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Greg M Silverman
 
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Am looking into buying microphones to record the following:

-- solo guitar (mostly nylon string)

-- guitar and recorder

-- guitar, winds, tuba and voice

-- 2-guitars, recorder and voice

and possiblly other ensemble mixes.

I've been told to get Oktava 012's by several people (small diaphragm,
with interchangeable capsule for different situations), but have also
been told that CAD 300s (or equivalent) would better suit my needs for
good sound.
I will be using a Powerbook with an mBox for the recording.

First, is this NG the best one for this type of question, and if not
could someone please direct me to a better one?

If so, what would people's recommendations? I would be willing to spend
up to $500 for a pair of decent mics.

TIA!

gms--

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Arny Krueger
 
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Default microphones

"Greg M Silverman" wrote in message

Am looking into buying microphones to record the following:

-- solo guitar (mostly nylon string)


-- guitar and recorder


-- guitar, winds, tuba and voice


-- 2-guitars, recorder and voice


and possibly other ensemble mixes.


I've been told to get Oktava 012's by several people (small diaphragm,
with interchangeable capsule for different situations), but have also
been told that CAD 300s (or equivalent) would better suit my needs for
good sound.


I wouldn't recommend the same pair of mics for all of these applications.

The obvious stand-out is voice. There's a lot of charm to using a mic that
was specifically designed for vocal work when you record a vocalist. A
well-designed vocalist's mic will have good pop suppression, good internal
shock mounting, and handle high SPLs, but has only modest needs for
sensitivity and low noise. I've just switched a half-dozen vocalists from
SM57s with foam pop filters to CAD 95s with external foam pop filters over
and above the internal filters. Why CAD 95s? The room has a bad case of cold
sound, and the slight broad lower midrange rise of the older CAD 95s warms
things up just a tad. Losing the slightly harsh presence peak of the 57s
allows me use the highly limited eq on the Mackie console to deal with
personal issues, since I no longer have to use it to fight with my mics. The
current model of the now-discontinued CAD 95 is the CAD 195 which lacks the
slight added warmth in the midrange.

OTOH, I've been getting very pleasing results on instruments like acoustical
guitars, winds and brass with another classic cheap but good mic - the MXL
603. I've used 603s as vocal mics, but they are easy to pop even with an
added pop filter over the included one, and have minimal resistance to
handling noise. Used as acoustic instrument mics, their warm, smooth
response and broad directivity make it a "natural".

So now we're got a pair of tight cardiod vocal mics, a pair of broad cardiod
MI mics, and a some of of that $500 is still in the kitty. Give me a budget
and I tend to spend it all.

Just for something different, but clearly something that can be very useful,
let me suggest getting a pair of another classic cheap but good mic - the
ultra-small diameter omnidirectional Behringer ECM8000. I use pairs of these
to record room ambience, pipe organ, choirs and mid-sized vocal groups.
I've also used them on a piano. Ultrasmall omnis are even more
omnidirectional than 1" omnis, with a reduced on-axis crispness peak. Their
noise performance can be an areas of weakness, so you mostly want to use
them where SPLs are relatively high. Because they are so non-directional,
it's feasible to use them very close to sound sources which partially
compensates for the mediocre noise performance.


  #3   Report Post  
Greg M Silverman
 
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Arny Krueger wrote:

"Greg M Silverman" wrote in message

Am looking into buying microphones to record the following:

-- solo guitar (mostly nylon string)


-- guitar and recorder


-- guitar, winds, tuba and voice


-- 2-guitars, recorder and voice


and possibly other ensemble mixes.


I've been told to get Oktava 012's by several people (small diaphragm,
with interchangeable capsule for different situations), but have also
been told that CAD 300s (or equivalent) would better suit my needs for
good sound.


I wouldn't recommend the same pair of mics for all of these applications.


Hi Arny,
I was afraid of this kind of response! Guess I was trying to do too much with
too little, eh? :-)



The obvious stand-out is voice. There's a lot of charm to using a mic that
was specifically designed for vocal work when you record a vocalist. A
well-designed vocalist's mic will have good pop suppression, good internal
shock mounting, and handle high SPLs, but has only modest needs for
sensitivity and low noise. I've just switched a half-dozen vocalists from
SM57s with foam pop filters to CAD 95s with external foam pop filters over
and above the internal filters. Why CAD 95s? The room has a bad case of cold
sound, and the slight broad lower midrange rise of the older CAD 95s warms
things up just a tad. Losing the slightly harsh presence peak of the 57s
allows me use the highly limited eq on the Mackie console to deal with
personal issues, since I no longer have to use it to fight with my mics. The
current model of the now-discontinued CAD 95 is the CAD 195 which lacks the
slight added warmth in the midrange.


Yes, all points very well taken.




OTOH, I've been getting very pleasing results on instruments like acoustical
guitars, winds and brass with another classic cheap but good mic - the MXL
603. I've used 603s as vocal mics, but they are easy to pop even with an
added pop filter over the included one, and have minimal resistance to
handling noise. Used as acoustic instrument mics, their warm, smooth
response and broad directivity make it a "natural".


As with this too.



So now we're got a pair of tight cardiod vocal mics, a pair of broad cardiod
MI mics, and a some of of that $500 is still in the kitty. Give me a budget
and I tend to spend it all.


Good deal.



Just for something different, but clearly something that can be very useful,
let me suggest getting a pair of another classic cheap but good mic - the
ultra-small diameter omnidirectional Behringer ECM8000. I use pairs of these
to record room ambience, pipe organ, choirs and mid-sized vocal groups.
I've also used them on a piano. Ultrasmall omnis are even more
omnidirectional than 1" omnis, with a reduced on-axis crispness peak. Their
noise performance can be an areas of weakness, so you mostly want to use
them where SPLs are relatively high. Because they are so non-directional,
it's feasible to use them very close to sound sources which partially
compensates for the mediocre noise performance.


Thanks for the great response. You have given me much more to think about. More
research to do on my part I guess. And you have convinced me that it just isn't
possible to do it all with a single pair of mics.

Ciao!

gms--

  #4   Report Post  
Raymond
 
Posts: n/a
Default microphones

greg wrote
Am looking into buying microphones to record the following:

-- solo guitar (mostly nylon string)

-- guitar and recorder

-- guitar, winds, tuba and voice

-- 2-guitars, recorder and voice

and possiblly other ensemble mixes.


A SDC (small diaphragm condenser) mic can yield good recordings for acoustic
instraments if... you have a nice live room to record them in. When you get
down to it, it all depends (after you get talented players and quality
instruments) on the design of the room you use. If you have no room built for
the task you can try a long hallway (wood floor) in your house. Many large
churches have good sounding halls/santuarey's to.

I've been told to get Oktava 012's by several people (small diaphragm,
with interchangeable capsule for different situations), but have also
been told that CAD 300s (or equivalent) would better suit my needs for
good sound.


I don't know about those mic's, I've been using a pair of AT 3032's (omni) and
a AT 4047sv (LDC omni) for some steel string guitar and African drum
recording's in the front hall of my house. I used an SM 57 as well with great
results.
The SM57 worked best for the Negombe (large African drum), the condenser mic's
didn't do the very low frequencies it produced to much justice. The smaller
Dejombe drum's where fine with the AT 3032, if I'd been using a larger room
maybe things would have been different.


If so, what would people's recommendations? I would be willing to spend
up to $500 for a pair of decent mics.


You can find some good mic's for $500 bucks, The 3032's where about $200 each
and the 4047sv was around $500. (do some shopping and compare sound and price)
  #5   Report Post  
Greg M Silverman
 
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Default microphones



Raymond wrote:

greg wrote
Am looking into buying microphones to record the following:

-- solo guitar (mostly nylon string)

-- guitar and recorder

-- guitar, winds, tuba and voice

-- 2-guitars, recorder and voice

and possiblly other ensemble mixes.


A SDC (small diaphragm condenser) mic can yield good recordings for acoustic
instraments if... you have a nice live room to record them in. When you get
down to it, it all depends (after you get talented players and quality
instruments) on the design of the room you use. If you have no room built for
the task you can try a long hallway (wood floor) in your house. Many large
churches have good sounding halls/santuarey's to.

I've been told to get Oktava 012's by several people (small diaphragm,
with interchangeable capsule for different situations), but have also
been told that CAD 300s (or equivalent) would better suit my needs for
good sound.


I don't know about those mic's, I've been using a pair of AT 3032's (omni) and
a AT 4047sv (LDC omni) for some steel string guitar and African drum
recording's in the front hall of my house. I used an SM 57 as well with great
results.
The SM57 worked best for the Negombe (large African drum), the condenser mic's
didn't do the very low frequencies it produced to much justice. The smaller
Dejombe drum's where fine with the AT 3032, if I'd been using a larger room
maybe things would have been different.

If so, what would people's recommendations? I would be willing to spend
up to $500 for a pair of decent mics.


You can find some good mic's for $500 bucks, The 3032's where about $200 each
and the 4047sv was around $500. (do some shopping and compare sound and price)


Thanks, these both look quite promising.

gms--




  #6   Report Post  
John L Rice
 
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Default microphones

Just FYI - I recently did a lot of percussion tracks using a CAD E300
through a Martech Mss-10 pre and it worked great ( bells, xylophone,
shakers, sleigh, various dumbeks, snare drums, gongs, etc ) For a few
things a Stedman N90 worked better ( when the sound source was extremely
loud or too bright )

Best of luck!

John L Rice


"Raymond" wrote in message
...
greg wrote
Am looking into buying microphones to record the following:

-- solo guitar (mostly nylon string)

-- guitar and recorder

-- guitar, winds, tuba and voice

-- 2-guitars, recorder and voice

and possiblly other ensemble mixes.


A SDC (small diaphragm condenser) mic can yield good recordings for

acoustic
instraments if... you have a nice live room to record them in. When you

get
down to it, it all depends (after you get talented players and quality
instruments) on the design of the room you use. If you have no room built

for
the task you can try a long hallway (wood floor) in your house. Many large
churches have good sounding halls/santuarey's to.

I've been told to get Oktava 012's by several people (small diaphragm,
with interchangeable capsule for different situations), but have also
been told that CAD 300s (or equivalent) would better suit my needs for
good sound.


I don't know about those mic's, I've been using a pair of AT 3032's (omni)

and
a AT 4047sv (LDC omni) for some steel string guitar and African drum
recording's in the front hall of my house. I used an SM 57 as well with

great
results.
The SM57 worked best for the Negombe (large African drum), the condenser

mic's
didn't do the very low frequencies it produced to much justice. The

smaller
Dejombe drum's where fine with the AT 3032, if I'd been using a larger

room
maybe things would have been different.


If so, what would people's recommendations? I would be willing to spend
up to $500 for a pair of decent mics.


You can find some good mic's for $500 bucks, The 3032's where about $200

each
and the 4047sv was around $500. (do some shopping and compare sound and

price)


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