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J. P. Gilliver (John) J. P. Gilliver (John) is offline
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Default Audio Precision System One Dual Domani Measuirement Systems

In message , Don Pearce
writes:
On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 20:48:39 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

(I am not on either side in the argument between Jerry and others: I
live in UK, but still find ring mains odd.)


Why do you find ring mains odd? Once you have daisy chained all the
sockets it is an extremely sensible idea to complete the loop back to


If you happen to have laid them out in a ring manner anyway, yes.

the distribution board. For the cost of a few feet of cable, you have
halved both the effective resistance of the mains and the distance to
the furthest socket. I can't imagine a single reason not to do it.

d


I can see the halving of the resistance (well, at the most remote point
anyway), but not the halving of the distance.

I think maintenance (I mean when modifying, not just general wear and
tear): most extras added to ring mains are spurs. (Also, instinctively,
it's easier to know when one is isolated with a spur, though that
shouldn't be done that way.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The summit of Everest is marine limestone.
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In article ,
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
Why do you find ring mains odd? Once you have daisy chained all the
sockets it is an extremely sensible idea to complete the loop back to


If you happen to have laid them out in a ring manner anyway, yes.


Why wouldn't you? There are less runs back to the CU than doing the same
with radials, so surely not too difficult to design?

the distribution board. For the cost of a few feet of cable, you have
halved both the effective resistance of the mains and the distance to
the furthest socket. I can't imagine a single reason not to do it.

d


I can see the halving of the resistance (well, at the most remote point
anyway), but not the halving of the distance.


I think maintenance (I mean when modifying, not just general wear and
tear): most extras added to ring mains are spurs. (Also, instinctively,
it's easier to know when one is isolated with a spur, though that
shouldn't be done that way.)


You are allowed to add spurs within the regs, but why is it so much more
difficult to simply add a socket properly to the ring?

--
*Certain frogs can be frozen solid, then thawed, and survive *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
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In article ,
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
Thanks for confirming we can add flex ratings to the things you know
nothing about.

Conductors rated at only 1A are very thin - sufficiently so that they do
not have great mechanical strength.


Where will you find an appliance sold fitted with 1A flex and a 13 amp
plug?

Therefore Jerry's statement that
mains leads (in US: line cords) are likely to have a higher rating than
absolutely necessary is valid.


All appliances now sold in the UK (and elsewhere in Europe) are capable of
blowing a 13 amp fuse in event of a fault on the line chord.

Especially if they're of the sort that
has a connector at both ends: if there's a chance that they might be
used for an appliance that draws more, then it is unwise to use
low-current wire/cable for them.


Same with extensions etc sold in the UK.

(I am not on either side in the argument between Jerry and others: I
live in UK, but still find ring mains odd.)


I can understand this, as practice is what matters. Diversity loading.
Not some theoretical maybe as Jerry insist on bringing up - even although
it has been explained to him time and time again.

Final ring circuits are for domestic premises only. For workshops or
offices where you have known fixed loads you'd stick to radials. As you'd
do for fixed heating in a domestic scenario.

--
*Isn't it a bit unnerving that doctors call what they do "practice?"

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
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Default Audio Precision System One Dual Domani Measuirement Systems

In article ,
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
Why do you find ring mains odd? Once you have daisy chained all the
sockets it is an extremely sensible idea to complete the loop back to


If you happen to have laid them out in a ring manner anyway, yes.


Why wouldn't you? There are less runs back to the CU than doing the same
with radials, so surely not too difficult to design?


the distribution board. For the cost of a few feet of cable, you have
halved both the effective resistance of the mains and the distance to
the furthest socket. I can't imagine a single reason not to do it.

d


I can see the halving of the resistance (well, at the most remote point
anyway), but not the halving of the distance.


I think maintenance (I mean when modifying, not just general wear and
tear): most extras added to ring mains are spurs. (Also, instinctively,
it's easier to know when one is isolated with a spur, though that
shouldn't be done that way.)


You are allowed to add spurs within the regs, but why is it so much more
difficult to simply add a socket properly to the ring?


Access to the wiring might be a problem.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.16

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"John Williamson" wrote in message
...
Don Pearce wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 23:53:37 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:


(excluding the US and Canada) and Japan, drive on the wrong side of
the road, AS COMPARED TO_EVERYWHERE_. Sorry, but THAT is weird. The
It's not the wrong side, it's the left side (-:.


UK, Australia, New Zealand, India. All left side (proper side)
drivers.


Add Japan and most of Africa (Where the drivers don't just stick to the
ruts, which normally match the track of a Land Rover.


Currently, the split is about 50/50 in terms of the number of countries
which drive on which side.


After all, the Right side is the right side...




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On 30/01/2012 16:24, Arny Krueger wrote:
"John wrote in message
...
Don Pearce wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 23:53:37 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:


(excluding the US and Canada) and Japan, drive on the wrong side of
the road, AS COMPARED TO_EVERYWHERE_. Sorry, but THAT is weird. The
It's not the wrong side, it's the left side (-:.


UK, Australia, New Zealand, India. All left side (proper side)
drivers.


Add Japan and most of Africa (Where the drivers don't just stick to the
ruts, which normally match the track of a Land Rover.


Currently, the split is about 50/50 in terms of the number of countries
which drive on which side.


After all, the Right side is the right side...



You mean the French side

Ron
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"Ron" wrote in message
...
On 30/01/2012 16:24, Arny Krueger wrote:
"John wrote in message
...
Don Pearce wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 23:53:37 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:


(excluding the US and Canada) and Japan, drive on the wrong side of
the road, AS COMPARED TO_EVERYWHERE_. Sorry, but THAT is weird. The
It's not the wrong side, it's the left side (-:.


UK, Australia, New Zealand, India. All left side (proper side)
drivers.


Add Japan and most of Africa (Where the drivers don't just stick to the
ruts, which normally match the track of a Land Rover.


Currently, the split is about 50/50 in terms of the number of countries
which drive on which side.


After all, the Right side is the right side...



You mean the French side


and German and...

The good news is that most of the major car manufacturers have figured out
to make cars of either format on the same production line, etc.


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On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 11:24:28h -0500, Arny Krueger declared:

After all, the Right side is the right side...


Will somebody not think of the bus drivers?

Is it easier for bus drivers to take fares and issue tickets
to people boarding the bus from the left hand side or the
right hand side when usually most bus drivers are right handed?
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On Mon, 30 Jan 2012 08:25:23 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message , Don Pearce
writes:
On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 20:48:39 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

(I am not on either side in the argument between Jerry and others: I
live in UK, but still find ring mains odd.)


Why do you find ring mains odd? Once you have daisy chained all the
sockets it is an extremely sensible idea to complete the loop back to


If you happen to have laid them out in a ring manner anyway, yes.

the distribution board. For the cost of a few feet of cable, you have
halved both the effective resistance of the mains and the distance to
the furthest socket. I can't imagine a single reason not to do it.

d


I can see the halving of the resistance (well, at the most remote point
anyway), but not the halving of the distance.


For the most remote socket, the distance can be reduced to almost zero
by completing the loop (assuming the run goes around the house and
almost back again. For any socket beyond half distance, the run is
reduced. Half was just an estimate.

I think maintenance (I mean when modifying, not just general wear and
tear): most extras added to ring mains are spurs. (Also, instinctively,
it's easier to know when one is isolated with a spur, though that
shouldn't be done that way.)


Spurs are allowed on a ring main, but to a single point only (which
can of course be a double socket).

d
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On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 11:43:42h -0500, Arny Krueger wrote:

"Ron" wrote in message

You mean the French side


and German and...


Most of the map at http://en.wikipedia.ORG/wiki/Right-_and_left-hand_traffic
is red.


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On Mon, 30 Jan 2012 16:55:38 +0000 (UTC), J G Miller
wrote:

On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 11:43:42h -0500, Arny Krueger wrote:

"Ron" wrote in message

You mean the French side


and German and...


Most of the map at http://en.wikipedia.ORG/wiki/Right-_and_left-hand_traffic
is red.


The good bits are blue.

d
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"J G Miller" wrote in message
...
On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 11:24:28h -0500, Arny Krueger declared:

After all, the Right side is the right side...


Will somebody not think of the bus drivers?

Is it easier for bus drivers to take fares and issue tickets
to people boarding the bus from the left hand side or the
right hand side when usually most bus drivers are right handed?


It must be a long time since you were last on a bus.

--
JohnT

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On Mon, 30 Jan 2012 16:45:02 +0000 (UTC), J G Miller
wrote:

On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 11:24:28h -0500, Arny Krueger declared:

After all, the Right side is the right side...


Will somebody not think of the bus drivers?

Is it easier for bus drivers to take fares and issue tickets
to people boarding the bus from the left hand side or the
right hand side when usually most bus drivers are right handed?


Fares? Nobody takes fares on buses any more.

d
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Default Audio Precision System One Dual Domani Measuirement Systems

In article ,
J G Miller wrote:
On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 11:24:28h -0500, Arny Krueger declared:

After all, the Right side is the right side...


Will somebody not think of the bus drivers?


Is it easier for bus drivers to take fares and issue tickets
to people boarding the bus from the left hand side or the
right hand side when usually most bus drivers are right handed?


Take fares? When last were you on a bus? ;-)

--
*Two many clicks spoil the browse *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
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On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 17:50:21h +0000, Don Pearce wrote:

Fares? Nobody takes fares on buses any more.


Nonsense. All depends on the bus company.

And what if you want a transfer [slip]?

On some bus line extensions, you even pay an extra fare
when you get off the bus.


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On 30/01/2012 18:12, J G Miller wrote:
On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 17:50:21h +0000, Don Pearce wrote:

Fares? Nobody takes fares on buses any more.


Nonsense. All depends on the bus company.



And the country

Ron
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On Mon, 30 Jan 2012 18:12:00 +0000 (UTC), J G Miller
wrote:

On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 17:50:21h +0000, Don Pearce wrote:

Fares? Nobody takes fares on buses any more.


Nonsense. All depends on the bus company.

And what if you want a transfer [slip]?

On some bus line extensions, you even pay an extra fare
when you get off the bus.


No idea what you are talking about, I'm afraid. I get on the bus,
swipe my card then get off when I'm there.

d
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On 1/31/2012 3:24 AM, Arny Krueger wrote:
"John wrote in message
...
Don Pearce wrote:
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 23:53:37 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:


(excluding the US and Canada) and Japan, drive on the wrong side of
the road, AS COMPARED TO_EVERYWHERE_. Sorry, but THAT is weird. The
It's not the wrong side, it's the left side (-:.


UK, Australia, New Zealand, India. All left side (proper side)
drivers.


Add Japan and most of Africa (Where the drivers don't just stick to the
ruts, which normally match the track of a Land Rover.


Currently, the split is about 50/50 in terms of the number of countries
which drive on which side.


After all, the Right side is the right side...



**Why? I've driven cars on both sides, in several countries. As long as
everyone else has it figured out, there seems to be no real problem.
HOWEVER, I would posit that, when driving an automobile with a manual
gearbox, using one's right hand to control the wheel (assuming one is
right handed), with the other hand using the gear change, is a better idea.

As it happens, I am suddenly in the market for a new (second hand)
automobile. The advantage for me is that I can easily purchase a direct
Japense import, with low milage and in very good condition for quite
good prices and without any need to convert to local conditions.

FWIW: A Nissan Stagea beckons.

--
Trevor Wilson www.rageaudio.com.au
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On 29/01/2012 18:45, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
... except pints and gallons of course. The US "English" system has
never been used in England.

IIRC, it has. The UK one was changed sometime after US independence. They
stuck to the old units, understandably.


I'm prepared to be proved wrong, but a little rummage suggest the US
gallon is based on the English Gallon as used for Wine, and there was no
unified English Gallon.

I'm also quite prepared for someone to say British not English...

Andy
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On 1/31/2012 4:50 AM, Don Pearce wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jan 2012 16:45:02 +0000 (UTC), J G
wrote:

On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 11:24:28h -0500, Arny Krueger declared:

After all, the Right side is the right side...


Will somebody not think of the bus drivers?

Is it easier for bus drivers to take fares and issue tickets
to people boarding the bus from the left hand side or the
right hand side when usually most bus drivers are right handed?


Fares? Nobody takes fares on buses any more.

d


**Yes, they do.

--
Trevor Wilson www.rageaudio.com.au


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On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 18:20:14h +0000, Don Pearce wrote:

No idea what you are talking about, I'm afraid. I get on the bus, swipe
my card then get off when I'm there.


Well that is probably what all bus companies would like everybody to do
and do away with cash fares entirely.

They have you money before you use any of their services and they
can keep track of where you have been traveling, which they can
cross-reference with the on board video surveillance camera tapes.
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On 1/30/2012 2:56 PM, Andy Champ wrote:
On 29/01/2012 18:45, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
... except pints and gallons of course. The US "English" system has
never been used in England.

IIRC, it has. The UK one was changed sometime after US independence. They
stuck to the old units, understandably.


I'm prepared to be proved wrong, but a little rummage suggest the US
gallon is based on the English Gallon as used for Wine, and there was no
unified English Gallon.

There were a number of different gallons, used for different things, in
different places. And yes, I believe it was the wine gallon.

I'm also quite prepared for someone to say British not English...



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Trevor Wilson wrote...

I would posit that, when driving an automobile with a manual
gearbox, using one's right hand to control the wheel (assuming one is
right handed), with the other hand using the gear change, is a better idea.

I'm right handed and learnt to drive in Germany and found that using
the right hand to manipulate the gear lever and handbrake felt natural
and controlled. It seemed awkward when I first drove in the UK and it
took a while to adjust.

--
Ken O'Meara
http://www.btinternet.com/~unsteadyken/
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On 1/31/2012 8:14 AM, UnsteadyKen wrote:

Trevor Wilson wrote...

I would posit that, when driving an automobile with a manual
gearbox, using one's right hand to control the wheel (assuming one is
right handed), with the other hand using the gear change, is a better idea.

I'm right handed and learnt to drive in Germany and found that using
the right hand to manipulate the gear lever and handbrake felt natural
and controlled. It seemed awkward when I first drove in the UK and it
took a while to adjust.


**I'm sure that would be the case. I learned to drive in Australia,
using a 'three on the tree' and later a four speed, floor mounted manual
gearbox. I now drive a five speed manual gearbox car. I've driven auto
gearbox cars in the US and elsewhere. I reckon that trying to drive a
manual gearbox in the US would be a difficult adjustment to make, though
using an auto box was easy enough.

--
Trevor Wilson www.rageaudio.com.au
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In message , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes:
In article ,
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
Thanks for confirming we can add flex ratings to the things you know
nothing about.

Conductors rated at only 1A are very thin - sufficiently so that they do
not have great mechanical strength.


Where will you find an appliance sold fitted with 1A flex and a 13 amp
plug?


That was exactly my point: 1A leads (flex) are virtually non-existent
now, even if captive and the appliance draws 1A or less. Whatever the
consumption, if sold for use in UK, it will now have a "13A" plug, as
that is the only type of socket in the majority of homes and workplaces.
(Strictly a "BS1363" plug - many variants aren't actually capable of
carrying 13A continuously, especially the ones where the pins are made
of folded metal.)

Therefore Jerry's statement that
mains leads (in US: line cords) are likely to have a higher rating than
absolutely necessary is valid.


All appliances now sold in the UK (and elsewhere in Europe) are capable of
blowing a 13 amp fuse in event of a fault on the line chord.


Confirming what I said above. (The flex rather than the appliance, but
I'm sure that's what you meant.) [Major or minor chord (-:?]
[]
Final ring circuits are for domestic premises only. For workshops or
offices where you have known fixed loads you'd stick to radials. As you'd
do for fixed heating in a domestic scenario.

I was decidedly surprised to find a fan heater - fixed - in the lighting
circuit in this home (assembled 1999), in the shower room. (Not sure if
this home has ring circuits or not: it's a prefabricated building. I
haven't had any reason to investigate. It has a fairly
conventional-looking distribution unit.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The hypothalamus is one of the most important parts of the brain, involved in
many kinds of motivation, among other functions. The hypothalamus controls the
"Four F's": fighting, fleeing, feeding, and mating. -Heard in a neuropsychology
classroom


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In message , Don Pearce
writes:
[]
Fares? Nobody takes fares on buses any more.

d


(And Dave Plowman.)

I had occasion to use buses several times in Newcastle (upon Tyne, north
England), earlier this month; I would say that the majority of
passengers were paying cash, or using free (disabled, age, or
schoolchildren) passes. I don't think they even _had_ any form of swipe
reader or similar. I would venture that the same applies in a lot of
England, probably Britain.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

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Radio Times, 7-13 June, 2003.
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Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Jerry wrote:

The great advantage of radial circuits is that idiots find it a
little more difficult to bridge out the breaker in the panel,
unlike the silly fuse fitted in BS1363 plugs (which for some
silly reason is the same shape and diameter as many screws, bolts
and any other round bar)



Wonder how you know all this? Just who ever wants to draw more than 13
amps from a socket anyway?

Oh yes - I remember. You used to work in a garage and probably did just
that since because it didn't have the correct wiring installed.

Not everyone is as stupid as you Jerry.


You just need 2 13A plugs on wires leading to a choc block where they
are connected in parallel - gives 32A then.
Just like we had avaialble in our test room at work to power the
satellite uplink.

And while we are on it, nothing like the VERY nasty UK sockets etc which
have stared to appear with Insulation displacement type connections
(like Krone/BT sockets but a tiny bit bigger)

Keep to a proper nice strong screw on terminal (and with a real slot so
any screwdriver works instead of these cra**y phirrips type heads that
just turn into a round groove when tightened!)

And of course the trend for screws that have cut threads and don't taper
so are useless for fixing into wallplugs as they don't expand them

And the nasty cup hooks I got the other day with no real points on the
thread (health and safety?) so won't screw in without pre-drilling and
are made of aluminium (aluminum for you US wrong-spellers) so shear off
when finally tightened

Mike
(grumpy old man)

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Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
J G Miller wrote:

On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 11:24:28h -0500, Arny Krueger declared:


After all, the Right side is the right side...



Will somebody not think of the bus drivers?



Is it easier for bus drivers to take fares and issue tickets
to people boarding the bus from the left hand side or the
right hand side when usually most bus drivers are right handed?



Take fares? When last were you on a bus? ;-)


I hear the second person on the new "Boris bus" in london is
re-christened a CCA (Customer Care Assistant) and is primarily
responsible for stopping inexperienced tourists stepping off the rear
open step like proer Londoners do at traffic lights!

Hang on, there will be door at the rear and it will only be opened in
peak traffic areas

Mike

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In article ,
Trevor Wilson wrote:
HOWEVER, I would posit that, when driving an automobile with a manual
gearbox, using one's right hand to control the wheel (assuming one is
right handed), with the other hand using the gear change, is a better
idea.


I had a Riley Pathfinder. With a right hand floor change. Allowed a bench
front seat. ;-)

--
*Confession is good for the soul, but bad for your career.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
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In article ,
m wrote:
You just need 2 13A plugs on wires leading to a choc block where they
are connected in parallel - gives 32A then.
Just like we had avaialble in our test room at work to power the
satellite uplink.


Obviously no H&S rep in those days then. ;-)

--
*Indian Driver - Smoke signals only*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.


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In article ,
Paul Ratcliffe wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jan 2012 17:54:08 +0000 (GMT), Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:


Take fares? When last were you on a bus? ;-)


There are buses in places other than Landun you know. They don't have
Oyster.


Neither do I. But don't pay cash on the bus.

--
*It is wrong to ever split an infinitive *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
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"John Williamson" wrote in message
...

UK, Australia, New Zealand, India. All left side (proper side)
drivers.

Add Japan and most of Africa (Where the drivers don't just stick to the
ruts, which normally match the track of a Land Rover.

Add Thailand as well.

Currently, the split is about 50/50 in terms of the number of countries
which drive on which side.

David.


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"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...


After all, the Right side is the right side...



You mean the French side


and German and...

The story goes that it was Napoleon who imposed driving on the right (or
more accurately in those pre-motor vehicle days passing oncoming traffic on
the right) onto a continent that up until then had mostly still followed the
old Roman rule of passing on the left.

The good news is that most of the major car manufacturers have figured out
to make cars of either format on the same production line, etc.


Yes, its not a big deal. Although I have never driven across a land border
between left and right passing countries myself (its hard to drive across
the English Channel!) I have watched traffic crossing the border between
Thailand (drives on the left) and Burma (drives on the right). It all seemed
to work very smoothly.

David.


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In article , J G Miller wrote:
No idea what you are talking about, I'm afraid. I get on the bus, swipe
my card then get off when I'm there.


Well that is probably what all bus companies would like everybody to do
and do away with cash fares entirely.

They have you money before you use any of their services and they
can keep track of where you have been traveling, which they can
cross-reference with the on board video surveillance camera tapes.


And there won't be large amounts of cash carried on board. Perhaps this
could make the bus companies less reluctant to provide services late at
night when they would otherwise be vulnerable to theft.

Rod.
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In article , J. P. Gilliver (John)
wrote:
[]
Fares? Nobody takes fares on buses any more.

d


(And Dave Plowman.)

I had occasion to use buses several times in Newcastle (upon Tyne, north
England), earlier this month; I would say that the majority of
passengers were paying cash, or using free (disabled, age, or
schoolchildren) passes. I don't think they even _had_ any form of swipe
reader or similar. I would venture that the same applies in a lot of
England, probably Britain.


It can only be a matter of time though. Merseyrail has some kind of
electronic sensing system at Central Station that will accept my old fogey
pass if it's just waved in the general vicinity of the ticket slot on one
of the exit barriers. Evidently the start of some master plan. I had no
idea my pass had any electronics in it, as it just looks like a piece of
printed plastic.

Rod.
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Roderick Stewart wrote:

It can only be a matter of time though. Merseyrail has some kind of
electronic sensing system at Central Station that will accept my old fogey
pass if it's just waved in the general vicinity of the ticket slot on one
of the exit barriers. Evidently the start of some master plan. I had no
idea my pass had any electronics in it, as it just looks like a piece of
printed plastic.


It's a RIFID (pronounced like the three legged plant) chip. They are in
everything these days. If you search youtube you can find some interesting
videos about them, including one of a person who put a 900mHz reader in his
car with an antenna covering a side window. He was able to read the information
on credit cards, driver's licenses, passports etc of people passing him in
other cars and on the street as he drove by.

The Mythbusters were going to do a show about them, and were told by the
credit card companies not to do it. Discovery Network agreed so they are
never going to do one.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, N3OWJ/4X1GM
My high blood pressure medicine reduces my midichlorian count. :-(


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On Tue, 31 Jan 2012 08:02:25 -0000, David Looser wrote:

The story goes that it was Napoleon who imposed driving on the right (or
more accurately in those pre-motor vehicle days passing oncoming traffic
on the right) onto a continent that up until then had mostly still
followed the old Roman rule of passing on the left.


Hum, I wonder of that has anything to do with which hand one would
have ones sword in? Most people are right handed so being on the
right makes it harder to take a swipe at some one passing.

--
Cheers
Dave.



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On 31/01/2012 10:22, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Tue, 31 Jan 2012 08:02:25 -0000, David Looser wrote:

The story goes that it was Napoleon who imposed driving on the right (or
more accurately in those pre-motor vehicle days passing oncoming traffic
on the right) onto a continent that up until then had mostly still
followed the old Roman rule of passing on the left.


Hum, I wonder of that has anything to do with which hand one would
have ones sword in? Most people are right handed so being on the
right makes it harder to take a swipe at some one passing.


That's the usual explanation for driving on the left in Roman times.
Some say it was Napoleon who decreed driving on the right, some say it
was the Pope.

Incidentally, I was at a presentation about Barbados the other day, and
was told that it's not possible to hire a car in Barbados due to the
previous amount of traffic accidents involving hire cars. They drive on
the left, and the majority of tourists are American and can't get used
to driving on that side. I myself prefer to drive down the middle

Ron
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"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote in message
...
In message , Don Pearce
writes:
[]
We mix our units much more than that. Take temperatures - if it is
near freezing we use Centigrade, when it is hot we use Fahrenheit.

[]
I suspect that for a lot of us, it's only the media - in fact, only the
print media - who do this. I think in Celsius for both:


Likewise. The first time I was ever interested in air temperatures was on
holiday in 1960 in Switzerland where, naturally, they have used Celcius for
centuries. Then, since school physics used SI units, where was the point in
bothering with Farenheit?

thirtysomething is too hot for me, much below twenty (unless there's
absolutely no wind) too cold.


Below zero: freezing (literaly)
0 - 10: cold
10- 20: mild
20 - 30: pleasant
30 - 40: hot
40+ too hot

Seems simple enough to me!

Our weather forecasts have been in C for some decades, albeit with the
forecaster giving the F equivalent verbally (but not visually).


Indeed.

David.

--




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On 31/01/2012 00:30, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In ,
Paul wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jan 2012 17:54:08 +0000 (GMT), Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:


Take fares? When last were you on a bus? ;-)


There are buses in places other than Landun you know. They don't have
Oyster.


Neither do I. But don't pay cash on the bus.

When in Belgium last year, I found that, on the tramways, there was no
place to pay the driver, and no 'conductor'.
Most passengers seem to insert a card into a machine, no one checked
tickets. I asked several folks how do I pay, they just shrugged, so it
seems travel between stops wasn't worth collecting fares for. The whole
system is remarkably cheap.

Ron
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