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George W.
 
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Default Behringer MX802A line inputs

There was recently some discussion here about the line level inputs on
the small Behringer mixers, specifically the 802, and whether they use
the mic preamps or bypass them completely. I haven't been able to find
an answer to this. Anyone know for sure how they route the signal?

Thanks.
  #2   Report Post  
Arny Krueger
 
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Default Behringer MX802A line inputs

"George W." wrote in message


There was recently some discussion here about the line level inputs on
the small Behringer mixers, specifically the 802, and whether they use
the mic preamps or bypass them completely. I haven't been able to find
an answer to this. Anyone know for sure how they route the signal?


Since the stereo channels don't have mic preamps, it seems like it would be
quite obvious that their line inputs don't bypass any mic preamps, since
there are no mic preamps to bypass.

You may be thinking about the two mono channels with mic preamps. Typically
low and mid-end mixer line inputs don't bypass a given mixing channel's mic
preamps when that mixing channel has mic preamps. This is true of the
Behringer and Mackie mixers for which detailed block diagrams are available,
for example.


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Scott Dorsey
 
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Default Behringer MX802A line inputs

George W. wrote:
There was recently some discussion here about the line level inputs on
the small Behringer mixers, specifically the 802, and whether they use
the mic preamps or bypass them completely. I haven't been able to find
an answer to this. Anyone know for sure how they route the signal?


They all go through the mike preamps. So do the small Mackie, Soundcraft,
and Allen and Heath consoles.

If you don't like it, inject the signal into the insert, after the mike
preamp.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
  #5   Report Post  
octopus
 
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Default Behringer MX802A line inputs

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message ...
"George W." wrote in message


There was recently some discussion here about the line level inputs on
the small Behringer mixers, specifically the 802, and whether they use
the mic preamps or bypass them completely. I haven't been able to find
an answer to this. Anyone know for sure how they route the signal?


Since the stereo channels don't have mic preamps, it seems like it would be
quite obvious that their line inputs don't bypass any mic preamps, since
there are no mic preamps to bypass.

You may be thinking about the two mono channels with mic preamps. Typically
low and mid-end mixer line inputs don't bypass a given mixing channel's mic
preamps when that mixing channel has mic preamps. This is true of the
Behringer and Mackie mixers for which detailed block diagrams are available,
for example.



maybe the original poster is referring to an older discussion where it
was mentioned that you should use the AUX1/2 returns if you want to
bypass the input sections of the stereo channels.

.... and: what is "mid-end" :-)


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Dan
 
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Default Behringer MX802A line inputs

This particular mixer doesn't have inserts, and the two stereo
channels don't have preamps - but neither do they have sends.

After that previous discussion mentioned (in which I took part) I have
decided that I am going to find a better way to do this, because, as
Mr. Boyke points out, that Behringer pre is messing up my nice RNP'd
signal. I simply don' have time right now to experiment, but when I do
I will try to contribute some questions and perhaps some comments.

d



(Scott Dorsey) wrote in message ...
George W. wrote:
There was recently some discussion here about the line level inputs on
the small Behringer mixers, specifically the 802, and whether they use
the mic preamps or bypass them completely. I haven't been able to find
an answer to this. Anyone know for sure how they route the signal?


They all go through the mike preamps. So do the small Mackie, Soundcraft,
and Allen and Heath consoles.

If you don't like it, inject the signal into the insert, after the mike
preamp.
--scott

  #8   Report Post  
Dan
 
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Default Behringer MX802A line inputs

Twist the little black preamp gain knob while you are plugged into the
line level input. Hear that? That's messing us up, George.

d


George W. wrote in message . ..
There was recently some discussion here about the line level inputs on
the small Behringer mixers, specifically the 802, and whether they use
the mic preamps or bypass them completely. I haven't been able to find
an answer to this. Anyone know for sure how they route the signal?

Thanks.

  #9   Report Post  
George W.
 
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Default Behringer MX802A line inputs

On 19 Nov 2003 16:09:02 -0800, Dan wrote:

Twist the little black preamp gain knob while you are plugged into the
line level input. Hear that? That's messing us up, George.


Dan,

I assume you're referring to the RNP when it's connected to the mixer.
With everything up on the mixer it's pretty loud but when I run the
RNP direct to the soundcard and turn the gain all the way up I still
get some hiss. I have to turn up the volume louder than normal (about
1/4 of the way) but it certainly isn't dead quite. I imagine it's
unrealistic to expect it to be but how much noise would be "normal"
for the RNP?

I found that noise other than hiss on the RNP is very much dependant
on location. I had it about a foot from the PC monitor but got a
pretty obvious buzz with the gain turned up. Moving it a couple of
more feet helped. I'm gonna have to re-think the location of some
components and perhaps try some better cables. I'm using regular RCA
audio cables with 1/4" adapters on the RNP side. Along these lines I'd
appreciate any input by anyone on whether the RNP is working as it
should be.

Thanks.

G.
  #10   Report Post  
Dan
 
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Default Behringer MX802A line inputs

Yeah, that hiss and the gain that it is accompanying is proof that the
MX802A preamp is part of the circuit - that's the preamp gain knob.
Any hope that the preamp is out of the circuit when using the line-in
is dashed. My RNP will also hiss when turned all the way up...I bet
most pres do. The RNP is known to be slightly noisier than some other
preamps, but as some have observed, even its noise is way less than
that of some treasured vintage preamps in use by professionals daily
(also, see McQuilken's accomanying package notes on design/price
trade-offs). Its nothing compared to the noise you and I will add to
the chain with our PC monitors, PC fans, questionable acoustic
treatment, and whatever else. My set up is so claustrophobic that I
sometimes just turn my monitor off and on again as needed while
tracking to eliminate hum - I use keyboard shortcuts, and don't always
have to see. Get this, my studio is in a square, untreated home office
shared with my wife, who works full-time at home, in that office, and
often into the evening, with 4 PCs networked and humming 24/7. ****ing
terrific environment. but we'll maybe be moving soon, so I'll be on
the lookout for a garage type space.

That PC monitor is going to bleed into everything, it will even affect
your monitor speakers - many studios use active matrix/flat panel/LCD
monitors to avoid most of this.

Regards,

d


George W. wrote in message . ..
On 19 Nov 2003 16:09:02 -0800, Dan wrote:

Twist the little black preamp gain knob while you are plugged into the
line level input. Hear that? That's messing us up, George.


Dan,

I assume you're referring to the RNP when it's connected to the mixer.
With everything up on the mixer it's pretty loud but when I run the
RNP direct to the soundcard and turn the gain all the way up I still
get some hiss. I have to turn up the volume louder than normal (about
1/4 of the way) but it certainly isn't dead quite. I imagine it's
unrealistic to expect it to be but how much noise would be "normal"
for the RNP?

I found that noise other than hiss on the RNP is very much dependant
on location. I had it about a foot from the PC monitor but got a
pretty obvious buzz with the gain turned up. Moving it a couple of
more feet helped. I'm gonna have to re-think the location of some
components and perhaps try some better cables. I'm using regular RCA
audio cables with 1/4" adapters on the RNP side. Along these lines I'd
appreciate any input by anyone on whether the RNP is working as it
should be.

Thanks.

G.



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Stephen Boyke
 
Posts: n/a
Default Behringer MX802A line inputs

in article , George W. at
wrote on 11/19/03 5:18 PM:

Dan,

I assume you're referring to the RNP when it's connected to the mixer.
With everything up on the mixer it's pretty loud but when I run the
RNP direct to the soundcard and turn the gain all the way up I still
get some hiss. I have to turn up the volume louder than normal (about
1/4 of the way) but it certainly isn't dead quite. I imagine it's
unrealistic to expect it to be but how much noise would be "normal"
for the RNP?

I found that noise other than hiss on the RNP is very much dependant
on location. I had it about a foot from the PC monitor but got a
pretty obvious buzz with the gain turned up. Moving it a couple of
more feet helped. I'm gonna have to re-think the location of some
components and perhaps try some better cables. I'm using regular RCA
audio cables with 1/4" adapters on the RNP side. Along these lines I'd
appreciate any input by anyone on whether the RNP is working as it
should be.

Thanks.

G.


George,

I doubt you will ever need 100% gain on the RNP. If you do, something
else is amiss. The RNP I tried had a bit more noise than other quality
preamps, but it's not really noticeable at moderate signal levels. You
might want to purchase a pair of higher quality cables to go between the RNP
and your soundcard. Keep the cables away from the CRT as well as any 120v
lines (or if you have to have them near 120v lines, cross them at 90 degrees
- don't let them run parallel).

Now all you need to do is figure out how to get rid of the CPU fan and
hard drive noise. I solved it by moving the CPU (a G4) into the next room -
cut a 2" hole through the wall and got some extension cables - stuffed the
hole with foam = works great).
--
Stephen T. Boyke


  #12   Report Post  
George W.
 
Posts: n/a
Default Behringer MX802A line inputs

On Thu, 20 Nov 2003 17:06:58 GMT, Stephen Boyke wrote:

in article , George W. at
wrote on 11/19/03 5:18 PM:

Dan,

I assume you're referring to the RNP when it's connected to the mixer.
With everything up on the mixer it's pretty loud but when I run the
RNP direct to the soundcard and turn the gain all the way up I still
get some hiss. I have to turn up the volume louder than normal (about
1/4 of the way) but it certainly isn't dead quite. I imagine it's
unrealistic to expect it to be but how much noise would be "normal"
for the RNP?

I found that noise other than hiss on the RNP is very much dependant
on location. I had it about a foot from the PC monitor but got a
pretty obvious buzz with the gain turned up. Moving it a couple of
more feet helped. I'm gonna have to re-think the location of some
components and perhaps try some better cables. I'm using regular RCA
audio cables with 1/4" adapters on the RNP side. Along these lines I'd
appreciate any input by anyone on whether the RNP is working as it
should be.

Thanks.

G.


George,

I doubt you will ever need 100% gain on the RNP. If you do, something
else is amiss. The RNP I tried had a bit more noise than other quality
preamps, but it's not really noticeable at moderate signal levels. You
might want to purchase a pair of higher quality cables to go between the RNP
and your soundcard. Keep the cables away from the CRT as well as any 120v
lines (or if you have to have them near 120v lines, cross them at 90 degrees
- don't let them run parallel).

Now all you need to do is figure out how to get rid of the CPU fan and
hard drive noise. I solved it by moving the CPU (a G4) into the next room -
cut a 2" hole through the wall and got some extension cables - stuffed the
hole with foam = works great).


I get the feeling there's no light at the end of this tunnel. g
Thanks for the cable advice. I've got some RS RCA cables with 1/4"
adapters on one end so I'll see if I can find something better. Moving
the RNP away from the monitor helped a lot.

Thanks Steve.

G.

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