My 2 Questions;


the mackie has a subwoofer output which feeds an amped/powered
subwoofer system
with a 75hz low cut summed-stereo signal. Is there a way to recreate
this behavior on the soundcraft?


You can add an external crossover between the amps and the mixer,
which will not ONLY give you a low-pass filter for the subs but also
a low-pass for the mains. This is a whole lot more useful.

Is the only way to solo listen to a channel on the soundcraft to move
my headphone plug?


I don't know, does it have a button marked PFL or SOLO? If not, you
do not have a solo buss. The solo buss is a wonderful thing.

A distant third is a Yamaha MG206C-USB, because my associate has a
macbook which we could theoretically use for fx processing. I'm
guessing the latency is unacceptable though.


I have never used the Yamaha or the Soundcraft, but I will say the Mackie
is really a pain in the neck and a step down from the larger Mackies. The
EQ is even worse than on the 1604 and the faders don't feel so good. It
has a cheesy effects unit that I advise you not to use, but which too many
people are tempted to overuse because it's right there.

In general, what does everyone think about these units?


I'd want to know first of all what your budget is, what your band is like,
how many mike feeds you really have, and what your speaker system is.
How many monitor sends do you need? What makes you think you need effects
on the mains?
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
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Mike Rivers Mike Rivers is offline
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On Mar 23, 1:45 am, Donovan Digital wrote:

I am about ready to buy my first live mixer. I've narrowed it down to
Soundcraft MFX20 and Mackie CFX20.


Right off, I'd weigh strongly toward the Soundcraft, but it depends on
what you really need and how you intend ot use it.

the mackie has a subwoofer output which feeds an amped/powered
subwoofer system
with a 75hz low cut summed-stereo signal. Is there a way to recreate
this behavior on the soundcraft?


Not directly, but you may not need it. If you're using a powered
subwoofer, it may have a crossover built into it (and one at the right
frequency rather than a fixed 75 Hz). And you can always add a
crossover at the mixer output. The subwoofer output on the Mackie CFX
is convenient if you happen to have an old big speaker and power
amplifier laying around and want to add some boom to your mix. But in
a more modern system, it's best to use something else. Same for the
(noisy and undefeatable) graphic equalizer on the Mackie outputs.

Is the only way to solo listen to a channel on the soundcraft to move
my headphone plug?


No need to do that. The headphone output either monitors the PFL
(solo) bus or the selected output bus (Main mix, subgroups, or
external "tape" in). The selected output is what's normally fed to the
headphones, but pressing the PFL switch on any channel overrides that
selection and switches the headphone and monitor outputs as well as
the meters to the soloed channel. Note that these MONITOR outputs are
for speakers in the control room, not to be confused with (or used as)
stage monitors. You'd feed stage monitors from an AUX output.

A distant third is a Yamaha MG206C-USB, because my associate has a
macbook which we could theoretically use for fx processing. I'm
guessing the latency is unacceptable though.


Mixers with a built-in USB output are useful for live recording where
latency doesn't matter. Generally they aren't set up for convenient
work in the studio environment where you're overdubbing and latency
does matter. Like I said, it depends on the application. I've played
with a small MG series Yamaha board and it sounds quite good. Hard to
believe that they can make something that good for the price, but it
feels (and is) quite plastic and might not hold up very long under
hard use. But I don't really know.

In general, what does everyone think about these units?


While I'm a pretty big supporter of Mackie in general, I don't care
for the CFX. It's OK in applications where a one-box solution is
important because nobody really knows how to use a mixer and hook up
components. But it doesn't share many of the design features like the
clean and quiet mic preamps that earned Mackie its reputation for
decent modestly priced mixers.

Is a Mackie VLZ3 within your budget? It doesn't have all the bells and
whistles of the CFX, but those bells and whistles are kind of weak.
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Donovan Digital Donovan Digital is offline
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how about this guy?

http://www.phonic.com/en/mixers/heli...wire-mkii.html

Thanks much

Joe

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Mike Rivers Mike Rivers is offline
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On Mar 23, 8:54 pm, Donovan Digital wrote:
how about this guy?


Oh, I supose that one is OK too. I've never used one or even seen one
up close. The Firewire setup is handy for recording a live show to a
computer but, like the Mackie Onyx Firewire opton, you may find it a
bit cumbersome to use for studio-type recording.where you're
overdubbing to other recorded tracks.


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D C[_2_] D C[_2_] is offline
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Mike Rivers wrote:

Oh, I supose that one is OK too. I've never used one or even seen one
up close. The Firewire setup is handy for recording a live show to a
computer but, like the Mackie Onyx Firewire opton, you may find it a
bit cumbersome to use for studio-type recording.where you're
overdubbing to other recorded tracks.



Years ago, Phonic was the OEM manufacturer for Yamaha. I'm not sure
about now.


I have a general question about these Firewire mixers. Do they record to
separate tracks via Firewire, or do they just provide a stereo mix?
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cedricl cedricl is offline
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On Mar 22, 10:45*pm, Donovan Digital wrote:
I am about ready to buy my first live mixer. I've narrowed it down to
Soundcraft MFX20 and Mackie CFX20.

My 2 Questions;

the mackie has a subwoofer output which feeds an amped/powered
subwoofer system
with a 75hz low cut summed-stereo signal. Is there a way to recreate
this behavior on the soundcraft?

Is the only way to solo listen to a channel on the soundcraft to move
my headphone plug?

A distant third is a *Yamaha MG206C-USB, because my associate has a
macbook which we could theoretically use for fx processing. I'm
guessing the latency is unacceptable though.

In general, what does everyone think about these units?

Thanks much

Joseph Stavitsky
Teachers Assistant - Computer Based Recording
Bergen Commuity College
201-951-6148


I'd check out the Yamaha LS916 or LS932. The 32 has 32 preamps and 16
XLR outputs and you can carry it under your arm. It has two card slots
that you could configure several ways. Put a mLan16 card in a 01V96
and direct record through the firewire of your computer to any Mac
core audio multitrack application. I own a 01V96 with the mLan card
that also works as the control surface for ProTools.
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Donovan Digital Donovan Digital is offline
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Default entry-level mixer


I have a general question about these Firewire mixers. Do they record to
separate tracks via Firewire, or do they just provide a stereo mix?


separate tracks
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Donovan Digital Donovan Digital is offline
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yea list price six grand, maybe later

that said, the first outfit i worked on had one. Good board, but
expensive.
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Arny Krueger Arny Krueger is offline
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"Donovan Digital" wrote in
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I am about ready to buy my first live mixer. I've
narrowed it down to Soundcraft MFX20 and Mackie CFX20.


I really like the MFX20 and the rest of this series of mixers because they
don't cost a ton of money, they have a good pedigre, almost all inputs are
mic inputs, and they have a real insert (for tapping off to record) on just
about every channel.

My 2 Questions;


the mackie has a subwoofer output which feeds an
amped/powered subwoofer system
with a 75hz low cut summed-stereo signal. Is there a way
to recreate this behavior on the soundcraft?


Making mono from a mixer's output is just a couple of resistors in a Y
cable. If you're doing SR, you probably want that, anyway.

Also, there are lots of ways to provide a signal to a sub. One involves
using an Aux send that is only driven by channels from sources (e.g. *not*
vocal microhones) that can't give you problems with feedback. That can work,
too.

Is the only way to solo listen to a channel on the
soundcraft to move my headphone plug?


Well, there are all these PFL buttons. They are for that purpose, even
though their name isn't solo. Another great feature. BTW, Soundcraft gets
points from me for not calling them Solo buttons, because in my lexicon,
they ain't. Macke often seems to think otherwise, and I can live with that,
too when I have no choice. You still have a choice!

A distant third is a Yamaha MG206C-USB, because my
associate has a macbook which we could theoretically use
for fx processing. I'm guessing the latency is
unacceptable though.


In general, what does everyone think about these units?


I wish I had one for small gigs. It looks to me like a great SR board and a
great board for recording. Too bad the whole thing ain't digital! Come back
in 5 years. ;-)

BTW, I answered all your questions by reading;

http://www.soundcraft.com/download.a...nge/MFX_UG.pdf

Which google found in a flash on this page:

http://www.soundcraft.com/product_sh...product_id=149

I've always been of the opinion that I'd rather teach someone how to fish
and fillet, rather than just give them a fish stick. You live next to a lake
of knowlege called the web - please learn how to fish! ;-)

Also, it sounds like you could know more about doing live sound without
hurting yourself (couldn't we all!), You might want to read Yamaha's Sound
Reinforcement Handbook, which again Google can give you a zillion sources
for.






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Arny Krueger Arny Krueger is offline
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"D C" wrote in message

Mike Rivers wrote:

Oh, I supose that one is OK too. I've never used one or
even seen one up close. The Firewire setup is handy for
recording a live show to a computer but, like the Mackie
Onyx Firewire opton, you may find it a bit cumbersome to
use for studio-type recording.where you're overdubbing
to other recorded tracks.



Years ago, Phonic was the OEM manufacturer for Yamaha.
I'm not sure about now.


I have a general question about these Firewire mixers. Do
they record to separate tracks via Firewire, or do they
just provide a stereo mix?


I have a friend who has an Alesis FW mixer, and it provides feeds for both
the stereo mix, and every input. Sweet.


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Arny Krueger Arny Krueger is offline
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"Donovan Digital" wrote in
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yea list price six grand, maybe later


Worth every penny, if you have the pennies. ;-)

that said, the first outfit i worked on had one. Good
board, but expensive.


Right, your OP mentioned the Soundcraft, which looks like a good choice to
me.


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Mike Rivers Mike Rivers is offline
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On Mar 23, 11:53 pm, D C wrote:

I have a general question about these Firewire mixers. Do they record to
separate tracks via Firewire, or do they just provide a stereo mix?


You have to read the literature - carefully. Some do individual
channels (direct outputs to Firewire) and some feed just the stereo
mix to the Firewire output. This particular Phonic mixer appears to
have direct outputs from each of the sixteen channels. And unlike some
others, you have a choice of whether those outputs are taken pre- or
post-EQ, though I didn't dig deeply enough into it to see if this was
a global switch, a switch for each channel, or an internal
modification-by-jumper.
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