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Bose Patrician



 
 
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  #11  
Old December 1st 08, 02:04 PM posted to rec.audio.tech
Eeyore
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Posts: 8,474
Default Bose Patrician Dadgummit - ELECTRO VOICE - JBL!



Richard Crowley wrote:

> But Bose makes a 1/25th-scale plastic scale model that looks
> vaguely reminiscent.


LMAO !

Graham

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  #12  
Old December 1st 08, 02:08 PM posted to rec.audio.tech
Eeyore
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Posts: 8,474
Default Bose Patrician



Arny Krueger wrote:

> Impressive in the day, by modern standards it is a peanut-whistle. Couldn't
> take much power, and had virtually no linear stroke at all.


60W continuous IIRC. No Kapton back then I assume, or not in use as voice coil
formers. Didn't work very well as aircraft wiring insulation as it happens. It
cracked too easily and would arc over.

I recall coming back from Tunisia in a 727 where the lights kept flickering. It
wasn't a good feeling.

Nor was the baggage inspection on the way out from Heathrow. It was dumped on
the tarmac and you had to pick up your own luggage before they'd put it in the
hold and then you walked up the rear air stairs, ensuring at least you'd have to
be a suicide bomber one presumes.

Graham

  #13  
Old December 1st 08, 02:33 PM posted to rec.audio.tech
Arny Krueger
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Posts: 17,262
Default Bose Patrician

"Eeyore" > wrote in
message
> Arny Krueger wrote:
>
>> Impressive in the day, by modern standards it is a
>> peanut-whistle. Couldn't take much power, and had
>> virtually no linear stroke at all.

>
> 60W continuous IIRC.


That's what I remember.

Of course, power amps with more than 60 watts were very rare in the days of
tubes.

I have a number of friends who used 30W woofers in the day, some of whom
still have working examples to this day. A good modern 10" driver could
out-displace a 30 W. In the day, even EV's later SP-12s were more
practical.

> No Kapton back then I assume, or not
> in use as voice coil formers. Didn't work very well as
> aircraft wiring insulation as it happens. It cracked too
> easily and would arc over.


Materials sciences of those days, particularly glues and insulation, were
hardly what they are today.



  #14  
Old December 1st 08, 04:41 PM posted to rec.audio.tech
Kalman Rubinson[_3_]
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Posts: 114
Default Bose Patrician

On Sun, 30 Nov 2008 22:17:10 -0600, "PanHandler"
> wrote:

>As I was reading the thread on Bose 901 speakers I was reminded of a Bose
>system of the mid-late sixties. It was a single cabinet unit about 8' long
>by about 3' high and had a convex curved front panel with ports (slots?) at
>each end near the mid and high drivers. The curved panel looked about 5
>feet wide. The model name was 'Patrician' possibly with a suffix number. It
>had a 30" woofer. I used to have an old Audio magazine from the era, and
>there was a write-up on it, along with a photo. I've worn Google out looking
>for info, but no joy on this particular 'Patrician'. Please... somebody tell
>me I haven't lost my marbles and at least say "yeah, I seem to recall
>something like that". Mebbe I'll sleep better hearing at least that much!
>Many Thanx!


As others have pointed out, the Patrician was an EV speaker
and, even in those less litigious times, I doubt if EV would
have stood for use of their flagship's name by any
competitor.

That said, there was a predecessor to the Bose 901 which
used, iirc, 27 of the little drivers in a 1/8 sphere
enclosure designed to fit into a floor corner of the
listening room. It was shown/demonstrated at a NY HiFi show
but I do not know it it was ever marketed.

Kal

  #15  
Old December 1st 08, 05:15 PM posted to rec.audio.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 332
Default Bose Patrician

On Dec 1, 10:41 am, Kalman Rubinson > wrote:
> That said, there was a predecessor to the Bose 901 which
> used, iirc, 27 of the little drivers in a 1/8 sphere
> enclosure designed to fit into a floor corner of the
> listening room. It was shown/demonstrated at a NY HiFi show
> but I do not know it it was ever marketed.


Bose 2701. I have seen and heard a couple of them
that were in private hands, so it's likely there were
some small retail sales volume.

When I worked back at Lafayette radio in Boston in
the early 70's, hordes of MIT EE students would come
come in and buy the legendary FE-103 4" paper-come
speakers, always either 9 or 18 at a time, depending
upon how impoverished they were at the moment. I
knew lots of people at MIT at the time, and they said
there was a period where the engineering woodshop
was VERY busy making 901 clones

  #16  
Old December 1st 08, 08:16 PM posted to rec.audio.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 1
Default Bose Patrician

On Sun, 30 Nov 2008 22:17:10 -0600, PanHandler wrote:

>As I was reading the thread on Bose 901 speakers I was reminded of a Bose
>system of the mid-late sixties. It was a single cabinet unit about 8' long
>by about 3' high and had a convex curved front panel with ports (slots?) at
>each end near the mid and high drivers. The curved panel looked about 5
>feet wide. The model name was 'Patrician' possibly with a suffix number. It
>had a 30" woofer. I used to have an old Audio magazine from the era, and
>there was a write-up on it, along with a photo. I've worn Google out looking
>for info, but no joy on this particular 'Patrician'. Please... somebody tell
>me I haven't lost my marbles and at least say "yeah, I seem to recall
>something like that". Mebbe I'll sleep better hearing at least that much!
>Many Thanx!
>

I recall that there was an Electrovoice Patrician with a 30 inch
woofer. It was a gigantic 5 or 6 ft high monster built for corner
placement.

  #17  
Old December 2nd 08, 06:00 AM posted to rec.audio.tech
isw
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Posts: 182
Default Bose Patrician

In article >,
"Arny Krueger" > wrote:

> "PanHandler" > wrote in message
>
>
> > As I was reading the thread on Bose 901 speakers I was
> > reminded of a Bose system of the mid-late sixties. It was
> > a single cabinet unit about 8' long by about 3' high and
> > had a convex curved front panel with ports (slots?) at
> > each end near the mid and high drivers. The curved panel
> > looked about 5 feet wide. The model name was 'Patrician'
> > possibly with a suffix number.

>
> As others have observed, it was the EV Patrician, of which there were a
> chronological sequence of upgraded models.
>
> > It had a 30" woofer.

>
> Impressive in the day, by modern standards it is a peanut-whistle. Couldn't
> take much power, and had virtually no linear stroke at all.


I've heard that EV developed that 30" woofer as a replacement when they
lost their license to make Klipschorn clones -- and they lost it because
their "clones" deviated a bit too much, and performed a bit too poorly,
to satisfy PWK.

Isaac
  #18  
Old December 2nd 08, 07:46 AM posted to rec.audio.tech
Mr.T
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Posts: 2,108
Default EV Patrician


"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
> >> Impressive in the day, by modern standards it is a
> >> peanut-whistle. Couldn't take much power, and had
> >> virtually no linear stroke at all.

> >
> > 60W continuous IIRC.

>
> That's what I remember.
>
> Of course, power amps with more than 60 watts were very rare in the days

of
> tubes.


Exactly, It's not the power handling that was important, it's the max
undistorted SPL, and many of those speakers would leave the now common mini
box speakers
for dead.

> I have a number of friends who used 30W woofers in the day, some of whom
> still have working examples to this day. A good modern 10" driver could
> out-displace a 30 W. In the day, even EV's later SP-12s were more
> practical.


Sure, as amplifiers got bigger, speakers got smaller, which suited more
people and rooms.

> Materials sciences of those days, particularly glues and insulation, were
> hardly what they are today.


So true, but some of those speakers weren't bad considering. The Patrician
wouldn't have been my choice personally, but I'd still have a Tannoy GRF or
JBL Hartsfield :-)

MrT.


  #19  
Old December 2nd 08, 02:33 PM posted to rec.audio.tech
Arny Krueger
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Posts: 17,262
Default EV Patrician

"Mr.T" <[email protected]> wrote in message
u
> "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> ...


>>>> (EV 30W) Impressive in the day, by modern standards it is a
>>>> peanut-whistle. Couldn't take much power, and had
>>>> virtually no linear stroke at all.


>>> 60W continuous IIRC.


>> That's what I remember.


>> Of course, power amps with more than 60 watts were very
>> rare in the days of tubes.


> Exactly, It's not the power handling that was important,
> it's the max undistorted SPL, and many of those speakers
> would leave the now common mini box speakers
> for dead.


The best speakers of the day roughly correspond to current accepted practice
for live sound. Since those days, live sound drivers got comparable thermal
and long-throw upgrades, and now make several times as many acoustic watts
in the same size boxes, but significantly deeper and cleaner.

>> I have a number of friends who used 30W woofers in the
>> day, some of whom still have working examples to this
>> day. A good modern 10" driver could out-displace a 30
>> W. In the day, even EV's later SP-12s were more
>> practical.


> Sure, as amplifiers got bigger, speakers got smaller,
> which suited more people and rooms.


Also, the economics were very favorable. Good sound cheaper always sells.

>> Materials sciences of those days, particularly glues and
>> insulation, were hardly what they are today.


> So true, but some of those speakers weren't bad
> considering. The Patrician wouldn't have been my choice
> personally, but I'd still have a Tannoy GRF or JBL
> Hartsfield :-)


I have a friend who in the 60s and 70s used a pair of Tannoy Monitor Golds
and a 30W modified with an accelerometer fastened to the voice coil, and
inside a servo system that used a Tigersaurus (ca. 200 wpc) for power.

Sounded great until the Tigersaurus slowly cooked the 30W voice coil and it
started to rub. The nonlinear loading of the rubbing made the servo system
emit strange noises, but it still basically worked.



  #20  
Old December 2nd 08, 02:38 PM posted to rec.audio.tech
Arny Krueger
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Posts: 17,262
Default Bose Patrician

"isw" > wrote in message
]

> I've heard that EV developed that 30" woofer as a
> replacement when they lost their license to make
> Klipschorn clones -- and they lost it because their
> "clones" deviated a bit too much, and performed a bit too
> poorly, to satisfy PWK.


That seems bass-ackwards to me. It is true that Klipsch started out using
EV drivers. He was a box-builder and systems integrator, not a builder of
speaker components. I don't know where the relatively small trickle of
drivers that EV sold to Klipsch affected EV's technical development or
business plans.


 




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