[Peter Scott]

John Phillips wrote:
On 2007-09-04, Peter Scott wrote:



As for broadcast digital audio links, in UK they are Nicam728 and the
data carried is 14-bit (actually its compressed slightly on the link to
13 bits IIRC). Possibly in other parts of the world they use more than
16 bits but I don't know the standards. Out of interest can you point
me to the relevant references?


I thought that the BBC used 20 bit for data links from live concerts
such as the Proms. Perhaps I'm wrong. I know that much lower resolutions
are used on the broadcast material on most digital channels.
--
__________________________________________________ _______________________

Composed using Mozilla Thunderbird and virus checked using Grisoft AVG

Peter Scott
__________________________________________________ _______________________

[Peter Scott]

Arny Krueger wrote:
"Peter Scott" wrote in message
...

Thanks for all your comments and those from others. Looks

like I have been poorly educated in the technicalities of

CD. I'll take your advice and update my knowledge. I guess

the pictures that I have in mind about the stepped nature

of samples is far too simplistic.







--
__________________________________________________ _______________________

Composed using Mozilla Thunderbird and virus checked using Grisoft AVG

Peter Scott
__________________________________________________ _______________________

[Mr.T]

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
ti.fi...
The public do not need to know (and probably don't ca-)
that there are quite many pop CD's which have been
re-mastered in this way.

Those more used to CD quality though, DO find it annoying when they buy
a
reissue on CD that has some of the noise of a vinyl pressing, plus the
artefacts of single ended noise reduction attempts, plus the extra
distortion etc.

If you are foolish enough to buy CD's with the artefacts
you describe, then you are deserve exactly what you get.

You are so lucky then that you can listen to every single CD you have before
you buy it.
Most people are not so lucky. Or maybe you just don't buy any?

Personally I am ****ed off, especially if I already have it on vinyl and
was
hoping for something a step closer to the master tapes.´

Having never heard the master tapes, how can you possibly
know? LOL:-)

Well the noise and distortion is a give away to those who can tell. I guess
that doesn't include you.

MrT.

[John Phillips]

On 2007-09-07, Peter Scott wrote:


John Phillips wrote:
On 2007-09-04, Peter Scott wrote:



As for broadcast digital audio links, in UK they are Nicam728 and the
data carried is 14-bit (actually its compressed slightly on the link to
13 bits IIRC). Possibly in other parts of the world they use more than
16 bits but I don't know the standards. Out of interest can you point
me to the relevant references?


I thought that the BBC used 20 bit for data links from live concerts
such as the Proms. Perhaps I'm wrong. I know that much lower resolutions
are used on the broadcast material on most digital channels.

Ah, you may be right. I was thinking of the links to the transmitters
and I now suspect that was not the right meaning of broadcast digital
audio links.

--
John Phillips

[Iain Churches[_2_]]

"George M. Middius" cmndr _ george @ comcast . net wrote in message
...


Iain Churches said:

"Facts about Krooborg" states that you're a second-hand
computer repair man from Michigan!

Also Chrysler Ashtray Designer Emeritus. (It says so on his toilet
paper.)

How could someone so cruelly mis-inform me on such an important
matter? :-)

That's what you get for relying on underground reference books. The
Resistance's official handbook on audio 'borgism is quite
comprehensive.

I received an e-mail circular some years ago, when I first
began "discussions" with Arny on UKRA.

Do you still have the email? I'd be interested in knowing who sent it. The
maddening emerged originally on RAO and spread to other audio groups.

Sadly no. I think its sender was a subscriber to RAO, a group I had
not even heard of at that time. I took a look there once. That was
enough for me.

Other than an announcement saying that Arny had been voted
"No.1 Sh*t on Usenet" I have no other bits of endearing
biographical info:-) except:

There was a very good cartoon posted on a university
audio website. It depicted a control room with Phil A at the
console and Arny as tape op. You could see a huge number of
people all with tambourines in the studio. The conductor looked
like Sir Simon Rattle ! Phil was shouting down the talkback,
calling the conductor a an autistic pommy cretin, while Arny,
with achinagraph pencil in his mouth, was pondering
"Do all symphonies sound the same?"


This was prior to his being born again.

When was Krooger "born again"? I have to say his piety is overwhelming.

Isn't Arny a born again Baptist?

They have the most dreadful music! Give me a Russian Orthodox
Choir any day:-)


Iain

[Iain Churches[_2_]]

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Mr.T" MrT@home wrote in message
...

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
.fi...

The public do not need to know (and probably don't ca-)
that there are quite many pop CD's which have been
re-mastered in this way.

Arny. It's nice to see yourself and Mr.T hand in hand on
Usenet. You deserve each other:-)

That does help explain Iain's attitude to his customers.

Yup, he presumes that they can't smell crap when he serves it up to them.

Arny. Please remind me. Which one of us has made
1000 recordings without a single one being published
or being accepted for commercial release???

I fear it must be your goodself who is turning out
the cr*p :-)))

In classical recording proper, client, artist and listener
all have very high expectations indeed.

Cordially,
Iain

[George M. Middius]

Iain Churches said:

Arny. Please remind me. Which one of us has made
1000 recordings without a single one being published
or being accepted for commercial release???

Irrelevant. Krooger has "been there done, that" LoT"s.

I fear it must be your goodself who is turning out
the crap :-)))

Crap is not wasted chez Krooger. It's not just the worms that benefit from
the surplus.

In classical recording proper, client, artist and listener
all have very high expectations indeed.

Unfair, Iain. Krooger's "audio career" exists entirely on Usenet. When you
or others remind Mr. **** of how real music is recorded in the real world,
that's equivalent to beating a cripple with his own crutches.

[Arny Krueger]

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
ti.fi...

Arny. Please remind me. Which one of us has made
1000 recordings without a single one being published
or being accepted for commercial release???

Well Iain, since admit that you've never made a recording that you could say
was your own personal creation as I have, the answer is...

[Iain Churches[_2_]]

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
news

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
ti.fi...

Arny. Please remind me. Which one of us has made
1000 recordings without a single one being published
or being accepted for commercial release???

Well Iain, since admit that you've never made a recording that you could
say was your own personal creation as I have, the answer is...

Personal creation?? Is that what you call that hideous racket? LOL:-)
If your work was of any merit whatsoever, at any level, someone
would have tried to make money with it. It is not. They did not.

With your Been There, Done That attitude, you still do not understand
that recording production requires a small but highly skilled team of
professionals. One needs production, recording, editing,
pre-production, mastering, sleeve notes with translation into four
languages, photography, marketing etc etc.

You and your tambourine bashers are in another world:-)

[Arny Krueger]

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
i.fi...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
news

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
ti.fi...

Arny. Please remind me. Which one of us has made
1000 recordings without a single one being published
or being accepted for commercial release???

Well Iain, since admit that you've never made a recording that you could
say was your own personal creation as I have, the answer is...

Personal creation?? Is that what you call that hideous racket? LOL:-)
If your work was of any merit whatsoever, at any level, someone
would have tried to make money with it. It is not. They did not.

With your Been There, Done That attitude, you still do not understand
that recording production requires a small but highly skilled team of
professionals.

Sue me for knowing better than that.

One needs production, recording, editing,
pre-production, mastering, sleeve notes with translation into four
languages, photography, marketing etc etc.

Tell that to any number of legendary one-man production groups that did it
all themselves. BTW, it is quite clear Iain that you've lost perspective
with your deification of the last 4 items on your list. Note that in the US
liner notes need only be done in 1 language, because we've managed to agree
among ourselves about that! Europe should try it!

You and your tambourine bashers are in another world:-)

[Clyde Slick]

On 9 Sep, 21:54, "Iain Churches" wrote:
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message

news


"Iain Churches" wrote in message
hti.fi...

Arny. Please remind me. Which one of us has made
1000 recordings without a single one being published
or being accepted for commercial release???

Well Iain, since admit that you've never made a recording that you could
say was your own personal creation as I have, the answer is...

Personal creation?? Is that what you call that hideous racket? LOL:-)
If your work was of any merit whatsoever, at any level, someone
would have tried to make money with it. It is not. They did not.

With your Been There, Done That attitude, you still do not understand
that recording production requires a small but highly skilled team of
professionals. One needs production, recording, editing,
pre-production, mastering, sleeve notes with translation into four
languages, photography, marketing etc etc.

You and your tambourine bashers are in another world:-)

Arny worships at The Church of The Holy Castenet.
Tamborines are a heresy.

[Clyde Slick]

On 9 Sep, 21:54, "Iain Churches" wrote:
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message

news


"Iain Churches" wrote in message
hti.fi...

Arny. Please remind me. Which one of us has made
1000 recordings without a single one being published
or being accepted for commercial release???

Well Iain, since admit that you've never made a recording that you could
say was your own personal creation as I have, the answer is...

Personal creation?? Is that what you call that hideous racket? LOL:-)
If your work was of any merit whatsoever, at any level, someone
would have tried to make money with it. It is not. They did not.

With your Been There, Done That attitude, you still do not understand
that recording production requires a small but highly skilled team of
professionals. One needs production, recording, editing,
pre-production, mastering, sleeve notes with translation into four
languages, photography, marketing etc etc.

You and your tambourine bashers are in another world:-)

Besides, what would you know about "Churches", anyway?

[Clyde Slick]

On 9 Sep, 23:50, "Arny Krueger" wrote:



Tell that to any number of legendary one-man production groups that did it
all themselves.

So, now you are comparing yourself to Pierre Sprey.
Besides, "at least" he designed the ashtray for the F-15,
not for some pathetic Omni.

[Jenn]

In article .com,
Clyde Slick wrote:

On 9 Sep, 21:54, "Iain Churches" wrote:
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message

news


"Iain Churches" wrote in message
hti.fi...

Arny. Please remind me. Which one of us has made
1000 recordings without a single one being published
or being accepted for commercial release???

Well Iain, since admit that you've never made a recording that you could
say was your own personal creation as I have, the answer is...

Personal creation?? Is that what you call that hideous racket? LOL:-)
If your work was of any merit whatsoever, at any level, someone
would have tried to make money with it. It is not. They did not.

With your Been There, Done That attitude, you still do not understand
that recording production requires a small but highly skilled team of
professionals. One needs production, recording, editing,
pre-production, mastering, sleeve notes with translation into four
languages, photography, marketing etc etc.

You and your tambourine bashers are in another world:-)

Arny worships at The Church of The Holy Castenet.
Tamborines are a heresy.

And keys... don't forget the keys! ;-)

[Iain Churches[_2_]]

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
i.fi...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
news

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
ti.fi...

Arny. Please remind me. Which one of us has made
1000 recordings without a single one being published
or being accepted for commercial release???

Well Iain, since admit that you've never made a recording that you could
say was your own personal creation as I have, the answer is...

Personal creation?? Is that what you call that hideous racket? LOL:-)
If your work was of any merit whatsoever, at any level, someone
would have tried to make money with it. It is not. They did not.

With your Been There, Done That attitude, you still do not understand
that recording production requires a small but highly skilled team of
professionals.

Sue me for knowing better than that.

You probably don't have a cent:-)

One needs production, recording, editing,
pre-production, mastering, sleeve notes with translation into four
languages, photography, marketing etc etc.

Tell that to any number of legendary one-man production groups that did it
all themselves. BTW, it is quite clear Iain that you've lost perspective
with your deification of the last 4 items on your list. Note that in the
US liner notes need only be done in 1 language, because we've managed to
agree among ourselves about that! Europe should try it!

By definition, one man cannot be a production group!

The EU is, I am told, a larger and probably in cultural terms a
richer ecomomy than the US. It has been standard practice here
for classical recordings to have sleeve notes in three or four
languages since the late 1960s.

[Iain Churches[_2_]]

"Mr.T" MrT@home wrote in message
u...

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
ti.fi...
The public do not need to know (and probably don't ca-)
that there are quite many pop CD's which have been
re-mastered in this way.

Those more used to CD quality though, DO find it annoying when they buy
a
reissue on CD that has some of the noise of a vinyl pressing, plus the
artefacts of single ended noise reduction attempts, plus the extra
distortion etc.

If you are foolish enough to buy CD's with the artefacts
you describe, then you are deserve exactly what you get.

You are so lucky then that you can listen to every single CD you have
before
you buy it.
Most people are not so lucky. Or maybe you just don't buy any?

I get sent some 10CDs a month as complimentary
evaluation or review copies. I buy five or six (often boxed sets)
at trade price.


Personally I am ****ed off, especially if I already have it on vinyl
and
was
hoping for something a step closer to the master tapes.´

Having never heard the master tapes, how can you possibly
know? LOL:-)

Well the noise and distortion is a give away to those who can tell. I
guess
that doesn't include you.

Can't tell? LOL. You are the one who is buying
sub-standard product:-)

I see there is a competition on at the moment to guess what the
"T" in Mr.T might stand for. Most of the suggestions seem to
have (how should I put it?) "anatomical connotations" Your
fellow audiophiles do not seem to hold you in high esteem!

Is that why you choose to cower behind anonymity and
a false e-mail address, and never post anything of value,
(a link to a schematic, one of your audio projects,
or an answer to a question) ?

I shall not bother to reply to your drivel in future.

Iain

[Mr.T]

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
i.fi...
The public do not need to know (and probably don't ca-)
that there are quite many pop CD's which have been
re-mastered in this way.
Having never heard the master tapes, how can you possibly
know? LOL:-)

Well the noise and distortion is a give away to those who can tell. I
guess that doesn't include you.

Can't tell? LOL. You are the one who is buying
sub-standard product:-)

That's what you are delivering unfortunately.
And *IF* you can tell, why are you so arrogant as to assume no one else
can????
But I'll bet you can't tell simply because your head is stuck too far up
your arse!


I shall not bother to reply to your drivel in future.

We can only hope, at least we will be spared your drivel.

MrT.

[Clyde Slick]

On 10 Sep, 09:22, "Iain Churches" wrote:

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message

. ..





"Iain Churches" wrote in message
ti.fi...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
news


Sue me for knowing better than that.

You probably don't have a cent:-)

"at least" he has a scent, but an unpleasant one, at that.

I see that Arny is begging for a second lawsuit against him.

[Phildo]

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
i.fi...
Isn't Arny a born again Baptist?

Arny says he's a xtian but doesn't lead by example and is a very poor
example of what a xtian should be.

He only goes to church because they let him play with their mixing desk
which is the only way he gets to fulfil his dream of doing live sound. He so
desperately wants to be a real engineer, sort of like the Pinocchio of the
live sound world.

Phildo