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Keep the Mac or eBay it?



 
 
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  #11  
Old June 4th 20, 09:45 PM posted to rec.audio.pro
Scott Dorsey
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Posts: 16,730
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

Try it. It won't cost you anything to try it since you already have it.
You might like it. I do; I think the bash command language is a whole hell
of a lot nicer than Powershell, and it makes it very easy to do operations
like batch normalizing and batch resampling files when you're trying to get
large projects done, or ship out a lot of slightly different demos of a
project.

If you don't like it, by all means sell it.

The Apple thing is that it's a closed platform, so you pay more money, but
you know the hardware will meet at least some basic minimal standard and
if something goes wrong the hardware and software people can't point fingers
at one another because they are one and the same.

I like the Apple OS a lot more than Windows, but then I spend most of my
time on the command line. Your mileage may differ, and it won't cost you
any money to find out.

At the very least trying it out will let you get some basic operating skill
so that when you're in some studio with an Apple you won't be at a loss.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
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  #12  
Old June 4th 20, 09:51 PM posted to rec.audio.pro
Scott Dorsey
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Posts: 16,730
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

John Williamson > wrote:
>
>Apple software is based on a *nix kernel. That's about as close as it
>gets to being a *nix system, as the UI and other stuff is pure Apple.
>The hardware is now mostly Intel based, so you can, in theory, use any
>x86 compatible operating system.


It's kind of the opposite. Internally, it's based on the Mach microkernel
which isn't really very Unixlike at all but which offers a Unixlike API.
What you get with the Apple is the Unix UI, that is to say a real command
line shell and the Software Tools environment.

Apple has a cheesy GUI on top of this, but you don't have to use the GUI
for anything other than running your DAW itself. You can stay on the command
line like a normal computer.

Now.. Apple has chosen to do some stuff, like managing USB devices, very
differently than other Unix dialects. If you are used to how NetBSD
or Linux handle audio streams, OSX does them all differently.

>If what you want is a seamless production environment, take the hit to
>your wallet and get Protools. It "just works", and projects can be
>worked on in just about any studio or mastering suite that uses it.


Protools has -finally- got to the point of just working with Protools 7.
Before that, you couldn't expect to get out the same data you put in if
you just loaded a file and didn't edit it but saved it. But the bloat
set in long before then. Still, we use Protools because that is what
the customers want.

>Alternatively, many people use the Adobe suite, where the audio and
>video tools work very well together. It is now "Software As A Service",
>though, so unless you keep subscribing, it stops working.


And that is a catastrophic problem if your computer is kept completely
isolated, which any DAW should be.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
  #14  
Old June 5th 20, 12:37 AM posted to rec.audio.pro
geoff
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Posts: 1,646
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

On 5/06/2020 2:53 am, Tobiah wrote:
>> Why do you feel the need change change your computer (a downgrade in
>> this particular¬* model instance) that may render your current software
>> unusable, or at least complicated to get it to work.

>
> Mostly because it's a Unix system.¬* I'm a programmer
> by trade, and I spend a lot of time on the command
> line.¬* I dual boot Linux and live there for anything
> except music.¬* I banged my heart at Linux audio for
> enough years.¬* I spent all my time configuring and
> none creating. Also my favorite interface is not
> yet supported.
>
> So I use Cygwin on Windows to get a decent shell,
> but it's a band-aid on a band-aid.¬* I wanted to
> be on a Unix OS where I'm comfy, with real audio
> support.
>
> Also, a couple of fellow developers at work are
> Mac heads and I've seen them use them for years.
> I found that it looked like an attractive alternative.
>
> Now, I also wanted a seamless audio production
> experience.¬* I'll take into account some of the comments
> that have been made here.
>
>
>
>
>



Unless you want to use a command-line DAW (?!!!) then surely you are
approaching everything from 100% the wrong direction ?!!!

Good that you you do have an open mind though - hope whatever works out
works out for the best.

geoff
  #15  
Old June 5th 20, 12:39 AM posted to rec.audio.pro
geoff
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Posts: 1,646
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

On 5/06/2020 4:16 am, Tobiah wrote:
>> Apple software is based on a *nix kernel. That's about as close as it
>> gets to being a *nix system, as the UI and other stuff is pure Apple.

>
> ¬*From what I can tell, it's a Unix system with a proprietary kernel,
> ¬*POSIX compliant and certified by The Open Group.¬* The UI is really
> ¬*just a program that runs in that environment.
>
> ¬*I get bash and all of the Unixy command line tools and it feels
> ¬*like an old pair of blue jeans.


What - grimy, full of holes and a bit faded ?

;- )

geoff
  #16  
Old June 5th 20, 12:50 AM posted to rec.audio.pro
geoff
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Posts: 1,646
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

On 5/06/2020 8:51 am, Scott Dorsey wrote:
> John Williamson > wrote:
>>
>> Apple software is based on a *nix kernel. That's about as close as it
>> gets to being a *nix system, as the UI and other stuff is pure Apple.
>> The hardware is now mostly Intel based, so you can, in theory, use any
>> x86 compatible operating system.

>
> It's kind of the opposite. Internally, it's based on the Mach microkernel
> which isn't really very Unixlike at all but which offers a Unixlike API.
> What you get with the Apple is the Unix UI, that is to say a real command
> line shell and the Software Tools environment.
>
> Apple has a cheesy GUI on top of this, but you don't have to use the GUI
> for anything other than running your DAW itself. You can stay on the command
> line like a normal computer.


These days a 'normal computer' relies on a command line, or even by
default starts-up to one ?

>
> Now.. Apple has chosen to do some stuff, like managing USB devices, very
> differently than other Unix dialects. If you are used to how NetBSD
> or Linux handle audio streams, OSX does them all differently.
>
>> If what you want is a seamless production environment, take the hit to
>> your wallet and get Protools. It "just works", and projects can be
>> worked on in just about any studio or mastering suite that uses it.



Having grown up on command-lines I really can't see why anybody would
get a stiffy from one.

>
> Protools has -finally- got to the point of just working with Protools 7.
> Before that, you couldn't expect to get out the same data you put in if
> you just loaded a file and didn't edit it but saved it. But the bloat
> set in long before then. Still, we use Protools because that is what
> the customers want.


Brought about largely by cynical restrictive marketing practices and
business tie-ups in the early days of DAWs.

>> Alternatively, many people use the Adobe suite, where the audio and
>> video tools work very well together. It is now "Software As A Service",
>> though, so unless you keep subscribing, it stops working.

>
> And that is a catastrophic problem if your computer is kept completely
> isolated, which any DAW should be.
> --scott
>


Alternatively many people use many other apps too that aren't on a
subscription model, and only update if purposefully connected to the
outside world and updated.

Though Protools, mainly for the previously mentioned reason, remains the
most common 'high-end' solution.

geoff
  #17  
Old June 5th 20, 06:57 PM posted to rec.audio.pro
Tobiah[_6_]
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Posts: 7
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?


> Unless you want to use a command-line DAW (?!!!) then surely you are
> approaching everything from 100% the wrong direction ?!!!


Not from one direction or the other. I just want both.
Of course I live in the GUI, with browsers and audio
programs open, along with terminal windows.

One way I would like to work, is to write command line
programs that generate MIDI messages that are sent to
a sampler.
  #18  
Old June 5th 20, 11:12 PM posted to rec.audio.pro
Scott Dorsey
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Posts: 16,730
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

In article >, Tobiah > wrote:
>
>> Unless you want to use a command-line DAW (?!!!) then surely you are
>> approaching everything from 100% the wrong direction ?!!!

>
>Not from one direction or the other. I just want both.
>Of course I live in the GUI, with browsers and audio
>programs open, along with terminal windows.
>
>One way I would like to work, is to write command line
>programs that generate MIDI messages that are sent to
>a sampler.


You need an Atari ST.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
  #19  
Old June 6th 20, 03:14 PM posted to rec.audio.pro
Tobiah[_6_]
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Posts: 7
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

On 6/5/20 3:12 PM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
> In article >, Tobiah > wrote:
>>
>>> Unless you want to use a command-line DAW (?!!!) then surely you are
>>> approaching everything from 100% the wrong direction ?!!!

>>
>> Not from one direction or the other. I just want both.
>> Of course I live in the GUI, with browsers and audio
>> programs open, along with terminal windows.
>>
>> One way I would like to work, is to write command line
>> programs that generate MIDI messages that are sent to
>> a sampler.

>
> You need an Atari ST.
> --scott
>


In the mid 80's I was absorbed by a Yamaha CX5M computer.
It had a four operator FM synth module that could be
triggered through hooks in the BASIC language.

That was cookin' with gas. I saved everything
on cassette tape, but didn't know what I was
missing. The first program on the tape would
display an index into tape counter positions
for the other programs. It was the inception
of a file system.

While I'm on nostalgia, had come across a commodore 64
with a printer at a thrift shop. I wanted to print
from the Yamaha, so I used the Yamaha's controllable
cassette motor relay to switch pins of the joystic port
on the commodore. Assembly routines on both ends worked
out a timing code to send the data across and on to
the printer.



  #20  
Old June 7th 20, 12:21 AM posted to rec.audio.pro
geoff
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Posts: 1,646
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

On 7/06/2020 2:14 am, Tobiah wrote:
> On 6/5/20 3:12 PM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
>> In article >, Tobiah
>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> Unless you want to use a command-line DAW (?!!!) then surely you are
>>>> approaching everything from 100% the wrong direction ?!!!
>>>
>>> Not from one direction or the other.¬* I just want both.
>>> Of course I live in the GUI, with browsers and audio
>>> programs open, along with terminal windows.
>>>
>>> One way I would like to work, is to write command line
>>> programs that generate MIDI messages that are sent to
>>> a sampler.

>>
>> You need an Atari ST.
>> --scott
>>

>
> In the mid 80's I was absorbed by a Yamaha CX5M computer.
> It had a four operator FM synth module that could be
> triggered through hooks in the BASIC language.
>
> That was cookin' with gas.¬* I saved everything
> on cassette tape, but didn't know what I was
> missing.¬* The first program on the tape would
> display an index into tape counter positions
> for the other programs.¬* It was the inception
> of a file system.
>
> While I'm on nostalgia, had come across a commodore 64
> with a printer at a thrift shop.¬* I wanted to print
> from the Yamaha, so I used the Yamaha's controllable
> cassette motor relay to switch pins of the joystic port
> on the commodore.¬* Assembly routines on both ends worked
> out a timing code to send the data across and on to
> the printer.


I once saw a horse and cart that was really good. Made going shopping in
the city really easy. And that stone tablet was so quick and easy to
inscript, and durable ....

geoff
 




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