Maybe god just needed to use the restroom.......


Holy ****.
(Mark Steven Brooks/Elaterium Music)

Please take off the jokes regarding God. Does not belong here.
Obviously the people who answered this are small minded and do not
believe in divine intervention even when it is the smallest of things
to let you know he is listening.

Please take off the jokes regarding God. Does not belong here.
Obviously the people who answered this are small minded and do not
believe in divine intervention even when it is the smallest of things
to let you know he is listening.


God walks into a bar.....
(Mark Steven Brooks/Elaterium Music)

Please take off the jokes regarding God. Does not belong here.
Obviously the people who answered this are small minded and do not
believe in divine intervention even when it is the smallest of things
to let you know he is listening.


Jesus walks into a Holiday Inn, put a couple of nails down on the counter, says
"can you put me up for the night?".

Ba-boom.
(Mark Steven Brooks/Elaterium Music)

Please take off the jokes regarding God. Does not belong here.
Obviously the people who answered this are small minded and do not
believe in divine intervention even when it is the smallest of things
to let you know he is listening.


My God can kick the **** out of your God!
(Mark Steven Brooks/Elaterium Music)

Christian Serig wrote:

Please take off the jokes regarding God. Does not belong here.
Obviously the people who answered this are small minded and do not
believe in divine intervention even when it is the smallest of things
to let you know he is listening.

Please leave off with assitgning gender to any so-called supreme being;
that is the height of human arrogance and male sexism.

--
ha

hank alrich wrote:

Christian Serig wrote:


Please take off the jokes regarding God. Does not belong here.
Obviously the people who answered this are small minded and do not
believe in divine intervention even when it is the smallest of things
to let you know he is listening.


Please leave off with assitgning gender to any so-called supreme being;
that is the height of human arrogance and male sexism.

I vividly recall the response of a Buddhist teacher some years ago to a student's bemoaning the sad state of affairs in the world, "When you start with the concept that God is a man and He's ****ed off, this is what you get."\

hank alrich wrote:



Please leave off with assitgning gender to any so-called supreme being;
that is the height of human arrogance and male sexism.


While I agree that assigning a gender is rather limiting, I
also find that many people's eyebrows go up when I call it
"it." Like that makes it less human or something. :-)


Bob
--

"Things should be described as simply as possible, but no
simpler."

A. Einstein

Bob Cain wrote:

hank alrich wrote:


Please leave off with assitgning gender to any so-called supreme being;
that is the height of human arrogance and male sexism.


While I agree that assigning a gender is rather limiting, I also find
that many people's eyebrows go up when I call it "it." Like that makes
it less human or something. :-)

English lacks the gender-neutral tense which many other languages use for the task. Arabic comes to mind...

Bob Cain wrote:

hank alrich wrote:

Please leave off with assitgning gender to any so-called supreme being;
that is the height of human arrogance and male sexism.

While I agree that assigning a gender is rather limiting, I
also find that many people's eyebrows go up when I call it
"it." Like that makes it less human or something. :-)

Less human? Ya think? g

The Jesus Christ Chainsaw Massacree movie has now taken in (so to speak)
over a quarter billion murkin dollahs. There's our humanity.

--
ha

Kurt Albershardt wrote:

Bob Cain wrote:


hank alrich wrote:


Please leave off with assitgning gender to any so-called supreme being;
that is the height of human arrogance and male sexism.



While I agree that assigning a gender is rather limiting, I also find
that many people's eyebrows go up when I call it "it." Like that
makes it less human or something. :-)


English lacks the gender-neutral tense which many other languages use
for the task. Arabic comes to mind...


So Muhammad wasn't quite the male chauvenist we've been
(very erroneously) taught. :-)


Bob
--

"Things should be described as simply as possible, but no
simpler."

A. Einstein

Bob Cain wrote:

Kurt Albershardt wrote:

Bob Cain wrote:


hank alrich wrote:


Please leave off with assitgning gender to any so-called supreme being;
that is the height of human arrogance and male sexism.

While I agree that assigning a gender is rather limiting, I also find
that many people's eyebrows go up when I call it "it." Like that
makes it less human or something. :-)

English lacks the gender-neutral tense which many other languages use
for the task. Arabic comes to mind...

So Muhammad wasn't quite the male chauvenist we've been (very
erroneously) taught. :-)

Not only that, but the vast majority of the oft-labeled "misogynist" directives in the Koran were actually *radically progressive* for their time. God forbid we should interpret these holy tomes in the historical context which/when they were written!

I'd like to relate a story if I may that is relevent to the discussion
(he/her/it/God):

About 20 years ago the band I was in (Kub Coda band) was doing a gig somewhere
in Ct. While we were setting up a sweet 5 year old girl was watching
(presumably the owners' daughter). She came up to me and said; "look, I found
a penny", to which I replied "well make a wish and don't tell anyone what it
is". She said "I'll only tell God, HE won't tell on me". I don't know why but
I immediately said "how do you know God is a he? God might be a she, or God
might be both he AND she". Her eyes got really wide and she said "wow!)".
She totally got it. Anyway, a few minutes later I saw her playing pinball and
went up say hi. She turned around looking very angry and said to me "my mommy
told me never to talk to you again!".

There I went, interfering with her Christian indoctrination. I like to think
that somehow she has never forgotten the insight she got.
(Mark Steven Brooks/Elaterium Music)

Christian Serig wrote:

Please take off the jokes regarding God. Does not belong here.

First we hear that God doesn't throw dice (x), and now that God doesn't
have a Sense of Humour. I would have thought that it was a prerequisite
for Surviving at that Desk looking down on Creation for Eons ....

(x) Einstein tried to make that point stick, but failed, Bohr, whose
grandchildred I went to school with, prevailed with the assertion that
"perhaps He likes to". (x)

O;-)

(x) any confusion of the reader is intentional ....


Kind regards

Peter Larsen



--
*******************************************
* My site is at: http://www.muyiovatki.dk *
*******************************************

(hank alrich)
Please leave off with assitgning gender to any so-called supreme being;
that is the height of human arrogance and male sexism.

Speaking for the Allmighty, are we Hank? Are we putting words in God's
mouth now? I mean I don't disagree that the Creator is the origin of both
genders, but you may be importuning a bit when you presume to speak on "His"
behalf and demand a change in the historical manner the Creator has been
addressed.

Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Off the Morning Show! & sleepin' In... / Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

While I agree that assigning a gender is rather limiting,
I also find that many people's eyebrows go up when I call
it "it." Like that makes it less human or something. :-)

Unfortunately, English does not have a genderless pronoun that implies
sentience.

but you may be importuning a bit when you presume to speak on "His"
behalf and demand a change in the historical manner the Creator has been
addressed.

!!!!rotflmfao!!!!
show me one word"god" ever said that was not just man speaking on "its"
behalf
George

In article ,
George wrote:
but you may be importuning a bit when you presume to speak on "His"
behalf and demand a change in the historical manner the Creator has been
addressed.

!!!!rotflmfao!!!!
show me one word"god" ever said that was not just man speaking on "its"
behalf

He said "fiat lux" I believe.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Mark Steven Brooks wrote:

I'd like to relate a story if I may that is relevent to the discussion
(he/her/it/God):

About 20 years ago the band I was in (Kub Coda band) was doing a gig
somewhere in Ct. While we were setting up a sweet 5 year old girl was
watching (presumably the owners' daughter). She came up to me and said;
"look, I found a penny", to which I replied "well make a wish and don't
tell anyone what it is". She said "I'll only tell God, HE won't tell on
me". I don't know why but I immediately said "how do you know God is a
he? God might be a she, or God might be both he AND she". Her eyes got
really wide and she said "wow!)". She totally got it. Anyway, a few
minutes later I saw her playing pinball and went up say hi. She turned
around looking very angry and said to me "my mommy told me never to talk
to you again!".

There I went, interfering with her Christian indoctrination. I like to
think that somehow she has never forgotten the insight she got.
(Mark Steven Brooks/Elaterium Music)

So her mommy really wanted to be God but couldn't face that. g

--
ha

WillStG wrote:

Speaking for the Allmighty, are we Hank? Are we putting words in God's
mouth now? I mean I don't disagree that the Creator is the origin of both
genders, but you may be importuning a bit when you presume to speak on "His"
behalf and demand a change in the historical manner the Creator has been
addressed.

I figure I'm as entitled as any other arrogant prick who decides to
speak for the humanly unimaginable. Seeking to justify the all powerful
penishood of thyself, are ya?

I don't do "creator" as any kind of entity. I speculate it's a process,
not a being. As to the "he" thing, that's male chauvinism.

As for "reality", try this:

http://www.simulation-argument.com/


--
ha

hank alrich wrote:



I don't do "creator" as any kind of entity. I speculate it's a process,
not a being.

A rose by any other name...


As for "reality", try this:

http://www.simulation-argument.com/

What a resource! Thanks. I really enjoy that argument,
particularly the speculation that quantum mechanics merely
exposes the granularity of the simulation's event list,
below which it becomes the Monte Carlo method on a grand
scale. The pixel size, so to speak. :-)


Bob
--

"Things should be described as simply as possible, but no
simpler."

A. Einstein

I really opened up a can of worms here. Yes I was wrong for calling
him he. I apoligize. I guess growing up you always here of God being a
he when actually we do not really know. Except for the fact there is
someone very much so listening to are thoughts, hearts and actions and
if we put positive energy into this you will be rewarded. Thank you
for enlightening me to looking at this in a new context.


Peter Larsen wrote in message ...
Christian Serig wrote:

Please take off the jokes regarding God. Does not belong here.

First we hear that God doesn't throw dice (x), and now that God doesn't
have a Sense of Humour. I would have thought that it was a prerequisite
for Surviving at that Desk looking down on Creation for Eons ....

(x) Einstein tried to make that point stick, but failed, Bohr, whose
grandchildred I went to school with, prevailed with the assertion that
"perhaps He likes to". (x)

O;-)

(x) any confusion of the reader is intentional ....


Kind regards

Peter Larsen

(hank alrich)

I figure I'm as entitled as any other arrogant prick who decides to
speak for the humanly unimaginable. Seeking to justify the all powerful
penishood of thyself, are ya?

So Hank, you would call Jesus of Nazareth, who taught his followers to pray
"Our Father" a chavinistic "arrogant prick"? That is a rather ignorant
pronouncement to make I think; Jesus was quite revolutionary in the way he
treated women and many Theologians consider him to have been truly a
"feminist".

I don't do "creator" as any kind of entity. I speculate it's a process,
not a being. As to the "he" thing, that's male chauvinism.

The issue isn't whether you "do creator" or not, rather it is who are you
to judge the relationship another person might have with God, who are you to
judge the relationship Jesus had with God? If God has spent the last 2000
years trying to get across the concept that his relationship to man is a
"parent to child" relationship, not a "master - servant" relationship, who do
you think you are you to claim that "He" does not want to be addressed as one's
"Father"?

Yeah I wrote about God in my song "Tales Of The Neophyte" as being the
Mother. So God has a feminine side, Father, Mother, it's all the same address,
because the Creator is "One".

Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Off the Morning Show! & sleepin' In... / Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

WillStG wrote:
(hank alrich)

I figure I'm as entitled as any other arrogant prick who decides to
speak for the humanly unimaginable. Seeking to justify the all powerful
penishood of thyself, are ya?

So Hank, you would call Jesus of Nazareth, who taught his followers to pray
"Our Father" a chavinistic "arrogant prick"? That is a rather ignorant
pronouncement to make I think; Jesus was quite revolutionary in the way he
treated women and many Theologians consider him to have been truly a
"feminist".

Did he actually do that? I know that when it got translated into Latin
it was definitely rendered as "Pater" and of course in English it's always
translated as "Father" but I honestly don't know if the original absolutely
implied gender or not.

As it is, gender implications in English seem to have changed since I was
in school. "Man is vivparous and he bears live young" was a perfectly
reasonable sentence not long ago, although today it seems cumbersome and we
don't expect the male to always include the female. How are Hebrew and
Aramaic in that regard?
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

George

!!!!rotflmfao!!!!
show me one word"god" ever said that was not just man speaking on "its"
behalf

On a meter George? How are you going to wire that into my Oversoul?

Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Off the Morning Show! & sleepin' In... / Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

On Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:56:14 -0800, Bob Cain
wrote:

hank alrich wrote:
http://www.simulation-argument.com/

What a resource! Thanks. I really enjoy that argument,
particularly the speculation that quantum mechanics merely
exposes the granularity of the simulation's event list,
below which it becomes the Monte Carlo method on a grand
scale. The pixel size, so to speak. :-)

Aren't you bothered by the argument's linear model?
IOW, can chaotic "reality" be modeled linearly?

Chris Hornbeck

"Thank you so much Dr. Bostrom. You have proved that
my psychiatrist was wrong all along." (anonymous)

Scott Dorsey wrote:

George wrote:

but you may be importuning a bit when you presume to speak on "His"
behalf and demand a change in the historical manner the Creator has been
addressed.

!!!!rotflmfao!!!!
show me one word"god" ever said that was not just man speaking on "its"
behalf

He said "fiat lux" I believe.

I thought Edison said that.

--
ha

hank alrich wrote:
Scott Dorsey wrote:

George wrote:

but you may be importuning a bit when you presume to speak on "His"
behalf and demand a change in the historical manner the Creator has been
addressed.

!!!!rotflmfao!!!!
show me one word"god" ever said that was not just man speaking on "its"
behalf

He said "fiat lux" I believe.

I thought Edison said that.

Possibly, but much later. It was in the public domain by then.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

(Scott Dorsey)

Did he actually do that? I know that when it got translated into Latin
it was definitely rendered as "Pater" and of course in English it's always
translated as "Father" but I honestly don't know if the original absolutely
implied gender or not.

Yes. The Hebrew word is "Abba" and it means "Father". It was used in
every suirviving record all the time, and in the "Lord's Prayer".

If Hank didn't intend to call Jesus a sexist "Arrogant prick" for
teaching people God was "Our Father", he should've stuck to talking about what
he knows. That PC **** is intended to be insulting, whether he is aware of it
or not.

Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Off the Morning Show! & sleepin' In... / Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

(Scott Dorsey)

As it is, gender implications in English seem to have changed since I was
in school. "Man is vivparous and he bears live young" was a perfectly
reasonable sentence not long ago, although today it seems cumbersome and we
don't expect the male to always include the female. How are Hebrew and
Aramaic in that regard?

My Jewish friends say that all Semitic languages lack gender neutral
expressions, everything is gendered.

And sorry, "Abba" is the aramaic from the original texts.

Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Off the Morning Show! & sleepin' In... / Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

And sorry, "Abba" is the aramaic from the original texts.

My understanding is that "abba" is informal, and translates into English more as
"daddy" than "father."

In article ,
ospam (WillStG) wrote:

(Scott Dorsey)

Did he actually do that? I know that when it got translated into Latin
it was definitely rendered as "Pater" and of course in English it's always
translated as "Father" but I honestly don't know if the original absolutely
implied gender or not.

Yes. The Hebrew word is "Abba" and it means "Father". It was used in
every suirviving record all the time, and in the "Lord's Prayer".

If Hank didn't intend to call Jesus a sexist "Arrogant prick" for
teaching people God was "Our Father", he should've stuck to talking about what
he knows. That PC **** is intended to be insulting, whether he is aware of it
or not.

something first has to exist before we should bother over what sex it
might be

and you don't for even one second really belive Jesus was the son of
God, do you?
George

I don't do "creator" as any kind of entity. I speculate it's a process,
not a being.

Right, I think one of the prime causes of violence and suffering in this world
comes from people anthroporphising 'God'. A God with desires, with an ego etc.

I think of God as the experience of oneness that occurs when one steps outside
one's ego. God for me is a verb, or perhaps an adverb.
(Mark Steven Brooks/Elaterium Music)

If God has spent the last 2000
years trying to get across the concept that his relationship to man is a
"parent to child" relationship, not a "master - servant" relationship, who do
you think you are you to claim that "He" does not want to be addressed as one's
"Father"?

God as person again, a very immature response I think. The problem with 'he'
is that all of our patriarchal concepts are overlayed on to something which
transcends all of these things. It is because of this 'he' (Allah or Jesus
etc.) is that 'he' then needs to be placated, defended, etc. There will be no
peace on this earth until people get beyond these
infantile concepts.

The Christian Scientists always refer to 'God' as
'our father/mother God'. I always liked that. You'll never see images of
Christ (or Mary Baker Eddy for that matter) in a CS church. No images to get
hung up on. (No, I am not a CS).
(Mark Steven Brooks/Elaterium Music)

you don't for even one second really belive Jesus was the son of
God, do you?

adopted
(Mark Steven Brooks/Elaterium Music)

How are you going to wire that into my Oversoul?

Ah, a transcendentalist.
(Mark Steven Brooks/Elaterium Music)

something first has to exist before we should bother over what sex it
might be

The point is what the nature of the relationship is. The point is that it
is personal and as close as a Parent and their child should be.

and you don't for even one second really belive Jesus was the son of
God, do you?

Call me a liberal, but I beleive that even you George are a son of God.

Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Off the Morning Show! & sleepin' In... / Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

In article ,
ospam (WillStG) wrote:


something first has to exist before we should bother over what sex it
might be

The point is what the nature of the relationship is. The point is that it
is personal and as close as a Parent and their child should be.

and you don't for even one second really belive Jesus was the son of
God, do you?

Call me a liberal, but I beleive that even you George are a son of God.

and I believe I am as much a god as any, possible more so beacuse I
create my destiny
it is not waiting for me if I say the right words on the right days, or
send enough of my money off to gods adminstrative offices on earth
George

(Mark Steven Brooks)
God as person again, a very immature response I think. The problem with 'he'
is that all of our patriarchal concepts are overlayed on to something which
transcends all of these things.

Jesus taught his followers to pray to "our Father", that was his
relationship with God that he was trying to pass on. If the Creator says "Call
me Dad", who are you Mark to call that sexist or chauvinistic or immature? You
are presuming to speak on God's behalf, when by all accounts "he" has exactly
the opposite opinion of the one you would claim. And in doing so isn't you
who is "anthropomorphizing God", as you lay your own sexist hangups on the
Creator who doesn't have that problem, and on Jesus who, judged by how he
treated women at the time many consider to have been actually a "feminist"?

It is because of this 'he' (Allah or Jesus
etc.) is that 'he' then needs to be placated, defended, etc. There will be
no
peace on this earth until people get beyond these
infantile concepts.

So it is because Jesus prayed "our Father" that there is no world peace?
Now _that_ is infantile.

Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Off the Morning Show! & sleepin' In... / Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

(Mark Steven Brooks)

Ah, a transcendentalist.

And beyond.

Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Off the Morning Show! & sleepin' In... / Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits