....is waiting on the shelf of your local Best Buy or Circuit City box store.
It costs $129.95 street price. It plays CD, and gives you three upsampling
options. It plays DVD-A. It includes built-in DD and DTS. And it is the
most open, transparent piece of head-end gear I've ever had in my system.
See the quick review and follow up discussion I posted on AA at:

http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/dv...ges/10732.html

My guess is that Panasonic has kept the signal completely digital through
the DAC and on into a digital line amp on this thing, thereby eliminating
both the conversion to analog and the need for an op-amp. This would be
consistent with the receiver/amp line up, which they are converting to
digital.

At any rate, this has finally let me take the full measure of DVD-A, and it
comes off well. Sounds very similar to SACD's played on my Sony C222ES, but
somewhat more ultimate transparency (but since I hear similar sonic
qualities on Redbook on the two machines, it is a machine difference and not
a format difference).

I will say that this little DVD-A player can create the same kind of
excitement that the Sony SCD-1 did upon SACD's introduction.

Not bad for only a...let's see...$3330.00..difference in price!!

Let's see, what else. Well, I am running it on Sorbothane feet...but then
I've found virtually all cd players sound better that way...but if it
doesn't sound like I describe, but it on Audioquest feet before drawing any
final conclusions.

Run, do not walk, to your store for one of these. I have the single drawer
model S55. The S85 is a five-disk changer version for $20 more.

Harry Lavo
"it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing" - Duke Ellington

Harry Lavo wrote:


I will say that this little DVD-A player can create the same kind of
excitement that the Sony SCD-1 did upon SACD's introduction.


I doubt if this little DVD-A player has created any excitement at all.
It has been around for quite a while now.

On the other hand, the Pioneer DV-563 universal DVD player (with
progressive scan) is now selling at $150. That seems like a pretty good
deal, if someone wants to sample both SACD and DVD-A offerings.

Harry,

You've piqued my interest after reading your review, I'm curious though if
anyone can confirm that the 5-Disc changer version of the panasonic line
modelsDVD-F65S & DVD-F85S use similar internals? Studing the model number it
would be easy to assume that is the case.

PT

"Harry Lavo" wrote in message
news:a0hXb.301128$I06.3069760@attbi_s01...
...is waiting on the shelf of your local Best Buy or Circuit City box
store.
It costs $129.95 street price. It plays CD, and gives you three
upsampling
options. It plays DVD-A. It includes built-in DD and DTS. And it is the
most open, transparent piece of head-end gear I've ever had in my system.
See the quick review and follow up discussion I posted on AA at:

http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/dv...ges/10732.html

My guess is that Panasonic has kept the signal completely digital through
the DAC and on into a digital line amp on this thing, thereby eliminating
both the conversion to analog and the need for an op-amp. This would be
consistent with the receiver/amp line up, which they are converting to
digital.

At any rate, this has finally let me take the full measure of DVD-A, and
it
comes off well. Sounds very similar to SACD's played on my Sony C222ES,
but
somewhat more ultimate transparency (but since I hear similar sonic
qualities on Redbook on the two machines, it is a machine difference and
not
a format difference).

I will say that this little DVD-A player can create the same kind of
excitement that the Sony SCD-1 did upon SACD's introduction.

Not bad for only a...let's see...$3330.00..difference in price!!

Let's see, what else. Well, I am running it on Sorbothane feet...but then
I've found virtually all cd players sound better that way...but if it
doesn't sound like I describe, but it on Audioquest feet before drawing
any
final conclusions.

Run, do not walk, to your store for one of these. I have the single
drawer
model S55. The S85 is a five-disk changer version for $20 more.

Harry Lavo
"it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing" - Duke Ellington

On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 03:56:54 GMT, "Harry Lavo"
wrote:

My guess is that Panasonic has kept the signal completely digital through
the DAC and on into a digital line amp on this thing, thereby eliminating
both the conversion to analog and the need for an op-amp.

No conversion? So this has only digital output?

Kal

Harry Lavo wrote:

...is waiting on the shelf of your local Best Buy or Circuit City box store.
It costs $129.95 street price. It plays CD, and gives you three upsampling
options. It plays DVD-A. It includes built-in DD and DTS. And it is the
most open, transparent piece of head-end gear I've ever had in my system.
See the quick review and follow up discussion I posted on AA at:

http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/dv...ges/10732.html

My guess is that Panasonic has kept the signal completely digital through
the DAC and on into a digital line amp on this thing, thereby eliminating
both the conversion to analog and the need for an op-amp. This would be
consistent with the receiver/amp line up, which they are converting to
digital.

At any rate, this has finally let me take the full measure of DVD-A, and it
comes off well. Sounds very similar to SACD's played on my Sony C222ES, but
somewhat more ultimate transparency (but since I hear similar sonic
qualities on Redbook on the two machines, it is a machine difference and not
a format difference).

I will say that this little DVD-A player can create the same kind of
excitement that the Sony SCD-1 did upon SACD's introduction.

Not bad for only a...let's see...$3330.00..difference in price!!

Let's see, what else. Well, I am running it on Sorbothane feet...but then
I've found virtually all cd players sound better that way...but if it
doesn't sound like I describe, but it on Audioquest feet before drawing any
final conclusions.

Run, do not walk, to your store for one of these. I have the single drawer
model S55. The S85 is a five-disk changer version for $20 more.

Harry Lavo
"it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing" - Duke Ellington

This is a very interesting observation, and I can back it up . . .sort
of. I bought the Panasonic S35K. It's the little brother to the s55.
From the Pnasonic website, it looks like they share the same 24/192
audio DAC. When I bought my s35, I was simply looking a for a decent
quality DVD Video player that also plays MP3s, nothing more. I'm not a
video fanatic, just make it look good onscreen and I'm happy. Critical
audio liistening was the last thing on my mind. During my time with it,
I noticed that it really sounded quite good playing my MP3s, so I
decided to try regular audio CDs with it. Compared to my Denon multi CD
changer with 18 (or was it 20?) bit Burr Brown DACs, it blew the Denon
away. I couldn't beleive it. I had no idea what the DAC was that was
inside the panasonic at the time. And I'm not saying that Denon is crap
either. It was on old Denon, model DCM 370. It was good at the time I
bought it, but Denon makes much better stuff now. I found out that the
Panasonic has the 24/192 DAC. Not much more info after that, but I knew
it sounded great. The Panasonic pretty much retired my Denon changer for
CD-Audio. I never knew I could look to Panasonic for serious audio,
but I do now. This was quite a surprise.

CD

Harry Lavo wrote:

...is waiting on the shelf of your local Best Buy or Circuit City box store.
It costs $129.95 street price. It plays CD, and gives you three upsampling
options. It plays DVD-A. It includes built-in DD and DTS. And it is the
most open, transparent piece of head-end gear I've ever had in my system.
See the quick review and follow up discussion I posted on AA at:

http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/dv...ges/10732.html
...
Run, do not walk, to your store for one of these. I have the single drawer
model S55. The S85 is a five-disk changer version for $20 more.

You might also consider the Pioneer DV-563A. It plays DVD-A, SACD, CD
and just about everything else that's out there. I run its output to a
Benchmark DAC-1 and it sounds quite wonderful.

--
Len Moskowitz PDAudio, Binaural Mics, Cables, DPA, M-Audio
Core Sound http://www.stealthmicrophones.com
Teaneck, New Jersey USA http://www.core-sound.com
Tel: 201-801-0812, FAX: 201-801-0912

No, it has analog 2ch out, as well as analog 5.1 out, and digital toslink
only.

I bought one of these a while ago, its OK, I don't know what big fuss is
about.

"Kalman Rubinson" wrote in message
news:nztXb.310636$xy6.1509442@attbi_s02...
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 03:56:54 GMT, "Harry Lavo"
wrote:

My guess is that Panasonic has kept the signal completely digital through
the DAC and on into a digital line amp on this thing, thereby eliminating
both the conversion to analog and the need for an op-amp.

No conversion? So this has only digital output?

Kal

On Fri, 20 Feb 2004 18:31:00 GMT, "John Hamill"
wrote:

No, it has analog 2ch out, as well as analog 5.1 out, and digital toslink
only.

I bought one of these a while ago, its OK, I don't know what big fuss is
about.

I know. I should not have left off the smiley.

Kal



"Kalman Rubinson" wrote in message
news:nztXb.310636$xy6.1509442@attbi_s02...
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 03:56:54 GMT, "Harry Lavo"
wrote:

My guess is that Panasonic has kept the signal completely digital through
the DAC and on into a digital line amp on this thing, thereby eliminating
both the conversion to analog and the need for an op-amp.

No conversion? So this has only digital output?

Kal

"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:EnsZb.88828$uV3.553144@attbi_s51...
No, it has analog 2ch out, as well as analog 5.1 out, and digital toslink
only.

I bought one of these a while ago, its OK, I don't know what big fuss is
about.


Was it an S55? These are very recent. There was a previous series that
looked the same with a KP in front of the number (KP52 and KP82, I believe).
Don't know whether or not they used the same technology.

The fuss is over the extreme transparency versus other low cost (or even
moderate cost) DVD-A and SACD players. If your HT setup is not of very high
quality, you may not hear it. In my system, it is pretty startling compared
to the other CD/SACD players I have had in the system (thermselves not
slouches).


"Kalman Rubinson" wrote in message
news:nztXb.310636$xy6.1509442@attbi_s02...
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 03:56:54 GMT, "Harry Lavo"
wrote:

My guess is that Panasonic has kept the signal completely digital
through
the DAC and on into a digital line amp on this thing, thereby
eliminating
both the conversion to analog and the need for an op-amp.

No conversion? So this has only digital output?

Kal

"Harry Lavo" wrote in message
...
"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:EnsZb.88828$uV3.553144@attbi_s51...

snip

Was it an S55? These are very recent. There was a previous series that
looked the same with a KP in front of the number (KP52 and KP82, I
believe).
Don't know whether or not they used the same technology.

The fuss is over the extreme transparency versus other low cost (or even
moderate cost) DVD-A and SACD players. If your HT setup is not of very
high
quality, you may not hear it. In my system, it is pretty startling
compared
to the other CD/SACD players I have had in the system (thermselves not
slouches).

I just stumbled across a CNet editors review list of DVD players...they have
two categories..budget/progressive..and audiophile. Same 10 point rating
scale they use for all of their reviews. Reviews are based on lab analysis
as well as listening, viewing, features, and convenience.

Of all the non-recording DVD players tested, the top two were a Sony NS325
pure DVD-V player and the Denon 2900 universal. Both were accorded an 8.0.
At the second level, the Panasonic S55 received a 7.7 along with the Yamaha
2300 and the Onkyo SP800. All others ranked below.

By comparison, the Panasonic 563a received only a 7.4.

I believe it is a safe inference that my observations about this little
player (S55) are dead on - thus "the fuss".

"Harry Lavo" wrote in message
...
"Harry Lavo" wrote in message
...
"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:EnsZb.88828$uV3.553144@attbi_s51...

snip

Was it an S55? These are very recent. There was a previous series that
looked the same with a KP in front of the number (KP52 and KP82, I
believe).
Don't know whether or not they used the same technology.

The fuss is over the extreme transparency versus other low cost (or even
moderate cost) DVD-A and SACD players. If your HT setup is not of very
high
quality, you may not hear it. In my system, it is pretty startling
compared
to the other CD/SACD players I have had in the system (thermselves not
slouches).

I just stumbled across a CNet editors review list of DVD players...they
have
two categories..budget/progressive..and audiophile. Same 10 point rating
scale they use for all of their reviews. Reviews are based on lab
analysis
as well as listening, viewing, features, and convenience.

Of all the non-recording DVD players tested, the top two were a Sony NS325
pure DVD-V player and the Denon 2900 universal. Both were accorded an
8.0.
At the second level, the Panasonic S55 received a 7.7 along with the
Yamaha
2300 and the Onkyo SP800. All others ranked below.

By comparison, the Panasonic 563a received only a 7.4.

I believe it is a safe inference that my observations about this little
player (S55) are dead on - thus "the fuss".


Two corrections/additions:

1) the Yamaha and Onkyo are universal players.

2) that should be the Pioneer 563a, not Panasonic.

Harry Lavo wrote:
"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:EnsZb.88828$uV3.553144@attbi_s51...
No, it has analog 2ch out, as well as analog 5.1 out, and digital toslink
only.

I bought one of these a while ago, its OK, I don't know what big fuss is
about.


Was it an S55? These are very recent.

It came out in April 2003. Not exactly very reason.

There was a previous series that
looked the same with a KP in front of the number (KP52 and KP82, I believe).
Don't know whether or not they used the same technology.

The fuss is over the extreme transparency versus other low cost (or even
moderate cost) DVD-A and SACD players.

You seem to tbe stating that as a fact, not an opinion.

If your HT setup is not of very high
quality, you may not hear it. In my system, it is pretty startling compared
to the other CD/SACD players I have had in the system (thermselves not
slouches).

In my experience, "startling" differences between CD players are often
due to mismatched levels. Or if one is intentionally designed to be
inaccurate.

chung wrote:
Harry Lavo wrote:
"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:EnsZb.88828$uV3.553144@attbi_s51...
No, it has analog 2ch out, as well as analog 5.1 out, and digital toslink
only.

I bought one of these a while ago, its OK, I don't know what big fuss is
about.


Was it an S55? These are very recent.

It came out in April 2003. Not exactly very reason.


Should be "recent" .

"chung" wrote in message
...
Harry Lavo wrote:
"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:EnsZb.88828$uV3.553144@attbi_s51...
No, it has analog 2ch out, as well as analog 5.1 out, and digital
toslink
only.

I bought one of these a while ago, its OK, I don't know what big fuss
is
about.


Was it an S55? These are very recent.

It came out in April 2003. Not exactly very reason.

There was a previous series that
looked the same with a KP in front of the number (KP52 and KP82, I
believe).
Don't know whether or not they used the same technology.

The fuss is over the extreme transparency versus other low cost (or even
moderate cost) DVD-A and SACD players.

You seem to tbe stating that as a fact, not an opinion.

If your HT setup is not of very high
quality, you may not hear it. In my system, it is pretty startling
compared
to the other CD/SACD players I have had in the system (thermselves not
slouches).

In my experience, "startling" differences between CD players are often
due to mismatched levels. Or if one is intentionally designed to be
inaccurate.


Chung, I have done side by side comparisons with a Toshiba 4700 (top dog two
years ago) and a JVC 600 (top dog as recently as six months ago). Those
two sound close, with the JVC having the edge. The Panasonic is in a
different league. Much more different than the difference between my Thiel
3.5's and my Thiel 2 2's, for example. There is a gross difference in
transparency, the difference say between a third generation 15ips tape and a
studio feed, both of which I have lots of experience with.

You can obviously have your opinion; I know differently.

I continue to be amazed by this little machine. In side by side
comparisons, as noted above, it wiped the other two sonically. In addition
it has upsampling which makes it a wonderful sounding cd player, and its
ergonomics are equally advanced compared to the others, both in DVD-V and
other modes. For example, it has an "audio only" mode that shuts off the
video output so you can watch news streamers silently, for example, while
listening to music. It's designation (admittedly only on-screen) of the
exact format playing is better than the other two. It's speaker setup (and
menu structure in general) are better - for example, a "setup" button
instead of the JVC's "change" button.

The only decision it leaves me is whether or not I should buy the changer
version, since I obviously will be using it for much more music than just
DVD-A. Probably will.

Harry Lavo wrote:
"chung" wrote in message
...
Harry Lavo wrote:
"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:EnsZb.88828$uV3.553144@attbi_s51...
No, it has analog 2ch out, as well as analog 5.1 out, and digital
toslink
only.

I bought one of these a while ago, its OK, I don't know what big fuss
is
about.


Was it an S55? These are very recent.

It came out in April 2003. Not exactly very reason.

There was a previous series that
looked the same with a KP in front of the number (KP52 and KP82, I
believe).
Don't know whether or not they used the same technology.

The fuss is over the extreme transparency versus other low cost (or even
moderate cost) DVD-A and SACD players.

You seem to tbe stating that as a fact, not an opinion.

If your HT setup is not of very high
quality, you may not hear it. In my system, it is pretty startling
compared
to the other CD/SACD players I have had in the system (thermselves not
slouches).

In my experience, "startling" differences between CD players are often
due to mismatched levels. Or if one is intentionally designed to be
inaccurate.


Chung, I have done side by side comparisons with a Toshiba 4700 (top dog two
years ago) and a JVC 600 (top dog as recently as six months ago). Those
two sound close, with the JVC having the edge. The Panasonic is in a
different league. Much more different than the difference between my Thiel
3.5's and my Thiel 2 2's, for example. There is a gross difference in
transparency, the difference say between a third generation 15ips tape and a
studio feed, both of which I have lots of experience with.

You can obviously have your opinion; I know differently.

I have never found two CD players that sound as different as two
different speakers, so I find this very hard to believe.


I continue to be amazed by this little machine. In side by side
comparisons, as noted above, it wiped the other two sonically. In addition
it has upsampling which makes it a wonderful sounding cd player,

Why would upsampling improve the sound?

and its
ergonomics are equally advanced compared to the others, both in DVD-V and
other modes. For example, it has an "audio only" mode that shuts off the
video output so you can watch news streamers silently, for example, while
listening to music. It's designation (admittedly only on-screen) of the
exact format playing is better than the other two. It's speaker setup (and
menu structure in general) are better - for example, a "setup" button
instead of the JVC's "change" button.

The only decision it leaves me is whether or not I should buy the changer
version, since I obviously will be using it for much more music than just
DVD-A. Probably will.


If anyone is interested in the changer version, amazon.com has it on
sale for $120:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/AS...161990-0974235

Note that this player has been out since April 2003.

Wow you can buy this player on etonics for $109.00, but the shipping is
pricey:

http://etronics.resultspage.com/disp...dynamic&Store=

PT
"Harry Lavo" wrote in message
news:688_b.368168$I06.3854820@attbi_s01...
"chung" wrote in message
...
Harry Lavo wrote:
"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:EnsZb.88828$uV3.553144@attbi_s51...
No, it has analog 2ch out, as well as analog 5.1 out, and digital
toslink
only.

I bought one of these a while ago, its OK, I don't know what big fuss
is
about.


Was it an S55? These are very recent.

It came out in April 2003. Not exactly very reason.

There was a previous series that
looked the same with a KP in front of the number (KP52 and KP82, I
believe).
Don't know whether or not they used the same technology.

The fuss is over the extreme transparency versus other low cost (or
even
moderate cost) DVD-A and SACD players.

You seem to tbe stating that as a fact, not an opinion.

If your HT setup is not of very high
quality, you may not hear it. In my system, it is pretty startling
compared
to the other CD/SACD players I have had in the system (thermselves not
slouches).

In my experience, "startling" differences between CD players are often
due to mismatched levels. Or if one is intentionally designed to be
inaccurate.


Chung, I have done side by side comparisons with a Toshiba 4700 (top dog
two
years ago) and a JVC 600 (top dog as recently as six months ago). Those
two sound close, with the JVC having the edge. The Panasonic is in a
different league. Much more different than the difference between my
Thiel
3.5's and my Thiel 2 2's, for example. There is a gross difference in
transparency, the difference say between a third generation 15ips tape and
a
studio feed, both of which I have lots of experience with.

You can obviously have your opinion; I know differently.

I continue to be amazed by this little machine. In side by side
comparisons, as noted above, it wiped the other two sonically. In
addition
it has upsampling which makes it a wonderful sounding cd player, and its
ergonomics are equally advanced compared to the others, both in DVD-V and
other modes. For example, it has an "audio only" mode that shuts off the
video output so you can watch news streamers silently, for example, while
listening to music. It's designation (admittedly only on-screen) of the
exact format playing is better than the other two. It's speaker setup
(and
menu structure in general) are better - for example, a "setup" button
instead of the JVC's "change" button.

The only decision it leaves me is whether or not I should buy the changer
version, since I obviously will be using it for much more music than just
DVD-A. Probably will.

I do have the S55. I put it into my main 2-ch rig the other day (using
revealing Quad ESL-63's) and this little rig does have quite good detail and
musicality. I've always had it in my HT system which isn't the best and
never really used it to play CD's. I haven't even used the DVD-A capability
yet which is probably worth a try. So I suppose some fuss is in order. I am
still one of those old holdouts who listens to LP, so therefore digital is
suspect (but not as suspect as it used to be).

"Harry Lavo" wrote in message
...
"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:EnsZb.88828$uV3.553144@attbi_s51...
No, it has analog 2ch out, as well as analog 5.1 out, and digital
toslink
only.

I bought one of these a while ago, its OK, I don't know what big fuss is
about.


Was it an S55? These are very recent. There was a previous series that
looked the same with a KP in front of the number (KP52 and KP82, I
believe).
Don't know whether or not they used the same technology.

The fuss is over the extreme transparency versus other low cost (or even
moderate cost) DVD-A and SACD players. If your HT setup is not of very
high
quality, you may not hear it. In my system, it is pretty startling
compared
to the other CD/SACD players I have had in the system (thermselves not
slouches).


"Kalman Rubinson" wrote in message
news:nztXb.310636$xy6.1509442@attbi_s02...
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 03:56:54 GMT, "Harry Lavo"
wrote:

My guess is that Panasonic has kept the signal completely digital
through
the DAC and on into a digital line amp on this thing, thereby
eliminating
both the conversion to analog and the need for an op-amp.

No conversion? So this has only digital output?

Kal

Glad you gave it a try, John. Nothing wrong with being an LP lover, though.
I still listen to those black shiny disks a good deal of the time.

If you let us know some of your musical interests, I and some of the others
here will be happy to suggest a DVD-A or two to get you started. As an LP
lover, you'll appreciate the difference from ordinary cd.

Harry

"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:HKw0c.11654$PR3.291476@attbi_s03...
I do have the S55. I put it into my main 2-ch rig the other day (using
revealing Quad ESL-63's) and this little rig does have quite good detail
and
musicality. I've always had it in my HT system which isn't the best and
never really used it to play CD's. I haven't even used the DVD-A
capability
yet which is probably worth a try. So I suppose some fuss is in order. I
am
still one of those old holdouts who listens to LP, so therefore digital is
suspect (but not as suspect as it used to be).

"Harry Lavo" wrote in message
...
"John Hamill" wrote in message
news:EnsZb.88828$uV3.553144@attbi_s51...
No, it has analog 2ch out, as well as analog 5.1 out, and digital
toslink
only.

I bought one of these a while ago, its OK, I don't know what big fuss
is
about.


Was it an S55? These are very recent. There was a previous series that
looked the same with a KP in front of the number (KP52 and KP82, I
believe).
Don't know whether or not they used the same technology.

The fuss is over the extreme transparency versus other low cost (or even
moderate cost) DVD-A and SACD players. If your HT setup is not of very
high
quality, you may not hear it. In my system, it is pretty startling
compared
to the other CD/SACD players I have had in the system (thermselves not
slouches).


"Kalman Rubinson" wrote in message
news:nztXb.310636$xy6.1509442@attbi_s02...
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 03:56:54 GMT, "Harry Lavo"
wrote:

My guess is that Panasonic has kept the signal completely digital
through
the DAC and on into a digital line amp on this thing, thereby
eliminating
both the conversion to analog and the need for an op-amp.

No conversion? So this has only digital output?

Kal