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This Group is sadly borring....



 
 
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  #11  
Old April 7th 09, 08:43 AM posted to rec.audio.car
Helen Weed
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1
Default This Group is sadly borring....

MOSFET wrote:
> Come on guys! This not the RAC I knew and loved 15 years ago.

....
> Anyway, I felt like ranting. Hell, nothing else was happening, right?
>
> Anyway, it's a little sad. I saw it happening 10 years ago with the death
> of IASCA. I knew even WAY BACK THEN times, they were a changin'.
>
> MOSFET
> Ian D. Bjorhovde
>
>


It could be that there are so many egocentric individuals here, ready to
pounce on people and ridicule them for asking questions that might seem
silly to some. People that think they know everything and seem to just
live for the opportunity to laugh at others.

So, Ian, have any idea WHO I might be referring to?
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  #12  
Old April 8th 09, 09:29 PM posted to rec.audio.car
MOSFET
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 810
Default This Group is sadly borring....

I know EXACTLY who you are refferring to. You know, he tried to sell my car
once (I kid you not, if you've been on this group for a several years you
might remember this), by getting many of the details about my car from
Cardomain and then listing it on an on-line car sales site (this was after a
particularly nasty flame exchange). The ONLY reason I found out about it is
because I started getting these strange Emails asking details (miliage,
condition, price offers, and so on) about my car. Naturally I reported this
(and all supporting evidence, which wasn't hard as the on-line car sales
site had the evidence of who had listed it) to his IP and then he
MYSTERIOUSLY disapeared for three months, hmmmm.......

But in the interest of not starting yet ANOTHER flame war, I will not name
names, but if you are reading this, YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE.

You know, I truly and sincerely HOPE this group didn't die because of flame
throwers. However, I have had enough knock down, drag out flame wars with
these guys that your theory could very well be true. And it always seemed
like our flame wars revolved around, or boiled down to, the notion that the
only way to keep this group alive and healthy is to NOT scare away the
noobs.

And the quickest way to scare away the noobs is for them to come to this
group and find about six flame wars in full swing with the natural gas
turned up to the max.

I mean, geez, would I want to post anythign here if I were a noob? Hell,
no! I would go find my answer somewhere else. There were certainly times
this group should have been called "rec.flame-wars.car".

I REALLY hope that's not the reason for the apparent death of this group,
but I fear you may be on to something.

I always hoped this would be a friendly, inviting collection of folks who
shared a passion for car audio and a TRUE desire to help people, always
willing to offer good advice to anyone who asked, no matter how simple or
repetitious the question seemed to be.

I am only one person put, for what it's worth, at least I will try to live
up to this creed.

MOSFET


"Helen Weed" > wrote in message
...
> MOSFET wrote:
>> Come on guys! This not the RAC I knew and loved 15 years ago.

> ...
>> Anyway, I felt like ranting. Hell, nothing else was happening, right?
>>
>> Anyway, it's a little sad. I saw it happening 10 years ago with the
>> death of IASCA. I knew even WAY BACK THEN times, they were a changin'.
>>
>> MOSFET
>> Ian D. Bjorhovde

>
> It could be that there are so many egocentric individuals here, ready to
> pounce on people and ridicule them for asking questions that might seem
> silly to some. People that think they know everything and seem to just
> live for the opportunity to laugh at others.
>
> So, Ian, have any idea WHO I might be referring to?



  #13  
Old April 8th 09, 10:00 PM posted to rec.audio.car
MOSFET
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 810
Default This Group is sadly borring....

Oh, and just to add, I am certainly not the only one who feels this way.
Mr. Lull, for instance, has perhaps been the most consistently helpful
member of this fraternity. Even when I feel like I've had enough of the
bull****, and have to give this group a rest for several months (because I
fear I will throw my monitor out the window), Lull keeps plugging away,
helping all those in need. For that I applaud him because I fear my skin is
a bit too thin for the insults and hate and I just have to excuse myself for
a period of time now and then.

So for all of you who still try to always help the best you can, I salute
you.

Another thing that just came to mind that also may be the cause of very
little activity is the incredible amount of SPAM we started getting a couple
years ago. You have to wade through all this BS to find an actual question
or someone in need. I know this now happens in almost all newsgroups and it
is a shame. Again, it represents yet ANOTHER difference between this group
now and this group 10-15 years ago. It may confuse noobs as it appears
there are about 30 times the SPAM posts as there are actual car audio
related posts. If I came to this group for the first time and all I saw
were SPAM posts, again I would likely seek my answer somewhere else. Don't
think anything can be done about it, short of creating a new MODERATED, car
audio group. I have flirted with this idea but I fear I wouldn't have the
time to moderate it. Lull, what about you? Just a thought because RAC is
dying a quick death.

MOSFET

"MOSFET" > wrote in message
m...
>I know EXACTLY who you are refferring to. You know, he tried to sell my car
>once (I kid you not, if you've been on this group for a several years you
>might remember this), by getting many of the details about my car from
>Cardomain and then listing it on an on-line car sales site (this was after
>a particularly nasty flame exchange). The ONLY reason I found out about it
>is because I started getting these strange Emails asking details (miliage,
>condition, price offers, and so on) about my car. Naturally I reported
>this (and all supporting evidence, which wasn't hard as the on-line car
>sales site had the evidence of who had listed it) to his IP and then he
>MYSTERIOUSLY disapeared for three months, hmmmm.......
>
> But in the interest of not starting yet ANOTHER flame war, I will not name
> names, but if you are reading this, YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE.
>
> You know, I truly and sincerely HOPE this group didn't die because of
> flame throwers. However, I have had enough knock down, drag out flame
> wars with these guys that your theory could very well be true. And it
> always seemed like our flame wars revolved around, or boiled down to, the
> notion that the only way to keep this group alive and healthy is to NOT
> scare away the noobs.
>
> And the quickest way to scare away the noobs is for them to come to this
> group and find about six flame wars in full swing with the natural gas
> turned up to the max.
>
> I mean, geez, would I want to post anythign here if I were a noob? Hell,
> no! I would go find my answer somewhere else. There were certainly times
> this group should have been called "rec.flame-wars.car".
>
> I REALLY hope that's not the reason for the apparent death of this group,
> but I fear you may be on to something.
>
> I always hoped this would be a friendly, inviting collection of folks who
> shared a passion for car audio and a TRUE desire to help people, always
> willing to offer good advice to anyone who asked, no matter how simple or
> repetitious the question seemed to be.
>
> I am only one person put, for what it's worth, at least I will try to live
> up to this creed.
>
> MOSFET
>
>
> "Helen Weed" > wrote in message
> ...
>> MOSFET wrote:
>>> Come on guys! This not the RAC I knew and loved 15 years ago.

>> ...
>>> Anyway, I felt like ranting. Hell, nothing else was happening, right?
>>>
>>> Anyway, it's a little sad. I saw it happening 10 years ago with the
>>> death of IASCA. I knew even WAY BACK THEN times, they were a changin'.
>>>
>>> MOSFET
>>> Ian D. Bjorhovde

>>
>> It could be that there are so many egocentric individuals here, ready to
>> pounce on people and ridicule them for asking questions that might seem
>> silly to some. People that think they know everything and seem to just
>> live for the opportunity to laugh at others.
>>
>> So, Ian, have any idea WHO I might be referring to?

>
>



  #14  
Old April 9th 09, 04:15 PM posted to rec.audio.car
Mister.Lull
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 143
Default This Group is sadly borring....

Well, while I appreciate the kudos, I take breaks from the group as
well. Whether it be life that gets in the way, or frustration with
hackers, spammers, and flamers varies from break to break...

The last break I took was due to the fact that some jack-assed hacker/
spammer had "stolen" my ID... Still, to this day, if I check my
posting history (I use google groups to access) there's a bunch of
garbled crap that "I" have posted in many, many groups...

Moderated groups are fine (I was a member of one for quite a while
[can't remember the name now, but it's gone]), but sometimes I enjoy
using a little bit of colorful language to accentuate a point. When
you have a glorified digital janitor on a power-kick who erases half
your posts, even though they contained good advice, moderated forums
can be frustrating (not that all mods are like that, but as
stereotypes go...........).

~Mister.Lull

On Apr 8, 2:00*pm, "MOSFET" > wrote:
> Oh, and just to add, I am certainly not the only one who feels this way.
> Mr. Lull, for instance, has perhaps been the most consistently helpful
> member of this fraternity. *Even when I feel like I've had enough of the
> bull****, and have to give this group a rest for several months (because I
> fear I will throw my monitor out the window), Lull keeps plugging away,
> helping all those in need. *For that I applaud him because I fear my skin is
> a bit too thin for the insults and hate and I just have to excuse myself for
> a period of time now and then.
>
> So for all of you who still try to always help the best you can, I salute
> you.
>
> Another thing that just came to mind that also may be the cause of very
> little activity is the incredible amount of SPAM we started getting a couple
> years ago. *You have to wade through all this BS to find an actual question
> or someone in need. *I know this now happens in almost all newsgroups and it
> is a shame. *Again, it represents yet ANOTHER difference between this group
> now and this group 10-15 years ago. *It may confuse noobs as it appears
> there are about 30 times the SPAM posts as there are actual car audio
> related posts. *If I came to this group for the first time and all I saw
> were SPAM posts, again I would likely seek my answer somewhere else. *Don't
> think anything can be done about it, short of creating a new MODERATED, car
> audio group. *I have flirted with this idea but I fear I wouldn't have the
> time to moderate it. *Lull, what about you? *Just a thought because RAC is
> dying a quick death.
>
> MOSFET
>
> "MOSFET" > wrote in message
>
> m...
>
>
>
> >I know EXACTLY who you are refferring to. You know, he tried to sell my car
> >once (I kid you not, if you've been on this group for a several years you
> >might remember this), by getting many of the details about my car from
> >Cardomain and then listing it on an on-line car sales site (this was after
> >a particularly nasty flame exchange). *The ONLY reason I found out about it
> >is because I started getting these strange Emails asking details (miliage,
> >condition, price offers, and so on) about my car. *Naturally I reported
> >this (and all supporting evidence, which wasn't hard as the on-line car
> >sales site had the evidence of who had listed it) to his IP and then he
> >MYSTERIOUSLY disapeared for three months, hmmmm.......

>
> > But in the interest of not starting yet ANOTHER flame war, I will not name
> > names, but if you are reading this, YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE.

>
> > You know, I truly and sincerely HOPE this group didn't die because of
> > flame throwers. *However, I have had enough knock down, drag out flame
> > wars with these guys that your theory could very well be true. *And it
> > always seemed like our flame wars revolved around, or boiled down to, the
> > notion that the only way to keep this group alive and healthy is to NOT
> > scare away the noobs.

>
> > And the quickest way to scare away the noobs is for them to come to this
> > group and find about six flame wars in full swing with the natural gas
> > turned up to the max.

>
> > I mean, geez, would I want to post anythign here if I were a noob? *Hell,
> > no! *I would go find my answer somewhere else. There were certainly times
> > this group should have been called "rec.flame-wars.car".

>
> > I REALLY hope that's not the reason for the apparent death of this group,
> > but I fear you may be on to something.

>
> > I always hoped this would be a friendly, inviting collection of folks who
> > shared a passion for car audio and a TRUE desire to help people, always
> > willing to offer good advice to anyone who asked, no matter how simple or
> > repetitious the question seemed to be.

>
> > I am only one person put, for what it's worth, at least I will try to live
> > up to this creed.

>
> > MOSFET

>
> > "Helen Weed" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> MOSFET wrote:
> >>> Come on guys! *This not the RAC I knew and loved 15 years ago.
> >> ...
> >>> Anyway, I felt like ranting. *Hell, nothing else was happening, right?

>
> >>> Anyway, it's a little sad. *I saw it happening 10 years ago with the
> >>> death of IASCA. *I knew even WAY BACK THEN times, they were a changin'.

>
> >>> MOSFET
> >>> Ian D. Bjorhovde

>
> >> It could be that there are so many egocentric individuals here, ready to
> >> pounce on people and ridicule them for asking questions that might seem
> >> silly to some. People that think they know everything and seem to just
> >> live for the opportunity to laugh at others.

>
> >> So, Ian, have any idea WHO I might be referring to?- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -


  #15  
Old April 9th 09, 09:03 PM posted to rec.audio.car
MOSFET
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 810
Default This Group is sadly borring....

When
you have a glorified digital janitor on a power-kick who erases half
your posts, even though they contained good advice, moderated forums
can be frustrating (not that all mods are like that, but as
stereotypes go...........).


I hear you there, brother. I was a member of two moderated home-stereo
audiophile groups and my posts were often not posted although I knew they
were relevant and helpful to the discussion at hand (at least based on what
I saw from other postings, not that I am the end-all, be-all expert on
high-end home audio). Once I asked a question and recieved a curt Email
back that my question was not "worthy" for consideration by the regular
"gods".

What I began to notice was that certain individuals seemed to ALWAYS get
their posts listed, no matter how superflouous or unrelated their comments
were. And it wans't long before I relalized what I was TRULY dealing with
was a private club for "members only". Needless to say, after this
epiphany, I never went back.

So yes, I agree with you Lull. My experience with EVERY mod I've ever
participated in has not been a positive one.

And I suppose I can see why. Even the most earnest attempt at making an all
inclusive, helpful, flame and obsenity free moderated group will, in all
probability, eventually go south. The reason is simple, the moderator.

After wading through endless SPAM, obsenity, non-related topics, and
downright nastiness, a moderator will eventually find himself taxed for time
and become just a little jaded at all the garbage he has to read through.
No doubt a moderator will fall into the trap of creating a kind of
"short-hand" way of dealing with all the posts. The easist way is to first
allow all posts, sight unseen, from those people the moderator knows well.
The next bit of short-hand is a cursory look at everything else and at the
first sign of anything that doesn't smell right AT ALL, the delete button is
employed.

I mean, moderating a popular group CANNOT be easy and, of course, extremelly
time consuming. It is simply human nature that eventually a type of
shorthand by the moderator will evolve, no matter how noble the original
intentions. Like I said before, I don't think I'd want that job, in fact, I
KNOW I wouldn't want that responsibility.

Perhaps one day AI will evolve to the point that a computer can screen the
questions in a fair, unbiased way, but we are obviously VERY far from that
(heck, for now I'd take a bot that simply tossed out all those posts with
obsenities, it would at least be a small start down that road).

MOSFET


  #16  
Old April 10th 09, 12:50 AM posted to rec.audio.car
James
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 83
Default This Group is sadly borring....

Just a quick comment from a casual "reader" of this group. I am a low key
person who mainly monitors this group, but as a novice in car audio, it has
been nice to post questions here and have some helpful responses,
especially including MOSFET.

Yes, it is mostly crud and spammers here, but if you need the help you need
the help............

Good Luck / Don't Give Up

James


  #17  
Old April 10th 09, 03:44 AM posted to rec.audio.car
MOSFET
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 810
Default This Group is sadly borring....

Well said. Be persistent.

If you need the help, despite all the BS, THE KNOWLEDGE IS HERE. I have
asked dozens of questions of my own over the years and was ALWAYS able to
get the info I needed right here. I posted a question only a couple months
back and got the information I wanted.

James, you raise a good point. This group may not be exactly the same as it
was 10 years ago with the SPAMMERS and such, but this is still where I go
when I need the 411.

I suppose my orginal post on this thread really was about how little
activity there seems to be these days, not that there still aren't nice
people willling to help anyone with a question. Fortunately there are such
folks quitely waiting in the wings ready to help anyone who asks.

It's just that I remember a day when this group was positively BRIMMING with
questions (I've got alternator whine; Dynamat's too expensive, any
alternatives; who makes the best this or that; how does IASCA judge this or
that; how do I connect my iPod to my stereo; etc.). Every day, dozens of
questions or comments.

Now, almost nothing. That was my original thought. And I just wanted to
kick around some ideas as to why this is so (too much SPAM, too many people
scaring the noobs, fewer people putting aftermarket systems in their cars,
etc.).

But James, you raise a good point. If persistent, this is STILL a good
place to get a question answered about car audio.

MOSFET


"James" > wrote in message
...
> Just a quick comment from a casual "reader" of this group. I am a low key
> person who mainly monitors this group, but as a novice in car audio, it
> has
> been nice to post questions here and have some helpful responses,
> especially including MOSFET.
>
> Yes, it is mostly crud and spammers here, but if you need the help you
> need
> the help............
>
> Good Luck / Don't Give Up
>
> James
>
>



 




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