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  #161   Report Post  
Kevin Murray
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

1 megawatt for $79.99? I want one! Will I need to add a stiffening cap to
my system? How about a new alternator and extra battery?

Sorry TG, had to do it ;-)


"Tha Ghee" wrote in message
...
"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
Maybe Audiobahn is a little better then you think, i don't know I have

never
used any of their gear. No one is foced to bid on amps that they don't

want on
Ebay. If Audiobahn is the biggest seller on Ebay, then their is a reason

for
it. What is your point?



In article , "Mark Zarella"
wrote:
Checkout Ebay and you'll see what people are paying for old
Orion and PPI amps compared to the new ones.

Ah yes, ebay. Where Audiobahn is the biggest seller.


one reason that Audiobahn sells well on eBay is because it looks pretty,
most people buy car audio comp. based on looks printed specs. when they

get
a little knowledge they learn to buy the used McIn amp and not the 1000kws
for $79.95




  #162   Report Post  
Paul Vina
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

I'll give him this, he's nothing if not consistent.



Paul Vina




"Tha Ghee" wrote in message
...
"Paul Vina" wrote in message
news:t0PGb.481653$275.1379414@attbi_s53...
If by "season" you mean "since his retarded ass started posting here"

then
yes, I agree with you!



Paul Vina

PV you have to give him credit many persons have piled on him and he's
standing his position I like that. The best way for him to learn
similarities and differences he needs to see the circuit boards and
layout/heatsink of the amp and the debt will be settled. If any one can

put
the pics inside and out of all the amps in question this thread may die




  #163   Report Post  
John Durbin
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

Why don't you do your own legwork and post it here, instead of stooping
to childish namecalling? It's not like I have anything to prove, but
clearly YOU have an agenda. Don't expect me to do your research for you...

You could also quit changing the subject and go back to what started
this, your erroneous jumping to concusions about the commonality of
older Orion and PPI designs... or have you finally figured out how far
off base you were?

JD

Captain Howdy wrote:

Call the the Federal Trade Commission and ask for the International Division
of Consumer Protection about that, or in Canada call the Competition Bureau,
Industry Canada. You moron



In article , John Durbin
wrote:



I don't know about spelling it out for Paul, but you should go check
your facts... warranty laws don't cross national borders.




  #164   Report Post  
John Durbin
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

Don't put words in my mouth, pal... what I said was I didn't know the
inner details about the companies in question during that part of their
history. I know the products a lot better than you, which is no surprise
given I worked with many of them over the 17 years I spent working in
retail before moving to Directed. My first exposure was with a/d/s/
products starting in 1977, at Howard Sound's Denver and Boulder
locations. We sold and installed the a/d/s/ 2002/Nakamichi 250 systems,
also the passive 200C and 300C. I own a couple of those systems still...
also worked with more of that early stuff including the 2001 version
with outboard power amp, the first-gen P100 PowerPlate, 300i's, pretty
much all of their mobile products in the period of 1981-1993 here in San
Diego while working at Radioman, and again after founding La Jolla Audio
where we carried the entire mobile line. We were also an authorized
Orion dealer, and as I mentioned elsewhere, dabbled in Precision Power.
We also had a good friend that built competition vehicles with PPI at
the time, and spent sometime playing with their larger surfboard models
as a result. I've installed and repaired all of the above, along the
way. It's not clear to me what your expertise on these products stems
from, other than being confused by a similar heat sink shape.

And, you seem very willing to ignore the comments by John Andreen, all
of which rebutted your claims and which demonstrated a very expert
knowledge of the companies and their products back then. What's wrong,
you only go after people you think can't defend themselves? Whatever,
you picked the wrong target this time... but go on insulting me if it
makes you feel better about yourself. It's a lousy excuse for knowing
what you're talking about though...

I'm sure some of the other "morons" that have listened to what I have
said here about DEI products over the past few years will enjoy your
opinion of them, too.

JD

Captain Howdy wrote:

Like I said, make a phone call, you'll see just what a moron you really are.
The only thing that you know is how to talk out your ass about your products.
Trying to tell people how good your new products are while you openly admitted
that you don't know **** about the products that companies such Orion, PPI and
ADS produced before DEI bought them out. Only a moron would believe anything
that you have to say about DEI related products. We both know that the truth
would be against your best interest.



Where did you dig this theory up? You're almost as clueless about trade
law as you are about amplifiers...

JD
seems to me that everyone and his cousin here at RAC has been sweeping
the floor with you, frankly




  #165   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers



JD, lets break this down. This all started with my comment about Directed 2003
amplifier line looking like the old Alpine V12 line. I do admit that I did
push the issue a little far because you started getting fired up about it,
only to be a prick. This brings me to topic number 2, PPI amplifier cloning. I
not know for a fact that their was cloning going on with the early PPI amp
line, But I do feel that they do/did "look" like Orion GX knock offs with only
the black paint missing, and a hell of a lot more then the Directed 2003
amplifier line looking like the old Alpine V12 line. Not that it even matters
20 years later, give or take a few years. Better yet, not that it ever
mattered at any time.

Topic number 3, Overpriced DEI alarms. Comparing my Viper and Audiovox, I
don't see anything that justifies the extra $200. They both have same
options. They both still work. The viper is 5 years old and the audiovox is 6
years old, both on their second car.

Topic number 4, Older is better. I truly do believe that older PPI, Orion gear
is better then their new gear. Their other people that feel that same
including John Andreen on the PPI part anyways, I know that you read the post
in question and ignored his comments on that issue, just as I did regarding
cloning. I also believe that Ebay sales and final bid prices speak for
themselves. You don't see the same clueless people paying more for 15- 20 year
old Hu.

Topic number 5, DEI's poor Canadian product support. This is what two dealers
had to say when asked why they dropped DEI products. Why would they both lie,
they have nothing to gain by saying this.

Topic 6, Warranty support, who is responsible, the suppler or manufacturer.
The law simply states that the supplier is fully responsible if the supplier
does not identify the manufacturer, at which point the supplier will be seen
as the manufacturer. In fact they are both responsible. If you were to sue,
you could sue both. Trade laws don't stop at any boarders, not anymore. The
same stands for Family law and Ecommerce law. But like I said, the truth is
only a phone call away.


Who do I go after? You, Mark and Paul? You all can defend yourselves just
fine, well maybe not Paul never the less he tries. LOL. John, I can truly say
that I enjoy and agree with most of your posts, as I do with Mark's and Paul's
posts. I just feel that your posts regarding DEI are a little one-sided. This
is the only reason I rattled your cage about DEI. I also know that this post
wouldn't of went as far as it did , if it wasn't regarding DEI.






And, you seem very willing to ignore the comments by John Andreen, all
of which rebutted your claims and which demonstrated a very expert
knowledge of the companies and their products back then. What's wrong,
you only go after people you think can't defend themselves? Whatever,
you picked the wrong target this time... but go on insulting me if it
makes you feel better about yourself. It's a lousy excuse for knowing
what you're talking about though...

I'm sure some of the other "morons" that have listened to what I have
said here about DEI products over the past few years will enjoy your
opinion of them, too.

JD



  #166   Report Post  
John Durbin
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

It's easy to take shots at successful companies like Directed... when
they're justified by the facts, assuming any facts are presented, I
typically ignore them. When things written about us or our products are
misrepresented or outright untrue, I am more likely to respond. I try to
avoid taking a purely company line in the process, as it makes what I
write less credible. Sticking to facts is the better approach. If
everyone on the internet would avoid posting their speculations, myths,
and gossip as fact, it would be a much better place. Less entertaining
maybe, but better...

I will comment on one part of your last post, although again I have
nothing personally to do with our alarm business these days: the
overwhelming majority of dealers and customers in the US does not agree
with your assessment. The survey results that track opinions of our
security products and their value vs. other brands like Audiovox
emphatically show that people do recognize the difference and are
willing to pay for it. We've earned that position through years of
consistent quality, and a lot of hard work in engineering, product and
customer support areas. If you don't agree, that's your prerogative -
but you're in the minority.

On the ebay subject, a casual looksuggests that pricing is not driven by
"old is better" but by simple supply and demand. Old products are
scarcer, and no longer available in quantity at wholesale prices by
dealers - or from manufacturers that dump goods that way sometimes. That
means the products being sold are mostly by end users, that paid more
for them than a dealer would have. I would expect them to sell for more
than current product which by comparison is relatively available and in
the hands of dealers that paid less for them in the first place. Throw
in the predisposition of a certain class of consumers to buy into the
"older is better" mythology (not that it isn't true some times, but
never as often as the auction market would have you believe), and the
model is complete.

JD

Captain Howdy wrote:

JD, lets break this down. This all started with my comment about Directed 2003
amplifier line looking like the old Alpine V12 line. I do admit that I did
push the issue a little far because you started getting fired up about it,
only to be a prick. This brings me to topic number 2, PPI amplifier cloning. I
not know for a fact that their was cloning going on with the early PPI amp
line, But I do feel that they do/did "look" like Orion GX knock offs with only
the black paint missing, and a hell of a lot more then the Directed 2003
amplifier line looking like the old Alpine V12 line. Not that it even matters
20 years later, give or take a few years. Better yet, not that it ever
mattered at any time.

Topic number 3, Overpriced DEI alarms. Comparing my Viper and Audiovox, I
don't see anything that justifies the extra $200. They both have same
options. They both still work. The viper is 5 years old and the audiovox is 6
years old, both on their second car.

Topic number 4, Older is better. I truly do believe that older PPI, Orion gear
is better then their new gear. Their other people that feel that same
including John Andreen on the PPI part anyways, I know that you read the post
in question and ignored his comments on that issue, just as I did regarding
cloning. I also believe that Ebay sales and final bid prices speak for
themselves. You don't see the same clueless people paying more for 15- 20 year
old Hu.

Topic number 5, DEI's poor Canadian product support. This is what two dealers
had to say when asked why they dropped DEI products. Why would they both lie,
they have nothing to gain by saying this.

Topic 6, Warranty support, who is responsible, the suppler or manufacturer.
The law simply states that the supplier is fully responsible if the supplier
does not identify the manufacturer, at which point the supplier will be seen
as the manufacturer. In fact they are both responsible. If you were to sue,
you could sue both. Trade laws don't stop at any boarders, not anymore. The
same stands for Family law and Ecommerce law. But like I said, the truth is
only a phone call away.


Who do I go after? You, Mark and Paul? You all can defend yourselves just
fine, well maybe not Paul never the less he tries. LOL. John, I can truly say
that I enjoy and agree with most of your posts, as I do with Mark's and Paul's
posts. I just feel that your posts regarding DEI are a little one-sided. This
is the only reason I rattled your cage about DEI. I also know that this post
wouldn't of went as far as it did , if it wasn't regarding DEI.







And, you seem very willing to ignore the comments by John Andreen, all
of which rebutted your claims and which demonstrated a very expert
knowledge of the companies and their products back then. What's wrong,
you only go after people you think can't defend themselves? Whatever,
you picked the wrong target this time... but go on insulting me if it
makes you feel better about yourself. It's a lousy excuse for knowing
what you're talking about though...

I'm sure some of the other "morons" that have listened to what I have
said here about DEI products over the past few years will enjoy your
opinion of them, too.

JD




  #167   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers



I will comment on one part of your last post, although again I have
nothing personally to do with our alarm business these days: the
overwhelming majority of dealers and customers in the US does not agree
with your assessment. The survey results that track opinions of our
security products and their value vs. other brands like Audiovox
emphatically show that people do recognize the difference and are
willing to pay for it. We've earned that position through years of
consistent quality, and a lot of hard work in engineering, product and
customer support areas. If you don't agree, that's your prerogative -
but you're in the minority.


I totally believe that to be true. As a matter of fact both of the dealers
that I have talked with (the same ones from my previous posts) said nothing
but positive things regarding DEI and Clifford alarms. One of them went as far
as saying that, I quote" We do not reinstall used alarms with the exception of
Viper alarms, due to their low failure rate".

From my own experience, I have had no problems over the past 5 years with my
Viper 300+, the only thing that I don't like about this model is the built in
shock sensor, which is turned off anyways, since I find them to be a pain in
the butt with any alarm built in or not. Both the Viper and Audiovox we own
have a proximity sensor in place of the shock sensor. This far I have
installed 6 or 7 audiovox alarms (never any all-in-ones) for friends and
family over the past 15 years and never had any negative results or need for
warranty repairs, unlike a crimestopper alarm I used to own. We also have a
pair of Valet car starters that work great, both of them are in their second
car and are used all year around, since both cars have AC.


On the ebay subject, a casual looksuggests that pricing is not driven by
"old is better" but by simple supply and demand. Old products are
scarcer, and no longer available in quantity at wholesale prices by
dealers - or from manufacturers that dump goods that way sometimes. That
means the products being sold are mostly by end users, that paid more
for them than a dealer would have. I would expect them to sell for more
than current product which by comparison is relatively available and in
the hands of dealers that paid less for them in the first place. Throw
in the predisposition of a certain class of consumers to buy into the
"older is better" mythology (not that it isn't true some times, but
never as often as the auction market would have you believe), and the
model is complete.

JD


Let me ask you this, Why are older products in demand at all? There is no
shortage of new products to place a high or higher demand on old products.
Unlike cars, car amplifiers have no classic or vintage value only a higher
chance of failure due to age. If you could buy a brand new amplifier of equal
or better quality for less money or just a little more money with a warranty,
why buy a used one?
  #168   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers



I will comment on one part of your last post, although again I have
nothing personally to do with our alarm business these days: the
overwhelming majority of dealers and customers in the US does not agree
with your assessment. The survey results that track opinions of our
security products and their value vs. other brands like Audiovox
emphatically show that people do recognize the difference and are
willing to pay for it. We've earned that position through years of
consistent quality, and a lot of hard work in engineering, product and
customer support areas. If you don't agree, that's your prerogative -
but you're in the minority.


I totally believe that to be true. As a matter of fact both of the dealers
that I have talked with (the same ones from my previous posts) said nothing
but positive things regarding DEI and Clifford alarms. One of them went as far
as saying that, I quote" We do not reinstall used alarms with the exception of
Viper alarms, due to their low failure rate".

From my own experience, I have had no problems over the past 5 years with my
Viper 300+, the only thing that I don't like about this model is the built in
shock sensor, which is turned off anyways, since I find them to be a pain in
the butt with any alarm built in or not. Both the Viper and Audiovox we own
have a proximity sensor in place of the shock sensor. This far I have
installed 6 or 7 audiovox alarms (never any all-in-ones) for friends and
family over the past 15 years and never had any negative results or need for
warranty repairs, unlike a crimestopper alarm I used to own. We also have a
pair of Valet car starters that work great, both of them are in their second
car also and are used all year around, since both cars have AC.



On the ebay subject, a casual looksuggests that pricing is not driven by
"old is better" but by simple supply and demand. Old products are
scarcer, and no longer available in quantity at wholesale prices by
dealers - or from manufacturers that dump goods that way sometimes. That
means the products being sold are mostly by end users, that paid more
for them than a dealer would have. I would expect them to sell for more
than current product which by comparison is relatively available and in
the hands of dealers that paid less for them in the first place. Throw
in the predisposition of a certain class of consumers to buy into the
"older is better" mythology (not that it isn't true some times, but
never as often as the auction market would have you believe), and the
model is complete.

JD

Let me ask you this, Why are older products in demand at all? There is no
shortage of new products to place a high or higher demand on old products.
Unlike cars, car amplifiers have no classic or vintage value only a higher
chance of failure due to age. If you could buy a brand new amplifier of equal
or better quality for less money or just a little more money with a warranty,
why buy a used one?
  #169   Report Post  
John Durbin
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

That's an excellent question :-)

JD

Captain Howdy wrote:

Let me ask you this, Why are older products in demand at all? There is no
shortage of new products to place a high or higher demand on old products.
Unlike cars, car amplifiers have no classic or vintage value only a higher
chance of failure due to age. If you could buy a brand new amplifier of equal
or better quality for less money or just a little more money with a warranty,
why buy a used one?



  #170   Report Post  
OldOneEye
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

Which Class T amps are you refering to? If you mean the ones with th
plastic cases, those were dropped from the lineup for reliabilit
issues quite a while ago in fact, that is why you see them gettin
blown out.


Juan

Captain Howdy wrote:
*I just like the fact that MTX is doing their own thing in regards t
building
amplifiers. Sort of like Blaupunkt and their new class T amplifiers.

In article , "Joh
Spagnolo
MMXpress.com" wrote:
Oh. OK then.

Thought ya meant something that made em sound better. :-)

I always liked MTX as a great bang for the buck brand. I even had

system
with MTX amps for a while. The old Thunder 2300 and a Thunder 2175.

-
OldOneEy
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
CarAudioForum.com - Usenet Gateway w/over one million posts online
View this thread: http://www.caraudioforum.com/showthr...threadid=16757



  #171   Report Post  
OldOneEye
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

Me a noob? Funny

Rec.Audio.Car Post from about 8 years ago:

http://tinyurl.com/37tt

Febuary 1996. Had only recently discovered the internet at that poin
really.

Did a search in Google for my email (had it for about 8 years as well
tons of junkmail at this point)

http://tinyurl.com/37tt

2000 plus results.

Car Audio Forum:

http://tinyurl.com/3cqov

450 posts, 4/2000 register date

Elite Car Audio Forums:

http://tinyurl.com/yvd2h

1100 posts, Ultimate Member. 8/99 register date

SoundDomain Forums:

http://tinyurl.com/2rzvz

924 posts, Admin/Mod. 1/2000 Register Date

TermPro forums

http://tinyurl.com/2cwhy

426 posts, Member # 127 (14000+ members at this point), 6/1999 registe
date.

CarSound Forum

http://tinyurl.com/395d2

1500+ Posts, 6/2000 register date, Ultra Member.

Canadian Car Audio Forum

http://tinyurl.com/25mq9

150+ posts, 12/2000 register date.

About 6500+ posts on several car audio related forums.

Seems to me that OldOneEye Captain Obvious.

Juan

Captain Howdy wrote:
*What is your point other then being a noob?

In article m
OldOneEye
wrote:
It seems at this point that I should be setting my calendar i

Outlook
for a reminder in December 2004 to reply to a post "2004 Directe

amps
look like Brand X" from Howdy Doody.

Juan

-
OldOneEy
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
CarAudioForum.com - Usenet Gateway w/over one million posts online
View this thread: http://www.caraudioforum.com/showthr...threadid=16757

  #172   Report Post  
Tha Ghee
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

"Kevin Murray" wrote in message
t.cable.rogers.com...
1 megawatt for $79.99? I want one! Will I need to add a stiffening cap

to
my system? How about a new alternator and extra battery?

Sorry TG, had to do it ;-)

that's funny, but a lot of people think like this and when I try to tell
them that Helix is good they look at me crazy, "I've never heard of it how
can it be any good, is it better than JL?"


  #173   Report Post  
Tha Ghee
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

"Paul Vina" wrote in message
news:tT%Gb.206224$_M.912380@attbi_s54...
I'll give him this, he's nothing if not consistent.



Paul Vina

yes he is, I just think you need to let a him find it out for himself


  #174   Report Post  
Tha Ghee
 
Posts: n/a
Default Directed Amplifiers

"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...

Topic number 4, Older is better. I truly do believe that older PPI, Orion

gear
is better then their new gear. Their other people that feel that same
including John Andreen on the PPI part anyways, I know that you read the

post
in question and ignored his comments on that issue, just as I did

regarding
cloning. I also believe that Ebay sales and final bid prices speak for
themselves. You don't see the same clueless people paying more for 15- 20

year
old Hu.

I think you have to take each amp and company on it's own merits, what used
to be good, doesn't always work for now times.


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