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I just am not satisfied

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Old November 21st 18, 08:08 PM posted to rec.audio.high-end
Trevor Wilson
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Posts: 776
Default I just am not satisfied

On 22/11/2018 12:20 am, wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 20, 2018 at 9:54:19 PM UTC-5, wrote:
>> On Tuesday, November 20, 2018 at 6:01:26 AM UTC-5, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>> On 5/09/2018 9:09 pm,
>>>> I just am not satisfied with the sound from any solid state amplifiers.
>>>> I have tried high end home amps and even some top of the line amps made
>>>> for commercial use. (Stage equipment).
>>>> I miss my old tube system that I had years ago. Those tube amps pumped
>>>> out 300W (RMS) and had more actual power than my current 1200W (RMS)
>>>> solid state system..

>>> I'd be curious to know which valve amps you had that
>>> could deliver 300 Watts (continuous). 1,200 Watts,
>>> continuous, is impossible, unless you are operating on a
>>> multi-phase power supply.

>> Not necessarily. let's look at the details.

> ...
>> Now, let's do the same for this hypothetical 1200 watt amp:
>> assume the same 40% class-AB efficiency, but we need much less
>> of a power budget for everything else, so consumption from the
>> supply is 3000 Watts. Assume the same transformer efficiency,
>> that's 3400 watts. At 120 volts, that's 28 amps at 120 VAC,
>> a lot to be sure, but it would run fine on a 30 amp. Run it at
>> 240 VAC, that's 14 amps.

> Sorry, I got distracted and forgot the other case. The guy
> talks about "stage equipment", so we also need to entertain
> the possibility that this supposed 1200 watt amp is a switcher,
> in which case we're looking at an overall efficiency of 85%,
> which means this 1200 watt amp is pulling, at peak, 1400 watts
> from the wall. At 120 VAC, that's a bit under 12 amps, and would
> run fine on a 15 amp circuit.

**I have, perhaps foolishly, assumed that the amp was a two channel one.

>> Look at it another way, it's like running a 1.25 HP vs a 4 HP motor
>> under load: at 220 VAC, you don't need multi-phase power (well,
>> multi-phase would help startup, but that's not so much of an
>> issue with an amplifier).

> And in the switcher case, that's less than 2 HP.

**Perhaps the OP will reveal some more details of the set-up. Then we
can discuss the issue with more helpful responses.

Trevor Wilson
Old November 26th 18, 09:04 PM posted to rec.audio.high-end
Peter Wieck[_2_]
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Posts: 114
Default I just am not satisfied

Guys and gals:

The OP is a person-of-strong-opinion. Nothing wrong with that, but if the starting point is "stage equipment", that puts a specific slant on what is being represented herein.

Back in the day, now 50 years ago, I ran a professional 35mm RCA projection system that an individual had donated to my high-school, along with the building it was in and other gifts. It was an RCA system set up for visual Mono and magnetic stereo - but the school used only the visual sound-track. That was a total of six (6) 6L6 output tubes driven by 6SN7 drivers to a single pretty large horn behind the screen. Did fine. My guess is about 60 watts, continuous if necessary. The stereo amps were 4 x 6L6 each.

I did once observe reinforcement equipment at a large NYC theater venue - multiple tube amps that may, in total, have reached 500 watts or so. It is perhaps possible that a WHO concert back in the day might have 1000 +/- watts on stage, or maybe the cumulative effect of Woodstock. But 3,000 watts? OK, then.

Point being that not one single example cited herein was designed as an exercise in High Fidelity. More an exercise in making noise as efficiently as possible with the equipment at-hand.

Hindsight is always 20:20, often enhanced by wishful thinking to 20:10 or even better. As I suggested earlier, solid-state equipment of high wattage (and decent quality) is totally merciless on the signal fed to it. Tube equipment driven to clipping is very soft (and easy) on the same sources.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

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