I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

To that end, I have started to configure my newsreader with a killfile list
for this group, so I won't have to see those peoples' postings any more.
I've never had to do that before. It's a bit of a challenge and judgement
call. It seems unavoidable that I will have to kill postings from a few
people who do sometimes have worthwhile contributions. Sad, but so be it.

Here's my list so far:

Andre Jute


George M. Middius cmndr underscore george at comcast dot net
Clyde Slick








il








Does anyone else have recommendations for a kill list for this group?

/kenw

wrote:

I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

Well my friend, please ask whatever queries you may have about tube audio
that you wish to.
The more questions you ask, the more you might learn, because the more replies
and interchanges may occur.

But 95% of what I know came from my self taught behaviour before I went on line

in 2000.
I was only 53 then, and before then I spent countless hours in my shed at night
till
3am soldering up gear and measuring it, listening to it, and thus teaching
myself how it worked,
and finding some understanding about what was written in the shelf of old books
I had
found by trapsing around old book stores, sales, and reading up in tech college
and university
libraries.
I recall once spending 3 days at a tech college photocopying 1,000 pages of
Tremain's 1963 book,
Audio Encyclpedia.
At 10C per page, it wasn't cheap, but I knew I had to have a copy of relevant
chapters.

So please expect far more of yourself than what might be expected from us.
We won't help you unless you show you are working hard to understand on your
own.
Say to yourself to learn and learn thoroughly each day, and you will, if you
let the
many many questions occur in your mind about what you observe.
The answers come slowly, but eventually you begin to take into account
enough design criteria to build some gear. Never rest on your laurels
because what you think is a fine right now may be bettered in 3 days, or years.



The signal to noise ratio of just about any group is always possibly
distracting,
but the noise always exists in all groups because that's the nature of
humanity,
ie, ppl chatter about all sorts when there isn't enough technical stuff they
can bite into, and when there is, sometimes a lot of spitting out of what is
bitten into occurs.
r.a.t has some of the very best and deepest discussions about audio that you
will ever read.
but its also un-moderated, so the loudest noise is also found here.
And the Google archives contain huge amounts of info.
Try searching under say 'negative feedback triodes amplifiers'
Huge amounts of info comes up.

But you have to decide what makes real sense to you, and for that to occur,
its out to your shed with the hot soldering iron.

Learn to not be so easily offended.

I don't use any kill files at all.

I give a bit of curry back to those
who have a go, but I do try to not hold grudges forever,
and I try to forgive the imperfections because I know I sure ain't perfect.

Everyone's **** stinks a bit.




To that end, I have started to configure my newsreader with a killfile list
for this group, so I won't have to see those peoples' postings any more.
I've never had to do that before. It's a bit of a challenge and judgement
call. It seems unavoidable that I will have to kill postings from a few
people who do sometimes have worthwhile contributions. Sad, but so be it.

Feel free to exercise your choice, but perhaps you may find yourself the target

of those you have kill filed, since stating who you don't like so openly
does not bring any diplomatic reward.

I believe I probably leave some worry in some ppls minds because
I choose to treat ppl the way i do, and some cannot understand
why I may be tolerant of some you have listed below, while these very ppl
cause such acrimony amoung themselves.
But nobody can ever be everyone's buddy, but I just don't have time for
many threads where triodes are simply never mentioned.
The convolutions of personal attacks and counter attacks don't
interest me greatly; my time is limited....

I am usually always around if triodes are mentioned.

If I were you, I'd be rather quiet about who you kilfile.

I find I can operate about tubes even if there are only 5 posts a day about
audio, with
55 about OT or posturing, or scoring points personally.

Please try to have a sense of humour about all this Internet Stuff That Goez
On.



Anyway, what projects are you up to at present?

Patrick Turner.




Here's my list so far:

Andre Jute


George M. Middius cmndr underscore george at comcast dot net
Clyde Slick








il








Does anyone else have recommendations for a kill list for this group?

/kenw

wrote in message
...
I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

To that end, I have started to configure my newsreader with a killfile
list
for this group, so I won't have to see those peoples' postings any more.
I've never had to do that before. It's a bit of a challenge and judgement
call. It seems unavoidable that I will have to kill postings from a few
people who do sometimes have worthwhile contributions. Sad, but so be it.

Here's my list so far:

Andre Jute


You may not like his style, but if you really need to know the truth about
something audio related, Arny is an excellent person ask.



Killfile me if you wish, but I'm not going to be hanging around a NG
dedicated to inferior sounding audio, especially since people like Mr. Jute
have no real interest in anything more than self-aggrandizement and lies.

George M. Middius cmndr underscore george at comcast dot net
Clyde Slick








il

Again if you killfile Stewart you will lose a source of the most accurate
information on audio there is on usenet.







This is one Jute's sockpuppetts.



Does anyone else have recommendations for a kill list for this group?

/kenw

said:

Here's my list so far:



Why is Patrick on your list?
If you want to learn a little something about tubes, you should
definitely read his on topic posts.

--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

Sander deWaal wrote:

said:

Here's my list so far:



Why is Patrick on your list?
If you want to learn a little something about tubes, you should
definitely read his on topic posts.

Because he contributed in an abusive thread. I may have been too hasty; as
I say, it's tricky to strike the right balance. Thanks for the feedback;
I'll remove it.

/kenw
Ken Wallewein
K&M Systems Integration
Phone (403)274-7848
Fax (403)275-4535

www.kmsi.net

wrote:

I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

To that end, I have started to configure my newsreader with a killfile list
for this group, so I won't have to see those peoples' postings any more.
I've never had to do that before. It's a bit of a challenge and judgement
call. It seems unavoidable that I will have to kill postings from a few
people who do sometimes have worthwhile contributions. Sad, but so be it.

Here's my list so far:

Seems like you won't be seeing many posts then !

Graham

"marko" said:

Pat Turner (not part of the problem) gave some good advice. Get some old
books and parts and go for the most precious part of it all: experience.


This is the very essence of tube craft, and my major reason for
stating that tube audio should be restricted to DIY-ers only.

Plenty of them around though!

--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

Here's my list so far:



LOL !!!!

--
"Nobody seemes to have actaully read what i wrote.
But what's new around here?"

Dave Weil, Sun, 05 Oct 2003 00:57:15

"Sander deWaal" wrote in message
...
: "marko" said:
:
: Pat Turner (not part of the problem) gave some good advice. Get some old
: books and parts and go for the most precious part of it all: experience.
:
:
: This is the very essence of tube craft, and my major reason for
: stating that tube audio should be restricted to DIY-ers only.

and i think dutch 63/37 euphonic solder should be restricted:
local market only!

especially in view of the whitewidow resin core,
you will note :-)

Rudy
:
: Plenty of them around though!
:
: --
:
: "Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
: - Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

I'll reply here on top. I stopped posting on this NG years ago due to this
ever-increasing plague. This is not the only NG where it happens.

Many years ago this NG was "recreation." Isn't that what "rec." stands for?
Long threads about much more simple issues like scrapping consoles for
parts.

Now it has become a war for the self-proclaimed erudite: king of the tube
mountain. This serves the recreational purposes of a few, but many can't
stomach the
insults and self-centered power plays.

Yes, you may get some useful replies, but there is the great possibility
that you will be a target for abuse. There is a panel of self-appointed
judges here that dole out punishment based solely on their delusions of
power and accomplishment.

This is not the NASA annex. Tube amps are cool and complicated to
beginners, but no great technological purposed is served by bashing the
inexperienced.

This is a very large world and once a few pointyheads find each other on a
NG the delusions flow like a river of fecal sludge.

Lighten up dudes. If you want to go into combat get on the sci.relativity
NG. You'll get a big dose of what you are full of: self-serving, sadistic,
pedantic, and most of all pointless bashing and bickering. It is also a
good example of why physics will never get anywhere with gravity. These
prime specimens of academia are looking for packages of this and that. None
of them have an inkling of what Einstein was trying to impart to the world:
we cannot trust our perspective of the universe because we don't know what
relative state we are in. Einstein gave a relationship that few can really
understand (I do not imply that I understand it to any useful degree, but I
can appreciate it). The relationship must be understood before the quest
for real understanding can be successfully undertaken.

Pat Turner (not part of the problem) gave some good advice. Get some old
books and parts and go for the most precious part of it all: experience.

You can usually find what you need from tutorials on the web.

I remember a few years ago I posted on the classical music NG. I used the
word "irregardless." I was thoroughly chewed out by some editor who
contended that it was not really a word and a panel of pointyheads
had condemned this alleged double-negative as useable by the
ignorant and uneducated only.

I opened the Webster's and guess what. It is a valid word. It is a hybrid
of
irrespective and regardless.

Pointyheads are usually full of crap, but they don't care. They are waging
war for personal fulfillment.

One of the primitive instincts of the human animal is territorialism. This
is what is being practiced here.

A true idiot thinks that confounding the words of another is proof that they
are wrong. No, it only means that the idiot doesn't have the
self-discipline to stop and understand (assuming that there is something to
understand).

For now, I will remain in orbit with shields up.

If you can't stand the smell of Klingons, warp outta there.

Lowering shields

Firing photon torpedoes.

Raising shields

Mark




wrote in message
...
I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

To that end, I have started to configure my newsreader with a killfile
list
for this group, so I won't have to see those peoples' postings any more.
I've never had to do that before. It's a bit of a challenge and judgement
call. It seems unavoidable that I will have to kill postings from a few
people who do sometimes have worthwhile contributions. Sad, but so be it.

Here's my list so far:

Andre Jute


George M. Middius cmndr underscore george at comcast dot net
Clyde Slick








il








Does anyone else have recommendations for a kill list for this group?

/kenw

You probably should add me. Then all you have left is yourself. If you then
add yourself ... Maybe we can start all over again.

west'

wrote in message
...
I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

To that end, I have started to configure my newsreader with a killfile
list
for this group, so I won't have to see those peoples' postings any more.
I've never had to do that before. It's a bit of a challenge and judgement
call. It seems unavoidable that I will have to kill postings from a few
people who do sometimes have worthwhile contributions. Sad, but so be it.

Here's my list so far:

Andre Jute


George M. Middius cmndr underscore george at comcast dot net
Clyde Slick








il








Does anyone else have recommendations for a kill list for this group?

/kenw

I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology.



** That was your first dumb mistake.

Usenet groups are NOT educational institutions.

Although, participating in one can certainly provided one with an
"education".

Spend enough time and you may wind up with a honorary PhD in mob psychology
and clinical insanity.





......... Phil

Phil Allison wrote:


I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology.



** That was your first dumb mistake.

Usenet groups are NOT educational institutions.

Although, participating in one can certainly provided one with an
"education".

Spend enough time and you may wind up with a honorary PhD in mob psychology

LOL. Hey, Allison, get off my ****ing patch! I do mob psychology here.

and clinical insanity.

Now that Krueger seems intent on joining us, you will have plenty to
study on your own patch.

........ Phil

Andre Jute
Share and share alike

Welcome to the usenet, Ken. I wish you luck with storming into
conferences and telling the established contributors how to behave but
I shan't be congratulating your mother on your manners. Will you be
contributing something except whining and posturing?

Andre Jute
Visit Jute on Amps at http://members.lycos.co.uk/fiultra/
"an unbelievably comprehensive web site" -- Hi-Fi News & Record Review


wrote:
I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

To that end, I have started to configure my newsreader with a killfile list
for this group, so I won't have to see those peoples' postings any more.
I've never had to do that before. It's a bit of a challenge and judgement
call. It seems unavoidable that I will have to kill postings from a few
people who do sometimes have worthwhile contributions. Sad, but so be it.

Here's my list so far:

Andre Jute


George M. Middius cmndr underscore george at comcast dot net
Clyde Slick








il








Does anyone else have recommendations for a kill list for this group?

/kenw

wrote in message
...
Sander deWaal wrote:

said:

Here's my list so far:



Why is Patrick on your list?
If you want to learn a little something about tubes, you should
definitely read his on topic posts.

Because he contributed in an abusive thread. I may have been too hasty;
as
I say, it's tricky to strike the right balance. Thanks for the feedback;
I'll remove it.

/kenw
Ken Wallewein
K&M Systems Integration
Phone (403)274-7848
Fax (403)275-4535

www.kmsi.net


I called the above number and the phone was answered by Alvin Halfpenny.
When I asked where the other half went, the guy started crying like a child.
They seem to a have a real concentration of masculinity under the same roof.

Cheers,

Margaret

"Margaret von B."


Ken Wallewein
K&M Systems Integration
Phone (403)274-7848
Fax (403)275-4535

www.kmsi.net


I called the above number and the phone was answered by Alvin Halfpenny.
When I asked where the other half went, the guy started crying like a
child. They seem to a have a real concentration of masculinity under the
same roof.




** The Canadian hyena is called " Alvin Halpenny " :

http://www.kmsi.net/contacts.htm





.......... Phil

Andre Jute wrote:

Phil Allison wrote:


I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology.



** That was your first dumb mistake.

Usenet groups are NOT educational institutions.

Although, participating in one can certainly provided one with an
"education".

Spend enough time and you may wind up with a honorary PhD in mob psychology

LOL. Hey, Allison, get off my ****ing patch! I do mob psychology here.

The *only* thing you are actually supposedly qualified to do here in fact !


and clinical insanity.

Now that Krueger seems intent on joining us, you will have plenty to
study on your own patch.

Pfftt.

Phil's well aquainted with Arny already from the pro-audio groups. You will be
disappointed I fear.


Graham

Ruud Broens wrote:

"Sander deWaal" wrote in message
...
: "marko" said:
:
: Pat Turner (not part of the problem) gave some good advice. Get some old
: books and parts and go for the most precious part of it all: experience.
:
:
: This is the very essence of tube craft, and my major reason for
: stating that tube audio should be restricted to DIY-ers only.

and i think dutch 63/37 euphonic solder should be restricted:
local market only!

What are you going to do when the RoHS legislation comes into force ( July 2006
). No more lead for you my friend !

Graham

I like all the flame wars. But then, again, I'm a masochist.

wrote:

Sander deWaal wrote:

said:

Here's my list so far:



Why is Patrick on your list?
If you want to learn a little something about tubes, you should
definitely read his on topic posts.

Because he contributed in an abusive thread. I may have been too hasty; as
I say, it's tricky to strike the right balance. Thanks for the feedback;
I'll remove it.

I don't mind too much if I am on someone's kilfile list.

I *do* sometimes take part in what are flame or abuse threads.

I find I just cannot please all the people all the time;
many make no effort at pleasing me though, and are lousy at persuading me
towards
their idea, or are so one eyed, easily offended and stubborn that I don't care
if they have
kill filed me 50 times.

Patrick Turner.





/kenw
Ken Wallewein
K&M Systems Integration
Phone (403)274-7848
Fax (403)275-4535

www.kmsi.net

Sander deWaal wrote:

"marko" said:

Pat Turner (not part of the problem) gave some good advice. Get some old
books and parts and go for the most precious part of it all: experience.

This is the very essence of tube craft, and my major reason for
stating that tube audio should be restricted to DIY-ers only.

Why should it be restricted to DIYers?

I am a DIYer, but I sell my product.

Commercial operators should be welcomable,
because someone who can sell what he makes could have some very
valid and practical useful advice to share.
But as we saw in the flame wars in the late nineties things get ugly
when people want to dominate the group and use the group to sell product,
and be less than honest about the gear they sell, or about what other ppl may
sell.


Plenty of them around though!

Yeah, and that's OK.

Patrick Turner.



--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

"Billy Boy (78's Rule!)" wrote:

I like all the flame wars. But then, again, I'm a masochist.

Uh ?

I wasn't flaming him.

I wanted to know if he was aware of the RoHS legislation.

Graham

On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 16:26:07 -0800, "marko" wrote:

I'll reply here on top. I stopped posting on this NG years ago due to this
ever-increasing plague. This is not the only NG where it happens.

Many years ago this NG was "recreation." Isn't that what "rec." stands for?
Long threads about much more simple issues like scrapping consoles for
parts.

Now it has become a war for the self-proclaimed erudite: king of the tube
mountain. This serves the recreational purposes of a few, but many can't
stomach the
insults and self-centered power plays.

Yes, you may get some useful replies, but there is the great possibility
that you will be a target for abuse. There is a panel of self-appointed
judges here that dole out punishment based solely on their delusions of
power and accomplishment.

This is not the NASA annex. Tube amps are cool and complicated to
beginners, but no great technological purposed is served by bashing the
inexperienced.

Actually, they're hot and simple....... :-)

That's why people like them - a decent-sounding tube amp can be put
together by anyone with basic soldering skills. It helps to be
paranoid around kilovolt power rails, of course.........

And once it's done, it looks like really serious hi-fi, even if it
actually sounds like any other decent amp - presuming you did it right
and avoided the SET route.
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 02:04:27 +0000, Pooh Bear
wrote:


Ruud Broens wrote:

"Sander deWaal" wrote in message
...
: "marko" said:
:
: Pat Turner (not part of the problem) gave some good advice. Get some old
: books and parts and go for the most precious part of it all: experience.
:
:
: This is the very essence of tube craft, and my major reason for
: stating that tube audio should be restricted to DIY-ers only.

and i think dutch 63/37 euphonic solder should be restricted:
local market only!

What are you going to do when the RoHS legislation comes into force ( July 2006
). No more lead for you my friend !

I have about 3 kilos of LMP 'eutectic' tin/lead/silver solder in my
parts bin - that should see me out! :-)
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

On 16 Dec 2005 16:50:31 -0800, "Andre Jute" wrote:


Phil Allison wrote:


I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology.



** That was your first dumb mistake.

Usenet groups are NOT educational institutions.

Although, participating in one can certainly provided one with an
"education".

Spend enough time and you may wind up with a honorary PhD in mob psychology

LOL. Hey, Allison, get off my ****ing patch! I do mob psychology here.

What, you mean in the sense that you and your sockpuppets *are* an
insane mob?

--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

kenw wrote:

I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish
personal
attacks.

kenw smells like poo.

Does anyone else have recommendations for a kill list for this
group?

I advise you remove Turner from your list. He is the main provider
of what your dim wit most desires.

Please add me to your list.

cheers, Ian

Pooh Bear said:

What are you going to do when the RoHS legislation comes into force ( July 2006
). No more lead for you my friend !


Enough of that in stock (about 10 kilos).

--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

Patrick Turner said:

This is the very essence of tube craft, and my major reason for
stating that tube audio should be restricted to DIY-ers only.

Why should it be restricted to DIYers?


Because some knowledge and caution is needed to fully employ the
hobby, not to mention persistence.
Buying a tube amp is something I'd never consider, were I a technical
clueless person (cue Arny saying: "Thanks for admitting deWaal you are
a technically clueless person"). :-)


I am a DIYer, but I sell my product.


No problem with that.

I'm a hobbyist, and the occasional tune amp has left the premises here
as well.

But they all went to people who appreciate tubes, and who are aware of
what possible risks and costs tube gear may bring.

--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

Sander deWaal wrote:

Patrick Turner said:

I didn't say the sentence immediately below...

This is the very essence of tube craft, and my major reason for
stating that tube audio should be restricted to DIY-ers only.

But I did ask ....

Why should it be restricted to DIYers?

Because some knowledge and caution is needed to fully employ the
hobby, not to mention persistence.

Commercial producers of amplifiers have to know, be cautious,
and persist.


Buying a tube amp is something I'd never consider, were I a technical
clueless person (cue Arny saying: "Thanks for admitting deWaal you are
a technically clueless person"). :-)

I only ever bought a 30 watt/channel am/fm receiver once, since
I had no time to build my own amps; I was
building my house, and married, and had a busy job.



I am a DIYer, but I sell my product.

No problem with that.

I'm a hobbyist, and the occasional tune amp has left the premises here
as well.

I like those tune amps, I must make more of them. :-)



But they all went to people who appreciate tubes, and who are aware of
what possible risks and costs tube gear may bring.

Ppl with a good grip of reality know everything needs care and cautions
about use, repairs, and that nothing is forever.

Patrick Turner.



--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

"Pooh Bear" wrote in message
...
:
:
: Ruud Broens wrote:
:
: "Sander deWaal" wrote in message
: ...
: : "marko" said:
: :
: : Pat Turner (not part of the problem) gave some good advice. Get some old
: : books and parts and go for the most precious part of it all: experience.
: :
: :
: : This is the very essence of tube craft, and my major reason for
: : stating that tube audio should be restricted to DIY-ers only.
:
: and i think dutch 63/37 euphonic solder should be restricted:
: local market only!
:
: What are you going to do when the RoHS legislation comes into force ( July 2006
: ). No more lead for you my friend !
:
: Graham
:
darn, time flies when you're havin' fun.
hmm, you're right, what to do with all that heavy stuff ?
maybe create _solder art_, that will make it through all sorts of
regulations :-)
cheers,
Rudy

"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
...
: On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 02:04:27 +0000, Pooh Bear
: wrote:
:
:
: Ruud Broens wrote:
:
: "Sander deWaal" wrote in message
: ...
: : "marko" said:
: :
: : Pat Turner (not part of the problem) gave some good advice. Get some
old
: : books and parts and go for the most precious part of it all: experience.
: :
: :
: : This is the very essence of tube craft, and my major reason for
: : stating that tube audio should be restricted to DIY-ers only.
:
: and i think dutch 63/37 euphonic solder should be restricted:
: local market only!
:
: What are you going to do when the RoHS legislation comes into force ( July
2006
: ). No more lead for you my friend !
:
: I have about 3 kilos of LMP 'eutectic' tin/lead/silver solder in my
: parts bin - that should see me out! :-)
: --

hey, that's like tube thinking, getting enough of the material you like
to last a lifetime it's not rubbing off onto you, now, Stew ? ;-)
R.
:
: Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

Patrick Turner said:

I'm a hobbyist, and the occasional tune amp has left the premises here
as well.

I like those tune amps, I must make more of them. :-)


Typo, should have been tuve amp of course.

--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

Ruud Broens wrote:

"Pooh Bear" wrote in message
...
:
:
: Ruud Broens wrote:
:
: "Sander deWaal" wrote in message
:


: What are you going to do when the RoHS legislation comes into force ( July 2006
: ). No more lead for you my friend !
:
: Graham
:
darn, time flies when you're havin' fun.
hmm, you're right, what to do with all that heavy stuff ?
maybe create _solder art_, that will make it through all sorts of
regulations :-)
cheers,
Rudy

Unless they ban the sales of ordinary 5050 cored solder
it will be around for awhile, and cause little troubles to the makers
tube amps in very low number production runs.

Patrick Turner.

Sander deWaal wrote:

Patrick Turner said:

I'm a hobbyist, and the occasional tune amp has left the premises here
as well.

I like those tune amps, I must make more of them. :-)

Typo, should have been tuve amp of course.

I am working on some prototype class HMM tuve amps.

The output impudence is rather high, and Natalie Fether-Bottom
has been consulted to lower it.

Patrick Turner.



--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

wrote:
I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

Why are you posting your killfile then? Seems to me like a personal
attack against everyone on your list.

That said, please add me to your list. I don't criticise people openly,
at least not as much as some people here, but I can't stand it when
people post their filter list. I've heard it called "vanity
killfiling." Seems like an apt description.

You don't need to type in such a long list, Kennie. Put the names of
the useful people who start popular, productive threads on your list
(Patrick and me and less than a handful of others) and soon you will
receive no messages at all. -- Andre Jute

wrote:
I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

To that end, I have started to configure my newsreader with a killfile list
for this group, so I won't have to see those peoples' postings any more.
I've never had to do that before. It's a bit of a challenge and judgement
call. It seems unavoidable that I will have to kill postings from a few
people who do sometimes have worthwhile contributions. Sad, but so be it.

Here's my list so far:

Andre Jute


George M. Middius cmndr underscore george at comcast dot net
Clyde Slick








il








Does anyone else have recommendations for a kill list for this group?

/kenw

"Karl" wrote:

wrote:
I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

Why are you posting your killfile then? Seems to me like a personal
attack against everyone on your list.

That said, please add me to your list. I don't criticise people openly,
at least not as much as some people here, but I can't stand it when
people post their filter list. I've heard it called "vanity
killfiling." Seems like an apt description.

I hadn't heard that term, but I think I understand it. I apologise if I
offended you; that wasn't my intent. My posting of a kill list wasn't
intended as an attack on anyone. Only a way for some of us to cooperate in
improving our perception of the group's signal to noise ratio.

Isn't that a reasonable thing to do? Surely the people who post abusive
messages wouldn't be offended if some bystanders choose not to listen. I
really do want to stop receiving such postings, I'm sure others do as well,
and it seemed the most constructive way to proceed. If you have a more
practical suggestion, I would welcome hearing it.

/kenw

wrote:
"Karl" wrote:
wrote:
I read this group to learn about tube amps and audio technology. I very
must dislike reading, and having my time wasted by, childish personal
attacks.

Why are you posting your killfile then? Seems to me like a personal
attack against everyone on your list.

That said, please add me to your list. I don't criticise people openly,
at least not as much as some people here, but I can't stand it when
people post their filter list. I've heard it called "vanity
killfiling." Seems like an apt description.

I hadn't heard that term, but I think I understand it. I apologise if I
offended you; that wasn't my intent. My posting of a kill list wasn't
intended as an attack on anyone. Only a way for some of us to cooperate in
improving our perception of the group's signal to noise ratio.

After reading my response I realise it was a bit reactionary, and as
much as I hate this buzzword I think I should have been "proactive." I
apologise for not posting something more useful.

Isn't that a reasonable thing to do? Surely the people who post abusive
messages wouldn't be offended if some bystanders choose not to listen. I
really do want to stop receiving such postings, I'm sure others do as well,
and it seemed the most constructive way to proceed. If you have a more
practical suggestion, I would welcome hearing it.

Many of the people on your list are the best techs on this group. After
a while I've been able to discern whom I trust and whom I do not. I
have also detected a rhythm to the flame wars and an ability to detect
when an otherwise good discussion starts to degenerate into madness and
hysteria.

The first few posts by virtually anyone are usually productive.
Sometimes the productive exchange lasts far longer. I bookmark those on
my browser (I'm still reading and posting mainly through Google Groups)
under the heading "tech threads." You'll get to the point where you can
see a list of who's arguing back and forth and skip long worthless
exchanges.

I avoid any thread that has anybody's name in the title. These are
usually started by Andre Jute, but lately Jon Yaeger has picked up the
habit. Phil Allison has also done this a lot. These threads are a
worthless rehashing of past flame wars. You won't even learn what
started most of them, as many are picayune dissections of semantics.
They also contain a lot of quoted material, which suggests the OP
dicided something in another flame thread turned in his direction and
he wants to brag about it to everybody that is ignoring the original
thread. This kind of attention seeking post is reason enough to KF the
OP.

There are two strategies I use, since Google Groups doesn't have
filters (or spellcheck). I have been experimenting with a free
newsreader and a free newsservice, but I don't like the format and I
can't KF people who are continually employing sockpuppets (like Marc
Mulay of arf.genius.amps). Thunderbird needs to be able to filter by
data in the header before I'll employ it on a regular basis. If someone
can recommend a newsreader and newsservice (I'm willing to pay for good
ones), I'm all ears.

Patrick Turner wrote:

Ruud Broens wrote:

"Pooh Bear" wrote in message
...
:
:
: Ruud Broens wrote:
:
: "Sander deWaal" wrote in message
:


: What are you going to do when the RoHS legislation comes into force ( July 2006
: ). No more lead for you my friend !
:
: Graham
:
darn, time flies when you're havin' fun.
hmm, you're right, what to do with all that heavy stuff ?
maybe create _solder art_, that will make it through all sorts of
regulations :-)
cheers,
Rudy

Unless they ban the sales of ordinary 5050 cored solder
it will be around for awhile, and cause little troubles to the makers
tube amps in very low number production runs.

It will continue to be available ( officially for repair work since you shouldn't mix
your solders ).

I can assure that it's troubling those who manufacture in Europe and similarly those
who sell there.

The legislation is idiotic but that's only to be expected from bureaucrats. There are
reports already of reduced relaiblity in equipment using lead-free processing.

Graham

On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 17:39:48 +0100, "Ruud Broens"
wrote:


"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
.. .
: On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 02:04:27 +0000, Pooh Bear
: wrote:
:
:
: Ruud Broens wrote:
:
: "Sander deWaal" wrote in message
: ...
: : "marko" said:
: :
: : Pat Turner (not part of the problem) gave some good advice. Get some
old
: : books and parts and go for the most precious part of it all: experience.
: :
: :
: : This is the very essence of tube craft, and my major reason for
: : stating that tube audio should be restricted to DIY-ers only.
:
: and i think dutch 63/37 euphonic solder should be restricted:
: local market only!
:
: What are you going to do when the RoHS legislation comes into force ( July
2006
: ). No more lead for you my friend !
:
: I have about 3 kilos of LMP 'eutectic' tin/lead/silver solder in my
: parts bin - that should see me out! :-)
: --

hey, that's like tube thinking, getting enough of the material you like
to last a lifetime it's not rubbing off onto you, now, Stew ? ;-)

Nope, it was always there - I have a box full of Hitachi 2SJ/SK FET
pairs as well...................
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering