[Scott Harker]

Hey all. New to the group and looking for advice.

I've got a '99 civic that's still in great shape, but I need to upgrade
the system. currently I've got a decent Pioneer deck/CD. I'm running
an older Boston Acc. component set up front (5.25s and tweeters), and
some 6x9 3-ways in the rear deck. those are all powered by the unit.
I've got two Kicker comp. 10" subs boxed in the back running off an old
but reliable Alpine 3522 (35w x 2). I'm using an old coustic XM-3
Crossover.

Recently, I lost my bass completely, and I also have some doubts about
the stability of my 3-ways in the back. I'm thinking about getting two
new amps, and replacing the front and rear speakers (keeping the deck
and subs).

Any suggestions? I'm not looking for tons of bass. I want really nice
imaging, and I want to really hear the guitars and vocals, as well as my
bass filler. I listen mostly to Disturbed and similar bands, as well as
a lot of blues and vocals like Sinatra (I know, eclectic mix).

I'd love to use my iPod as well, but the XM transmitter I use kinda
sucks for music (good for podcasts though).

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks!

scottro

[Nigel]

I would suggest that since you are in a little car you wouldn't really
need rear speakers, and to spend the money you save by not purchasing
these on maybe a better comp. set and comp. amp.

For components, I have been impressed with both Boston Acoustics and JL
Audio. I find both companies put out quality sets. For JL I find the
VR line to be nice.

As for amplifiers, I would suggest possibly JL, Kicker, JBL, Alpine.
All are quality amps from what I have seen of them.

Nigel


--
Nigel

[[email protected]]

On Mar 3, 5:34 pm, Scott Harker
wrote:
Hey all. New to the group and looking for advice.

I've got a '99 civic that's still in great shape, but I need to upgrade
the system. currently I've got a decent Pioneer deck/CD. I'm running
an older Boston Acc. component set up front (5.25s and tweeters), and
some 6x9 3-ways in the rear deck. those are all powered by the unit.
I've got two Kicker comp. 10" subs boxed in the back running off an old
but reliable Alpine 3522 (35w x 2). I'm using an old coustic XM-3
Crossover.

Recently, I lost my bass completely, and I also have some doubts about
the stability of my 3-ways in the back. I'm thinking about getting two
new amps, and replacing the front and rear speakers (keeping the deck
and subs).

Any suggestions? I'm not looking for tons of bass. I want really nice
imaging, and I want to really hear the guitars and vocals, as well as my
bass filler. I listen mostly to Disturbed and similar bands, as well as
a lot of blues and vocals like Sinatra (I know, eclectic mix).

I'd love to use my iPod as well, but the XM transmitter I use kinda
sucks for music (good for podcasts though).

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks!

scottro

Ive heard Infinity 6x9's and those are some pretty amazing ones and
since ur not goin to need them for bass they will work great for
filling in your highs, they are pretty affordable to. For the
component set up front, that varies. Infinity makes two sets of
components ones Reference and the other is Kappa. The Reference series
is the one that i would prefer as it has silk dome tweeters and silk
doesnt give off such a peaky high end. Kappa's have metal dome
tweeters that give off that really high high, but if that is what you
want then there ya go. The most expensive set is Kappa and they all
come with outside crossovers . But also remember that your component
set is also only going to be as good as your wires, the better the
wires the cleaner the sound. Ive heard that streetwires and stinger
makes good wiring but i have a rockford fosgate wiring kit and that
doesnt very well. I would also say just upgrade your deck, with just
that it will greatly upgrade your sound and most decks these days come
with an aux. input on the front for just that purpose. As for subs, if
you want really good sound quality infinity's are good. But the best
ones i have come acrossed for SQ is Digital Design or DD. They are a
Euro brand but from their stats they are very good, also have a great
track record behind them.

[D.Kreft]

On Mar 6, 11:35 am, " wrote:


The Reference series
is the one that i would prefer as it has silk dome tweeters and silk
doesnt give off such a peaky high end.

Whoa! Rampant generalization spotted! Red Alert! Red Alert! Battle
stations, everyone!

Just because the dome is made of silk does not mean that you
automagically get "silky" highs. Likewise, just because a dome is made
out of aluminum or titanitum, that doesn't mean you're going to get
"tinny" or "raspy" highs. There is *far* more to the design of a
tweeter (or any loudspeaker for that matter) than just the material
from which the diaphragm is made.

In my days, I've heard some really raspy, crappy-sounding silk-dome
tweeters (like those made by Infinity about a decade ago...I cannot
comment on their current silk-dome offering) as well as good-sounding
fabric-dome tweets (Boston Acoustics from the same era and Dynaudio
come to mind); I've also heard some really sweet-sounding metal-dome
tweeters (MB Quarts were my favorites and what I used in my own car).

Please try not to generalize like this--it perpetuates misconceptions.

Kappa's have metal dome
tweeters that give off that really high high, but if that is what you
want then there ya go.

What's a "high high"?

The most expensive set is Kappa and they all
come with outside crossovers . But also remember that your component
set is also only going to be as good as your wires, the better the
wires the cleaner the sound.

Oh no...more audio folklore.

This is bunk, sir. There's nothing magical about speaker wires. It's a
copper conduit for alternating current--nothing more, nothing less. I
defy you to do a double-blind A/B test between two wires of equivalent
gauge, one premium (read "overpriced") and one "cheapy", and detect a
difference. Even if you *could* detect a difference that wasn't
related to the characteristic impedance of the wire, you would lose
that difference as soon as your car started rolling down the street
(i.e. it'd be masked by road noise).

Don't waste your money on fancy wires--it's just plain not worth it
unless you just can't stand having that money sitting in the bank
earning interest.

Ive heard that streetwires and stinger
makes good wiring but i have a rockford fosgate wiring kit and that
doesnt very well.

What about it "doesn't very well"?

They are a
Euro brand but from their stats they are very good, also have a great
track record behind them.

This is a classic newbie audiophile mistake--saying that something
sounds good just because its spec sheet has impressive-looking
numbers. This is simply not possible to do--I don't care what numbers
you're comparing. You can no more make a determination of how good a
speaker sounds by looking at its spec sheet than you can determine
whether a breakfast cereal tastes good by looking at the ingredients
stamped on the outside of the box.

-dan

[Eddie Runner]

Come on Danny boy,
we all know silk domes sound silky smooth,
shiny titanium domes sound brighter,
clear cones sound more transparent.

if not what on earth do those terms really mean???

ha ha ha

Eddie Runner

D.Kreft wrote:
On Mar 6, 11:35 am, " wrote:
Whoa! Rampant generalization spotted! Red Alert! Red Alert! Battle
stations, everyone!

Just because the dome is made of silk does not mean that you
automagically get "silky" highs.

[D.Kreft]

On Mar 6, 2:36 pm, Eddie Runner wrote:

Come on Danny boy,

Wow....Eddie Runner. Now there's a blast from the past for ya. :-)

if not what on earth do those terms really mean???

You got me.

-dan

[[email protected]]

On Mar 6, 10:11 pm, "D.Kreft" wrote:
On Mar 6, 2:36 pm, Eddie Runner wrote:

Come on Danny boy,

Wow....Eddie Runner. Now there's a blast from the past for ya. :-)

if not what on earth do those terms really mean???

You got me.

-dan

Ok eddie im not saying that i know everything about speakers and
nobody should ever say that. But what people should do is when someone
posts about what they should put in for speakers people should post
what their OPINIONS are and thats it. Posts are not meant to be a
place where people nit-pick at other peoples grammer or suggestions.
Now correct me if im wrong but is silver a better conductor than
copper? Is platinum a better conductor than copper? I think so,
remembering from science. Companies arent going to make wires out of
pure platinum or silver but if they coat the wires in either it still
helps in transfer of signal. And if expensive wires dont help out at
all then why dont competition vehicles just use radioshack wiring.
Many expensive wires use ther insulators to block some of the radio
waves that come out of the wire under the power loads.

About the speaker stats; if we cant go off of stats then why would we
even pay attention to rms ratings or peak power ratings or db's? Or
the frequency range in which a speaker can go? And considering from
what your saying you are just as willing to go out and buy a brand new
speaker out of a brand new company because recognitions of companies
doesnt matter, companies winning SQ competitions or SPL competitions
doesnt matter. Hmmmm....sounds a bit funny to me.

P.S. Danny boy thank you for backing me up a little bit

[D.Kreft]

On Mar 7, 2:35 pm, " wrote:

Ok eddie im not saying that i know everything about speakers and
nobody should ever say that.

Nobody? I wouldn't say that. There are some who *do* know all there is
to know about loudspeaker design. I'm not one of them, but I can think
of a couple of people who do know it all...or at least come perilously
close to knowing it all.

But what people should do is when someone
posts about what they should put in for speakers people should post
what their OPINIONS are and thats it.

Well, sometimes, yes. Opinions are one thing, but making incorrect
statements like "silk dome tweets sound 'smooth'" crosses the line
from personal taste and subjective analysis into the realm of
objective fact. It's when you cross that line when people start going
to battle stations. :-)

Posts are not meant to be a
place where people nit-pick at other peoples grammer or
suggestions.

Hehheh...apparently you're not a USENET (newsgroup) veteran. On the
contrary, my dear sir, this is *precisely* the place where you will
get nit-picked--a little on grammar, a little on spelling, and a lot
on the technical correctness of your posts.

Now correct me if im wrong but is silver a better conductor than
copper?

Yes, by about 6%.

Is platinum a better conductor than copper?

No, actually, it's not. It's actualy a pretty poor conductor (15% as
efficient) when compared to annealed copper:

http://www.wisetool.com/designation/cond.htm

Companies arent going to make wires out of
pure platinum or silver but if they coat the wires in either it
still helps in transfer of signal.

Yes, it will reduce the resistance of the wire, but whether it does so
in any significant amount is up for debate, particulary when you're
talking about low frequencies (i.e. in the realm of human hearing...a
"high frequency" would be something in the MHz or GHz region, which is
where silver plating *really* comes in handy).

But there is otherwise nothing "magical" about the wire....it won't
sound any better--it'll just be louder (perhaps imperceptibly so).

But nobody is talking about silver plated wire anyway--that stuff is
MILspec (they use it in airplanes) and costs a fortune.

And if expensive wires dont help out at
all then why dont competition vehicles just use radioshack wiring.

Three reasons:

1) Car audio is as much about ego as it is about performance
(which directly reflects on ego). Pride says "I spent $5/foot
on my speaker wires--therefore I'm awesome";

2) Radio Schnack wiring is ugly and doesn't make for pretty
amp racks. But you'd be surprised at how many custom vehicles
(IASCA champions, no less) I've seen that use "cheap" wiring
behind the scenes and the "pretty stuff" where it's visible;
and

3) Marketing.

Copper is even a better conductor than gold...but why do you think
that you don't see people using pure copper distribution blocks and
connections for their high-priced systems? Mostly because nobody wants
to sit around polishing copper all day long and because even after a
good polishing, copper still doesn't look as cool as gold.

It's not all about what works best...a lot of it is what *looks* best.
Such is the nature of an industry driven by the desires of 18-25 year-
olds.

Many expensive wires use ther insulators to block some of the radio
waves that come out of the wire under the power loads.

Bullsoy. We're still talking about speaker wires, right? Don't get me
started on RCA interconnects.

Assuming we're talking about speaker wires, there ain't nothing a
rubber coating is going to do to stop radiated EMF. Nothing. Period.
Besides, in speaker wires, the signal-to-noise ratio is typically so
high as to make such shielding moot.

About the speaker stats; if we cant go off of stats then why would we
even pay attention to rms ratings or peak power ratings or db's?

Because there is no standard for measuring these things, and there is
no regulation of these measurements that puts them all on equal
footing. You *do* want to pay attention to these stats, though, but
not for the reasons you hinted at (determining the quality of a
speaker or how good it'll sound).

Power ratings will give you an indication of how big of an amp you can
put on the speaker without blowing it up (assuming the manufacturer
hasn't lied about it--and some do). It will not tell you how good the
speaker sounds.

"dB"s (presuming you mean "db SPL") will only tell you if something is
loud or not...it will not tell you if the speaker has a relatively
smooth response curve. Being loud is useless if you have a huge
resonant peak that makes you want to gouge out your eardrums every
time your favorite song comes on.

Or the frequency range in which a speaker can go?

Again, lack of standards, and utterly useless when trying to make a
qualitative judgement like "This tweeter sounds really good because it
has a usable frequency response from 5kHz to 25kHz."

Similarly, comparing the THD spec on amps and other electronics is
equally pointless. Some amps have super-low THD that impresses the
uninformed and then they wonder why their once nice-sounding tweeters
sound very harsh now. Other amps (the Carver Silver 7 comes to mind)
have very high (~1% or so) THD, but sound *very* sweet because the
harmonic distortion is *even ordered*, which makes it sound very
*warm* (this is why blues guitar players typically prefer tube amps to
solid state amps, and why the guys with the long hair and tattoos tend
to prefer the solid state amps that can make your eyeballs bleed).

And considering from
what your saying you are just as willing to go out and buy a brand new speaker out of a brand new company because recognitions of
companies doesnt matter, companies winning SQ competitions or SPL
competitions doesnt matter. Hmmmm....sounds a bit funny to me.

This is exactly the opposite of what I'm saying. I don't buy audio
components based upon reputation alone. I use the reputation as a
starting point, but eventually it's my ears that decide what I will
spend my money on...not specs, not marketing hype, and not silver
plating or fat insulating jackets on my wires.

-dan

[D.Kreft]

On Mar 7, 2:35 pm, " wrote:

Ok eddie im not saying that i know everything about speakers and
nobody should ever say that.

Au contraire, monsooer. If one *does* know everything about speakers,
then one would be well within his right to say so. I don't claim to be
such a person, but I know personally at least one man in the industry
who fits this description...or comes mighty darn close to it...and I
wouldn't be offended at all if he said "Yep, I pretty much know this
stuff like the back of my hand."

But what people should do is when someone posts about what they
should put in for speakers people should post what their
OPINIONS are and thats it.

Well, yes and no. If you want to share an opinion, then word it as
such. However, when you are dealing with the laws of physics and
quantitative analysis, opinions don't mean squat--what matters is
being technically correct. Your post was not technically correct
because it crossed the line between subjective analysis ("I like the
Ininfity silk-dome tweeters because they sound really smooth") into
the realm of an incorrect assertion or insinuation drawn from
anecdotal evidence ("All silk-dome tweeters sound smooth, metal dome
tweeters are brighter").

Posts are not meant to be a place where people nit-pick at other
peoples grammer or suggestions.

You'll quickly find out that if you spend any time in USENET (internet
newsgroups) that this statement is naive at best. You may indeed get
picked-on for your spelling and grammar a little bit, especially if
your grammar or spelling makes it difficult to read and understand
your post (by the way, you still haven't told us why your RF wiring
kit "doesn't very well"). But you will absolutely, without a doubt be
called to account for any baseless assertions and technical
inaccuracies in your posts. This is, after all, a technical forum--
there's a lot of physics (and psychology) involved in audio
reproduction. It's rather naive to think that we can all just gather
around the fire, share our feelings about tweeters and break into a
chorus of "Kum Ba Ya" whenever someone says something patently absurd
(like "expensive wires make your system sound better").

Now correct me if im wrong but is silver a better conductor than
copper?

Yes, by about 6% or so.

Is platinum a better conductor than copper? I think so,
remembering from science.

It is not. It falls short of annealed copper by about 85%
(http://www.wisetool.com/designation/cond.htm).

Companies arent going to make wires out of
pure platinum or silver but if they coat the wires in either it
still helps in transfer of signal.

For low frequencies (those in the ranges we're talking about--in the
kHz range), the difference would be pretty much zero in terms of
reducing the impedance of the wire. When you start talking about
signals in the MHz and GHz range, however, where the signals are more
prone to being affected by the "skin effect," then you have another
situation.

Look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skin_effect -- you'll notice that
the "skin depth" for a 60Hz AC signal in Cu is about 8.57mm--which
means that the signal travels along the full diameter of the wire up
to about what, 6AWG or so (I don't have a chart handy to look up the
diameter of an 6AWG copper wire--google is your friend if you are
interested). Even at 100kHz--far outside the range of human hearing--
the silver coating would have to be 0.21mm thick in order to make any
real difference at that frequency.

What silver plating will buy you in audio applications is "wow" (or
"what-an-idiot") factor from your friends when you tell them how much
you spent on MIL-spec cables that make no detectable difference to the
sound of your system.

And let's say, just for the sake of argument, that the silver coating
*did* make a difference (though it would NOT for reasons already
explained). It's not going to make your system *sound* any better--
there's nothing "magical" about Ag or Pt--all you can hope to achieve
is a stronger signal at the other end. In other words, it would be
louder...and undoubtedly imperceptably so. If you want to talk about
the *inductance* of the wire having an effect on sound quality, then
you've got something to talk about...but I don't *think* that a silver
plating is going to significantly affect inductance (though it's been
a while, so I'm a little rusty on this part).

A wire is to an electrical current what a highway is to a car. You can
make the road smoother and thus minimize the amount of jarring your
body has to endure (and in turn go faster!), but no matter how many
lanes the highway has and no matter how smooth it is, it's not going
to make your car any shinier or any less rusty (or the driver any more
likely to "pick up chicks").

And if expensive wires dont help out at
all then why dont competition vehicles just use radioshack
wiring.

Because RS wiring is, quite frankly, not terribly pretty. There's
nothing inherently wrong with the wire (although some of the *really*
cheap stuff they sell is pretty prone to corrosion)--and if you go
with some of their more refined offerings, you can even get some stuff
that isn't really even that ugly. But even then, it won't be as "cool"-
looking as, say, Streetwires. It pretty much boils down to
testosterone and marketing.

And by the way, how many champion sound-quality systems have you built
or seen behind the scenes? I think you'd be plenty surprised at the
number of them that actually use "cheapy" cables behind the panels and
just run the pretty stuff in the visible areas.

It's all about marketing and looking good. What else would you expect
from an industry that caters primarily to 18-25 year-old males?

Many expensive wires use ther insulators to block some of the
radio waves that come out of the wire under the power loads.

"Block radio waves that come out of the wire"???? Exqueeze me?
Uhh...even if this somehow could be true, why would it be relevant?
Who cares if some "radio waves" leak out of a wire? What're they going
to do, give the car "radio noise" (the inverse of engine noise)???

We're still talking about speaker wires, right? Good. Then then is
complete bullsoy. The signal-to-noise ratio of a speaker wire in a
typical automotive setting is so high that most noise is simply
overpowered. But even if it the noise is particularly powerful, a thin
rubber jacket around the wire isn't going to do squat to reject the
radiated EMF.

If you want to talk about RCA interconnects, then you still stand on
some pretty weak ground. I've talked with installers for whom I have a
great deal of respect (IASCA champion system installers) and they've
told me of numerous occassions where the big, fat, expensive RCA
cables actually *injected* noise into the system--noise that was
easily removed from the system by switching to using some "cheesy"
Radio Schnack-style back RCA cables with the red and white plugs. The
problem when you build a big fat cable with two wires separated by a
good-sized gap is that it winds up acting like an antenna (http://
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dipole_antenna). The excessive shielding used by
these manufacturers is more for your ego than for technical merit--
that shielding is really only effective when you're talking about
trying to reject really high-frequency noise. In the automotive
environment, there really isn't a heck of a lot of that flying around.

The only way I know of to completely reject injected (radiated) noise
from the system is to use a balanced line driver (http://
sound.westhost.com/project51.htm)...which is a bit more sophisticated
than simply running $5/ft interconnects through your vehicle and
praying for results.

About the speaker stats; if we cant go off of stats then why
would we even pay attention to rms ratings or peak power ratings
or db's?

Because there is no standard and no enforcing agency. Put another way,
some manufacturers "fudge" their numbers, and others outright lie. But
I'll address your questions directly anyway...

Power ratings will *only* tell you how much power you can apply before
you void you warranty. They tell you precious little about how well
the speaker is engineered and assembled, and even less about how the
speaker will sound in any given application.

Or the frequency range in which a speaker can go?

Again, a mostly useless stat if you're trying to find a good speaker.
There isn't much consistency in how manufacturers measure frequency
ranges (some are +/1 1dB or less, others use +/- 3dB), so comparing
them is perilously close to "apples-and-oranges" comparisons.

And it won't tell you how the speaker *sounds*.

And considering from what your saying you are just as willing
to go out and buy a brand new speaker out of a brand new
company because recognitions of companies doesnt matter,
companies winning SQ competitions or SPL competitions
doesnt matter. Hmmmm....sounds a bit funny to me.

This doesn't make any sense. It's also completely not what I'm saying.
A company's reputation should be a factor in helping to narrow the
field, but it should never be a substitute for actually critically
listening to the speaker itself. I always get a chuckle when people go
all out and get everything from the head unit to the speakers from one
company--very rarely can one company do everything well (some can't
even do one thing well)--so indiscriminately buying just from one
company tells me that the owner and/or designer of the system is
either not a very critical listener, or they're receiving sponsorship
from the manufacturer.

Buy speakers because of the way they *sound*--not based upon how they
look in person or on paper. You wouldn't buy a car that way...why
would you do that with audio gear?

P.S. Danny boy thank you for backing me up a little bit

I'm not sure you've been reading these posts (both Eddie's and my own)
correctly...nobody's backing up much of anything you've said thus far.

-dan

[Eddie Runner]

ME a blast from the past??

YOUR the one that was MIA for over a decade..!!!

ha ha ha

Eddie


D.Kreft wrote:
On Mar 6, 2:36 pm, Eddie Runner wrote:

Come on Danny boy,

Wow....Eddie Runner. Now there's a blast from the past for ya. :-)

if not what on earth do those terms really mean???

You got me.

-dan

[Eddie Runner]

wrote:
Ok eddie im not saying that i know everything about speakers and
nobody should ever say that. But what people should do is when someone
posts about what they should put in for speakers people should post
what their OPINIONS are and thats it.

Ok, if you say so.
I kinda think folks post about whatever they want to.
In my opinion, other folks opinions sometimes suck!

Posts are not meant to be a
place where people nit-pick at other peoples grammer or suggestions.

They sure appear to be alot of times.

If your referring to my post, I was just giving Danny Boy a hard time.
I wasnt correcting anyone or stating an opinion.
IT WAS A FKN JOKE!!

shiny sounds brighter, silky sounds smoother,
PAY ATTENTION!!

Now correct me if im wrong but is silver a better conductor than
copper?

BEFORE or AFTER the silver has tarnished???

Is platinum a better conductor than copper? I think so,
remembering from science. Companies arent going to make wires out of
pure platinum or silver but if they coat the wires in either it still
helps in transfer of signal.

Does it help enough to HEAR the difference??

And if expensive wires dont help out at
all then why dont competition vehicles just use radioshack wiring.

Because folks would laugh at them without even listening to it..

Many expensive wires use ther insulators to block some of the radio
waves that come out of the wire under the power loads.

which wires are you talking about that emit radio waves?

About the speaker stats; if we cant go off of stats then why would we
even pay attention to rms ratings or peak power ratings or db's?

WHO is giving you the STATS? Do you believe them?
WHY can't you get the stats by yourself by testing the speaker yourself?

Or
the frequency range in which a speaker can go?

DITTO, do you believe the factory spec sheets on speakers?

And considering from
what your saying you are just as willing to go out and buy a brand new
speaker out of a brand new company because recognitions of companies
doesnt matter, companies winning SQ competitions or SPL competitions
doesnt matter. Hmmmm....sounds a bit funny to me.

Are you talking to me?
I dont think I ever said anything like that ??


Eddie Runner

[D.Kreft]

On Mar 8, 2:25 pm, Eddie Runner wrote:

YOUR the one that was MIA for over a decade..!!!

*ahem*...Just *under* a decade, sir. If I would've been cognizent of
that, I'd have waited a few more months to make it an even 10. ;-)

-dan

[Eddie Runner]

So,
what brings you back into the world of CAR AUDIO
(or RAC) with such a fervor after *NEARLY* a decade???

Or maybe more importantly, what kept you away??

Eddie Runner
http://www.teamrocs.com


D.Kreft wrote:
On Mar 8, 2:25 pm, Eddie Runner wrote:

YOUR the one that was MIA for over a decade..!!!

*ahem*...Just *under* a decade, sir. If I would've been cognizent of
that, I'd have waited a few more months to make it an even 10. ;-)

-dan

[D.Kreft]

On Mar 8, 3:23 pm, Eddie Runner wrote:

So,
what brings you back into the world of CAR AUDIO
(or RAC) with such a fervor after *NEARLY* a decade???

Or maybe more importantly, what kept you away??

A little history is in order here.

Like many, I got into car audio in high school and tinkered around a
lot in my own car when I finally got one at the age of 17. After I
graduated from high school in 1990, I begged and fought my way into a
job with Speaker Warehouse in Ft. Lauderdale, FL. I was so enamored by
the vehicles that they'd put together (featured in Car Audio
magazine), and was so impressed that their vehicles won first place in
pretty much every category (including Lucio Proni's Best of Show) in
the 1990 IASCA Finals that I said to myself "I'm going to go work for
*them*." So I did everything I could to get into the industry--which
as those who have tried can tell you, is *very* difficult--including
going to installer school, where I "graduated" top of my class with a
99.4% test average (I missed one question--a trick question at that).
After that, SW hired me on a commission-only basis...during a
recessionary time...so I had a heck of a time trying to make ends
meet. But the owners of SW saw me through that rough time with
generosity over and above what I could have expected.

Eventually, I co-managed the Hollywood, FL store and also worked as a
salesman and installer. One day on long commute home, I ran my car up
a curb and into a grassy median--I had fallen asleep at the wheel from
sheer exhaustion. I was living hand-to-mouth, and it was then that I
said to myself "This job is going to kill me...literally. I need to go
back to kollege and make something of my life." So I told the owners I
was going back to school to get a degree in Electrical Engineering.
They didn't want to see me go, and tried to get me to stay, but I
didn't think that crawling under dashboards and into roach-infested
trunks was what I really wanted to do for the rest of my life (note:
car audio isn't very glamorous, newbies!).

So, I wound up going to Northwestern University on a full-ride
(basketball) scholarship and returned to Florida for vacations to work
at JL Audio (same owners) doing technical support. It was at NU that
my roomate (a unix geek) said "Hey Dan, here's a newsgroup that you
might be interested in: 'rec.audio.car'." When I got on the group, I
saw tons of questions being asked about JL Audio products that were
only getting half-baked (and sometimes just plain wrong) answers. So I
dove in and with my trusty JL Reference Manual, and a list of all the
dealers in the nation sorted by ZIP code, I went to work. I was even
serving product brochures and such from an FTP server running on my
PowerMac 7100/66. :-) It was a hit, but I got tired of answering the
same questions over and over again. I got the crazy idea to spin-up
and develop jlaudio.com (the industry's first website) and offer
*real* technical support from my dormroom in Chicago via IRC
(#caraudio)...which were even bigger hits. I wrote many of the
tutorials that are on the JL Audio website even to this day (some of
the images that I created 10+ years ago are still there, too!).

Then, during the last game of my collegiate career, I was spotted by
the Chicago Bulls and invited to rookie camp...an offer which I could
not refuse (see http://kreft.net/journals/ncaa/michigan2.html). I was
one of the last people cut, but the fire had been lit--for the first
time in a long time, I was actually having fun playing basketball, and
I was getting money to play! Woooohoo! So, I decided to pursue a
career in basketball whilst I was still young and able to do so. I was
still doing website development and tech support for JL part time, but
eventually I had to focus just on basketball; so I had to quit working
for JL Audio--which was a very, very hard decision to make.

After that I went through a very big personal crisis and had developed
some anger and resentment "issues" with someone very close to me and
my life dramatically changed. Car audio only served to remind me of
the crisis and so I had to quit for the sake of my own personal
sanity.

Now, almost 10 years later, the wounds have been healed and I've got a
new life (on more than one level). I stopped by r.a.c. out of a
combination of curiosity, nostalgia and boredom and saw a post about
the "old timers," and that's when I jumped back in. I hadn't planned
on sticking around--I just wanted to make a surprise cameo--but even
though this group is but a shell of what it used to be, I surprisingly
still enjoy helping others with their car audio problems and
questions.

Probably more than you wanted to know, but hey...I'm detailed
oriented. :-)

-dan

[Eddie Runner]

Oh yeah, I remember all that stuff up to the point
where you vanished. I remember you told some story
about a balcony in college, was that the big personal
crisis? It seemed like you vanished right after that.

Alot of the old timers GREW up and GOT MARRIED, and
RAC is just kind of an outdated medium nowdays. Your
right it is only a shell of what it once was, we used
to have 1000s of daily posts.. And that was back when
alot of folks didnt even know what the internet was.

There are alot of car audio forums nowdays, they
BANNED me from most of them, as you may remember,
when some smarty pants makes a statement, I enjoy
questioning them to the point of making him cry to
see if he really can back up his tech talk.
ha ha

I started installing in 1974, and I
still own River Oaks Car Stereo in Houston.

but I dont even check RAC everyday like I used to.
Heck, we practically lived on RAC in the old days, I would
read and write on RAC then drive home and do it some more,
wake up in the morning and do it some more... WOW ...

Eddie Runner





D.Kreft wrote:
On Mar 8, 3:23 pm, Eddie Runner wrote:

So,
what brings you back into the world of CAR AUDIO
(or RAC) with such a fervor after *NEARLY* a decade???

Or maybe more importantly, what kept you away??

A little history is in order here.

Like many, I got into car audio in high school and tinkered around a
lot in my own car when I finally got one at the age of 17. After I
graduated from high school in 1990, I begged and fought my way into a
job with Speaker Warehouse in Ft. Lauderdale, FL. I was so enamored by
the vehicles that they'd put together (featured in Car Audio
magazine), and was so impressed that their vehicles won first place in
pretty much every category (including Lucio Proni's Best of Show) in
the 1990 IASCA Finals that I said to myself "I'm going to go work for
*them*." So I did everything I could to get into the industry--which
as those who have tried can tell you, is *very* difficult--including
going to installer school, where I "graduated" top of my class with a
99.4% test average (I missed one question--a trick question at that).
After that, SW hired me on a commission-only basis...during a
recessionary time...so I had a heck of a time trying to make ends
meet. But the owners of SW saw me through that rough time with
generosity over and above what I could have expected.

Eventually, I co-managed the Hollywood, FL store and also worked as a
salesman and installer. One day on long commute home, I ran my car up
a curb and into a grassy median--I had fallen asleep at the wheel from
sheer exhaustion. I was living hand-to-mouth, and it was then that I
said to myself "This job is going to kill me...literally. I need to go
back to kollege and make something of my life." So I told the owners I
was going back to school to get a degree in Electrical Engineering.
They didn't want to see me go, and tried to get me to stay, but I
didn't think that crawling under dashboards and into roach-infested
trunks was what I really wanted to do for the rest of my life (note:
car audio isn't very glamorous, newbies!).

So, I wound up going to Northwestern University on a full-ride
(basketball) scholarship and returned to Florida for vacations to work
at JL Audio (same owners) doing technical support. It was at NU that
my roomate (a unix geek) said "Hey Dan, here's a newsgroup that you
might be interested in: 'rec.audio.car'." When I got on the group, I
saw tons of questions being asked about JL Audio products that were
only getting half-baked (and sometimes just plain wrong) answers. So I
dove in and with my trusty JL Reference Manual, and a list of all the
dealers in the nation sorted by ZIP code, I went to work. I was even
serving product brochures and such from an FTP server running on my
PowerMac 7100/66. :-) It was a hit, but I got tired of answering the
same questions over and over again. I got the crazy idea to spin-up
and develop jlaudio.com (the industry's first website) and offer
*real* technical support from my dormroom in Chicago via IRC
(#caraudio)...which were even bigger hits. I wrote many of the
tutorials that are on the JL Audio website even to this day (some of
the images that I created 10+ years ago are still there, too!).

Then, during the last game of my collegiate career, I was spotted by
the Chicago Bulls and invited to rookie camp...an offer which I could
not refuse (see http://kreft.net/journals/ncaa/michigan2.html). I was
one of the last people cut, but the fire had been lit--for the first
time in a long time, I was actually having fun playing basketball, and
I was getting money to play! Woooohoo! So, I decided to pursue a
career in basketball whilst I was still young and able to do so. I was
still doing website development and tech support for JL part time, but
eventually I had to focus just on basketball; so I had to quit working
for JL Audio--which was a very, very hard decision to make.

After that I went through a very big personal crisis and had developed
some anger and resentment "issues" with someone very close to me and
my life dramatically changed. Car audio only served to remind me of
the crisis and so I had to quit for the sake of my own personal
sanity.

Now, almost 10 years later, the wounds have been healed and I've got a
new life (on more than one level). I stopped by r.a.c. out of a
combination of curiosity, nostalgia and boredom and saw a post about
the "old timers," and that's when I jumped back in. I hadn't planned
on sticking around--I just wanted to make a surprise cameo--but even
though this group is but a shell of what it used to be, I surprisingly
still enjoy helping others with their car audio problems and
questions.

Probably more than you wanted to know, but hey...I'm detailed
oriented. :-)

-dan

[John Durbin]

If you didn't insist on being right all the time, coulda saved yourself
a lot of that readin' & writin' :-)

JD

Eddie Runner wrote:
Oh yeah, I remember all that stuff up to the point
where you vanished. I remember you told some story
about a balcony in college, was that the big personal
crisis? It seemed like you vanished right after that.

Alot of the old timers GREW up and GOT MARRIED, and
RAC is just kind of an outdated medium nowdays. Your
right it is only a shell of what it once was, we used
to have 1000s of daily posts.. And that was back when
alot of folks didnt even know what the internet was.

There are alot of car audio forums nowdays, they
BANNED me from most of them, as you may remember,
when some smarty pants makes a statement, I enjoy
questioning them to the point of making him cry to
see if he really can back up his tech talk.
ha ha

I started installing in 1974, and I
still own River Oaks Car Stereo in Houston.

but I dont even check RAC everyday like I used to.
Heck, we practically lived on RAC in the old days, I would
read and write on RAC then drive home and do it some more,
wake up in the morning and do it some more... WOW ...

Eddie Runner





D.Kreft wrote:

On Mar 8, 3:23 pm, Eddie Runner wrote:

So,
what brings you back into the world of CAR AUDIO
(or RAC) with such a fervor after *NEARLY* a decade???

Or maybe more importantly, what kept you away??


A little history is in order here.

Like many, I got into car audio in high school and tinkered around a
lot in my own car when I finally got one at the age of 17. After I
graduated from high school in 1990, I begged and fought my way into a
job with Speaker Warehouse in Ft. Lauderdale, FL. I was so enamored by
the vehicles that they'd put together (featured in Car Audio
magazine), and was so impressed that their vehicles won first place in
pretty much every category (including Lucio Proni's Best of Show) in
the 1990 IASCA Finals that I said to myself "I'm going to go work for
*them*." So I did everything I could to get into the industry--which
as those who have tried can tell you, is *very* difficult--including
going to installer school, where I "graduated" top of my class with a
99.4% test average (I missed one question--a trick question at that).
After that, SW hired me on a commission-only basis...during a
recessionary time...so I had a heck of a time trying to make ends
meet. But the owners of SW saw me through that rough time with
generosity over and above what I could have expected.

Eventually, I co-managed the Hollywood, FL store and also worked as a
salesman and installer. One day on long commute home, I ran my car up
a curb and into a grassy median--I had fallen asleep at the wheel from
sheer exhaustion. I was living hand-to-mouth, and it was then that I
said to myself "This job is going to kill me...literally. I need to go
back to kollege and make something of my life." So I told the owners I
was going back to school to get a degree in Electrical Engineering.
They didn't want to see me go, and tried to get me to stay, but I
didn't think that crawling under dashboards and into roach-infested
trunks was what I really wanted to do for the rest of my life (note:
car audio isn't very glamorous, newbies!).

So, I wound up going to Northwestern University on a full-ride
(basketball) scholarship and returned to Florida for vacations to work
at JL Audio (same owners) doing technical support. It was at NU that
my roomate (a unix geek) said "Hey Dan, here's a newsgroup that you
might be interested in: 'rec.audio.car'." When I got on the group, I
saw tons of questions being asked about JL Audio products that were
only getting half-baked (and sometimes just plain wrong) answers. So I
dove in and with my trusty JL Reference Manual, and a list of all the
dealers in the nation sorted by ZIP code, I went to work. I was even
serving product brochures and such from an FTP server running on my
PowerMac 7100/66. :-) It was a hit, but I got tired of answering the
same questions over and over again. I got the crazy idea to spin-up
and develop jlaudio.com (the industry's first website) and offer
*real* technical support from my dormroom in Chicago via IRC
(#caraudio)...which were even bigger hits. I wrote many of the
tutorials that are on the JL Audio website even to this day (some of
the images that I created 10+ years ago are still there, too!).

Then, during the last game of my collegiate career, I was spotted by
the Chicago Bulls and invited to rookie camp...an offer which I could
not refuse (see http://kreft.net/journals/ncaa/michigan2.html). I was
one of the last people cut, but the fire had been lit--for the first
time in a long time, I was actually having fun playing basketball, and
I was getting money to play! Woooohoo! So, I decided to pursue a
career in basketball whilst I was still young and able to do so. I was
still doing website development and tech support for JL part time, but
eventually I had to focus just on basketball; so I had to quit working
for JL Audio--which was a very, very hard decision to make.

After that I went through a very big personal crisis and had developed
some anger and resentment "issues" with someone very close to me and
my life dramatically changed. Car audio only served to remind me of
the crisis and so I had to quit for the sake of my own personal
sanity.

Now, almost 10 years later, the wounds have been healed and I've got a
new life (on more than one level). I stopped by r.a.c. out of a
combination of curiosity, nostalgia and boredom and saw a post about
the "old timers," and that's when I jumped back in. I hadn't planned
on sticking around--I just wanted to make a surprise cameo--but even
though this group is but a shell of what it used to be, I surprisingly
still enjoy helping others with their car audio problems and
questions.

Probably more than you wanted to know, but hey...I'm detailed
oriented. :-)

-dan

[D.Kreft]

On Mar 9, 4:04 pm, Eddie Runner wrote:

I remember you told some story
about a balcony in college, was that the big personal
crisis? It seemed like you vanished right after that.

I don't remember the story of which you speak, but it has nothing to
do with anything (or anyone) from my college days.

There are alot of car audio forums nowdays

Yeah, caraudio.com seems to be "the big one" now, but I can't bring
myself to use it--between the colors of the site and its overall
layout, it all gives me a migraine. It also *seems* to cater more to
one-line-response, ADHD crowd...but I can't say definitively because
the layout makes it it take so painful to process an entire thread.

If it were more like google groups, I'd probably sign-up and give it a
whirl. Until then, I'm "stuck" here in tumbleweed town.

Heck, we practically lived on RAC in the old days, I would
read and write on RAC then drive home and do it some more,
wake up in the morning and do it some more... WOW ...

Ah yes, those were the days. I used to make posts well into the night.
Now you measure the time between posts in hours instead of
seconds. :-)

-dan

[Eddie Runner]

John Durbin wrote:
If you didn't insist on being right all the time,

Would you have preferred it if I was WRONG once in a
while?

coulda saved yourself
a lot of that readin' & writin' :-)

It was FUN.

[[email protected]]

On Mar 9, 3:05 pm, "D.Kreft" wrote:
On Mar 8, 3:23 pm, Eddie Runner wrote:

So,
what brings you back into the world of CAR AUDIO
(or RAC) with such a fervor after *NEARLY* a decade???

Or maybe more importantly, what kept you away??

A little history is in order here.

Like many, I got into car audio in high school and tinkered around a
lot in my own car when I finally got one at the age of 17. After I
graduated from high school in 1990, I begged and fought my way into a
job with Speaker Warehouse in Ft. Lauderdale, FL. I was so enamored by
the vehicles that they'd put together (featured in Car Audio
magazine), and was so impressed that their vehicles won first place in
pretty much every category (including Lucio Proni's Best of Show) in
the 1990 IASCA Finals that I said to myself "I'm going to go work for
*them*." So I did everything I could to get into the industry--which
as those who have tried can tell you, is *very* difficult--including
going to installer school, where I "graduated" top of my class with a
99.4% test average (I missed one question--a trick question at that).
After that, SW hired me on a commission-only basis...during a
recessionary time...so I had a heck of a time trying to make ends
meet. But the owners of SW saw me through that rough time with
generosity over and above what I could have expected.

Eventually, I co-managed the Hollywood, FL store and also worked as a
salesman and installer. One day on long commute home, I ran my car up
a curb and into a grassy median--I had fallen asleep at the wheel from
sheer exhaustion. I was living hand-to-mouth, and it was then that I
said to myself "This job is going to kill me...literally. I need to go
back to kollege and make something of my life." So I told the owners I
was going back to school to get a degree in Electrical Engineering.
They didn't want to see me go, and tried to get me to stay, but I
didn't think that crawling under dashboards and into roach-infested
trunks was what I really wanted to do for the rest of my life (note:
car audio isn't very glamorous, newbies!).

So, I wound up going to Northwestern University on a full-ride
(basketball) scholarship and returned to Florida for vacations to work
at JL Audio (same owners) doing technical support. It was at NU that
my roomate (a unix geek) said "Hey Dan, here's a newsgroup that you
might be interested in: 'rec.audio.car'." When I got on the group, I
saw tons of questions being asked about JL Audio products that were
only getting half-baked (and sometimes just plain wrong) answers. So I
dove in and with my trusty JL Reference Manual, and a list of all the
dealers in the nation sorted by ZIP code, I went to work. I was even
serving product brochures and such from an FTP server running on my
PowerMac 7100/66. :-) It was a hit, but I got tired of answering the
same questions over and over again. I got the crazy idea to spin-up
and develop jlaudio.com (the industry's first website) and offer
*real* technical support from my dormroom in Chicago via IRC
(#caraudio)...which were even bigger hits. I wrote many of the
tutorials that are on the JL Audio website even to this day (some of
the images that I created 10+ years ago are still there, too!).

Then, during the last game of my collegiate career, I was spotted by
the Chicago Bulls and invited to rookie camp...an offer which I could
not refuse (seehttp://kreft.net/journals/ncaa/michigan2.html). I was
one of the last people cut, but the fire had been lit--for the first
time in a long time, I was actually having fun playing basketball, and
I was getting money to play! Woooohoo! So, I decided to pursue a
career in basketball whilst I was still young and able to do so. I was
still doing website development and tech support for JL part time, but
eventually I had to focus just on basketball; so I had to quit working
for JL Audio--which was a very, very hard decision to make.

After that I went through a very big personal crisis and had developed
some anger and resentment "issues" with someone very close to me and
my life dramatically changed. Car audio only served to remind me of
the crisis and so I had to quit for the sake of my own personal
sanity.

Now, almost 10 years later, the wounds have been healed and I've got a
new life (on more than one level). I stopped by r.a.c. out of a
combination of curiosity, nostalgia and boredom and saw a post about
the "old timers," and that's when I jumped back in. I hadn't planned
on sticking around--I just wanted to make a surprise cameo--but even
though this group is but a shell of what it used to be, I surprisingly
still enjoy helping others with their car audio problems and
questions.

Probably more than you wanted to know, but hey...I'm detailed
oriented. :-)

-dan

hey guys dont kno if this makes a **** of a difference or not but i
honestly didnt know that you guys were that knoweledgable or had been
in it for this long, i thought you guys were just a pair of stuck up
assholes who really didnt have anything better to do than go around
and nit-pick newbs, but anyways where im goin with this is just
weanted to say sorry for the little tiff we had earlier lol it
honestly got me pretty ****ed off cause i dont like to be called out
on stuff but i figure it happens you know?

[Captain Howdy]

Yeah Eddie has always been a trouble maker. LOL


hey guys dont kno if this makes a **** of a difference or not but i
honestly didnt know that you guys were that knoweledgable or had been
in it for this long, i thought you guys were just a pair of stuck up
assholes who really didnt have anything better to do than go around
and nit-pick newbs, but anyways where im goin with this is just
weanted to say sorry for the little tiff we had earlier lol it
honestly got me pretty ****ed off cause i dont like to be called out
on stuff but i figure it happens you know?

[D.Kreft]

On Mar 10, 10:18 am, " wrote:

...i honestly didnt know that you guys were that knoweledgable or had been
in it for this long...

I mean this in the nicest way possible, but "Should it really matter
how long we've been into car audio?"

Shouldn't the merits of one's argument be of primary importance? That
is to say, if the argument is presented clearly, logically, is well
thought-out and is supported by the laws of physics, does it really
matter of the person doing the posting is 14 years old 34 (or in
Eddie's case, 64)? In my opinion, that's one of the strengths of the
abstraction that USENET (and the Internet in general) provides--it
encourages people to focus more on the argument at hand rather than on
the presenter (provided the presenter has a reasonable grasp of the
language and can spell :-); it prevents us from making judgements
about the presenter's argument based upon his age ("He's just a
kid...what does he know?") or physcial appearance ("He's nothing but a
dumb jock basketball player--how could he possibly know how to tune an
audio system?").

If I may be so bold as to offer some unsolicited fatherly-type advice,
as a self-described "newb," you would do well to approach your new
hobby with more curiosity and a willingness to learn. There's nothing
wrong with being wrong (nobody's perfect, of course), but part of
wisdom is knowing when you know and knowing when you don't know.
Wisdom says that when you know, you teach those who will listen; and
when you don't know, you listen to those who are trying to teach.
That's not to say, of course, that you turn off your brain and just
accept everything fed to you--of course not, you should always think
critically and ask questions when you don't understand--but arguing
from a lack of experience will almost always get you into trouble.
Note that this is not to say that the person from whom you can learn
something is somehow fundamentally superior to you--if we hopped over
to a different newsgroup, we may quickly find the student trading
places with the master (there are plenty of other NG's I could visit
where I wouldn't be able to do more than introduce myself :-).

...but anyways where im goin with this is just
weanted to say sorry for the little tiff we had earlier

No blood, no foul. I'll not hold it against you. I'm actually
impressed by this--it takes muchos cajones to swallow one's pride and
admit fault...especially in public like this.

it
honestly got me pretty ****ed off cause i dont like to be called out
on stuff but i figure it happens you know?

Hopefully as we get older, it happens less and less. :-)

-dan

[Captain Howdy]

You're the man Dan man...........LOL


In article . com, "D.Kreft"
wrote:
On Mar 10, 10:18 am, " wrote:

...i honestly didnt know that you guys were that knoweledgable or had been
in it for this long...

I mean this in the nicest way possible, but "Should it really matter
how long we've been into car audio?"

Shouldn't the merits of one's argument be of primary importance? That
is to say, if the argument is presented clearly, logically, is well
thought-out and is supported by the laws of physics, does it really
matter of the person doing the posting is 14 years old 34 (or in
Eddie's case, 64)? In my opinion, that's one of the strengths of the
abstraction that USENET (and the Internet in general) provides--it
encourages people to focus more on the argument at hand rather than on
the presenter (provided the presenter has a reasonable grasp of the
language and can spell :-); it prevents us from making judgements
about the presenter's argument based upon his age ("He's just a
kid...what does he know?") or physcial appearance ("He's nothing but a
dumb jock basketball player--how could he possibly know how to tune an
audio system?").

If I may be so bold as to offer some unsolicited fatherly-type advice,
as a self-described "newb," you would do well to approach your new
hobby with more curiosity and a willingness to learn. There's nothing
wrong with being wrong (nobody's perfect, of course), but part of
wisdom is knowing when you know and knowing when you don't know.
Wisdom says that when you know, you teach those who will listen; and
when you don't know, you listen to those who are trying to teach.
That's not to say, of course, that you turn off your brain and just
accept everything fed to you--of course not, you should always think
critically and ask questions when you don't understand--but arguing
from a lack of experience will almost always get you into trouble.
Note that this is not to say that the person from whom you can learn
something is somehow fundamentally superior to you--if we hopped over
to a different newsgroup, we may quickly find the student trading
places with the master (there are plenty of other NG's I could visit
where I wouldn't be able to do more than introduce myself :-).

...but anyways where im goin with this is just
weanted to say sorry for the little tiff we had earlier

No blood, no foul. I'll not hold it against you. I'm actually
impressed by this--it takes muchos cajones to swallow one's pride and
admit fault...especially in public like this.

it
honestly got me pretty ****ed off cause i dont like to be called out
on stuff but i figure it happens you know?

Hopefully as we get older, it happens less and less. :-)

-dan

[John Durbin]

Was I gone?

JD

I. Care wrote:
In article ,
says...

John Durbin wrote:

If you didn't insist on being right all the time,

Would you have preferred it if I was WRONG once in a
while?


coulda saved yourself
a lot of that readin' & writin' :-)

It was FUN.


Welcome back.

Red Ford Probe w/Pioneer ODR
1995 IASCA Finals Amateur 151-300w 9th

[John Durbin]

You WERE wrong once in awhile... but I was looking for "silent" :-)

JD
fun maybe but WAY too time consuming

Eddie Runner wrote:

John Durbin wrote:

If you didn't insist on being right all the time,


Would you have preferred it if I was WRONG once in a
while?

coulda saved yourself a lot of that readin' & writin' :-)


It was FUN.

[Jamie Pruden]

Damn, John... best laugh in a while...

I even had Eddie in my killfile as his long winded boasting was really
wearing me down.

Of course, he was right almost all of the time and he's not nearly as
long winded and after all this time, I had to use a new usenet
client...

smiles,
Jamie

On 2007-03-09 19:57:30 -0800, John Durbin said:

If you didn't insist on being right all the time, coulda saved yourself
a lot of that readin' & writin' :-)

JD

Eddie Runner wrote:
Oh yeah, I remember all that stuff up to the point
where you vanished. I remember you told some story
about a balcony in college, was that the big personal
crisis? It seemed like you vanished right after that.

Alot of the old timers GREW up and GOT MARRIED, and
RAC is just kind of an outdated medium nowdays. Your
right it is only a shell of what it once was, we used
to have 1000s of daily posts.. And that was back when
alot of folks didnt even know what the internet was.

[Jamie Pruden]

.... and I seriously doubt you'd really call Dan out to the street...
very large man...

smiles,
Jamie

On 2007-03-10 19:51:35 -0800, "D.Kreft" said:

it
honestly got me pretty ****ed off cause i dont like to be called out
on stuff but i figure it happens you know?

Hopefully as we get older, it happens less and less. :-)

-dan

[Eddie Runner]

It was Dan that was gone for a decade,
I never went anywhere, but I just dont post
much anymore

Eddie

I. Care wrote:

Welcome back.

Red Ford Probe w/Pioneer ODR
1995 IASCA Finals Amateur 151-300w 9th

[Eddie Runner]

I have only been installing since 1974 (remember 8 tracks?)
I own a shop in Houston, and I am famous for getting folks
on the internet RILED UP.

so dont feel bad, I do it to everyone. ;-)

Eddie Runner
http://www.teamrocs.com


wrote:

hey guys dont kno if this makes a **** of a difference or not but i
honestly didnt know that you guys were that knoweledgable or had been
in it for this long, i thought you guys were just a pair of stuck up
assholes who really didnt have anything better to do than go around
and nit-pick newbs, but anyways where im goin with this is just
weanted to say sorry for the little tiff we had earlier lol it
honestly got me pretty ****ed off cause i dont like to be called out
on stuff but i figure it happens you know?

[Eddie Runner]

D.Kreft wrote:
I mean this in the nicest way possible, but "Should it really matter
how long we've been into car audio?"

It matters to me!
Dan you will always be a NEWBIE to me!!

does it really
matter of the person doing the posting is 14 years old 34 (or in
Eddie's case, 64)?

FOURTY NINE!

If I may be so bold as to offer some unsolicited fatherly-type advice,
as a self-described "newb," you would do well to approach your new
hobby with more curiosity and a willingness to learn.

Why not just BASS?

I have been wondering where the folks that like car audio
for the HI FI aspects of it have gone?

Eddie Runner
http://www.teamrocs.com

[Eddie Runner]

No, you were never gone,
but welcome back anyway!!


John Durbin wrote:
Was I gone?

JD

I. Care wrote:
In article ,
says...

John Durbin wrote:

If you didn't insist on being right all the time,

Would you have preferred it if I was WRONG once in a
while?


coulda saved yourself a lot of that readin' & writin' :-)

It was FUN.


Welcome back.

Red Ford Probe w/Pioneer ODR
1995 IASCA Finals Amateur 151-300w 9th