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#41
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Matt Macchiarolo wrote: "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... What's the 741 doing btw ? Don't have the slightest idea, reading schematics is like Greek to me. Though it's there and there is only one. Perhaps something to do with the mono switch? If you have the schematics - can you scan them ( master section a tleast ) and post in alt.binaries.schematics.electronics ? I'll take a look. Would be able to advise better. Graham |
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#42
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Matt Macchiarolo wrote: I don't have a scanner, got a fax machine? Yup. My bad to post it here but here goes ( dial international access ) ( then UK code - 44 ) followed by 1727 then 765452. Plain paper fax btw. Only understands A4 ( international ) paper size - not some of the funny US sizes. Try one page first to see how it goes. Graham |
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#43
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Matt Macchiarolo wrote: I don't have a scanner, got a fax machine? Yup. My bad to post it here but here goes ( dial international access ) ( then UK code - 44 ) followed by 1727 then 765452. Plain paper fax btw. Only understands A4 ( international ) paper size - not some of the funny US sizes. Try one page first to see how it goes. Graham |
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#44
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"Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: I don't have a scanner, got a fax machine? Yup. Fax is transmitting. I won't give out your fax number. :-) 741 is in section A-4 of the lower schematic (Left Bus). |
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#45
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"Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: I don't have a scanner, got a fax machine? Yup. Fax is transmitting. I won't give out your fax number. :-) 741 is in section A-4 of the lower schematic (Left Bus). |
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#46
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#47
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#48
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So I am learning.
"Mike Rivers" wrote in message news:znr1100362543k@trad... In article writes: Just got a new (old) mixing console, Peavey/AMR 2400, and there is a noticeable level of noise in the master module when I pull up the faders, even though there is no signal from any of the channels. I called Peavey's tech dept and they suggested replacing the op-amps in the master module, as they age they lose their tolerances and can cause noise (it sounds like white noise). Yeah, Peavey's advice sounds like white noise, or just plain horse manure. I've never heard of op amps that "age" and "lose their tolerance." More likely it's a bad resistor, a bad capacitor, a bad switch, or a bad solder joint. Could even be a dirty connector contact. While there may be better sounding op amps available today, take care of the real source of the noise first or you'll still have it after you replace the chips. -- I'm really Mike Rivers ) However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over, lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo |
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#49
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So I am learning.
"Mike Rivers" wrote in message news:znr1100362543k@trad... In article writes: Just got a new (old) mixing console, Peavey/AMR 2400, and there is a noticeable level of noise in the master module when I pull up the faders, even though there is no signal from any of the channels. I called Peavey's tech dept and they suggested replacing the op-amps in the master module, as they age they lose their tolerances and can cause noise (it sounds like white noise). Yeah, Peavey's advice sounds like white noise, or just plain horse manure. I've never heard of op amps that "age" and "lose their tolerance." More likely it's a bad resistor, a bad capacitor, a bad switch, or a bad solder joint. Could even be a dirty connector contact. While there may be better sounding op amps available today, take care of the real source of the noise first or you'll still have it after you replace the chips. -- I'm really Mike Rivers ) However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over, lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo |
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#50
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Matt Macchiarolo wrote: "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: I don't have a scanner, got a fax machine? Yup. Fax is transmitting. I won't give out your fax number. :-) 741 is in section A-4 of the lower schematic (Left Bus). Ok - got it. Is that the size you got it ? A bit on the tiny side. Having trouble reading it. The good news is that the 741 clearly isn't in the audio path ( as I suspected ). I'm having trouble reading the U numbers but the ICs for the bus amps are the ones ( one on each page ) that are on the top left hand corner - note the connections to BUS GND and a 10UH inductor. Looks like one half of the dual op-amp is the bus amp - the other half is the fader buffer - pretty classic. If *anything* is going to make a difference - it's them ! The resistor values around the bus amps aren't *too* bad regarding thermal noise but I would use lower. But that's a re-design. Graham |
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#51
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Matt Macchiarolo wrote: "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: I don't have a scanner, got a fax machine? Yup. Fax is transmitting. I won't give out your fax number. :-) 741 is in section A-4 of the lower schematic (Left Bus). Ok - got it. Is that the size you got it ? A bit on the tiny side. Having trouble reading it. The good news is that the 741 clearly isn't in the audio path ( as I suspected ). I'm having trouble reading the U numbers but the ICs for the bus amps are the ones ( one on each page ) that are on the top left hand corner - note the connections to BUS GND and a 10UH inductor. Looks like one half of the dual op-amp is the bus amp - the other half is the fader buffer - pretty classic. If *anything* is going to make a difference - it's them ! The resistor values around the bus amps aren't *too* bad regarding thermal noise but I would use lower. But that's a re-design. Graham |
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#52
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Thanks Pooh! Next time I'm in the UK I will buy you a pint of Greene King!
Until then I will raise a glass of Old Speckled Hen to you! Both schematics are on one page, 8.5x11...fairly tiny. Those op amps are U1A and U1B, a=left b=right. . Those are the summing amps, correct? You don't think the U5's (section D-4) could be a factor? All those are 5532's. The manual includes a PCB diagram so I can find those pretty easily. If you were to replace those resistors, what would you recommend? And what does that 741 do? "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: I don't have a scanner, got a fax machine? Yup. Fax is transmitting. I won't give out your fax number. :-) 741 is in section A-4 of the lower schematic (Left Bus). Ok - got it. Is that the size you got it ? A bit on the tiny side. Having trouble reading it. The good news is that the 741 clearly isn't in the audio path ( as I suspected ). I'm having trouble reading the U numbers but the ICs for the bus amps are the ones ( one on each page ) that are on the top left hand corner - note the connections to BUS GND and a 10UH inductor. Looks like one half of the dual op-amp is the bus amp - the other half is the fader buffer - pretty classic. If *anything* is going to make a difference - it's them ! The resistor values around the bus amps aren't *too* bad regarding thermal noise but I would use lower. But that's a re-design. Graham |
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#53
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Thanks Pooh! Next time I'm in the UK I will buy you a pint of Greene King!
Until then I will raise a glass of Old Speckled Hen to you! Both schematics are on one page, 8.5x11...fairly tiny. Those op amps are U1A and U1B, a=left b=right. . Those are the summing amps, correct? You don't think the U5's (section D-4) could be a factor? All those are 5532's. The manual includes a PCB diagram so I can find those pretty easily. If you were to replace those resistors, what would you recommend? And what does that 741 do? "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: I don't have a scanner, got a fax machine? Yup. Fax is transmitting. I won't give out your fax number. :-) 741 is in section A-4 of the lower schematic (Left Bus). Ok - got it. Is that the size you got it ? A bit on the tiny side. Having trouble reading it. The good news is that the 741 clearly isn't in the audio path ( as I suspected ). I'm having trouble reading the U numbers but the ICs for the bus amps are the ones ( one on each page ) that are on the top left hand corner - note the connections to BUS GND and a 10UH inductor. Looks like one half of the dual op-amp is the bus amp - the other half is the fader buffer - pretty classic. If *anything* is going to make a difference - it's them ! The resistor values around the bus amps aren't *too* bad regarding thermal noise but I would use lower. But that's a re-design. Graham |
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#54
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Is this noise the same on both channels.... if so it's more likely either a
power supply issue or a design issue. Rgds: Eric "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: It's just the master faders. No channel faders are up. Ok - sounds like noisy bus amps. Most likely a / some 5532s. There's going to be some circuitry following them though that could also be influencing things. If you can identify the op-amp that's the bus mix section - then selective replacement as a test would make sense. I guess it's possible a chip's gone noisy - but it's rare. Maybe the Peavey guys know something they're not letting on about ? Graham |
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#55
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Is this noise the same on both channels.... if so it's more likely either a
power supply issue or a design issue. Rgds: Eric "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: It's just the master faders. No channel faders are up. Ok - sounds like noisy bus amps. Most likely a / some 5532s. There's going to be some circuitry following them though that could also be influencing things. If you can identify the op-amp that's the bus mix section - then selective replacement as a test would make sense. I guess it's possible a chip's gone noisy - but it's rare. Maybe the Peavey guys know something they're not letting on about ? Graham |
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#56
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Matt Macchiarolo wrote: Thanks Pooh! Next time I'm in the UK I will buy you a pint of Greene King! Until then I will raise a glass of Old Speckled Hen to you! Cheers then ! Both schematics are on one page, 8.5x11...fairly tiny. Those op amps are U1A and U1B, a=left b=right. . Those are the summing amps, correct? Ok - wondered if that might be so. You don't think the U5's (section D-4) could be a factor? All those are 5532's. The manual includes a PCB diagram so I can find those pretty easily. The other op-amps operate at high signal levels so the noise contribution there won't be an issue. No need to replace. If you were to replace those resistors, what would you recommend? Well, I'd most likely use something like 4k7 feedback Rs in place of 22k. You can't do that without altering the channel values though or the gain structure gets screwed. And what does that 741 do? Given the quality of the fax it's tricky to say. Is there a peak led there though. Maybe that's it ? TI's part number for the DIL 5532 is NE5532AP btw. http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folder...t/ne5532a.html - log in as a tech and request samples ! Philips / Signetics have stopped making it. NJR / JRC ( New Japan Radio Corporation ) also source it. Graham |
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#57
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Matt Macchiarolo wrote: Thanks Pooh! Next time I'm in the UK I will buy you a pint of Greene King! Until then I will raise a glass of Old Speckled Hen to you! Cheers then ! Both schematics are on one page, 8.5x11...fairly tiny. Those op amps are U1A and U1B, a=left b=right. . Those are the summing amps, correct? Ok - wondered if that might be so. You don't think the U5's (section D-4) could be a factor? All those are 5532's. The manual includes a PCB diagram so I can find those pretty easily. The other op-amps operate at high signal levels so the noise contribution there won't be an issue. No need to replace. If you were to replace those resistors, what would you recommend? Well, I'd most likely use something like 4k7 feedback Rs in place of 22k. You can't do that without altering the channel values though or the gain structure gets screwed. And what does that 741 do? Given the quality of the fax it's tricky to say. Is there a peak led there though. Maybe that's it ? TI's part number for the DIL 5532 is NE5532AP btw. http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folder...t/ne5532a.html - log in as a tech and request samples ! Philips / Signetics have stopped making it. NJR / JRC ( New Japan Radio Corporation ) also source it. Graham |
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#58
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Those op amps are U1A and U1B, a=left b=right. . Those are the summing
amps, correct? Ok - wondered if that might be so. According to the signal path diagram, they correspond to the summing amps. You don't think the U5's (section D-4) could be a factor? All those are 5532's. The manual includes a PCB diagram so I can find those pretty easily. The other op-amps operate at high signal levels so the noise contribution there won't be an issue. No need to replace. If you were to replace those resistors, what would you recommend? Well, I'd most likely use something like 4k7 feedback Rs in place of 22k. You can't do that without altering the channel values though or the gain structure gets screwed. Gotcha. And what does that 741 do? Given the quality of the fax it's tricky to say. Is there a peak led there though. Maybe that's it ? Ah yes, that makes sense to be the signal/peak LED circuit, it uses a bicolor LED that is green with signal and red when within 3dB of clipping, according to the manual... When I get a chance I'll swap out those 5532's and we'll see what happens...thanks for all your help!! |
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#59
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Those op amps are U1A and U1B, a=left b=right. . Those are the summing
amps, correct? Ok - wondered if that might be so. According to the signal path diagram, they correspond to the summing amps. You don't think the U5's (section D-4) could be a factor? All those are 5532's. The manual includes a PCB diagram so I can find those pretty easily. The other op-amps operate at high signal levels so the noise contribution there won't be an issue. No need to replace. If you were to replace those resistors, what would you recommend? Well, I'd most likely use something like 4k7 feedback Rs in place of 22k. You can't do that without altering the channel values though or the gain structure gets screwed. Gotcha. And what does that 741 do? Given the quality of the fax it's tricky to say. Is there a peak led there though. Maybe that's it ? Ah yes, that makes sense to be the signal/peak LED circuit, it uses a bicolor LED that is green with signal and red when within 3dB of clipping, according to the manual... When I get a chance I'll swap out those 5532's and we'll see what happens...thanks for all your help!! |
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#60
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"Pooh Bear" wrote in message
The resistor values around the bus amps aren't *too* bad regarding thermal noise but I would use lower. But that's a re-design. Might be a good idea to measure them and see that they are still the values that the schematic says they should be. That's a possible noise source... not so common with modern film resistors but it happens. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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#61
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"Pooh Bear" wrote in message
The resistor values around the bus amps aren't *too* bad regarding thermal noise but I would use lower. But that's a re-design. Might be a good idea to measure them and see that they are still the values that the schematic says they should be. That's a possible noise source... not so common with modern film resistors but it happens. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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#62
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It should scale to A4 with no problem.... and if he is calling from the
USA.. it's 011 44 1727 765452 011 international prefix... 44 UK country code.... Rgds: Eric "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: I don't have a scanner, got a fax machine? Yup. My bad to post it here but here goes ( dial international access ) ( then UK code - 44 ) followed by 1727 then 765452. Plain paper fax btw. Only understands A4 ( international ) paper size - not some of the funny US sizes. Try one page first to see how it goes. Graham |
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#63
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It should scale to A4 with no problem.... and if he is calling from the
USA.. it's 011 44 1727 765452 011 international prefix... 44 UK country code.... Rgds: Eric "Pooh Bear" wrote in message ... Matt Macchiarolo wrote: I don't have a scanner, got a fax machine? Yup. My bad to post it here but here goes ( dial international access ) ( then UK code - 44 ) followed by 1727 then 765452. Plain paper fax btw. Only understands A4 ( international ) paper size - not some of the funny US sizes. Try one page first to see how it goes. Graham |
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#64
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"Eric K. Weber" wrote: It should scale to A4 with no problem.... and if he is calling from the USA.. it's Ssssh ! It's a secret ! Yeah, it came through OK. Had some past trouble with the 'legal' size paper though. Pretty much all paper sizes here ( and rest of world ) are now international standards. Just the USA goes its own way with the stuff you enherited from us Brits mainly I think - lol. Graham |
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#65
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"Eric K. Weber" wrote: It should scale to A4 with no problem.... and if he is calling from the USA.. it's Ssssh ! It's a secret ! Yeah, it came through OK. Had some past trouble with the 'legal' size paper though. Pretty much all paper sizes here ( and rest of world ) are now international standards. Just the USA goes its own way with the stuff you enherited from us Brits mainly I think - lol. Graham |
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#66
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Well I just pulled the master module and it looks like it has been modded..
the 5532 in question seems to have been replaced with an LT1358, and some of the others were replaced with TLE2082's, along with some other components that were added. This console had 5 input channels modified by Audio Upgrades, it looks as if the master module has been modified as well...looks like I'll be calling Jim again. Thanks for everyone's help! Matt "Matt Macchiarolo" wrote in message ... Those op amps are U1A and U1B, a=left b=right. . Those are the summing amps, correct? Ok - wondered if that might be so. According to the signal path diagram, they correspond to the summing amps. You don't think the U5's (section D-4) could be a factor? All those are 5532's. The manual includes a PCB diagram so I can find those pretty easily. The other op-amps operate at high signal levels so the noise contribution there won't be an issue. No need to replace. If you were to replace those resistors, what would you recommend? Well, I'd most likely use something like 4k7 feedback Rs in place of 22k. You can't do that without altering the channel values though or the gain structure gets screwed. Gotcha. And what does that 741 do? Given the quality of the fax it's tricky to say. Is there a peak led there though. Maybe that's it ? Ah yes, that makes sense to be the signal/peak LED circuit, it uses a bicolor LED that is green with signal and red when within 3dB of clipping, according to the manual... When I get a chance I'll swap out those 5532's and we'll see what happens...thanks for all your help!! |
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#67
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Well I just pulled the master module and it looks like it has been modded..
the 5532 in question seems to have been replaced with an LT1358, and some of the others were replaced with TLE2082's, along with some other components that were added. This console had 5 input channels modified by Audio Upgrades, it looks as if the master module has been modified as well...looks like I'll be calling Jim again. Thanks for everyone's help! Matt "Matt Macchiarolo" wrote in message ... Those op amps are U1A and U1B, a=left b=right. . Those are the summing amps, correct? Ok - wondered if that might be so. According to the signal path diagram, they correspond to the summing amps. You don't think the U5's (section D-4) could be a factor? All those are 5532's. The manual includes a PCB diagram so I can find those pretty easily. The other op-amps operate at high signal levels so the noise contribution there won't be an issue. No need to replace. If you were to replace those resistors, what would you recommend? Well, I'd most likely use something like 4k7 feedback Rs in place of 22k. You can't do that without altering the channel values though or the gain structure gets screwed. Gotcha. And what does that 741 do? Given the quality of the fax it's tricky to say. Is there a peak led there though. Maybe that's it ? Ah yes, that makes sense to be the signal/peak LED circuit, it uses a bicolor LED that is green with signal and red when within 3dB of clipping, according to the manual... When I get a chance I'll swap out those 5532's and we'll see what happens...thanks for all your help!! |
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#68
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"Matt Macchiarolo" For you op-amp experts I need some advice... Just got a new (old) mixing console, Peavey/AMR 2400, and there is a noticeable level of noise in the master module when I pull up the faders, even though there is no signal from any of the channels. ** Bet you have selected every mic channel simultaneously - right ? Bet you have the monitor speakers next to your ears in a quiet room - right ? Bet you have a monitor amp with less than 1 volt input sensitivity - right ? Do I sound just a bit cynical ????? Yep - cos I just spent hours, at the owners insistence, removing a faint buzzing noise from a studio monitor amp that ONLY EXISTED when the input was open circuit !!!!! ................. Phil |
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#69
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"Matt Macchiarolo" For you op-amp experts I need some advice... Just got a new (old) mixing console, Peavey/AMR 2400, and there is a noticeable level of noise in the master module when I pull up the faders, even though there is no signal from any of the channels. ** Bet you have selected every mic channel simultaneously - right ? Bet you have the monitor speakers next to your ears in a quiet room - right ? Bet you have a monitor amp with less than 1 volt input sensitivity - right ? Do I sound just a bit cynical ????? Yep - cos I just spent hours, at the owners insistence, removing a faint buzzing noise from a studio monitor amp that ONLY EXISTED when the input was open circuit !!!!! ................. Phil |
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#70
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No, no and no. See the rest of this thread.
"Phil Allison" wrote in message ... "Matt Macchiarolo" For you op-amp experts I need some advice... Just got a new (old) mixing console, Peavey/AMR 2400, and there is a noticeable level of noise in the master module when I pull up the faders, even though there is no signal from any of the channels. ** Bet you have selected every mic channel simultaneously - right ? Bet you have the monitor speakers next to your ears in a quiet om - right ? Bet you have a monitor amp with less than 1 volt input nsitivity - right ? Do I sound just a bit cynical ????? Yep - cos I just spent hours, at the owners insistence, removing a faint buzzing noise from a studio monitor amp that ONLY EXISTED when the input was open circuit !!!!! ................ Phil |
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#71
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No, no and no. See the rest of this thread.
"Phil Allison" wrote in message ... "Matt Macchiarolo" For you op-amp experts I need some advice... Just got a new (old) mixing console, Peavey/AMR 2400, and there is a noticeable level of noise in the master module when I pull up the faders, even though there is no signal from any of the channels. ** Bet you have selected every mic channel simultaneously - right ? Bet you have the monitor speakers next to your ears in a quiet om - right ? Bet you have a monitor amp with less than 1 volt input nsitivity - right ? Do I sound just a bit cynical ????? Yep - cos I just spent hours, at the owners insistence, removing a faint buzzing noise from a studio monitor amp that ONLY EXISTED when the input was open circuit !!!!! ................ Phil |
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#72
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"Matt Macchiarolo" "Phil Allison" Just got a new (old) mixing console, Peavey/AMR 2400, and there is a noticeable level of noise in the master module when I pull up the faders, even though there is no signal from any of the channels. ** Bet you have selected every mic channel simultaneously - right ? Bet you have the monitor speakers next to your ears in a quiet room - right ? Bet you have a monitor amp with less than 1 volt input sensitivity - right ? No, no and no. ** So you selected no mic channels at all ??? Have the speakers miles away in a noisy room ???? Have an amp with more than 1 volt sensitivity ????? See the rest of this thread. ** The answers to my simple questions are not there. .............. Phil |
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#73
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"Matt Macchiarolo" "Phil Allison" Just got a new (old) mixing console, Peavey/AMR 2400, and there is a noticeable level of noise in the master module when I pull up the faders, even though there is no signal from any of the channels. ** Bet you have selected every mic channel simultaneously - right ? Bet you have the monitor speakers next to your ears in a quiet room - right ? Bet you have a monitor amp with less than 1 volt input sensitivity - right ? No, no and no. ** So you selected no mic channels at all ??? Have the speakers miles away in a noisy room ???? Have an amp with more than 1 volt sensitivity ????? See the rest of this thread. ** The answers to my simple questions are not there. .............. Phil |
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#74
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Matt Macchiarolo wrote: No, no and no. See the rest of this thread. Don't bother abour Phil, he's our resident rodent / troll. He loves to jump to conclusions based on everyone else being stupider than him ! Some actually *are* but not many. Regds, Graham |
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#75
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Matt Macchiarolo wrote: No, no and no. See the rest of this thread. Don't bother abour Phil, he's our resident rodent / troll. He loves to jump to conclusions based on everyone else being stupider than him ! Some actually *are* but not many. Regds, Graham |
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#76
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"Matt Macchiarolo" Well I just pulled the master module and it looks like it has been modded.. the 5532 in question seems to have been replaced with an LT1358, and some of the others were replaced with TLE2082's, along with some other components that were added. ** The LT1358 and TLE2082 are not low noise ICs - they are high speed ones. Some audiophool "gong beater" has been let loose at the desk. ............. Phil |
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#77
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"Matt Macchiarolo" Well I just pulled the master module and it looks like it has been modded.. the 5532 in question seems to have been replaced with an LT1358, and some of the others were replaced with TLE2082's, along with some other components that were added. ** The LT1358 and TLE2082 are not low noise ICs - they are high speed ones. Some audiophool "gong beater" has been let loose at the desk. ............. Phil |
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#78
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"Pooh Bear" Matt Macchiarolo wrote: No, no and no. See the rest of this thread. Don't bother abour Phil, he's our resident rodent / troll. ** Says a pathetic pommy ****** who *failed to ask* the basic questions and so wasted a lot of ASCII. He loves to jump to conclusions based on everyone else being stupider than him ** See above - the Pooh Brain just proved that assumption was good again. .............. Phil |
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#79
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"Pooh Bear" Matt Macchiarolo wrote: No, no and no. See the rest of this thread. Don't bother abour Phil, he's our resident rodent / troll. ** Says a pathetic pommy ****** who *failed to ask* the basic questions and so wasted a lot of ASCII. He loves to jump to conclusions based on everyone else being stupider than him ** See above - the Pooh Brain just proved that assumption was good again. .............. Phil |
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#80
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Matt Macchiarolo wrote: Well I just pulled the master module and it looks like it has been modded.. the 5532 in question seems to have been replaced with an LT1358, and some of the others were replaced with TLE2082's, along with some other components that were added. This console had 5 input channels modified by Audio Upgrades, it looks as if the master module has been modified as well...looks like I'll be calling Jim again. Ok - I pulled up the spec sheet for the LT1358. It's a kind of 'esoteric' device. http://www.linear.com.cn/prod/datash...l?datasheet=83 I wouldn't put it in an audio path without careful evaluation. Suggest you replace parts with originals ! They probably worked fine ! Then it might sound better. Idiots who do unsubstantiated 'upgrades' should be shot. I believe you have access to guns in the USA ? Just joking ! Graahm |
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Linear Mode
