[Sean[_2_]]

And lots of other Quality Nos tubes.. very reasonably priced

Please see:


http://search.ebay.com.au/_W0QQsassZ33-45QQhtZ-1

[Phil Allison]

"Sean"

http://search.ebay.com.au/_W0QQsassZ33-45QQhtZ-1


** The first three have large, visible burn marks on the plates.

The second from the left has its plate twisted.

I bin much better looking EL34s regularly.



....... Phil

[Sean[_2_]]

Phil Allison wrote:
"Sean"

http://search.ebay.com.au/_W0QQsassZ33-45QQhtZ-1


** The first three have large, visible burn marks on the plates.

The second from the left has its plate twisted.

Actually...the 4th tube is slightly twisted also, how did you miss that?


I bin much better looking EL34s regularly.

Good onya.

[Patrick Turner]

Phil Allison wrote:

"Sean"

http://search.ebay.com.au/_W0QQsassZ33-45QQhtZ-1

** The first three have large, visible burn marks on the plates.

The second from the left has its plate twisted.

I bin much better looking EL34s regularly.

...... Phil

Maximum price I'd pay for junk like this is $5 each.

You just never know how close such tubes are to the end of their life.

Patrick Turner.

[Peter Wieck]

On Mar 30, 7:04 am, Patrick Turner wrote:
Phil Allison wrote:

"Sean"

http://search.ebay.com.au/_W0QQsassZ33-45QQhtZ-1

** The first three have large, visible burn marks on the plates.

The second from the left has its plate twisted.

I bin much better looking EL34s regularly.

...... Phil

Maximum price I'd pay for junk like this is $5 each.

You just never know how close such tubes are to the end of their life.

Patrick Turner.

Apart from the fact that matching is not based on emissions...

Peter Wieck
Wyncote, PA

[Sean[_2_]]

Patrick Turner wrote:

Phil Allison wrote:
"Sean"

http://search.ebay.com.au/_W0QQsassZ33-45QQhtZ-1
** The first three have large, visible burn marks on the plates.

The second from the left has its plate twisted.

I bin much better looking EL34s regularly.

...... Phil

Maximum price I'd pay for junk like this is $5 each.

Thanks Patrick, I gather you've heard these particular junk el34's in a
hifi amp?


You just never know how close such tubes are to the end of their life.

We'll I can tell you they have been fully tested on a AVO CT160 and test
above new tube figures, with that in mind what makes you think they
are going to keel over and die any minute???

The fact that they are nearly fifty years old and still test perfect
should tell you something...shouldn't it?

Go on tell me the figures are BS

I'd be happy to run these up against any modern el34 and see how they go.
I'm betting they'll still be showing good figures and sound superior
long after the other crap has long expired or need re-biasing.



cheerio

[Phil Allison]

"Sean"
Patrick Turner wrote:
Phil Allison wrote:

http://search.ebay.com.au/_W0QQsassZ33-45QQhtZ-1
** The first three have large, visible burn marks on the plates.

The second from the left has its plate twisted.

I bin much better looking EL34s regularly.


Maximum price I'd pay for junk like this is $5 each.

Thanks Patrick, I gather you've heard these particular junk el34's in a
hifi amp?


** What pathetic, irrelevant ****e !!!!!!



You just never know how close such tubes are to the end of their life.

We'll I can tell you they have been fully tested on a AVO CT160


** Which is incapable of * fully testing * any power tube.



and test above new tube figures, with that in mind what makes you think
they are going to keel over and die any minute???


** The burn marks on the plates for starters.

Those ancient EL34s have been MIGHTILY abused for countless hours on end.

Best place for them is in the bin.


The fact that they are nearly fifty years old and still test perfect
should tell you something...shouldn't it?


** Your tests with the AVO are irrelevant as the tube's condition is very
BAD !!


Go on tell me the figures are BS


** No, just completely irrelevant.

However, YOU are absolutely full of BULL**** - Sean.



I'd be happy to run these up against any modern el34 and see how they go.
I'm betting they'll still be showing good figures and sound superior long
after the other crap has long expired or need re-biasing.


** Asinine, hypothetical drivel !!

Sean knows damn well he has NO proof will NEVER have to prove it.




....... Phil

[Peter Wieck]

Let's parse this crap:

On Mar 30, 10:43 pm, Sean wrote:

We'll I can tell you they have been fully tested on a AVO CT160 and test
above new tube figures, with that in mind what makes you think they
are going to keel over and die any minute???

The fact that what is essentially an emissions-tester cannot give any
valid indication of potential tube life, nor can it match tubes. It is
the functional equivalent of a Go/No-Go device with a very small
increment between those two states exaggerated by the dial scale
setting to appear meaningful.

The fact that they are nearly fifty years old and still test perfect
should tell you something...shouldn't it?

Age has not a damn-thing to do with it, nor would anyone here argue
differently. Use is the key. These tubes have seen hard use. That they
test well in emissions, again, is neither indicative nor relevant.

Go on tell me the figures are BS

BS? Not hardly. Relative to life and the actual operation of the tube
in an amp, relatively meaningless.

I'd be happy to run these up against any modern el34 and see how they go.
I'm betting they'll still be showing good figures and sound superior
long after the other crap has long expired or need re-biasing.

Oops? Did you really mean to write what you wrote above? Re-biasing?
Um.... as _any_ tube ages it will need re-biasing. Most especially
over the first 100 hours or so, then less often for the next 200 hours
or so. What you are stating even if that was not your intention, is
that these tubes have seen hard use and are well past any further age-
in process and will never need re-biasing for the rest of their quite-
likely short life.

Thanks for clarifying that so nicely.

cheerio

Yep. That too.

Peter Wieck
Wyncote, PA

[Patrick Turner]

Sean wrote:

Patrick Turner wrote:

Phil Allison wrote:
"Sean"

http://search.ebay.com.au/_W0QQsassZ33-45QQhtZ-1
** The first three have large, visible burn marks on the plates.

The second from the left has its plate twisted.

I bin much better looking EL34s regularly.

...... Phil

Maximum price I'd pay for junk like this is $5 each.

Thanks Patrick, I gather you've heard these particular junk el34's in a
hifi amp?

Definately not these particular quad of tubes.

You just never know how close such tubes are to the end of their life.

We'll I can tell you they have been fully tested on a AVO CT160 and test
above new tube figures, with that in mind what makes you think they
are going to keel over and die any minute???

Unfortunately, the world is full of pranksters selling on their used
tubes
as NOS et all and the ebay sales of tubes is riddled with ppl who give
honest sellers
a rotten name.

I have plenty of customers who buy lots of second hand pre-used tube
gear and
although most sales represent a bargain, ie, the buyer get something for
1/5 of the new price of the equivalent new amp, and the seller gets
something
instead of nothing for his junk, about 20% of the price people pay must
be allowed for
extensive repairs of the goods purchased. So where someonrt spends
$400 for something, they should allow $80 for a fix.
Tubes are things not fixed to equipment and are unplugged and traded,
but are the very items which wear out
first in any tube amp, especially output tubes, and sometimes they
look fine, but still end up on ebay with a big price tag, and the buyer
is dissapointed.
I have in the past been offered all sorts of deals with assurances about
tubes being NOS by the box full,
and then I find every tube in every good looking 1960 box is a pull from
the circuit;
it is the old tube which the new one replaced!

So don't ask me or expect me to endorse sales of second hand tubes at a
high price please.



The fact that they are nearly fifty years old and still test perfect
should tell you something...shouldn't it?

Yes, and many tubes supposedly perfect after 50 years go west in a
month.



Go on tell me the figures are BS

I'd be happy to run these up against any modern el34 and see how they go.
I'm betting they'll still be showing good figures and sound superior
long after the other crap has long expired or need re-biasing.

As I said, perhaps you are completely honest, but the actions of many
others
selling off tubes as new after they have used them for 3 years+ isn't
something
I can endorse and I NEVER pay more than $5 for any output tube unless I
have personally
tested and examined it visually myself.
One guy wanted to sell me sixty 12AU7, all good he said, so
I offered $3 but only payable after I test them.
So he sends them and I send 40 back because they are quite attrocious,
with noise and microphony
or gasiness very obvious, with muck all over them after years in
industrial gear/whatever.
20 were OK, but all used, and only worth $3.

I don't believe claims about second hand tubes any more than claims
about second hand cars
which were supposedly driven only by a little old lady one hour per
week.
One guy here just bought a pair of second hand Manley Labs mono amps on
ebay, beautiful gear,
made in 2002, but tubes were **** and fuses started blowing within a
fortnight, sound was crap
so i have to repair/modify them. One EL34 had a stuffed screen grid
which glowed hot
with 17mA of screen current, one 7044 was rooted, but it those tubes
looked just fine....

Rec.audio.tubes is a discussion group, and here is where any claim is
examined, and sceptics are welcomed, and
traders are NOT always believed. I have gear forsale at my website, and
must offer a warranty
for 3 mths if I expect to sell anything, unless I clearly sell something
that is defective, and
of only spare parts value.

Patrick Turner.



cheerio

[Peter Wieck]

On Mar 31, 9:28 am, François Yves Le Gal wrote:
On 31 Mar 2007 06:25:23 -0700, "Peter Wieck" wrote:

The fact that what is essentially an emissions-tester cannot give any
valid indication of potential tube life, nor can it match tubes.

The CT-160 is not only an emission tester, it also allows full
transconductance (Gm) and anode current (Ip) )measurements. Expected life
tests can be performed as usual by varying the filament voltage and static
as well as dynamic matching can be done as easily.

BTW, the CT-160 is one of the finest tube testers ever manufactured. Of
course it can't replace in situ testing.

All true. Excepting that the seller did none of that. So, the
criticism of the results stands, if not necessarily of the tester
itself.

Peter Wieck
Wyncote, PA

[Sean[_2_]]

Patrick Turner wrote:

Sean wrote:
Patrick Turner wrote:
Phil Allison wrote:
"Sean"

http://search.ebay.com.au/_W0QQsassZ33-45QQhtZ-1
** The first three have large, visible burn marks on the plates.

The second from the left has its plate twisted.

I bin much better looking EL34s regularly.

...... Phil
Maximum price I'd pay for junk like this is $5 each.
Thanks Patrick, I gather you've heard these particular junk el34's in a
hifi amp?

Definately not these particular quad of tubes.

Well If you ever happen to find a good set of the early Holland DD
getter EL34 have a listen before you bin em...you might even consider
parting with $20

You just never know how close such tubes are to the end of their life.
We'll I can tell you they have been fully tested on a AVO CT160 and test
above new tube figures, with that in mind what makes you think they
are going to keel over and die any minute???

Unfortunately, the world is full of pranksters selling on their used
tubes
as NOS et all and the ebay sales of tubes is riddled with ppl who give
honest sellers
a rotten name.

I couldn't agree more, Just for the record I've had around 400 tube
sales and not one returned.

I have plenty of customers who buy lots of second hand pre-used tube
gear and
although most sales represent a bargain, ie, the buyer get something for
1/5 of the new price of the equivalent new amp, and the seller gets
something
instead of nothing for his junk, about 20% of the price people pay must
be allowed for
extensive repairs of the goods purchased. So where someonrt spends
$400 for something, they should allow $80 for a fix.
Tubes are things not fixed to equipment and are unplugged and traded,
but are the very items which wear out
first in any tube amp, especially output tubes, and sometimes they
look fine, but still end up on ebay with a big price tag, and the buyer
is dissapointed.
I have in the past been offered all sorts of deals with assurances about
tubes being NOS by the box full,
and then I find every tube in every good looking 1960 box is a pull from
the circuit;
it is the old tube which the new one replaced!

So don't ask me or expect me to endorse sales of second hand tubes at a
high price please.

I never asked you to endorse anything.


The fact that they are nearly fifty years old and still test perfect
should tell you something...shouldn't it?

Yes, and many tubes supposedly perfect after 50 years go west in a
month.


Go on tell me the figures are BS

I'd be happy to run these up against any modern el34 and see how they go.
I'm betting they'll still be showing good figures and sound superior
long after the other crap has long expired or need re-biasing.

As I said, perhaps you are completely honest, but the actions of many
others
selling off tubes as new after they have used them for 3 years+ isn't
something
I can endorse and I NEVER pay more than $5 for any output tube unless I
have personally
tested and examined it visually myself.

Good, like I said, I never asked you to endorse anything.
You seem happy enough to rubbish my tubes on the strength of a photo though.


One guy wanted to sell me sixty 12AU7, all good he said, so
I offered $3 but only payable after I test them.
So he sends them and I send 40 back because they are quite attrocious,
with noise and microphony
or gasiness very obvious, with muck all over them after years in
industrial gear/whatever.
20 were OK, but all used, and only worth $3.

I don't believe claims about second hand tubes any more than claims
about second hand cars
which were supposedly driven only by a little old lady one hour per
week.
One guy here just bought a pair of second hand Manley Labs mono amps on
ebay, beautiful gear,
made in 2002, but tubes were **** and fuses started blowing within a
fortnight, sound was crap
so i have to repair/modify them. One EL34 had a stuffed screen grid
which glowed hot
with 17mA of screen current, one 7044 was rooted, but it those tubes
looked just fine....

Exactly...nice pretty labels aren't everything.
Believe it or not, I tested 8 pieces of the tubes in question and two
measured in the low 50mA range, but had almost perfect Valvo logos..
They would probably sell very quickly because they look nice.

I'd prefer to offer a matched fully tested quad....albeit ugly.




Rec.audio.tubes is a discussion group, and here is where any claim is
examined, and sceptics are welcomed, and
traders are NOT always believed.
I have gear forsale at my website, and
must offer a warranty
for 3 mths if I expect to sell anything, unless I clearly sell something
that is defective, and
of only spare parts value.

Funny that, I just checked your site and see a few clapped out tube
receivers for $150.00 , I throw them on the sidewalk regularly.

Patrick Turner.


cheerio

[Sean[_2_]]

Peter Wieck wrote:
Let's parse this crap:

On Mar 30, 10:43 pm, Sean wrote:

We'll I can tell you they have been fully tested on a AVO CT160 and test
above new tube figures, with that in mind what makes you think they
are going to keel over and die any minute???

The fact that what is essentially an emissions-tester cannot give any
valid indication of potential tube life, nor can it match tubes. It is
the functional equivalent of a Go/No-Go device with a very small
increment between those two states exaggerated by the dial scale
setting to appear meaningful.

Go lookup mA and mA/v wombat

The fact that they are nearly fifty years old and still test perfect
should tell you something...shouldn't it?

Age has not a damn-thing to do with it, nor would anyone here argue
differently. Use is the key. These tubes have seen hard use. That they
test well in emissions, again, is neither indicative nor relevant.
Go on tell me the figures are BS

BS? Not hardly. Relative to life and the actual operation of the tube
in an amp, relatively meaningless.

I'd be happy to run these up against any modern el34 and see how they go.
I'm betting they'll still be showing good figures and sound superior
long after the other crap has long expired or need re-biasing.

Oops? Did you really mean to write what you wrote above? Re-biasing?
Um.... as _any_ tube ages it will need re-biasing. Most especially
over the first 100 hours or so, then less often for the next 200 hours
or so. What you are stating even if that was not your intention, is
that these tubes have seen hard use and are well past any further age-
in process and will never need re-biasing for the rest of their quite-
likely short life.

Thanks for clarifying that so nicely.

cheerio

Yep. That too.

Peter Wieck
Wyncote, PA

[Patrick Turner]

Sean wrote:

Patrick Turner wrote:

Sean wrote:
Patrick Turner wrote:
Phil Allison wrote:
"Sean"

http://search.ebay.com.au/_W0QQsassZ33-45QQhtZ-1
** The first three have large, visible burn marks on the plates.

The second from the left has its plate twisted.

I bin much better looking EL34s regularly.

...... Phil
Maximum price I'd pay for junk like this is $5 each.
Thanks Patrick, I gather you've heard these particular junk el34's in a
hifi amp?

Definately not these particular quad of tubes.

Well If you ever happen to find a good set of the early Holland DD
getter EL34 have a listen before you bin em...you might even consider
parting with $20

I could wax lyrical about EL34 manufactured in Australia before
they closed the factories.
Used tubes from that era are still only worth $5 max afaiac.

You just never know how close such tubes are to the end of their life.
We'll I can tell you they have been fully tested on a AVO CT160 and test
above new tube figures, with that in mind what makes you think they
are going to keel over and die any minute???

Unfortunately, the world is full of pranksters selling on their used
tubes
as NOS et all and the ebay sales of tubes is riddled with ppl who give
honest sellers
a rotten name.

I couldn't agree more, Just for the record I've had around 400 tube
sales and not one returned.

Just for the record, the record is that you've claimed to have no
returns.

Because of claims and BS generated by other unscrupulous dealers,
nobody should believe yours.

You should offer a 3 month or 90 day guaranty so that if any has
trouble
with one or more of the tubes, they can return them for a refund,
or for a replacement; you seem to be selling lots of tubes.




I have plenty of customers who buy lots of second hand pre-used tube
gear and
although most sales represent a bargain, ie, the buyer get something for
1/5 of the new price of the equivalent new amp, and the seller gets
something
instead of nothing for his junk, about 20% of the price people pay must
be allowed for
extensive repairs of the goods purchased. So where someonrt spends
$400 for something, they should allow $80 for a fix.
Tubes are things not fixed to equipment and are unplugged and traded,
but are the very items which wear out
first in any tube amp, especially output tubes, and sometimes they
look fine, but still end up on ebay with a big price tag, and the buyer
is dissapointed.
I have in the past been offered all sorts of deals with assurances about
tubes being NOS by the box full,
and then I find every tube in every good looking 1960 box is a pull from
the circuit;
it is the old tube which the new one replaced!

So don't ask me or expect me to endorse sales of second hand tubes at a
high price please.

I never asked you to endorse anything.

Your problem would be that you don't like a spotlight
turnd on to your old tube dealings for the benefit of buyers, rather
than yourself, a seller.
News groups are usually conterproductive to sales. All present here hate
paying any money for anything,
let alone for what look like old worn EL34 output tubes
about which some unbelievable claims are being made regards sound
quality.

I know guys who have paid $35 for so called NOS Mullard 6CG7 on Ebay
only to find they
were used, and didn't sound as well as Miniwatts made in Oz, or Seimans
made in Germany.
In the case of 12AX7 the Sovtek seem to sound as well as any NOS, so
many say, and some say the opposite,
so the truth lies buried, eh, and then with output tubes the truth seems
even buried deaper because
of greater conflict of opinions.




The fact that they are nearly fifty years old and still test perfect
should tell you something...shouldn't it?

Yes, and many tubes supposedly perfect after 50 years go west in a
month.


Go on tell me the figures are BS

I'd be happy to run these up against any modern el34 and see how they go.
I'm betting they'll still be showing good figures and sound superior
long after the other crap has long expired or need re-biasing.

As I said, perhaps you are completely honest, but the actions of many
others
selling off tubes as new after they have used them for 3 years+ isn't
something
I can endorse and I NEVER pay more than $5 for any output tube unless I
have personally
tested and examined it visually myself.

Good, like I said, I never asked you to endorse anything.
You seem happy enough to rubbish my tubes on the strength of a photo though.

Its not just a photo that does not show everything. For starters, why do
the
stickers cover the bakelite bases? are you afraid the scorch marks would
show
lots of use?

The tubes are old, and regardless of whether thay test well, are no
worth more than
$5 afaiac. What other folks pay for them is their own business.


One guy wanted to sell me sixty 12AU7, all good he said, so
I offered $3 but only payable after I test them.
So he sends them and I send 40 back because they are quite attrocious,
with noise and microphony
or gasiness very obvious, with muck all over them after years in
industrial gear/whatever.
20 were OK, but all used, and only worth $3.

I don't believe claims about second hand tubes any more than claims
about second hand cars
which were supposedly driven only by a little old lady one hour per
week.
One guy here just bought a pair of second hand Manley Labs mono amps on
ebay, beautiful gear,
made in 2002, but tubes were **** and fuses started blowing within a
fortnight, sound was crap
so i have to repair/modify them. One EL34 had a stuffed screen grid
which glowed hot
with 17mA of screen current, one 7044 was rooted, but it those tubes
looked just fine....

Exactly...nice pretty labels aren't everything.
Believe it or not, I tested 8 pieces of the tubes in question and two
measured in the low 50mA range, but had almost perfect Valvo logos..
They would probably sell very quickly because they look nice.

I'd prefer to offer a matched fully tested quad....albeit ugly.


Rec.audio.tubes is a discussion group, and here is where any claim is
examined, and sceptics are welcomed, and
traders are NOT always believed.
I have gear forsale at my website, and
must offer a warranty
for 3 mths if I expect to sell anything, unless I clearly sell something
that is defective, and
of only spare parts value.

Funny that, I just checked your site and see a few clapped out tube
receivers for $150.00 , I throw them on the sidewalk regularly.

And they are being sold as crap, nothing special, just crap,
but perfect for the guy who wants something to build up from.
I once paid $100 for a very poor performing tubed Trio receiver,
just so I could spend months learning how to design and build something
better.
All the resulting ifo is at my website.

It appears I am the ONLY person in the world who has re-designed and
built
a fully working all tubed AM/FM tuner with stereo tubed MPX decoder
over the last 10 years.

Everyone else may have talked about it here on the group,
and nobody here does much except sit around typing.
But I actually do things.

Very few ppl design gear they then build for themselves, or forsale.

The junk I am selling is spelled out as being junk, take it or leave it.

I sold a couple of grand's worth of old junk last year.
One Rega turntable went for the
advertised price of $180 complete with broken motor, and description
that it
would have to be one of the most appalling bits of crap ever designed,
and broken.
But a buyer thought the tone arm alone plus cart was worth the $180
price I asked.

Notice there are no old tubes being offered in my forsale pages?

I do have a lot of them, but am in no hurry to sell them.
Most would only fetch 50c each at a hamfest.

The new ones are all worth the present going market rate plus freight
from the US or wherever.

My prices are well below most other importer trader prices.

Patrick Turner.


cheerio