[Diego]

I hope to find some answers here ...

I record mainly classical music. Till now, I used a Sony dat and a Tascam cd
recorder, with a a mackie mixer, a Millenia and a Tascam preamp and a prism
AD 124.
There are two things I'd like to do now:

1) find an interface with a 'digital-in' for my laptop, to be able to record
directly from the Prism;
2) find an affordable multitrack recorder for some opera project.

I've no ideas for the first (usb? firewire?): I just need a digital-in that
makes no change to what comes out from the prism!
For the second question, I'm watching the alesis HD 24, mainly because of
the easy way of moving the audio from the internal HD of the recorder to my
computer.

Has someone experience in working with this machine, and a suggestion for my
first question?

Thanks,

Gigio

[coreybenson]

Diego wrote:
I hope to find some answers here ...
snipped
For the second question, I'm watching the alesis HD 24, mainly because of
the easy way of moving the audio from the internal HD of the recorder to my
computer.

Has someone experience in working with this machine, and a suggestion for my
first question?

I have almost 5 years of experience with the HD24 as the center of our
studio. What do you want to know? It's been a bullet proof, good
sounding, easy to use machine. We love it. Great on location, great in
the studio.

It "feels" like a 2" reel to reel to me, which made it an easy
transition.

Only issue I have is the fact that there isn't a large remote
available, unless you use the original ADAT BRC. I bought one, tried
it, returned it. YMMV. I can do everything I need directly from the
faceplate, which is located to the left and down a bit from my mix
position, so it's ended up being fine. The LRC works for everything
else I need (start, stop, Rew, FF, Rec, etc.).

Drop me a line offline if you have specific questions about the HD24.
You could also check out the Yahoo HD24 User Group.

Corey
http://www.curbsideproductions.com

[Mike Rivers]

Diego wrote:

1) find an interface with a 'digital-in' for my laptop, to be able to record
directly from the Prism;

There aren't a lot of choices for a straightforward 2-channel
digital-in, laptop-friendly interface. Whenever someone asks for this,
about the only answer I can come up with is the Edirol UA-1EX. That
will get you S/PDIF at 24-bit up to 96 kHz sample rate which should be
good enough for you. TASCAM and Alesis have new ones coming out (just
showed at NAMM last weekend) that are in the same ballpark.


For the second question, I'm watching the alesis HD 24, mainly because of
the easy way of moving the audio from the internal HD of the recorder to my
computer.

All reports are that it's a pretty decent machine. If youre going to be
using its analog inputs (assuming you don't have 24 channels of Prism
A/D converters) you probably should spring for the XD model which is
set up for 96 kHz (12 tracks) and has better sounding converters, so
I'm told.

I'm a fan of the Mackie hard disk recorders, but since that line has
been discontinued for a while, you'll have to settle for a used one
(which is rarely a problem - not much can go wrong with them) and the
only way you can work at 96 kHz if that's your preference is to use the
AES/EBU I/O. Those I/O cards are a bit hard to find and hence pretty
expensive, and then you need outboard converters, so anything beyond 48
kHz is an expensive proposition with a Mackie HDR or MDR24/96.

[Richard Crowley]

"coreybenson" wrote ...
I have almost 5 years of experience with the HD24 as the center of our
studio. What do you want to know? It's been a bullet proof, good
sounding, easy to use machine. We love it. Great on location, great in
the studio.

And I have been using my HD24 for around the same
length of time, but mostly for live location recording.
Works great, never a failure.

My only complaint is that mine doesn't like any hard
drive I have tried that is larger than 40GB. OTOH,
40 GB is more than big enough for most anything.

The Fireport interface is invaluable for any kind of
realistic extraction of files into your computer.

It "feels" like a 2" reel to reel to me, which made
it an easy transition.

Well, I can lift my HD24 by myself so it feels a lot
lighter than a 2" reel-to-reel to me. In fact it feels
like about the same weight as two reels of 2" tape,
IIRC. :-)

[Take Vos]

Hello Diego,

I record mainly classical music. Till now, I used a Sony dat and a Tascam cd
recorder, with a a mackie mixer, a Millenia and a Tascam preamp and a prism
AD 124.
There are two things I'd like to do now:

1) find an interface with a 'digital-in' for my laptop, to be able to record
directly from the Prism;
There are lots of solutions out there, most of my customers seem to
like the MOTU http://www.motu.com/ interfaces. These interfaces have
both analogue and digital input and outputs. As my customers are mostly
film mixers they like the MOTU Traveler for its size and the
possibility to power them using DC (4 pronged XLR plug).

I also have a customer that records 48 channels using the two MOTU
24I/O, but that requires a PCI bus that laptops lack. When recording so
many channels (in mono files) you will need an external firewire hard
disk, as an internal SATA disk puts to much load on the system.

I would also recommend using a firewire audio interface, as it will
work fine when recording on a disk on the same firewire bus.

2) find an affordable multitrack recorder for some opera project.
I am not sure what kind of laptop you use, but if it is an Mac, I could
recommend the software that I have developed, "Boom Recorder"
http://www.vosgames.nl/
This software is specifically designed to be used as a field recorder.

Cheers,
Take

[coreybenson]

Richard Crowley wrote:
My only complaint is that mine doesn't like any hard
drive I have tried that is larger than 40GB. OTOH,
40 GB is more than big enough for most anything.

Interesting... I use 120GB's as my standard size, and have one 250GB
that works just fine. What version of the OS are you on? I'm on 1.20,
their most recent.

The Fireport interface is invaluable for any kind of
realistic extraction of files into your computer.

Yeppers! I completely agree.

It "feels" like a 2" reel to reel to me, which made
it an easy transition.

Well, I can lift my HD24 by myself so it feels a lot
lighter than a 2" reel-to-reel to me. In fact it feels
like about the same weight as two reels of 2" tape,
IIRC. :-)

Funny guy! lol

Just to clarify, in case there was any confusion, I mean that the HD24
operates much the same as a tape machine... destructive overdubs, etc.
It's NOT a DAW in a box, although there are some cut/paste functions
(which I've never used).

Corey

[Richard Crowley]

"coreybenson" wrote ...
[ Alesis HD24]
Interesting... I use 120GB's as my standard size, and have one 250GB
that works just fine. What version of the OS are you on? I'm on 1.20,
their most recent.

I'm still on 1.15 mostly because none of the release notes say
anything about "fixing" anything that I find to be a problem.
And I am a firm believer of the theory "don't attempt to fix it
if it ain't broke".

The only references I have seen (here on Usenet and in the
HD24 forum on Yahoo) are that the unit is sensitive to some
brands of drives. My problem with larger drives is that the
HD24 gives up trying to talk to them before they are ready
to talk (upon power-up).

I just keep a collection of older, small drives which I use
with my HD24. In fact, now I have people offering me
their old "too small" drives when they upgrade their PCs,
so I am essentially getting media for free these days! :-)

[coreybenson]

Richard Crowley wrote:
"coreybenson" wrote ...
[ Alesis HD24]
Interesting... I use 120GB's as my standard size, and have one 250GB
that works just fine. What version of the OS are you on? I'm on 1.20,
their most recent.

I'm still on 1.15 mostly because none of the release notes say
anything about "fixing" anything that I find to be a problem.
And I am a firm believer of the theory "don't attempt to fix it
if it ain't broke".

I'm a big believer in that as well... however, something was broke, and
a tech at Alesis suggested the upgrade. It's been a flawless machine
since.

The only references I have seen (here on Usenet and in the
HD24 forum on Yahoo) are that the unit is sensitive to some
brands of drives. My problem with larger drives is that the
HD24 gives up trying to talk to them before they are ready
to talk (upon power-up).

What speed drives are you trying to mount? I've never had this issue...
other than when I dropped a drive. Drive works great in my PC, but
won't mount in the HD24 at all.

I just keep a collection of older, small drives which I use
with my HD24. In fact, now I have people offering me
their old "too small" drives when they upgrade their PCs,
so I am essentially getting media for free these days! :-)

LOL... well, never mind then!

Corey

[vas]

Diego wrote:
I hope to find some answers here ...

I record mainly classical music. Till now, I used a Sony dat and a Tascam cd
recorder, with a a mackie mixer, a Millenia and a Tascam preamp and a prism
AD 124.
There are two things I'd like to do now:

1) find an interface with a 'digital-in' for my laptop, to be able to record
directly from the Prism;
2) find an affordable multitrack recorder for some opera project.

I've no ideas for the first (usb? firewire?): I just need a digital-in that
makes no change to what comes out from the prism!
For the second question, I'm watching the alesis HD 24, mainly because of
the easy way of moving the audio from the internal HD of the recorder to my
computer.

Has someone experience in working with this machine, and a suggestion for my
first question?

Thanks,

Gigio

RME Fireface for firewire, Cardbus Digiface/Mutiface for, well,
Cardbus. Lots more stuff than just SPDIF input - ADAT optical,
AES/EBU, high sampling rate support (if you need that) as well as very
good analog inputs. On the fireface, also some very good preamps.
They are expensive as far as interfaces go ($900 for the cheapest
cardbus solution, up to $1500 for fireface 800), but then you do own a
Prism and a Millennia so you're obviously not hurting too bad. It's
the best (read: most reliable and versatile) you can get in terms of
portable audio on a PC (also up there as far as mac goes). The cool
thing about having more than just 2 channels is being able to do your
multitrack opera stuff direct to the computer as well. Get the
standalone recorder for backup. Stay away from USB whatever you do.

Peace,
--Vas

[Ronald Wiebe]

"coreybenson" wrote in message
ups.com...
Richard Crowley wrote:
"coreybenson" wrote ...
[ Alesis HD24]
Interesting... I use 120GB's as my standard size, and have one 250GB
that works just fine. What version of the OS are you on? I'm on 1.20,
their most recent.

I'm still on 1.15 mostly because none of the release notes say
anything about "fixing" anything that I find to be a problem.
And I am a firm believer of the theory "don't attempt to fix it
if it ain't broke".

I'm a big believer in that as well... however, something was broke, and
a tech at Alesis suggested the upgrade. It's been a flawless machine
since.

The only references I have seen (here on Usenet and in the
HD24 forum on Yahoo) are that the unit is sensitive to some
brands of drives. My problem with larger drives is that the
HD24 gives up trying to talk to them before they are ready
to talk (upon power-up).

What speed drives are you trying to mount? I've never had this issue...
other than when I dropped a drive. Drive works great in my PC, but
won't mount in the HD24 at all.


What size of drive are you using Cory? Have you had success with something
like a 200GB drive?

[Edwin Hurwitz]

In article ,
"Richard Crowley" wrote:

"coreybenson" wrote ...
[ Alesis HD24]
Interesting... I use 120GB's as my standard size, and have one 250GB
that works just fine. What version of the OS are you on? I'm on 1.20,
their most recent.

I'm still on 1.15 mostly because none of the release notes say
anything about "fixing" anything that I find to be a problem.
And I am a firm believer of the theory "don't attempt to fix it
if it ain't broke".

The only references I have seen (here on Usenet and in the
HD24 forum on Yahoo) are that the unit is sensitive to some
brands of drives. My problem with larger drives is that the
HD24 gives up trying to talk to them before they are ready
to talk (upon power-up).

I just keep a collection of older, small drives which I use
with my HD24. In fact, now I have people offering me
their old "too small" drives when they upgrade their PCs,
so I am essentially getting media for free these days! :-)

I haven't had any issues with any drives in my HD24 and my current
record drive is a 400GB. I can get a whole tour on one disc! I know I
have all my eggs in one basket, but it sure makes life easy!

Edwin

[coreybenson]

What size of drive are you using Cory? Have you had success with something
like a 200GB drive?

Everything from 20gb drives up to a couple of 250gb drives. I have so
much space now I haven't even considered getting anything bigger.

120gb seems to be about right for us. I can fit a MASSIVE amount of
music on one 120gb drive.

Corey

[RD Jones]

Diego wrote:

For the second question, I'm watching the alesis HD 24, mainly because of
the easy way of moving the audio from the internal HD of the recorder to my
computer.

Mike Rivers wrote:

All reports are that it's a pretty decent machine. If youre going to be
using its analog inputs (assuming you don't have 24 channels of Prism
A/D converters) you probably should spring for the XD model which is
set up for 96 kHz (12 tracks) and has better sounding converters, so
I'm told.

Just to clarify, it's the "XR" model with the better converters
(not "XD") and if you find a deal on a used standard unit it's
a fairly simple upgrade to install the XR converter kit.

As far as tranfers to PC are concerned you will want the
Fireport interface for mounting the drive directly to the PC
via firewire, it's way faster than the built-in 10meg ethernet
port.

rd

[Lorin David Schultz]

Mike Rivers wrote:

There aren't a lot of choices for a straightforward 2-channel
digital-in, laptop-friendly interface. Whenever someone asks for
this, about the only answer I can come up with is the Edirol
UA-1EX. That will get you S/PDIF at 24-bit up to 96 kHz sample rate


Both the Edirol and M-Audio boxes have only optical S/PDIF. I seem to
live in a world full of copper, versus one full of glowy plastic. The
only other device I ever use with an optical connector is an old Digi001
sitting in an edit suite somewhere. Is there really demand for devices
with two-channel optical?

I wish someone made a CardBus or USB unit with nothing but electrical
digital in and out.

--
"It CAN'T be too loud... some of the red lights aren't even on yet!"
- Lorin David Schultz
in the control room
making even bad news sound good

(Remove spamblock to reply)

[Mike Rivers]

Lorin David Schultz wrote:

Both the Edirol and M-Audio boxes have only optical S/PDIF.

Bummer, dood. You'll have to look for a used one. The UA-30 has analog,
coax, and optical digital I/O. The UA-1D is the one you want, but I
guess it's been discontinued.

http://www.roland.com/products/en/UA-1D/index.html

Act fast and you might get this one for a couple of bucks:
http://tinyurl.com/z5ema
and it even includes an optical cable which doesn't fit this interface.
I see it's "USA Only" but you might write to him and ask if he'll sell
it to you, either for a bid or an offer after the auction ends if
nobydy buys it.

I seem to
live in a world full of copper, versus one full of glowy plastic. The
only other device I ever use with an optical connector is an old Digi001
sitting in an edit suite somewhere. Is there really demand for devices
with two-channel optical?

Most CD players and consumer receivers with digital output use optical
interface. I suspect this may be the intended application of the
optical-USB devices. Maybe they did that because too many people were
trying to connect analog to digital RCA jacks and complained that it
didn't work.

I wish someone made a CardBus or USB unit with nothing but electrical
digital in and out.

I guess it's just not a common enough request. You might see what you
can get a Digigram VX Pocket for. It's CardBus, good analog I/O and
coax digital I/O, as well as SMPTE time code but I can't remember if
it's input or output. I've never used it. That's still a current
product so you can buy a new one, but I'll bet they're about half price
second-hand. There aren't any current auctions for the VX, but one
ended a few days ago with a $125 buy-it-now. That's a decent deal.

[Lorin David Schultz]

Mike Rivers wrote:

Act fast and you might get this one for a couple of bucks:
http://tinyurl.com/z5ema

Thanks for the tip!

I originally excluded the UA-1D from consideration because it won't pass
a 24-bit word, and the bulk of the source material I get is 48/24. I'm
not concerned about 16 bits being insufficient or any of that kind of
silly hand-wringing specphobia, but I felt it might be a nuisance to
deal with either truncation or having to dither down everything destined
for its output.



I guess it's just not a common enough request. You might see what
you can get a Digigram VX Pocket for. It's CardBus, good analog I/O
and coax digital I/O, as well as SMPTE time code but I can't
remember if it's input or output.

Will Miho actually offered me one for a decent price. I didn't bite for
two reasons. One, the decent price was still quite a bit more than I
want to pay for what, in my application, would amount to nothing more
than a simple digi i/o.

Second, the octopus seems both unweildy and fragile. In my run and gun
world full of "now now NOW!!!" deadlines, I'm afraid I'll break it. As
I've mentioned before, I'm just slightly less clumsy than a hippo on a
tricycle.

I believe you're right that what I'm after isn't something enough other
people want. Of the options that do exist, it seems I'm just too damn
picky. I'm okay with that though. I've learned from several past
purchases that I'm often not any happier with the "wrong" device than I
am with nothing at all, and going without is usually cheaper (except
when a paying gig is on the line, in which case I learn to "make do" in
a hurry!).

--
"It CAN'T be too loud... some of the red lights aren't even on yet!"
- Lorin David Schultz
in the control room
making even bad news sound good

(Remove spamblock to reply)

[Mike Rivers]

Lorin David Schultz wrote:
Digigram VX Pocket

the octopus seems both unweildy and fragile. In my run and gun
world full of "now now NOW!!!" deadlines, I'm afraid I'll break it.

I was afraid I'd break mine too, but I've had it for over six years
now. It really does look fragile though, and you do need to take some
care. There's a little doodad molded on to the cable that has a pair of
screws that you can use to secure it to a DB-9 connector, but then
that's becoming a thing of the past on laptop computers, except maybe
for an external monitor (OK, that's not 9 pin but it's the same width).
That will take the strain off the flimsy connector on the card edge so
at least you won't yank it out if you trip over a cable. But there's
still a loop that you can snag something on.

A USB or Firewire connector and an RCA jack are really more robust. I'm
surprised at how much I don't worry about truncation now, though. You
should probably give it a try. If it's a rush job as many of your
projects are, you can't also be a perfectionist, and a cheapskate. g

How about an optical S/PDIF interface and an M-Audio CO2 optical-coax
converter? That will pass 24-bit up to 96 kHz. It's an extra lump and
an extra piece of fiber, and I never really like solutions like that,
but it might be a closer match to your budget.

I've learned from several past
purchases that I'm often not any happier with the "wrong" device than I
am with nothing at all

That's why I never buy anything that I can't return, unless I'm very
sure I really can use it, or it's so cheap that I can afford to put it
on the shelf and not use it.

How about

[Ray Thomas]

The Digigram card sounds like a good one...maybe the Echo Indigo IO would be
more up to date, a little more money....but no digital ins ! Here is a
review of the Digigram card:
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/feb0...les/digivx.htm

Ray
-----------------------------------
"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
oups.com...

Lorin David Schultz wrote:

Both the Edirol and M-Audio boxes have only optical S/PDIF.

Bummer, dood. You'll have to look for a used one. The UA-30 has analog,
coax, and optical digital I/O. The UA-1D is the one you want, but I
guess it's been discontinued.

http://www.roland.com/products/en/UA-1D/index.html

Act fast and you might get this one for a couple of bucks:
http://tinyurl.com/z5ema
and it even includes an optical cable which doesn't fit this interface.
I see it's "USA Only" but you might write to him and ask if he'll sell
it to you, either for a bid or an offer after the auction ends if
nobydy buys it.

I seem to
live in a world full of copper, versus one full of glowy plastic. The
only other device I ever use with an optical connector is an old Digi001
sitting in an edit suite somewhere. Is there really demand for devices
with two-channel optical?

Most CD players and consumer receivers with digital output use optical
interface. I suspect this may be the intended application of the
optical-USB devices. Maybe they did that because too many people were
trying to connect analog to digital RCA jacks and complained that it
didn't work.

I wish someone made a CardBus or USB unit with nothing but electrical
digital in and out.

I guess it's just not a common enough request. You might see what you
can get a Digigram VX Pocket for. It's CardBus, good analog I/O and
coax digital I/O, as well as SMPTE time code but I can't remember if
it's input or output. I've never used it. That's still a current
product so you can buy a new one, but I'll bet they're about half price
second-hand. There aren't any current auctions for the VX, but one
ended a few days ago with a $125 buy-it-now. That's a decent deal.