I'm starting to think about getting a new printer for my general
purpose computer. The Epson inkjet that I've had for a bit over 3
years is starting to get a little cranky and I'm thinking about
replacing it. Like microphones, there are entirely too many too
similar ones out there, and I suspect that within a certain range it
doesn't matter which one I buy but:

I'm thinking about a laser printer this time around, mostly for the
speed. Not necessarily the pages/minute speed but the time it takes to
go from not having been used for a couple of days to starting to
print. Seems like about half the time I print on my present printer,
it pumps and steams and groans for as much as 30 seconds before it
feeds the paper and actually starts printing. Do they all do that?

I know that laser printers usually go to a standby state after a
certain time. Does it take about as long for them to come to life as
it does my inkjet? In other words, will I just as fidgetty if I get a
laser printer?

My present printer prints color, and I've only used it to see if it
works, though it still insists in getting the color ink cartridge
replaced every now and then. I buy cheap ones so it hasn't cost me
that much to keep it running, but it's annoying to have to replace
something expendable that I'm not using.

*** NO, I don't refill ink cartridges. I use about three a year, and
I don't want to deal with the mess, the bottles, and wonder
about the shelf life of refill ink ***

I stopped looking at laser printers around the time of the HP
Laserjet II so I don't know in which directions they've progressed by
then. I can buy a used Laserjet 4 for about the same price as any
number of new "office supply store" laser printers. Will I be happier
with a new one (do they still last about 3 years?) or a used printer
from the day when they lasted until your requirements changed?

I'm somewhat concerned about power requirements. The whole front of
the house is on a single 15A circuit. I recall that the old laser
printers wanted at least 10A of their own and I can't really
accommodate that. I'll rewire the house for the studio, but not for a
#@%&* printer. Do they still draw a lot of current when starting or
printing?

I'm traditional enough to want one with a parallel port interface. My
present printer has a USB port in addition and for some reason that I
don't remember now, I decided that it was more bother than the
parallel port so I've never tried it. I don't want to be locked into a
USB-only printer, and I'll bet some of those that I haven't looked at
very closely don't have parallel ports. I learned my lesson with my
laptop - it doesn't have a standard serial port and I miss it.

So what should I look at more closely? New or used laser, or new
inkjet? eBay haunters restrain yourself from replying "There's a ####
on eBay right now for $37." I can find that myself.




--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

Mike,

I had Epson for awhile also but switched back to HP for the following
reasons. 1) Epsons print heads are in the printer as oppossed to HP's which
are on the cartridge. Over time I found the Epson clogged a lot more often
than the HP. That accounts for the huffing and puffing at start-up
(cleaning the heads) when a printer is used only occasionally. The other
thing that drove me nuts was, as you mentioned, the insistance of the
printer to have a color cartridge installed before the printer would print a
black text page. I used the printer occasionally for photos and when the
color cartridge ran out the printer was essentially worthless since it would
not operate with black only. I am currently using an HP Photosmart 1115
with neither problem and almost instant start-up. I don't even have it on
all the time but "hot swap" it on when I need it. It works within 7-10
seconds.

I know nothing about laser jets so can't help you there.

Dan

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
news:znr1064665527k@trad...

I'm starting to think about getting a new printer for my general
purpose computer. The Epson inkjet that I've had for a bit over 3
years is starting to get a little cranky and I'm thinking about
replacing it. Like microphones, there are entirely too many too
similar ones out there, and I suspect that within a certain range it
doesn't matter which one I buy but:

I'm thinking about a laser printer this time around, mostly for the
speed. Not necessarily the pages/minute speed but the time it takes to
go from not having been used for a couple of days to starting to
print. Seems like about half the time I print on my present printer,
it pumps and steams and groans for as much as 30 seconds before it
feeds the paper and actually starts printing. Do they all do that?

I know that laser printers usually go to a standby state after a
certain time. Does it take about as long for them to come to life as
it does my inkjet? In other words, will I just as fidgetty if I get a
laser printer?

My present printer prints color, and I've only used it to see if it
works, though it still insists in getting the color ink cartridge
replaced every now and then. I buy cheap ones so it hasn't cost me
that much to keep it running, but it's annoying to have to replace
something expendable that I'm not using.

*** NO, I don't refill ink cartridges. I use about three a year, and
I don't want to deal with the mess, the bottles, and wonder
about the shelf life of refill ink ***

I stopped looking at laser printers around the time of the HP
Laserjet II so I don't know in which directions they've progressed by
then. I can buy a used Laserjet 4 for about the same price as any
number of new "office supply store" laser printers. Will I be happier
with a new one (do they still last about 3 years?) or a used printer
from the day when they lasted until your requirements changed?

I'm somewhat concerned about power requirements. The whole front of
the house is on a single 15A circuit. I recall that the old laser
printers wanted at least 10A of their own and I can't really
accommodate that. I'll rewire the house for the studio, but not for a
#@%&* printer. Do they still draw a lot of current when starting or
printing?

I'm traditional enough to want one with a parallel port interface. My
present printer has a USB port in addition and for some reason that I
don't remember now, I decided that it was more bother than the
parallel port so I've never tried it. I don't want to be locked into a
USB-only printer, and I'll bet some of those that I haven't looked at
very closely don't have parallel ports. I learned my lesson with my
laptop - it doesn't have a standard serial port and I miss it.

So what should I look at more closely? New or used laser, or new
inkjet? eBay haunters restrain yourself from replying "There's a ####
on eBay right now for $37." I can find that myself.




--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

Mike,

I had Epson for awhile also but switched back to HP for the following
reasons. 1) Epsons print heads are in the printer as oppossed to HP's which
are on the cartridge. Over time I found the Epson clogged a lot more often
than the HP. That accounts for the huffing and puffing at start-up
(cleaning the heads) when a printer is used only occasionally. The other
thing that drove me nuts was, as you mentioned, the insistance of the
printer to have a color cartridge installed before the printer would print a
black text page. I used the printer occasionally for photos and when the
color cartridge ran out the printer was essentially worthless since it would
not operate with black only. I am currently using an HP Photosmart 1115
with neither problem and almost instant start-up. I don't even have it on
all the time but "hot swap" it on when I need it. It works within 7-10
seconds.

I know nothing about laser jets so can't help you there.

Dan

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
news:znr1064665527k@trad...

I'm starting to think about getting a new printer for my general
purpose computer. The Epson inkjet that I've had for a bit over 3
years is starting to get a little cranky and I'm thinking about
replacing it. Like microphones, there are entirely too many too
similar ones out there, and I suspect that within a certain range it
doesn't matter which one I buy but:

I'm thinking about a laser printer this time around, mostly for the
speed. Not necessarily the pages/minute speed but the time it takes to
go from not having been used for a couple of days to starting to
print. Seems like about half the time I print on my present printer,
it pumps and steams and groans for as much as 30 seconds before it
feeds the paper and actually starts printing. Do they all do that?

I know that laser printers usually go to a standby state after a
certain time. Does it take about as long for them to come to life as
it does my inkjet? In other words, will I just as fidgetty if I get a
laser printer?

My present printer prints color, and I've only used it to see if it
works, though it still insists in getting the color ink cartridge
replaced every now and then. I buy cheap ones so it hasn't cost me
that much to keep it running, but it's annoying to have to replace
something expendable that I'm not using.

*** NO, I don't refill ink cartridges. I use about three a year, and
I don't want to deal with the mess, the bottles, and wonder
about the shelf life of refill ink ***

I stopped looking at laser printers around the time of the HP
Laserjet II so I don't know in which directions they've progressed by
then. I can buy a used Laserjet 4 for about the same price as any
number of new "office supply store" laser printers. Will I be happier
with a new one (do they still last about 3 years?) or a used printer
from the day when they lasted until your requirements changed?

I'm somewhat concerned about power requirements. The whole front of
the house is on a single 15A circuit. I recall that the old laser
printers wanted at least 10A of their own and I can't really
accommodate that. I'll rewire the house for the studio, but not for a
#@%&* printer. Do they still draw a lot of current when starting or
printing?

I'm traditional enough to want one with a parallel port interface. My
present printer has a USB port in addition and for some reason that I
don't remember now, I decided that it was more bother than the
parallel port so I've never tried it. I don't want to be locked into a
USB-only printer, and I'll bet some of those that I haven't looked at
very closely don't have parallel ports. I learned my lesson with my
laptop - it doesn't have a standard serial port and I miss it.

So what should I look at more closely? New or used laser, or new
inkjet? eBay haunters restrain yourself from replying "There's a ####
on eBay right now for $37." I can find that myself.




--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

Mike Rivers wrote:

I'm starting to think about getting a new printer for my general
purpose computer. The Epson inkjet that I've had for a bit over 3
years is starting to get a little cranky and I'm thinking about
replacing it. Like microphones, there are entirely too many too
similar ones out there, and I suspect that within a certain range it
doesn't matter which one I buy but:


I had an Epson printer once. I will never buy an Epson again, it sucked.
At work (my own personal printer) is a black and white laser printer.
Current one is a Brother, and it has been great. Before that, an NEC,
also had no problems. The printers are cheap, but the new ink pack/drum
cost a bunch.

At home I have an HP 2000CE. It works every bit as good as the lasers
and it is color. About 400 bucks if I recall. But it does go through ink
(4 colors) and ink heads a lot. And they are expensive too.

Those would be my suggestions depending if you want color or not. At
work we have a color laser, don't remember the brand, but it needs
repairs plenty. Not user friendly like my printers. Hope that helps.

-Rob

Mike Rivers wrote:

I'm starting to think about getting a new printer for my general
purpose computer. The Epson inkjet that I've had for a bit over 3
years is starting to get a little cranky and I'm thinking about
replacing it. Like microphones, there are entirely too many too
similar ones out there, and I suspect that within a certain range it
doesn't matter which one I buy but:


I had an Epson printer once. I will never buy an Epson again, it sucked.
At work (my own personal printer) is a black and white laser printer.
Current one is a Brother, and it has been great. Before that, an NEC,
also had no problems. The printers are cheap, but the new ink pack/drum
cost a bunch.

At home I have an HP 2000CE. It works every bit as good as the lasers
and it is color. About 400 bucks if I recall. But it does go through ink
(4 colors) and ink heads a lot. And they are expensive too.

Those would be my suggestions depending if you want color or not. At
work we have a color laser, don't remember the brand, but it needs
repairs plenty. Not user friendly like my printers. Hope that helps.

-Rob

Mike Rivers wrote:

I'm thinking about a laser printer this time around, mostly for the
speed. Not necessarily the pages/minute speed but the time it takes to
go from not having been used for a couple of days to starting to
print.


My somewhat long-in-the-tooth LaserJet 6MP takes about ten seconds to go
from sleep to completion of printing for the first page.

We have a bunch of bigger HPs scattered here and there and a couple of
Lexmarks, all of which have been reliable. I do get the 6MP cleaned
every 2-3 years but other than toner and paper that's been the total outlay.

We have an HP 1100 (the cheap vertical format one that looks kind of
like a big inkjet) and it has absolutely terrible paperhandling.

Having started with a LaserJet 3 (still in service at a friend's
contracting business) I could never live with an inkjet as my only
printer. They're fine for low-volume color stuff but just don't cut it
for any kind of volume use with text.

Mike Rivers wrote:

I'm thinking about a laser printer this time around, mostly for the
speed. Not necessarily the pages/minute speed but the time it takes to
go from not having been used for a couple of days to starting to
print.


My somewhat long-in-the-tooth LaserJet 6MP takes about ten seconds to go
from sleep to completion of printing for the first page.

We have a bunch of bigger HPs scattered here and there and a couple of
Lexmarks, all of which have been reliable. I do get the 6MP cleaned
every 2-3 years but other than toner and paper that's been the total outlay.

We have an HP 1100 (the cheap vertical format one that looks kind of
like a big inkjet) and it has absolutely terrible paperhandling.

Having started with a LaserJet 3 (still in service at a friend's
contracting business) I could never live with an inkjet as my only
printer. They're fine for low-volume color stuff but just don't cut it
for any kind of volume use with text.

says...
Seems like about half the time I print on my present printer,
it pumps and steams and groans for as much as 30 seconds before it
feeds the paper and actually starts printing. Do they all do that?
I know that laser printers usually go to a standby state after a
certain time. Does it take about as long for them to come to life as
it does my inkjet? In other words, will I just as fidgetty if I get a
laser printer?

Will I be happier
with a new one (do they still last about 3 years?) or a used printer
from the day when they lasted until your requirements changed?

I'm somewhat concerned about power requirements.

I'm traditional enough to want one with a parallel port interface.

Mike,

I much prefer lasers if you don't need color -- they don't take all day,
use long-lasting reasonably priced cartridges, sharp 600dpi, don't
smudge, very reliable.

I like my HP Laserjet 1000, very nice and inexpensive ($200). This one
starts immediately even if it's in standby, takes 10-12 sec to finish the
first page, 10 ppm after that.

I'd recommend a new one vs used, and most definitely HP over any other
brand. Don't know about life expectancy, I've had this one about 18
months, no problems.

The fuser still requires a lot of power AFAIK, will probably not work
through a power conditioner for instance.

It's USB only. Much faster than Centronics parallel BTW. That may limit
your choices...

Steve

says...
Seems like about half the time I print on my present printer,
it pumps and steams and groans for as much as 30 seconds before it
feeds the paper and actually starts printing. Do they all do that?
I know that laser printers usually go to a standby state after a
certain time. Does it take about as long for them to come to life as
it does my inkjet? In other words, will I just as fidgetty if I get a
laser printer?

Will I be happier
with a new one (do they still last about 3 years?) or a used printer
from the day when they lasted until your requirements changed?

I'm somewhat concerned about power requirements.

I'm traditional enough to want one with a parallel port interface.

Mike,

I much prefer lasers if you don't need color -- they don't take all day,
use long-lasting reasonably priced cartridges, sharp 600dpi, don't
smudge, very reliable.

I like my HP Laserjet 1000, very nice and inexpensive ($200). This one
starts immediately even if it's in standby, takes 10-12 sec to finish the
first page, 10 ppm after that.

I'd recommend a new one vs used, and most definitely HP over any other
brand. Don't know about life expectancy, I've had this one about 18
months, no problems.

The fuser still requires a lot of power AFAIK, will probably not work
through a power conditioner for instance.

It's USB only. Much faster than Centronics parallel BTW. That may limit
your choices...

Steve

I need to print in color and so I limp along with the overpriced ink and
fussy nozzles on my Epson. But late at night, I think about the LaserJet
4MP I left behind.

If you must have a parallel port look for used HP 4s and 5s. I had a 4
for about 5 years and never had to do anything but add paper and toner.

-p

I need to print in color and so I limp along with the overpriced ink and
fussy nozzles on my Epson. But late at night, I think about the LaserJet
4MP I left behind.

If you must have a parallel port look for used HP 4s and 5s. I had a 4
for about 5 years and never had to do anything but add paper and toner.

-p

Mike Rivers wrote:

I'm starting to think about getting a new printer for my general
purpose computer. The Epson inkjet that I've had for a bit over 3
years is starting to get a little cranky and I'm thinking about
replacing it. Like microphones, there are entirely too many too
similar ones out there, and I suspect that within a certain range it
doesn't matter which one I buy but:

--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

It all depends on what you like. At home I have a canon multipass
combo color inkjet printer and fax machine. I also have an old HP
laserjet IIIsi I picked up at an auction for 50 bucks, and the ol dot
matrix printer for printing out text that is only for my use.
The gotchas with all inkjets is that the ink tanks are variously
expensive, they dry up and clog if you don't use them often enough.
Ink is not very waterproof, so will smear easily when you spill
something on it. Refill kits for them are erratic in usability. They
sell you the printer at near cost, and make their money on the ink.
Pluses for inkjets are inexpensive color, and if you put expensive
paper in it, you can get very good results.
Laser printers are less expensive than inkjets for the toner.
( Generally the larger the toner cartridge, the lower cost per page )
Image quality is good, but usually only black. ( there are color
laser printers, but are very expensive. ) They do want some
noticeable power, as the way the coal dust is turned into a permanent
image is that it is squeezed against the paper by a set of heated
rollers. Thus there is a warm-up time if it is in standby or off before
the first page comes out.

--Dale

I've had good luck with the Canon F30 multipass. The f50 has fax if you need
that too. Great B&W, beautiful color when you need it and separate ink
cartridges so you don't have to swap the whole pack at once. I had an NEC
Silentwriter for many years and liked the laser but the guy who repairs them
told me that the inkjets are a better value and cheaper to buy another one
in a few years than to try and repair the lasers.


"Dale Farmer" wrote in message
...


Mike Rivers wrote:

I'm starting to think about getting a new printer for my general
purpose computer. The Epson inkjet that I've had for a bit over 3
years is starting to get a little cranky and I'm thinking about
replacing it. Like microphones, there are entirely too many too
similar ones out there, and I suspect that within a certain range it
doesn't matter which one I buy but:

--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

It all depends on what you like. At home I have a canon multipass
combo color inkjet printer and fax machine. I also have an old HP
laserjet IIIsi I picked up at an auction for 50 bucks, and the ol dot
matrix printer for printing out text that is only for my use.
The gotchas with all inkjets is that the ink tanks are variously
expensive, they dry up and clog if you don't use them often enough.
Ink is not very waterproof, so will smear easily when you spill
something on it. Refill kits for them are erratic in usability. They
sell you the printer at near cost, and make their money on the ink.
Pluses for inkjets are inexpensive color, and if you put expensive
paper in it, you can get very good results.
Laser printers are less expensive than inkjets for the toner.
( Generally the larger the toner cartridge, the lower cost per page )
Image quality is good, but usually only black. ( there are color
laser printers, but are very expensive. ) They do want some
noticeable power, as the way the coal dust is turned into a permanent
image is that it is squeezed against the paper by a set of heated
rollers. Thus there is a warm-up time if it is in standby or off before
the first page comes out.

--Dale

In article writes:

The gotchas with all inkjets is that the ink tanks are variously
expensive, they dry up and clog if you don't use them often enough.
Ink is not very waterproof, so will smear easily when you spill
something on it. Refill kits for them are erratic in usability.

I've been buying cheap imitation cartridges after my first set of high
priced Epsons. I buy two black and one color from a mysterious mail
order place. Costs me about $35 with postage and that's usually about
a year's supply unless I'm dumping a lot to the printer. For this
reason, I've never messed with refill kits. Laser cartriges, even
remanufactured ones, are about twice that a shot. I wonder if one will
last me two years? Probably will, as I don't think that their shelf
life is significantly shortened once they're installed. I probably go
through a ream of paper in a year.

They do want some
noticeable power, as the way the coal dust is turned into a permanent
image is that it is squeezed against the paper by a set of heated
rollers.

That's what I need to look at. I already have two computers with CRT
monitors, a couple of 100 watt lights, and a small receiver in that
room, plus whatever lights are on in other rooms in the front of the
house. I haven't put an ammeter on that circuit (easy enough to do)
but I suspect that it's running close to 10A most of the time right
now. In the really cold weather when I run an electric heater in that
room, I have an extension cord strung across the living room floor to
an outlet that's on a practically unused circuit. I don't want to do
that with something as permanently-on as a printer though.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

Billy Bee wrote:
I had an NEC
Silentwriter for many years and liked the laser but the guy who repairs them
told me that the inkjets are a better value and cheaper to buy another one
in a few years than to try and repair the lasers.

Inkjets are a better value for the company that sells you your ink, for
sure.

Mike Rivers wrote:

In article writes:


The gotchas with all inkjets is that the ink tanks are variously
expensive, they dry up and clog if you don't use them often enough.
Ink is not very waterproof, so will smear easily when you spill
something on it. Refill kits for them are erratic in usability.


I've been buying cheap imitation cartridges after my first set of high
priced Epsons. I buy two black and one color from a mysterious mail
order place. Costs me about $35 with postage and that's usually about
a year's supply unless I'm dumping a lot to the printer. For this
reason, I've never messed with refill kits. Laser cartriges, even
remanufactured ones, are about twice that a shot. I wonder if one will
last me two years? Probably will, as I don't think that their shelf
life is significantly shortened once they're installed. I probably go
through a ream of paper in a year.

No aging issues with laser cartridges that I've seen so far. When they
get low (and BTW most printers ship with a partial-fill cartridge these
days) you may need to take them out and shake/rock them a bit to restore
even print density. Got an extra three months out of one that way.





They do want some
noticeable power, as the way the coal dust is turned into a permanent
image is that it is squeezed against the paper by a set of heated
rollers.


That's what I need to look at. I already have two computers with CRT
monitors, a couple of 100 watt lights, and a small receiver in that
room, plus whatever lights are on in other rooms in the front of the
house. I haven't put an ammeter on that circuit (easy enough to do)
but I suspect that it's running close to 10A most of the time right
now. In the really cold weather when I run an electric heater in that
room, I have an extension cord strung across the living room floor to
an outlet that's on a practically unused circuit. I don't want to do
that with something as permanently-on as a printer though.

6-7A peak startup on my LaserJet 6MP.

In rec.audio.pro, (Mike Rivers) wrote:


I'm starting to think about getting a new printer for my general
purpose computer. The Epson inkjet that I've had for a bit over 3
years is starting to get a little cranky and I'm thinking about
replacing it. Like microphones, there are entirely too many too
similar ones out there, and I suspect that within a certain range it
doesn't matter which one I buy but:

I'm thinking about a laser printer this time around, mostly for the
speed. Not necessarily the pages/minute speed but the time it takes to
go from not having been used for a couple of days to starting to
print. Seems like about half the time I print on my present printer,
it pumps and steams and groans for as much as 30 seconds before it
feeds the paper and actually starts printing. Do they all do that?

I've got an old 24-pin dot-matrix printer, it starts printing
instantly...

I know that laser printers usually go to a standby state after a
certain time. Does it take about as long for them to come to life as
it does my inkjet? In other words, will I just as fidgetty if I get a
laser printer?

I"ve not seen any answers to your laser-printer questions, but for
low-volume use, I think a laser printer is real overkill.

My present printer prints color, and I've only used it to see if it
works, though it still insists in getting the color ink cartridge
replaced every now and then. I buy cheap ones so it hasn't cost me
that much to keep it running, but it's annoying to have to replace
something expendable that I'm not using.

*** NO, I don't refill ink cartridges. I use about three a year, and
I don't want to deal with the mess, the bottles, and wonder
about the shelf life of refill ink ***

I stopped looking at laser printers around the time of the HP
Laserjet II so I don't know in which directions they've progressed by
then. I can buy a used Laserjet 4 for about the same price as any
number of new "office supply store" laser printers. Will I be happier
with a new one (do they still last about 3 years?) or a used printer
from the day when they lasted until your requirements changed?

I'm somewhat concerned about power requirements. The whole front of
the house is on a single 15A circuit. I recall that the old laser
printers wanted at least 10A of their own and I can't really
accommodate that. I'll rewire the house for the studio, but not for a
#@%&* printer. Do they still draw a lot of current when starting or
printing?

I'm traditional enough to want one with a parallel port interface. My
present printer has a USB port in addition and for some reason that I
don't remember now, I decided that it was more bother than the
parallel port so I've never tried it. I don't want to be locked into a
USB-only printer, and I'll bet some of those that I haven't looked at
very closely don't have parallel ports.

I'm not sure, but I don't think any new printers are made with the
parallel port interface anymore. Everything is USB.
A couple months ago I got an HP inkjet color printer/scanner/copier
combo at Sam's Club for $90. It's incredibly cheap in several ways
(probably made in a China factory that also makes microphones), but it
works.

I learned my lesson with my
laptop - it doesn't have a standard serial port and I miss it.

So what should I look at more closely? New or used laser, or new
inkjet? eBay haunters restrain yourself from replying "There's a ####
on eBay right now for $37." I can find that myself.




--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

-----
http://mindspring.com/~benbradley

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
news:znr1064665527k@trad...


So what should I look at more closely? New or used laser, or new
inkjet? eBay haunters restrain yourself from replying "There's a ####
on eBay right now for $37." I can find that myself.

Hmm. I'd say go with HP, and the biggest, newest one they make.

Glenn D.

"Ben Bradley" wrote in message
...
In rec.audio.pro, (Mike Rivers) wrote:

A couple months ago I got an HP inkjet color printer/scanner/copier
combo at Sam's Club for $90. It's incredibly cheap in several ways
(probably made in a China factory that also makes microphones), but it
works.

Well, I don't know about that, but I recently audited the factory that also
makes Digi-001 soundcards.

Glenn D.

Mike Rivers wrote:

I'm starting to think about getting a new printer for my general
purpose computer. The Epson inkjet that I've had for a bit over 3
years is starting to get a little cranky and I'm thinking about
replacing it.

Epson printers can get very cranky if you don't lubricate the bar on
which the print head slides occasionally. A light coat of machine oil
will often work wonders.

I'm thinking about a laser printer this time around, mostly for the
speed.

I did the same research recently and settled on a Brother 5040 laser
printer. Street price is around $250, but I got mine for $160 by
combining a rebate with an online discount from OfficeMax.com.

Not necessarily the pages/minute speed but the time it takes to
go from not having been used for a couple of days to starting to
print. Seems like about half the time I print on my present printer,
it pumps and steams and groans for as much as 30 seconds before it
feeds the paper and actually starts printing. Do they all do that?

Yes, all the inkjets that I've seen do that. It takes some time to
prime the head with ink. It wastes some ink whenever the printer has to
do that, too. They can be very expensive to operate for that reason.

I know that laser printers usually go to a standby state after a
certain time. Does it take about as long for them to come to life as
it does my inkjet? In other words, will I just as fidgetty if I get a
laser printer?

My new Brother printer gets the job started quite quickly - much faster
than my Canon inkjet that I use for printing color photos.

Will I be happier with a new one (do they still last about 3 years?)

I don't know how long current printers last. My new laser printer
replaced an IBM/Lexmark laser printer that had been going strong for a
full 10 years when it finally failed me. I'm hoping for the new one to
last that long, but I won't be surprised if it fails sooner than that.

I'm somewhat concerned about power requirements. The whole front of
the house is on a single 15A circuit. I recall that the old laser
printers wanted at least 10A of their own and I can't really
accommodate that. I'll rewire the house for the studio, but not for a
#@%&* printer. Do they still draw a lot of current when starting or
printing?

The 5040 uses less than 500 watts when it's printing, 75 when it's not
printing, and 5 when it's "sleeping". It sleeps most of the time,
turning itself on only when I send it a job to do.

I'm traditional enough to want one with a parallel port interface.

The 5040 comes with both USB and Parallel. I'm using the parallel
interface for mine. It also has an option to add an ethernet card to
it, but it seemed prohibitively expensive.

So what should I look at more closely?

Here's a pointer to the specs for the 5040:

http://www.brother.com/usa/printer/i...l5040_spe.html

And here's PC World's most recent report on laser printers for home and
office:

http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/artic...,110329,00.asp

"Glenn Dowdy" wrote in message
...

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
news:znr1064665527k@trad...


So what should I look at more closely? New or used laser, or new
inkjet? eBay haunters restrain yourself from replying "There's a ####
on eBay right now for $37." I can find that myself.

Hmm. I'd say go with HP, and the biggest, newest one they make.

Glenn D.


Good advice. I once had an Okidata ink jet printer that failed. I took it
to a repair facitlity that is close by. The technician gave me a repair
estimate that was about half what I originally paid. I asked him what he
didn't often see on his bench. He said HP Deskjet. I bought one. That was
7 or 8 years ago. It is still in my wife's office working perfectly.

Steve King

In article writes:

I've got an old 24-pin dot-matrix printer, it starts printing
instantly...

Me, too, and it's on another computer in another room. Getting a
little hard to find pin-feed paper on the shelf though.

I"ve not seen any answers to your laser-printer questions, but for
low-volume use, I think a laser printer is real overkill.

I was looking at a new H-P 1300 that has a "fast on" mode - less than
8 seconds to start printing. I agree that it's overkill, but so is a
color inkjet when I don't use color, but it's hard to find a plain
black one. Some models that used a singe cartridge for both black and
color (rather than separate cartridges like my Epson) offered a single
black-only cartridge.

What I'd like to get over is the need to immediately replace the ink
cartridge. When mine goes, it goes from printing just fine to not
printing at all in about two pages. Unlike a laser, you can't take the
cartridge out and shake it. This means that either I need to keep a
cartridge on hand (I just used my last one which is what got me
thinking about a new printer) so either I order a few more (it's
uneconomical to order just one without the 3+ discount and free
shipping over $25) or I wait until this one goes and then run out to
Office Depot and buy a Gen-U-Wine Epson cartridge for about $25.

I'm not sure, but I don't think any new printers are made with the
parallel port interface anymore. Everything is USB.

According to the HP website, the one I looked at had a parallel port,
and a slot for an optional network card (about $200!) to put it on the
LAN as a print server.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

In article writes:

Epson printers can get very cranky if you don't lubricate the bar on
which the print head slides occasionally. A light coat of machine oil
will often work wonders.

That's not the way it's getting cranky. It just stops spraying ink on
the paper. Sometimes running the nozzle cleaning utility revives it
(for a surprisingly long time) and other times it requires replacing
the cartridge, even when it feels (by weight) that there should still
be some ink left in it. On the other hand, I may be unfairly judging
this. Like I say, I don't print a lot of volume so it may be that the
last cartridge has been in for way too long. Last time I remember
changing it was to print out copies of my volumous income tax return
in February or so, though I may have replaced the cartridge since
then.

Buying a 10,000 pages per month rated laser would probalby be
overkill, but then I don't know what that kind of rating really means.
Does it mean that you can print 10,000 pages a month for a year (or
however long the warranty is) and then it's ready for the junkyard? Or
that at that rate you need to replace the cartridge once a month? Or
what?

I did the same research recently and settled on a Brother 5040 laser
printer. Street price is around $250, but I got mine for $160 by
combining a rebate with an online discount from OfficeMax.com.

That's the kind of answer I was hoping for - real live experience with
something other than one of the "big two." I once bought a dot matrix
printer that wasn't an Epson. It cost more and had nicer print output,
but it failed in a bit over a year and it would have cost more to
repair than a new printer. I don't even remember the brand.

Yes, all the inkjets that I've seen do that. It takes some time to
prime the head with ink. It wastes some ink whenever the printer has to
do that, too. They can be very expensive to operate for that reason.

This may be what I'm experiencing then. I may be wasting half of the
ink I buy just getting the printer started.

Thanks for the reference to the Brother. I'll see if it's still
available. So many things that people have owned long enough to
recommend have been superceded by a different model which may be
better, may be worse, but will certainly be different.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

Mike Rivers wrote:
In article writes:

Epson printers can get very cranky if you don't lubricate the bar on
which the print head slides occasionally. A light coat of machine oil
will often work wonders.

That's not the way it's getting cranky. It just stops spraying ink on
the paper. Sometimes running the nozzle cleaning utility revives it
(for a surprisingly long time) and other times it requires replacing
the cartridge, even when it feels (by weight) that there should still
be some ink left in it. On the other hand, I may be unfairly judging
this. Like I say, I don't print a lot of volume so it may be that the
last cartridge has been in for way too long. Last time I remember
changing it was to print out copies of my volumous income tax return
in February or so, though I may have replaced the cartridge since
then.

I thought I might have seen a note in this thread in which you mentioned
using 3rd party ink cartridges. In my experience, that's not a good
idea with any inkjet printer. The relationship between the ink and the
printhead is a critical part of the technology. I've used nothing but
Epson cartridges with my Stylus Photo 700 (which still works, though
I've passed it on to my sister) and nothing but Canon cartridges in my
current Canon S900, and both printers have performed very well for me.

The Epson did tend to clog if I went a long time (weeks) without
printing on it, but I never had any trouble getting it cleared up again.
It works best if it is used regularly.

The Canon has never clogged or failed in any way, but it's only a year
or so old. I like the Canon because its photographic output is gorgeous
and because it can print that kind of quality very quickly. In
addition, it uses a separate cartridge for each ink color, so I don't
have to throw out good magenta ink just because I run out of Cyan. But
you're not shopping for an inket, so I'll shut up about that.

Buying a 10,000 pages per month rated laser would probalby be
overkill, but then I don't know what that kind of rating really means.
Does it mean that you can print 10,000 pages a month for a year (or
however long the warranty is) and then it's ready for the junkyard? Or
that at that rate you need to replace the cartridge once a month? Or
what?

I don't know what that rating means either. While I'm happy with the
Brother laser printer to date, I really haven't had it long enough to
give you a meaningful report on its longevity. It seems to be well
made, and I see nothing in its design that worries me, but I've only had
it for a couple of months. So you can't use my example to guage that.

I did the same research recently and settled on a Brother 5040 laser
printer. Street price is around $250, but I got mine for $160 by
combining a rebate with an online discount from OfficeMax.com.

That's the kind of answer I was hoping for - real live experience with
something other than one of the "big two." I once bought a dot matrix
printer that wasn't an Epson. It cost more and had nicer print output,
but it failed in a bit over a year and it would have cost more to
repair than a new printer. I don't even remember the brand.

Thanks for the reference to the Brother. I'll see if it's still
available. So many things that people have owned long enough to
recommend have been superceded by a different model which may be
better, may be worse, but will certainly be different.

As I said, so far I'm still using the toner cartridge that came with the
printer, so obviously it hasn't seen enough wear and tear to judge that
aspect of its performance. But I've used it to print some large
documents and I've run some prints back through it for duplex printing,
and it seems to handle everything I've asked it to so far.

I hope it holds up as well as my old IBM/Lexmark 4029, but it's just too
soon to tell.

In any event, your local OfficeMax store will have one in stock, so it's
easy enough to see this model for yourself.

Mike Rivers wrote:

I'm starting to think about getting a new printer for my general
purpose computer. The Epson inkjet that I've had for a bit over 3
years is starting to get a little cranky and I'm thinking about
replacing it. Like microphones, there are entirely too many too
similar ones out there, and I suspect that within a certain range it
doesn't matter which one I buy but:

I bought an Epson recently and haven't been impressed. It seems to clog
up if I don't use it for more than a day. I even went as far as packing
it up to take it back under warranty but remembered something I needed
to print so I unpacked it and it then decided to work perfectly for a
while.

I've heard many other people complain about blocked Epsons - at least if
you get a totally blocked nozzle with an HP you can just change the
print cartridge - with an Epson you have to change the whole printer.

However, I've seen a suggestion that filling the Epson nozzles with
ammonia will clear them out. I haven't tried it but it is a suggestion
you could try if you feel inclined.

Cheers.

James.

On Mon, 29 Sep 2003 02:48:46 GMT, someone who calls themselves "Glenn
Dowdy" wrote:
"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
news:znr1064665527k@trad...

So what should I look at more closely? New or used laser, or new
inkjet? eBay haunters restrain yourself from replying "There's a ####
on eBay right now for $37." I can find that myself.

Hmm. I'd say go with HP, and the biggest, newest one they make.

I would refine that to an HP Laser printer, we have two LJ1100 that
won't die - though when they need a cleaning the paper feed goes
wonky, and you have to feed the paper one sheet at a time.

My LJ3200 All-in-one fax/printer/scanner/copier was a little flaky
with odd "BSOD" lock-ups (though a 2x20 display can't turn blue ;-)
when I got it, but now runs perfectly after they figured out their
goof and updated the firmware...

Stay away from the 'loss leader' cheapie printers for $59. The whole
idea of selling you ink-jet printers cheap (or worse, the Panasonic
wide-ribbon "Plain Paper" machines) is to nail you for $50 or more
every 6 months for the rest of your life for the refill consumables.
Laser printers go 2,500 pages or more on a cartridge, they are a more
money up front but their lifetime per-page cost is far lower.

The only caveat being, see if you can get two matching printers.
Find another one that uses the same print cartridge on special or at a
garage sale, and park it on the shelf. That way you can swap the
print cartridges to see if your good printer is broken or just out of
toner before you go running off for another $60 toner cartridge.
(It's an expensive lesson to find out afterwards.)

-- Bruce --
--
Bruce L. Bergman, POB 394, Woodland Hills CA 91365, USA
Electrician, Westend Electric (#726700) Agoura, CA

WARNING: UCE Spam E-mail is not welcome here. I report violators.
SpamBlock In Use - Remove the "Python" with a "net" to E-Mail.

In article writes:

The Epson did tend to clog if I went a long time (weeks) without
printing on it, but I never had any trouble getting it cleared up again.
It works best if it is used regularly.

Exactly why I'm thinking of switching to a different technology. I
don't really agree with your suggestion that the third party
cartridges were (or could) cause trouble. There really aren't any deep
dark secrets with ink cartridges. Or maybe they are, and that's why
they're so expensive from the original manufacturer. I don't do
refills myself though - too messy.

Buying a 10,000 pages per month rated laser . . .

I don't know what that rating means either.

I was browsing laser cartridges in Office Depot this morning. I saw
your Brother 5040 ($250) and the cartridge for it. Cartridge costs $60
and the box says it's good for 3300 pages. If I keep up with my
current ream-a-year average, the original cartridge shold last me 6
years. That's not a bad deal. But the printer info also says "20,000
sheet monthly volume". Run it at that capacity and you'll exceed the
printer's cost by 50% each month buying cartridges. Or maybe given its
speed of 17 pages/minute, if you took time out to change cartridges
and paper, you could just about get 20,000 pages printed per month if
you ran it around the clock. So I guess that specification means about
as much as "Frequency response 20-20K."



--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

From: (Mike Rivers)

I
don't really agree with your suggestion that the third party
cartridges were (or could) cause trouble. There really aren't any deep
dark secrets with ink cartridges. Or maybe they are, and that's why
they're so expensive from the original manufacturer.

FWIW, only problem I've had with my HP880C Inkjet in 3-4 years was from an
Office Depot (I think) cartridge. Didn't work, after freakout brought it back
and popped an HP in there, no probs. It tends to sit awhile and then print some
pages, BW-color (kids), no clogging problems, start-up time seems ok. Only
other problem is with drivers on HP Pavilion 8560, had to get a "patch" to take
the driver out after a crash (kids), and this era "plug and play" for USB
don't. Never used parallel port. Ink for these is expensive, that's how they
get a return.

Used an older Laser III from HP on a newsletter @ 8-10 years ago. One crapped
out, replaced free. I thought great for B&W only, reliable like a refrigerator,
many many pages printed. Used/refurb? --TP