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adam79 adam79 is offline
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Default Mackie Onyx 1640i, Allan and Heath ZED R16 (and other $2000 mixers)

I've been checking out Mixers. There seem to be a couple good ones for
$2000 or less. I've been reading that the Mackie Onyx 1640i was marketed
as a live mixer that works well as a recording mixer.. while the Allan
and Heath ZED R16 is the opposite; made as a recording mixer that works
well as a live one.

Anyways, I've read that while the 1640i has a better routing section and
outputs for every channel, while the ZED has better preamps, and also
MIDI capability, although I don't use MIDI, I might in the future. The
MIDI doesn't matter to me. Also, it doesn't matter that the 1640i is PT
M-Powered compatible, while the ZED isn't. I can always record into
Reaper and then transfer the files into Pro Tools (without a loss in
sound quality) for editing/mixing.

Anyone have ant experience w/ either unit? Suggestions? Also, if I
overlooked any other mixers in this price range, please tel. I'm
planning on using this mixer for my studio centerpiece.

Thanks,
-Adam
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hank alrich hank alrich is offline
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Default Mackie Onyx 1640i, Allan and Heath ZED R16 (and other $2000 mixers)

adam79 wrote:

I've been checking out Mixers. There seem to be a couple good ones for
$2000 or less. I've been reading that the Mackie Onyx 1640i was marketed
as a live mixer that works well as a recording mixer.. while the Allan
and Heath ZED R16 is the opposite; made as a recording mixer that works
well as a live one.

Anyways, I've read that while the 1640i has a better routing section and
outputs for every channel, while the ZED has better preamps, and also
MIDI capability, although I don't use MIDI, I might in the future. The
MIDI doesn't matter to me. Also, it doesn't matter that the 1640i is PT
M-Powered compatible, while the ZED isn't. I can always record into
Reaper and then transfer the files into Pro Tools (without a loss in
sound quality) for editing/mixing.

Anyone have ant experience w/ either unit? Suggestions? Also, if I
overlooked any other mixers in this price range, please tel. I'm
planning on using this mixer for my studio centerpiece.

Thanks,
-Adam


Are you planning to use the mixer for live sound as well as for
recording? (The Mackie Onyx 1640i is not marketed as a live sound mixer.
That would be the Onyx 24-4.)

If this if for recording first and live sound second I suggest you look
closely at the Mackie Onyx 1620i and 1640i, depending on how many
simultaneous mic inputs you need. The 1620 has 8 and the 1640 has 16.

That talk about the preamps is Internut bull****. I like A&H gear a lot.
It's very good stuff for the money. But those pres are not better than
those in the Onyx, and the Onyx line has excellent EQ - EQ of sufficient
qualtiy that I was surprised.

An Onyx whatever-"i" with the optional Firewire card is a fine rig,
allowing you to track right into the DAW of our choice. It works nicely,
based on my brief trial with an earlier version of the 1620 that I
tried, thanks to Kurt Albershardt for the mixer and Mike Rivers for the
Firewire card.

If you're going into a DAW anyway the Onyx feeds digital audio into your
computer, rendering the part about "individual outputs" irrelevant.

I have an A&H GL2200-24 that I use for SR work. It's a nice little
board. If I were looking for an "affordable" to cover both small=scale
live sound reinforcement and digital recording I would buy one of the
Mackies.

--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://armadillomusicproductions.com/who'slistening.html
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShai...withDougHarman
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Mike Rivers Mike Rivers is offline
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Default Mackie Onyx 1640i, Allan and Heath ZED R16 (and other $2000 mixers)

adam79 wrote:
I've been checking out Mixers. There seem to be a couple good ones for
$2000 or less. I've been reading that the Mackie Onyx 1640i was marketed
as a live mixer that works well as a recording mixer.. while the Allan
and Heath ZED R16 is the opposite; made as a recording mixer that works
well as a live one.


I'd say that was a nearly fair assessment. I'd say that the
ZED-R16 is a better studio mixer than the 1640i because it
offers more inputs and outputs than the 1640i (if you can
use them) and while it doesn't have motorized faders, it can
serve as a control surface for a DAW program.

Anyone have ant experience w/ either unit? Suggestions?


I reviewed the ZED-R16 in Pro Audio Review and I liked it a
whole lot. If it had 24 channels rather than 16 and a real
meter bridge, I wouldn't have wanted to send it back. I have
a Mackie 1640 with the optional Firewire card and I've used
that as a live mixer while recording the inputs to a
computer and it worked fine for that. The 1640i does that
and (like the ZED-R16) also can play all 16 Firewire
channels back into the mixer for real analog hands-on
mixing. I like the idea of working that way - use the
computer as a recorder, an editor, and exotic signal
processor (with plug-ins) but do the main mixing and EQ on
the analog console. It sounds better than mixing entirely on
the computer, but I think that's probably because I'm just
more comfortable working that way and I can do a better job
of mixing. Your experience may differ.


--
"Today's production equipment is IT based and cannot be
operated without a passing knowledge of computing, although
it seems that it can be operated without a passing knowledge
of audio." - John Watkinson
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adam79 adam79 is offline
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Default Mackie Onyx 1640i, Allan and Heath ZED R16 (and other $2000 mixers)

On 9/10/10 10:05 PM, hank alrich wrote:

Are you planning to use the mixer for live sound as well as for
recording?


This will be the main part of the home studio I'm starting. I like how
the Mackie has an output for every input just incase I have a client
that wants to record reel to reel. I'd be able to rent a reel to reel
and use it with the Mackie, the A&H wouldn't let me do that. This is a
far out scenario, but the option is nice.

As far as the mic-pres go, mostly every person who has tried both agrees
that if you know what you're doing, the difference in mic-pre quality
really doesn't justify it being a deal breaker.

-Adam
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hank alrich hank alrich is offline
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Default Mackie Onyx 1640i, Allan and Heath ZED R16 (and other $2000 mixers)

adam79 wrote:

On 9/10/10 10:05 PM, hank alrich wrote:

Are you planning to use the mixer for live sound as well as for
recording?


This will be the main part of the home studio I'm starting. I like how
the Mackie has an output for every input just incase I have a client
that wants to record reel to reel. I'd be able to rent a reel to reel
and use it with the Mackie, the A&H wouldn't let me do that. This is a
far out scenario, but the option is nice.


Have you ever alinged and calibrated an analog deck?

As far as the mic-pres go, mostly every person who has tried both agrees
that if you know what you're doing, the difference in mic-pre quality
really doesn't justify it being a deal breaker.


Frankly, my own opinion is that the Mackie pres, once you get to the
Onyx line, are better.


--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://armadillomusicproductions.com/who'slistening.html
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShai...withDougHarman


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Mike Rivers Mike Rivers is offline
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Default Mackie Onyx 1640i, Allan and Heath ZED R16 (and other $2000 mixers)

adam79 wrote:

This will be the main part of the home studio I'm starting. I like how
the Mackie has an output for every input just incase I have a client
that wants to record reel to reel. I'd be able to rent a reel to reel
and use it with the Mackie, the A&H wouldn't let me do that. This is a
far out scenario, but the option is nice.


If that's going to be a sometimes thing, you could use the
inserts on the A&H to go to and from the tape deck and it
will operate like an in-line console. Sure, they're
unbalanced, but unless you're using very long cables or
working in a high-EMI environment, that shouldn't be a
concern. It's too bad they didn't put direct analog outputs
on it, but you can't have everything unless you design it
yourself (or pay for more than you need).


--
"Today's production equipment is IT based and cannot be
operated without a passing knowledge of computing, although
it seems that it can be operated without a passing knowledge
of audio." - John Watkinson
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Sean Conolly Sean Conolly is offline
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Default Mackie Onyx 1640i, Allan and Heath ZED R16 (and other $2000 mixers)

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
...
adam79 wrote:

This will be the main part of the home studio I'm starting. I like how
the Mackie has an output for every input just incase I have a client that
wants to record reel to reel. I'd be able to rent a reel to reel and use
it with the Mackie, the A&H wouldn't let me do that. This is a far out
scenario, but the option is nice.


If that's going to be a sometimes thing, you could use the inserts on the
A&H to go to and from the tape deck and it will operate like an in-line
console. Sure, they're unbalanced, but unless you're using very long
cables or working in a high-EMI environment, that shouldn't be a concern.
It's too bad they didn't put direct analog outputs on it, but you can't
have everything unless you design it yourself (or pay for more than you
need).


People seem to forget that back in the day unbalnced was the norm for
interconnects. Even microphones were unbalanced. There's a whole body of
great recordings that were done under these conditions.

Sean


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Sean Conolly Sean Conolly is offline
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Default Mackie Onyx 1640i, Allan and Heath ZED R16 (and other $2000 mixers)

"adam79" wrote in message
net...
I've been checking out Mixers. There seem to be a couple good ones for
$2000 or less. I've been reading that the Mackie Onyx 1640i was marketed
as a live mixer that works well as a recording mixer.. while the Allan and
Heath ZED R16 is the opposite; made as a recording mixer that works well
as a live one.


Don't put a lot into how things are marketed. It's called 'marketing'
because they're trying to improve sales. It' about influencing the
perception of the potential buyers, which may or may not be truthful. I know
that I wouldn't reject either board for either role.


Anyone have ant experience w/ either unit? Suggestions? Also, if I
overlooked any other mixers in this price range, please tel. I'm planning
on using this mixer for my studio centerpiece.


I would seriously look at the Presonus StudioLive 16.4.2, which is a digital
board. You can buy them new at that price all day long, they have class-A
preamps with direct outs that sound great for recording, and they have a lot
of nice stuff built in like four band EQ (all four sweepable), comps and
gates. You can record and playback all channels over the fireware interface,
and you can even do things like patch effects from your DAW as a channel
insert on the board.

If you're not starting out with a lot of kit, I would definately add it to
your list of boards to consider. You can do a lot in your DAW, but sometimes
it's nice to not have to do *everything* in the DAW.


One important note for all of these firewire boads - pay close attention to
any notes about compatible chipsets. The Presonus manual lists specific
chipsets that are known to work and ones that are known to cause problems.

Sean


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