[Gary Eickmeier]

I have the Ultimate Support Tour T Tall 96 inch stand. It has a tripod base
rather than a simple round foot, and the post screws into that base. I just
didn't like the feel of it the last time I screwed it in, so I took a look
at the threads on both the post and the base. These are very coarse threads,
and they looked fine on the post, but in the base they seemed to have
started stripping. Shiny aluminum color, some apparent shreds of metal, not
real deep and sharp looking structure. I imagined my magnificent microphone
tree of 4 Audio Technicas falling over on stage, and decided to call the
Sound Professionals and Ultimate Support and see if they could overnight me
a replacement base. They agreed to replace the part for free.

I took the cheaper of two types of overnight fee, and it ended up costing
some 91 dollars. The whole stand was about $129 new. Just probably better
than having the thing fall on the conductor's head during the Stars and
Stripes.

Any experience with these stands failing? Is this a cheap one or are there
much better ones? My only observation about the structure of it is that the
post doesn't seem to fit snugly into the hole that it screws into in the
base. Nor is there much depth to the hole or the threads, leaving the whole
post and mikes to hang onto those threads alone, with some torque force
causing wear to the threads - if you know what I mean. All that the threads
should be doing is holding the post down in the hole, not supporting the
weight of the structure from tilting.

Looking for sympathy,
Gary Eickmeier

[Tom McCreadie]

Gary Eickmeier wrote:

I have the Ultimate Support Tour T Tall 96 inch stand.

A max height of only 96 inch is really very modest. It may be inappropriate for
many remote recording situations you encounter. And entrusting a top-heavy 3- or
4 mic array to a single wimpy thread could be an accident waiting to happen.

What you need generally falls under the class: "lighting stands", perhaps of
12-14 ft extended height. Manfrotto has a decent range, expandable via numerous
robust accessories.

[Gary Eickmeier]

"Tom McCreadie" wrote in message
...
Gary Eickmeier wrote:

I have the Ultimate Support Tour T Tall 96 inch stand.

A max height of only 96 inch is really very modest. It may be
inappropriate for
many remote recording situations you encounter. And entrusting a top-heavy
3- or
4 mic array to a single wimpy thread could be an accident waiting to
happen.

What you need generally falls under the class: "lighting stands", perhaps
of
12-14 ft extended height. Manfrotto has a decent range, expandable via
numerous
robust accessories.


OK, yes, I know Manfrotto. Will look into it, hoping that it wouldn't be too
obtrusive on stage during a live event.

Gary Eickmeier

[Frank Stearns]

Tom McCreadie writes:

Gary Eickmeier wrote:

I have the Ultimate Support Tour T Tall 96 inch stand.

A max height of only 96 inch is really very modest. It may be inappropriate for
many remote recording situations you encounter. And entrusting a top-heavy 3- or
4 mic array to a single wimpy thread could be an accident waiting to happen.

What you need generally falls under the class: "lighting stands", perhaps of
12-14 ft extended height. Manfrotto has a decent range, expandable via numerous
robust accessories.


Manfrotto is okay (I have two with the 17' reach in my kit), but they always scare
me that a puff of wind will knock them over. I always sandbag them. Also, their
payload is generally 4 lbs or less. By the time you add cable weight and shock
mounts, you're there with typically one mic. I have overloaded them, but regretted
it later.

Check out:

http://www.ribbonmics.com/aea/Modula...ne_Stands.html

Excellent quality, light weight, 12 lb load, articulated leg for positioning on
stairs, and a bargain at the prices charged. I also have two of the 13'6" models,
and can go to 21'6" with an extension pole.

And, AEA is great to deal with. I spoke to Wes Dooley on the phone a few years back,
and for another $14 or so, he sent me several 5/8-27 plumbing parts that have been
very useful to have in the kit. The man knows his stuff.

Frank
Mobile Audio
--

[Gary Eickmeier]

"Frank Stearns" wrote in message
. ..
Tom McCreadie writes:

Gary Eickmeier wrote:

I have the Ultimate Support Tour T Tall 96 inch stand.

A max height of only 96 inch is really very modest. It may be
inappropriate for
many remote recording situations you encounter. And entrusting a top-heavy
3- or
4 mic array to a single wimpy thread could be an accident waiting to
happen.

What you need generally falls under the class: "lighting stands", perhaps
of
12-14 ft extended height. Manfrotto has a decent range, expandable via
numerous
robust accessories.


Manfrotto is okay (I have two with the 17' reach in my kit), but they
always scare
me that a puff of wind will knock them over. I always sandbag them. Also,
their
payload is generally 4 lbs or less. By the time you add cable weight and
shock
mounts, you're there with typically one mic. I have overloaded them, but
regretted
it later.

Check out:

http://www.ribbonmics.com/aea/Modula...ne_Stands.html

Excellent quality, light weight, 12 lb load, articulated leg for
positioning on
stairs, and a bargain at the prices charged. I also have two of the 13'6"
models,
and can go to 21'6" with an extension pole.

And, AEA is great to deal with. I spoke to Wes Dooley on the phone a few
years back,
and for another $14 or so, he sent me several 5/8-27 plumbing parts that
have been
very useful to have in the kit. The man knows his stuff.

Frank
Mobile Audio

Frank -

Great site - just that those bases (tripod legs) are so huge. My base has
the tripod legs that lie flat on the surface, invisible to the audience. If
they would just make it right, I would be happy.

Gary

[Frank Stearns]

"Gary Eickmeier" writes:

snips

Check out:

http://www.ribbonmics.com/aea/Modula...ne_Stands.html

Excellent quality, light weight, 12 lb load, articulated leg for
positioning on
stairs, and a bargain at the prices charged. I also have two of the 13'6"
models,
and can go to 21'6" with an extension pole.

And, AEA is great to deal with. I spoke to Wes Dooley on the phone a few
years back,
and for another $14 or so, he sent me several 5/8-27 plumbing parts that
have been
very useful to have in the kit. The man knows his stuff.

Frank
Mobile Audio

Frank -

Great site - just that those bases (tripod legs) are so huge. My base has
the tripod legs that lie flat on the surface, invisible to the audience. If
they would just make it right, I would be happy.

There are different sizes, with different footprints; not all models might be
pictured. The photos are just a random position. Contact AEA for details.

The ones I have are tripod, and you could set them how you want (including a very
shallow pitch on the legs). However, without the reinforcing geometry of something
more like a triangle than a "flat L", and how that triangle positions the center of
gravity, you reduce overall system stability in the directions where there is no
leg. And when I think of well north of $7000 in 4-5 microphones on that stand (or
10+X or more in liability), I'd like things a little more stable than my fly-weight
Manfrottos

Regardless of manufacturer, be careful that what you do does not reduce stability
Typically, my setting has the top collar of the leg union at 20-24" above the
floor. Never been a sight-line issue where I've recorded. Stands over 5'-6" tall are
always sand-bagged.

Frank
Mobile Audio

--

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

On 11/8/2013 1:09 AM, Gary Eickmeier wrote:
My base has
the tripod legs that lie flat on the surface, invisible to the audience. If
they would just make it right, I would be happy.

You should check out Latch Lake Music. They make some really heavy duty
stands with a clever base that doesn't get in the way but will hold a
lot of weight at full height. They recently came out with a new folding
leg tripod base stand that looks a bit like yours, but designed by a
real mechanical engineer. Take a look at my AES show report for a photo
if there isn't anything on their web site yet. I haven't checked this week.

So, did the stand feel more stable with the replacement base? The web
site calls the threads "aggressive" which sounds like they shouldn't
strip easily. Did the threads on the replacement base look like they
were cut better than those on your original base?

[Tom McCreadie]

Gary Eickmeier wrote:

Great site - just that those bases (tripod legs) are so huge. My base has
the tripod legs that lie flat on the surface, invisible to the audience. If
they would just make it right, I would be happy.

It's precisely that kind of tripod construction - central pole being secured at
two places - that confers the solidity that yours lacks. If the stand is up on
stage close behind the director, you could consider hiding the base with a
tasteful flower arrangement. Maybe commandeer those flowers that they like to
dish out to the soloists at the end of concert? :-)

But (when I'm unable to hang up the mics) my stand is typically out in the
central aisle of an old church with a raised concert platform, so the stand base
is rarely a visual issue. For extra height on say, a 13 ft Manfrotto, I prefer
to add a vertical boom arm, as the topmost stand segment is of fairly narrow
diam. and flexible. I always weight the legs for stability - boom counterweights
come in handy. That also reduces the chances of stand-borne resonances...or
bumping-dislodgement by shuffling old audience ladies...or confiscation by
grumpy fire marshals :-)

[Scott Dorsey]

Frank Stearns wrote:
Tom McCreadie writes:

Gary Eickmeier wrote:

I have the Ultimate Support Tour T Tall 96 inch stand.

Are the tubing threads rolled or machined? Most of those Chinese stands
have rolled threads, and the threads always go bad.

If you're looking for small stage stands like that, consider the Atlas or
the K&M stands. Neither one are as well-made as they were a decade ago,
but they are workable and use threaded inserts.


Manfrotto is okay (I have two with the 17' reach in my kit), but they always scare
me that a puff of wind will knock them over. I always sandbag them. Also, their
payload is generally 4 lbs or less. By the time you add cable weight and shock
mounts, you're there with typically one mic. I have overloaded them, but regretted
it later.

Yes, that's pretty much the case for any low-mass stand, though, they are
all going to need to be sandbagged at the base. A wider base spread helps
but maybe not enough.

Bogen also sells a heavier duty line of light stands, from Avenger. These
are much heavier, with heavier bases and crank-up sections and they are
probably a better choice for studio work where you don't have to load and
unload them all the time.

In addition to the Modular one, AEA also sells the original Shure S15 stand
(which Shure has now replaced with a new one). That is a very convenient
and light 15-foot stand that works well.

And... if you find yourself with a lot of money and a large crew, there is
always the Starbird. I have worked in a couple of studios with Starbirds
and they are a wonderful thing for classical ensembles. Just listen in the
control room and have the boom operator swing the thing around until you
find the right place. I miss working on jobs like that.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Scott Dorsey]

In article , Mike Rivers wrote:
On 11/8/2013 1:09 AM, Gary Eickmeier wrote:
My base has
the tripod legs that lie flat on the surface, invisible to the audience. If
they would just make it right, I would be happy.

You should check out Latch Lake Music. They make some really heavy duty
stands with a clever base that doesn't get in the way but will hold a
lot of weight at full height. They recently came out with a new folding
leg tripod base stand that looks a bit like yours, but designed by a
real mechanical engineer. Take a look at my AES show report for a photo
if there isn't anything on their web site yet. I haven't checked this week.

Haven't they discontinued most of their smaller stage stands? I went looking
to replace some stage stands for a customer last fall and they didn't seem
to have anything any more other than the larger booms.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Gary Eickmeier]

"Tom McCreadie" wrote in message
...
Gary Eickmeier wrote:

Great site - just that those bases (tripod legs) are so huge. My base has
the tripod legs that lie flat on the surface, invisible to the audience.
If
they would just make it right, I would be happy.

It's precisely that kind of tripod construction - central pole being
secured at
two places - that confers the solidity that yours lacks. If the stand is
up on
stage close behind the director, you could consider hiding the base with a
tasteful flower arrangement. Maybe commandeer those flowers that they like
to
dish out to the soloists at the end of concert? :-)

But (when I'm unable to hang up the mics) my stand is typically out in the
central aisle of an old church with a raised concert platform, so the
stand base
is rarely a visual issue. For extra height on say, a 13 ft Manfrotto, I
prefer
to add a vertical boom arm, as the topmost stand segment is of fairly
narrow
diam. and flexible. I always weight the legs for stability - boom
counterweights
come in handy. That also reduces the chances of stand-borne
resonances...or
bumping-dislodgement by shuffling old audience ladies...or confiscation by
grumpy fire marshals :-)

Some great points - thanks. Haven't received my replacement base yet, will
re-think this whole thing after this concert.

Gary Eickmeier

[Gary Eickmeier]

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...
Frank Stearns wrote:
Tom McCreadie writes:

Gary Eickmeier wrote:

I have the Ultimate Support Tour T Tall 96 inch stand.

Are the tubing threads rolled or machined? Most of those Chinese stands
have rolled threads, and the threads always go bad.

If you're looking for small stage stands like that, consider the Atlas or
the K&M stands. Neither one are as well-made as they were a decade ago,
but they are workable and use threaded inserts.


Manfrotto is okay (I have two with the 17' reach in my kit), but they
always scare
me that a puff of wind will knock them over. I always sandbag them. Also,
their
payload is generally 4 lbs or less. By the time you add cable weight and
shock
mounts, you're there with typically one mic. I have overloaded them, but
regretted
it later.

Yes, that's pretty much the case for any low-mass stand, though, they are
all going to need to be sandbagged at the base. A wider base spread helps
but maybe not enough.

Bogen also sells a heavier duty line of light stands, from Avenger. These
are much heavier, with heavier bases and crank-up sections and they are
probably a better choice for studio work where you don't have to load and
unload them all the time.

In addition to the Modular one, AEA also sells the original Shure S15
stand
(which Shure has now replaced with a new one). That is a very convenient
and light 15-foot stand that works well.

And... if you find yourself with a lot of money and a large crew, there is
always the Starbird. I have worked in a couple of studios with Starbirds
and they are a wonderful thing for classical ensembles. Just listen in
the
control room and have the boom operator swing the thing around until you
find the right place. I miss working on jobs like that.
--scott

Thanks all. Looks like this was a worthy topic to stir up, hopefully for
more than just me. I just don't want to have to worry about some mechanical
problem while I am worrying about all of the recording and coordination
problems in a live event. I wish to God I could hang my mikes, but I would
probably worry even more about them falling.

Gary Eickmeier

[hank alrich]

Mike Rivers wrote:

On 11/8/2013 1:09 AM, Gary Eickmeier wrote:
My base has
the tripod legs that lie flat on the surface, invisible to the audience. If
they would just make it right, I would be happy.

You should check out Latch Lake Music. They make some really heavy duty
stands with a clever base that doesn't get in the way but will hold a
lot of weight at full height. They recently came out with a new folding
leg tripod base stand that looks a bit like yours, but designed by a
real mechanical engineer. Take a look at my AES show report for a photo
if there isn't anything on their web site yet. I haven't checked this week.

So, did the stand feel more stable with the replacement base? The web
site calls the threads "aggressive" which sounds like they shouldn't
strip easily. Did the threads on the replacement base look like they
were cut better than those on your original base?

Latch Lake stand set the bar very high. Superb design and manufacturing.

--
shut up and play your guitar * HankAlrich.Com
HankandShaidriMusic.Com
YouTube.Com/WalkinayMusic

[Richard Kuschel]

On Thursday, November 7, 2013 11:48:43 AM UTC-7, Gary Eickmeier wrote:
I have the Ultimate Support Tour T Tall 96 inch stand. It has a tripod base

SNIP

Any experience with these stands failing? Is this a cheap one or are there

much better ones? My only observation about the structure of it is that the

post doesn't seem to fit snugly into the hole that it screws into in the

base. Nor is there much depth to the hole or the threads, leaving the whole

post and mikes to hang onto those threads alone, with some torque force

causing wear to the threads - if you know what I mean. All that the threads

should be doing is holding the post down in the hole, not supporting the

weight of the structure from tilting.



Looking for sympathy,

Gary Eickmeier


What occurred is that the threads were galling.

This can be prevented by greasing each new stand when you put it into service.

Any nut, screw, thumbscrew, collet, or hand adjustment that is used should be greased.

The best lubricants that I have used have been STP engine treatment or motorcycle chain lube containing molybdenum disulfide.

The STP is a very heavy oil and doesn't evaporate. The motorcycle chain lube sprays on and turns into a very heavy grease that does not migrate. The molybedum disulphide actually becomes a part of the metals and prevents galling and reduces friction.

I learned this dealing with drum kit parts many years ago. there were a lot of steel bolts being held by zinc castings.

The parts will require less torque to fasten securely and the parts wil not wear out.

I performed this greasing operation to my Atlas, K&N, and Manfrotto stands 25 years ago and have not had one failure due to galling.

[Gary Eickmeier]

"Richard Kuschel" wrote in message
...


What occurred is that the threads were galling.

This can be prevented by greasing each new stand when you put it into
service.

Any nut, screw, thumbscrew, collet, or hand adjustment that is used should
be greased.

The best lubricants that I have used have been STP engine treatment or
motorcycle chain lube containing molybdenum disulfide.

The STP is a very heavy oil and doesn't evaporate. The motorcycle chain
lube sprays on and turns into a very heavy grease that does not migrate.
The molybedum disulphide actually becomes a part of the metals and
prevents galling and reduces friction.

I learned this dealing with drum kit parts many years ago. there were a
lot of steel bolts being held by zinc castings.

The parts will require less torque to fasten securely and the parts wil
not wear out.

I performed this greasing operation to my Atlas, K&N, and Manfrotto stands
25 years ago and have not had one failure due to galling.

I like the moly disulfide solution. Might just have to go to the auto parts
store on the way home.

Gary Eickmeier

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

On 11/8/2013 8:23 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Haven't they discontinued most of their smaller stage stands? I went looking
to replace some stage stands for a customer last fall and they didn't seem
to have anything any more other than the larger booms.

Who? Latch Lake? They only ever had the large, heavy stands and an
assortment of booms. The tripod stands were new at the AES show. They're
also capable of supporting a large boom. At the show, they had one
hanging an AEA K4U mic down inside an open top vocal booth, and had one
that, with the boom going straight up, went up more than 12 feet. But
when fully collapsed, was only about a foot longer (and three times as
heavy) as a K&M tripod base stand.

There was another new (to me anyway) mic stand maker at the show,
Triad-Orbit (dot com) that has some interesting innovations too.

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

On 11/8/2013 11:12 AM, hank alrich wrote:
Latch Lake stand set the bar very high

Literally. Jeff Roberts used to demonstrate them by doing chin-ups over
an extended boom.

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

Gary Eickmeier wrote:

OK, yes, I know Manfrotto. Will look into it, hoping that it wouldn't
be too obtrusive on stage during a live event.

They are acceptable to audiences over here, a tidy setup is however always
appreciated.

Gary Eickmeier

Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

Frank Stearns wrote:

Manfrotto is okay (I have two with the 17' reach in my kit), but they
always scare me that a puff of wind will knock them over. I always
sandbag them.

Mostly they just move sideways. The worry is the geezer or geezerin that
holds on to the stand while moving past it. I have only once felt the need
to tape it to the floor, I was right, the conductor had moved it in passing
on to the "stage area" of the fairly small church if I hadn't. On some
occasions having a "stand guard" is advisable. Beware of christmas
audiences!

Also, their payload is generally 4 lbs or less. By the
time you add cable weight and shock mounts, you're there with
typically one mic.

A pair of small condensers is OK.

http://www.ribbonmics.com/aea/Modula...ne_Stands.html

Excellent quality, light weight, 12 lb load, articulated leg for
positioning on stairs, and a bargain at the prices charged. I also
have two of the 13'6" models, and can go to 21'6" with an extension
pole.

Thanks! - may come in handy some day.

Frank

Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[Gary Eickmeier]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
...
On 11/8/2013 1:09 AM, Gary Eickmeier wrote:
My base has
the tripod legs that lie flat on the surface, invisible to the audience.
If
they would just make it right, I would be happy.

You should check out Latch Lake Music. They make some really heavy duty
stands with a clever base that doesn't get in the way but will hold a lot
of weight at full height. They recently came out with a new folding leg
tripod base stand that looks a bit like yours, but designed by a real
mechanical engineer. Take a look at my AES show report for a photo if
there isn't anything on their web site yet. I haven't checked this week.

So, did the stand feel more stable with the replacement base? The web site
calls the threads "aggressive" which sounds like they shouldn't strip
easily. Did the threads on the replacement base look like they were cut
better than those on your original base?

The new base doesn't look all that different from the old one. Maybe I
jumped the gun. The base threads seem to be machined and the post threads
molded to shape. I guess all I can do is test the whole rig out tomorrow and
make sure my load is balanced so it does not lean at all. That is one reason
I bought a fourth mike, to balance out the other three on the stand.

I am convinced about the tripod base idea with two stabilizing points. Will
look around for one soon!

Gary

[Adrian Tuddenham[_2_]]

Peter Larsen wrote:

...The worry is the geezer or geezerin that
holds on to the stand while moving past it. I have only once felt the need
to tape it to the floor, I was right, the conductor had moved it in passing
on to the "stage area" of the fairly small church if I hadn't.

I once had a folk band remove my mics and stands (still connected) to an
area behind the stage and substitute their own mics and stands (not
connected). This all happened when I was busy doing something else just
before the start of the performance.

When I turned up the mics there was nothing but distant echo.

The performers were crowded on the stage and obscured my view of what
they had done, so there were several seconds of confusion while I
followed the mic leads and discovered the truth. Once I realised what
had happened, I was then faced with the job of recovering my mics and
re-setting them on stage with the performers in full swing, blissfully
unaware that they were barely audible to most of the audience.


There are professional performers, amateur performers and folk
performers - in that order!

--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

[Tom McCreadie]

Gary Eickmeier wrote:


The new base doesn't look all that different from the old one. Maybe I
jumped the gun. The base threads seem to be machined and the post threads
molded to shape. I guess all I can do is test the whole rig out tomorrow and
make sure my load is balanced so it does not lean at all. That is one reason
I bought a fourth mike, to balance out the other three on the stand.

Don't go throwing good money after bad on this, Gary
In the Gearslutz/remote forum there's a recent post from someone who's gone
through 8 ultimate support stands that all broke! And for safety & stability I'd
prefer a 4th sandbag before a 4th mic. :-)
--
Tom McCreadie

Live at The London Palindrome - ABBA

[William Sommerwerck]

...The worry is the geezer or geezerin that holds on
to the stand while moving past it.

Geezerin -- German for female geezer. Love it!

Geezers are strictly male. Those of us who are proud of their geezerhood
should not let females appropriate the term. (Yer dern tootin'!)

[Don Pearce[_3_]]

On Sat, 9 Nov 2013 04:47:47 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:

...The worry is the geezer or geezerin that holds on
to the stand while moving past it.

Geezerin -- German for female geezer. Love it!

Geezers are strictly male. Those of us who are proud of their geezerhood
should not let females appropriate the term. (Yer dern tootin'!)

Ah, you should read PG Wodeouse. Bertie Wooster describes Nobby
(Zenobia Hopwood) as a geeezer - a term of affection for his favourite
girl.

d

[Don Pearce[_3_]]

On Sat, 09 Nov 2013 13:21:06 GMT, (Don Pearce) wrote:

On Sat, 9 Nov 2013 04:47:47 -0800, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:

...The worry is the geezer or geezerin that holds on
to the stand while moving past it.

Geezerin -- German for female geezer. Love it!

Geezers are strictly male. Those of us who are proud of their geezerhood
should not let females appropriate the term. (Yer dern tootin'!)

Ah, you should read PG Wodeouse. Bertie Wooster describes Nobby
(Zenobia Hopwood) as a geeezer - a term of affection for his favourite
girl.

d

But of course he doesn't do it with a triple E. Stupid Insert key.

d

[Scott Dorsey]

In article , Mike Rivers wrote:
On 11/8/2013 8:23 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Haven't they discontinued most of their smaller stage stands? I went looking
to replace some stage stands for a customer last fall and they didn't seem
to have anything any more other than the larger booms.

Who? Latch Lake? They only ever had the large, heavy stands and an
assortment of booms. The tripod stands were new at the AES show. They're
also capable of supporting a large boom.

Well, that would explain why I couldn't find it. So who was the company
that made the really nice stage stands, everything machined and made of
decent quality metal? I don't know if I saw them at AES or not, but they
were a good bit more expensive than K&M but were selling stands like K&M
made in the eighties.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[hank alrich]

Peter Larsen wrote:

Gary Eickmeier wrote:

OK, yes, I know Manfrotto. Will look into it, hoping that it wouldn't
be too obtrusive on stage during a live event.

They are acceptable to audiences over here, a tidy setup is however always
appreciated.

The beauty of such stand is that while appearing dauntingly large at
first glance, they can be placed outside of sightlines, extended much
above same, to reach the desired mic position nearly as if the mic was
suspended from the ceiling, trusses, or whatever. So set they are
remarkably unobtrusive.

--
shut up and play your guitar * HankAlrich.Com
HankandShaidriMusic.Com
YouTube.Com/WalkinayMusic

[hank alrich]

Mike Rivers wrote:

On 11/8/2013 11:12 AM, hank alrich wrote:
Latch Lake stand set the bar very high

Literally. Jeff Roberts used to demonstrate them by doing chin-ups over
an extended boom.

First time I saw the big Latch Lake micKing stand was at an AES show. It
had a huge mic, a Great River MP1-NV, and a bowling ball hanging from
it, and Jeff did a pullup on it. The stand didn't even wiggle in
response. Everything stayed right wfhere it had been positioned.

You could porobably hang a Smart Car from one.

--
shut up and play your guitar * HankAlrich.Com
HankandShaidriMusic.Com
YouTube.Com/WalkinayMusic

[hank alrich]

Adrian Tuddenham wrote:

Peter Larsen wrote:

...The worry is the geezer or geezerin that
holds on to the stand while moving past it. I have only once felt the need
to tape it to the floor, I was right, the conductor had moved it in passing
on to the "stage area" of the fairly small church if I hadn't.

I once had a folk band remove my mics and stands (still connected) to an
area behind the stage and substitute their own mics and stands (not
connected). This all happened when I was busy doing something else just
before the start of the performance.

When I turned up the mics there was nothing but distant echo.

The performers were crowded on the stage and obscured my view of what
they had done, so there were several seconds of confusion while I
followed the mic leads and discovered the truth. Once I realised what
had happened, I was then faced with the job of recovering my mics and
re-setting them on stage with the performers in full swing, blissfully
unaware that they were barely audible to most of the audience.


There are professional performers, amateur performers and folk
performers - in that order!

That example sets high standard for cluelessness, Adrian! Wow.

We may be encouraged to know that next year's International Folk
Alliance conference will sport an attendant Music Camp, where one area
of study will be tech for folks who havent picked up their clues yet,
which AFAICT from scant involvement with that crowd, is the majority of
'em.

--
shut up and play your guitar * HankAlrich.Com
HankandShaidriMusic.Com
YouTube.Com/WalkinayMusic

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

On 11/9/2013 10:42 AM, hank alrich wrote:
We may be encouraged to know that next year's International Folk
Alliance conference will sport an attendant Music Camp, where one area
of study will be tech for folks who havent picked up their clues yet,
which AFAICT from scant involvement with that crowd, is the majority of
'em.

I've been thinking of writing a book "Sound Systems for Musicians" ("..
for Dummies" is probably already reserved). I should get try to get it
out by then. Maybe I can sell some.

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

On 11/9/2013 10:04 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
So who was the company
that made the really nice stage stands, everything machined and made of
decent quality metal? I don't know if I saw them at AES or not, but they
were a good bit more expensive than K&M but were selling stands like K&M
made in the eighties.

Latch Lake was along one of the outside walls, the one to the right as
you entered the exhibit hall, sharing space with Taytrix (who makes the
iso booths). I have some K&M stands from the eighties and I don't recall
seeing anyone selling stands like them other than K&M, which apparently
are now more cheaply made. I haven't bought any new ones.

The two "big stands" exhibitors at AES this year we
http://www.triad-orbit.com/triad
http://latchlakemusic.com

Latch Lake doesn't have any pictures of their new tripod base stand on
the web site yet.

[Adrian Tuddenham[_2_]]

Mike Rivers wrote:

On 11/9/2013 10:42 AM, hank alrich wrote:
We may be encouraged to know that next year's International Folk
Alliance conference will sport an attendant Music Camp, where one area
of study will be tech for folks who havent picked up their clues yet,
which AFAICT from scant involvement with that crowd, is the majority of
'em.

I've been thinking of writing a book "Sound Systems for Musicians" ("..
for Dummies" is probably already reserved). I should get try to get it
out by then. Maybe I can sell some.

For the crew I described, you would have to start with some very basic
facts like:

1) Performers need to be somewhere near a microphone if they want to be
heard.

2) Microphones need to be somewhere near a performer if they are to do
anything useful.

3) Most microphones need to be connected to something by a piece of
wire if they are to work.


Then you can begin on the subtleties of performance like:

4) If you dance around and turn your back on the audience (and
microphone) when playing, they won't hear you properly.

5) If you move the whole performance into the unlighted auditorium away
from the brightly lit stage (which took all afternoon to set up), they
won't see you properly, either.


--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

[Gary Eickmeier]

Great Adrian!

Once upon a time, we were shooting a high school graduation in a huge
auditorium. We taped our separate recorder and microphone to the podium
because the acoustics were horrendous, so we needed a podium mike. The
Principal comes up for his farewell speech, reaches for the mike boom, and
starts grabbing the house mike and taking down all of the tape that ours and
some others' mikes were attached with. We could hear the crinkling of tape
from where we stood and a look of horror came upon me when I realized that
he was a "walker" - a speaker who simply MUST walk around while talking, to
show how dynamic an individual he really was. Our mike was not a walker, and
remained foolishly back on the podium, hanging by some amount of unravelled
tape.

Another time I taped the mike and recorder to the podium, unbeknownst to me
the podium had a collapsible stair step for shorter people and I had taped
the little digital recorder to the inside of the podium, right in the path
of those steps. When the second speaker came up, he folded up the steps,
knocked the recorder right onto the floor and pulled out the cable. It kept
on recording without skipping a beat, but it was now from the internal mike
from the floor, inside the podium box. Not good.

You try to plan for every eventuality....

Gary Eickmeier


"Adrian Tuddenham" wrote in message
alid.invalid...
Mike Rivers wrote:

On 11/9/2013 10:42 AM, hank alrich wrote:
We may be encouraged to know that next year's International Folk
Alliance conference will sport an attendant Music Camp, where one area
of study will be tech for folks who havent picked up their clues yet,
which AFAICT from scant involvement with that crowd, is the majority of
'em.

I've been thinking of writing a book "Sound Systems for Musicians" ("..
for Dummies" is probably already reserved). I should get try to get it
out by then. Maybe I can sell some.

For the crew I described, you would have to start with some very basic
facts like:

1) Performers need to be somewhere near a microphone if they want to be
heard.

2) Microphones need to be somewhere near a performer if they are to do
anything useful.

3) Most microphones need to be connected to something by a piece of
wire if they are to work.


Then you can begin on the subtleties of performance like:

4) If you dance around and turn your back on the audience (and
microphone) when playing, they won't hear you properly.

5) If you move the whole performance into the unlighted auditorium away
from the brightly lit stage (which took all afternoon to set up), they
won't see you properly, either.


--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

On 11/9/2013 6:46 PM, Adrian Tuddenham wrote:
For the crew I described, you would have to start with some very basic
facts like:

1) Performers need to be somewhere near a microphone if they want to be
heard.

2) Microphones need to be somewhere near a performer if they are to do
anything useful.

3) Most microphones need to be connected to something by a piece of
wire if they are to work.


Then you can begin on the subtleties of performance like:

4) If you dance around and turn your back on the audience (and
microphone) when playing, they won't hear you properly.

5) If you move the whole performance into the unlighted auditorium away
from the brightly lit stage (which took all afternoon to set up), they
won't see you properly, either.


That sounds like a book called "Sound Systems for Performers" (whether
or not they're musicians). My premise is that more and more these days
musicians need to provide their own sound system. It's a defense against
the ever popular forum question: "I went to the music store and bought 5
microphones, some powered speakers, and a mixer. Can someone tell me the
best way to hook it up?"