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#1
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why
would you pick 1.rf/mtx/jl/kenwood/clarion/audiobahn over
2. jvc/boss/profile/jensen/blaupunkt/lanzer??? the 2nd group is mostly cheaper. oh by the way i own all the 2nd brands n none of the 1st. oh wait i got some kenwood speakers i waited too long to return.doh! i did have the hots for clarion decks yrs ago. but i thought .why? |
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#2
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Sometimes, cheaper means lower quality. Personally, there are only two
brands I wouldn't buy up the I've heard far too many bad things about Boss to be seriously interested in something of theirs. And I know that Jensen go bought out by Audiovox, and I've personally had terrible times with Audiovox... That's my two cents. ~Mister.Lull |
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#3
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every company has better models than others...
all those brands make some great models but somes 30% cheaper than the others..... but if you had $1400in just equipment include ''wires,caps'' to make a system i know my system would be over 1400rms, 4 0hm. |
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#4
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i'm saying you can get more power cheaper with my brands verses thoses
others.. |
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#5
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Yeah but the power from your brands is way over-rated...
bob wald wrote: i'm saying you can get more power cheaper with my brands verses thoses others.. |
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#6
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bob wald wrote:
every company has better models than others... all those brands make some great models but somes 30% cheaper than the others..... but if you had $1400in just equipment include ''wires,caps'' to make a system i know my system would be over 1400rms, 4 0hm. Correction ... your system would be "Rated" over 1400W @ 4 ohm ... a far cry from reality I am sure. No doubt my 300W system would sound better (and be louder). Clarion DRX-6475 PPI PC450 Infinity 5 1/4" components Orion XTR10 It's surprising what you can acheive with 1 amp, 3 channels of sound and 5 speakers. On the other hand, the above 4 items purchased new would have cost more then $1400, but I think it still qualifies due to the fact that only the deck was purchased new, so I payed less the $1400 total for the system. Just my 0.02 -- Dan Snooks |
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#7
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i see you dont know 90% of all amps are over rated.i guess youre taking
about amps.Since thats all that can be over rated.usually by less than 10%.other are afew brands over rate by around 20% ''visonik'' i think.i dont watch legacy/pyramid/pyle to name afew.pyle doing alil better now tho. even after you subtract 10% from 1400rms 4ohm.you still got some good power... Also my jensen dual outputs on my cd player 5v too i love more than any other i ever used.so far. |
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#8
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i see you dont know 90% of all amps are over rated.
Do you have any facts to back up that statement? |
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#9
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Correction ... your system would be "Rated" over 1400W @ 4 ohm ... a far
cry from reality I am sure. No doubt my 300W system would sound better (and be louder). Clarion DRX-6475 PPI PC450 Infinity 5 1/4" components Orion XTR10 It's surprising what you can acheive with 1 amp, 3 channels of sound and 5 speakers. On the other hand, the above 4 items purchased new would have cost more then $1400, but I think it still qualifies due to the fact that only the deck was purchased new, so I payed less the $1400 total for the system. Just my 0.02 It's not difficult to top 1400 watts with $1400. Especially if you buy discounted equipment online. Brick and mortar...well, do people still do that? |
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#10
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bob wald wrote:
i see you dont know 90% of all amps are over rated.i guess youre taking about amps.Since thats all that can be over rated.usually by less than 10%.other are afew brands over rate by around 20% ''visonik'' i think.i dont watch legacy/pyramid/pyle to name afew.pyle doing alil better now tho. even after you subtract 10% from 1400rms 4ohm.you still got some good power... Also my jensen dual outputs on my cd player 5v too i love more than any other i ever used.so far. Curious "statistics" you have. And here I thought my PPI PC450 was a conservatively rated 50 x 4 @ 4 ohm ... thanks for clearing that up for me. I get the impression though, that you didn't catch the point I was trying to make ... power ratings are irrelevant when it comes to sound quality and SPL. Also, why do you say that amps are all that can be overrated? My Orion XTR10 is rated to handle 800W RMS (says so right on the sticker) ... I wouldn't bet the farm on it though ... probably closer to 400W rms. After all, it certainly gets a workout with the ~200W I am giving it from the PPI. And while we are overrating things, what ****es me off the most is manufacturers using the peak power ratings to pimp their products. What a bunch of jerks, there oughta be a law. -- Dan Snooks |
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#11
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MZ wrote:
Correction ... your system would be "Rated" over 1400W @ 4 ohm ... a far cry from reality I am sure. No doubt my 300W system would sound better (and be louder). Clarion DRX-6475 PPI PC450 Infinity 5 1/4" components Orion XTR10 It's surprising what you can acheive with 1 amp, 3 channels of sound and 5 speakers. On the other hand, the above 4 items purchased new would have cost more then $1400, but I think it still qualifies due to the fact that only the deck was purchased new, so I payed less the $1400 total for the system. Just my 0.02 It's not difficult to top 1400 watts with $1400. Especially if you buy discounted equipment online. Brick and mortar...well, do people still do that? on the other hand, why top 1400 when 300 is plenty? i love the more is better mentality ... sells me a lot of computers :-) I realize you don't subscribe to that theory Mark, just building the thread. -- Dan Snooks |
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#12
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It's not difficult to top 1400 watts with $1400. Especially if you
buy discounted equipment online. Brick and mortar...well, do people still do that? on the other hand, why top 1400 when 300 is plenty? i love the more is better mentality ... sells me a lot of computers :-) I realize you don't subscribe to that theory Mark, just building the thread. Well, I sorta do subscribe to that theory. But I realize there's a point at which more power (amplifier or computer) doesn't get you anything more once you reach the level that satisfies your needs. You bring up a good point with computers. It's my opinion that computers are ruining the public school system. Yes, that's right. Computers. They're unnecessary. And the applications that grade school, or even high school, students need doesn't warrant a Pentium 4 with 512MB. Yet these schools are constantly upgrading by practically giving away their entire lots and buying brand new systems with full support. Just think what that money could be used for if they just kept their Pentium 2 computers from a few years ago and asked the computer teacher to maintain them (even though half the computer teachers out there aren't capable of such a thing!). Hell, I work in a research laboratory that's using 486's for some of the applications, and a main server that's essentially a slightly modified 20 year old microvax. Sure, the same goes for audio. But I'd argue that the point is much higher than 300 watts, at least for most listening tastes. Maybe 300 for the sub, but when you factor in the rest you're easily pushing 1kW. The problem is that there's no standard, so the "1000 watt" Boss amp may be actually putting out the same amount of power as your "200 watt" PPI... |
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#13
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look if any speaker is said to handle a certain amount of power put that
to it! if it blows get a new one. after about 4 times theyll pay you to go away.....and buy back thier speakers.and might even pay you not to tell about this. LOL ...amps can be off from thier specs due to minor voltage differenses.so if your amp is not like the specs ...so.tuff. |
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#14
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all boss is overrated is around 10%. so a 1000watts is really around
900watts. |
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#15
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all boss is overrated is around 10%. so a 1000watts is really around
900watts. Where are you getting this information? |
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#16
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Think it on the other way round. Is it too difficult to manufacture a 1000W
or 1500W Amp? Think what is the difference between the cost of 900W and 1000W amp and compare it with the "Goodwill" of the company. If you are the CEO of an AMP company would you give false information, and that too which can be easily verified. Actually (not only in audio video, but in all consumer products), 90% of the information that you get from other consumers is not reliable. -- The best is yet to come V |
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#17
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"Daniel Snooks" wrote in message ... bob wald wrote: i see you dont know 90% of all amps are over rated.i guess youre taking about amps.Since thats all that can be over rated.usually by less than 10%.other are afew brands over rate by around 20% ''visonik'' i think.i dont watch legacy/pyramid/pyle to name afew.pyle doing alil better now tho. even after you subtract 10% from 1400rms 4ohm.you still got some good power... Also my jensen dual outputs on my cd player 5v too i love more than any other i ever used.so far. Curious "statistics" you have. And here I thought my PPI PC450 was a conservatively rated 50 x 4 @ 4 ohm ... thanks for clearing that up for me. I get the impression though, that you didn't catch the point I was trying to make ... power ratings are irrelevant when it comes to sound quality and SPL. Also, why do you say that amps are all that can be overrated? My Orion XTR10 is rated to handle 800W RMS (says so right on the sticker) ... I wouldn't bet the farm on it though ... probably closer to 400W rms. After all, it certainly gets a workout with the ~200W I am giving it from the PPI. And while we are overrating things, what ****es me off the most is manufacturers using the peak power ratings to pimp their products. What a bunch of jerks, there oughta be a law. -- Dan Snooks the 800w was a thermal rating, in a certain box, I think that was on the white paper.. amazing those are still kicking around, I had some of the 12's what?12 years ago? now there's a quality product! reliability is another issue that could keep this thread going for weeks.. but you don't see many subs still truckin that long. but your right, the biggest indicator of something we call junk is overrated, or peak power rating..maybe not the most appropriate word to handle them but the percieved dishonesty is enough to turn us purists against them.. but correct me if I'm wrong, but in it's early popular days didn't crossfire rate it's amps peak? they had an excellent rep anyway.. still do I believe.. |
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#18
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your ppi is i guess more like 45x4.reguardless of what the amps are
rated at youll only get 90% usable power from them.that top 10% would be so dirty you wouldnt want it. so in other words most amps only have 80% usable power.minus 10%overrated minus 10% too dirty to use.i guess you dont know this... |
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#19
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your ppi is i guess more like 45x4.reguardless of what the amps are
rated at youll only get 90% usable power from them.that top 10% would be so dirty you wouldnt want it. so in other words most amps only have 80% usable power.minus 10%overrated minus 10% too dirty to use.i guess you dont know this... Why do you insist on making things up?? You have no idea what you're talking about. |
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#20
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ok..you go out to you car turn it up over 90%.lollllll itll sound like
crapppp. plus itll be smokinggg soon...... the top 10% of every amp is un usable... because alot of reasons..ill let you figure it out.. |
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#21
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ok..you go out to you car turn it up over 90%.lollllll itll sound like
crapppp. plus itll be smokinggg soon...... the top 10% of every amp is un usable... because alot of reasons..ill let you figure it out.. It sounds perfectly clean when I turn it up to 100%. I think you're confusing gain adjustments with output level. When you turn your radio up to 90%, you're driving the amp into clipping because your gain adjustments are set such that it clips before the volume knob reaches 100%. Go to carsound.com, for example, to see distortion vs. output power charts. They demonstrate that the THD+N of virtually all amplifiers is at about its lowest point just prior to the onset of clipping (which you can tell by the sudden steep positive slope corresponding to the generation of harmonics). Here's an example: http://www.carsound.com/review_archi...1100dchts.html |
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#22
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listen very slowly....this is true with everything on this earth.....if
you run anything full blast..it wont last very long... example. get it your cars drive 135mph for 2.5hrs. see what you got left after you do that. i suspect youll need a overhaul,tune up,rebuilt transmission. oh and you can stop once and add fluids. it still will be wore out. |
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#23
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I am lovin' this bob wald guy. A whole lot of garbage info with nothing to
back it up. Maybe if he spent the extra money for some of his equipment he'd see a difference. I personally would love to see and hear his install. You are not going to build a sound quality competition install or DB drag system with the brands he is using. All brands have their place depending on what you want out of them. And MZ didn't we already have this brand discussion last week? where was this guy. "Vivek Kapoor" wrote in message ... Think it on the other way round. Is it too difficult to manufacture a 1000W or 1500W Amp? Think what is the difference between the cost of 900W and 1000W amp and compare it with the "Goodwill" of the company. If you are the CEO of an AMP company would you give false information, and that too which can be easily verified. Actually (not only in audio video, but in all consumer products), 90% of the information that you get from other consumers is not reliable. -- The best is yet to come V |
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#24
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listen very slowly....this is true with everything on this earth.....if
you run anything full blast..it wont last very long... That's not what you said. You said it will sound terrible. Are you abandoning that argument now that I've proven you wrong? example. get it your cars drive 135mph for 2.5hrs. see what you got left after you do that. i suspect youll need a overhaul,tune up,rebuilt transmission. oh and you can stop once and add fluids. it still will be wore out. Just ran my 5 year old ESX amplifier driving my 4 year old JL sub and 5 year old a/d/s/ amplifier driving my 3 year old a/d/s/ speakers at full blast. It wasn't the first time either. They held up fine. So do I have magical equipment or something? |
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#26
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are you saying as your amps distorting 10%thd itll sound great????? as
90% of amps pass 10%thd at peaking.or on the top 90%+ of its power...... |
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#27
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oh i just read you ran your equipment over 90% of power.lol it musta
sounded like xox#$o^*.lol |
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#28
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i guess you dont know dropping ohms make dirty power...lol espesially
if you turn it p..uugh! that sounds like thats 1reason i play with 4ohm only. |
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#29
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"bob wald" wrote in message ... i see you dont know 90% of all amps are over rated.i guess youre taking about amps.Since thats all that can be over rated.usually by less than 10%.other are afew brands over rate by around 20% ''visonik'' i think.i dont watch legacy/pyramid/pyle to name afew.pyle doing alil better now tho. even after you subtract 10% from 1400rms 4ohm.you still got some good power... Also my jensen dual outputs on my cd player 5v too i love more than any other i ever used.so far. Bob, It's very obvious that you know very little about the use of amplifiers. What you are talking about is running an amp into distortion. all amps will distort if driven with enough input. a lot of today's amps will put out slightly more power than what they are rated. either you are an idiot, or you don't understand setting gains on an amp. |
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#30
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are you saying as your amps distorting 10%thd itll sound great????? as
90% of amps pass 10%thd at peaking.or on the top 90%+ of its power...... Again, you're just making this up. Please provide a reputable source, as I have done, to back up your statements. |
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#31
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i guess you dont know dropping ohms make dirty power...lol espesially
if you turn it p..uugh! that sounds like thats 1reason i play with 4ohm only. What exactly is "dirty power", and why doesn't it show up in THD+N measurements? |
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#32
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"MZ" wrote in message ... i guess you dont know dropping ohms make dirty power...lol espesially if you turn it p..uugh! that sounds like thats 1reason i play with 4ohm only. What exactly is "dirty power", and why doesn't it show up in THD+N measurements? you know, he's starting to sound like mmdir... |
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#33
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its a fact..universal known...you get more distortion from every source
the higher the volume.....hello |
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#34
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#36
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On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 02:00:26 GMT, "Dark1"
wrote: "MZ" wrote in message ... i guess you dont know dropping ohms make dirty power...lol espesially if you turn it p..uugh! that sounds like thats 1reason i play with 4ohm only. What exactly is "dirty power", and why doesn't it show up in THD+N measurements? you know, he's starting to sound like mmdir... I was thinking the exact same thing. His English is better, but they obviously both went to the same parallel-universe electronics tech school. -- Scott Gardner "It may be that our role on this planet is not to worship God, but to create him." (Arthur C. Clarke) |
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#37
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its a fact..universal known...you get more distortion from every source
the higher the volume.....hello If it's universally known, then you should easily be able to refute the evidence I provided to you earlier which demonstrated the results of benchmark testing where, in fact, THD+N decreased with increasing power output up until clipping occurred. So please provide just one of the hundreds of reputable sources that must be available if it's such a universally known fact. |
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#38
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bob wald wrote:
your ppi is i guess more like 45x4.reguardless of what the amps are rated at youll only get 90% usable power from them.that top 10% would be so dirty you wouldnt want it. so in other words most amps only have 80% usable power.minus 10%overrated minus 10% too dirty to use.i guess you dont know this... I see, MOST amps (according to you) ... which amps don't fall into this sweeping definition I wonder, perhaps you will enlighten us. Heh ... actually, the PPI is closer to 60 x 4 and that's long before any audible distortion You guys remember the old Charcoal series with the red lightning on them ... what a sweet product they were/are, speaking of which, I wouldn't mind getting a 1400 to keep my 450 company, anyone have one of those kicking around still? Maybe even the joining plate for them? -- Dan Snooks |
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#39
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i'm using a 12.5v supply. turn up any device over 90% youll create
stress on it also. that 40rms ppi must be using over 12.5v to get 60rms. |
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#40
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What's wrong with your car if it's only giving you 12.5v?
On Tue, 14 Jun 2005, bob wald wrote: i'm using a 12.5v supply. turn up any device over 90% youll create stress on it also. that 40rms ppi must be using over 12.5v to get 60rms. |
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