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Keep the Mac or eBay it?



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 4th 20, 04:08 AM posted to rec.audio.pro
Tobiah
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Posts: 644
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

Model Name: Mac mini
Model Identifier: Macmini7,1
Processor Name: Intel Core i5
Processor Speed: 1.4 GHz
Number of Processors: 1
Total Number of Cores: 2
L2 Cache (per Core): 256 KB
L3 Cache: 3 MB
Memory: 4 GB


It has a 5400RPM hard drive which can be upgraded
with about an hour's effort and some luck.

The RAM is soldered in and can not be upgraded, at
least not by me.

I've wanted to switch to Mac for a long time, but
I have never owned one before now. My current PC
has an AMD Phenom(tm) II X4 910 Processor, 8Gig
and Windows 10. I don't want to take a noticeable
performance hit. How much is 4Gig going to hamper
things on a Mac? I do use some large Kontakt libraries.

I also need to upgrade the monitor since only the
HDMI output will drive the resolution I'm after.
I wanted to do that anyway, but that's another $350.

I can get about $300 for this thing on eBay.
If I were to upgrade, are the Mini's the way to
go? I understand the towers are thousands of
dollars.

I've never been able to bridge the gap to get to
a Mac. I would miss being able to get my hands
into the machine and replace/upgrade parts of it.
Maybe hackintosh? What are serious Mac users using
for tracking and production?

Sorry for rambling.
Ads
  #2  
Old June 4th 20, 05:14 AM posted to rec.audio.pro
geoff
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Posts: 1,632
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

On 4/06/2020 3:08 pm, Tobiah wrote:
> Model Name:┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬* Mac mini
> Model Identifier:┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬* Macmini7,1
> Processor Name:┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬* Intel Core i5
> Processor Speed:┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬* 1.4 GHz
> Number of Processors:┬*┬* 1
> Total Number of Cores:┬* 2
> L2 Cache (per Core):┬*┬*┬* 256 KB
> L3 Cache:┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬* 3 MB
> Memory: 4 GB
>
>
> It has a 5400RPM hard drive which can be upgraded
> with about an hour's effort and some luck.
>
> The RAM is soldered in and can not be upgraded, at
> least not by me.
>
> I've wanted to switch to Mac for a long time, but
> I have never owned one before now.┬* My current PC
> has an AMD Phenom(tm) II X4 910 Processor, 8Gig
> and Windows 10.┬* I don't want to take a noticeable
> performance hit.┬* How much is 4Gig going to hamper
> things on a Mac?┬* I do use some large Kontakt libraries.
>
> I also need to upgrade the monitor since only the
> HDMI output will drive the resolution I'm after.
> I wanted to do that anyway, but that's another $350.
>
> I can get about $300 for this thing on eBay.
> If I were to upgrade, are the Mini's the way to
> go?┬* I understand the towers are thousands of
> dollars.
>
> I've never been able to bridge the gap to get to
> a Mac.┬* I would miss being able to get my hands
> into the machine and replace/upgrade parts of it.
> Maybe hackintosh?┬* What are serious Mac users using
> for tracking and production?
>
> Sorry for rambling.



The thing that jumps out at me from all this is ......"Why ?".

geoff

  #3  
Old June 4th 20, 05:23 AM posted to rec.audio.pro
Tobiah
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Posts: 644
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

> The thing that jumps out at me from all this is ......"Why ?".
>
> geoff
>


Why what?
  #4  
Old June 4th 20, 06:33 AM posted to rec.audio.pro
Phil W
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Posts: 142
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

Am 04.06.2020 um 06:14 schrieb geoff:
> On 4/06/2020 3:08 pm, Tobiah wrote:
>> Model Name:┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬* Mac mini
>> Model Identifier:┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬* Macmini7,1
>> Processor Name:┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬* Intel Core i5
>> Processor Speed:┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬* 1.4 GHz
>> Number of Processors:┬*┬* 1
>> Total Number of Cores:┬* 2
>> L2 Cache (per Core):┬*┬*┬* 256 KB
>> L3 Cache:┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬*┬* 3 MB
>> Memory: 4 GB
>>
>>
>> It has a 5400RPM hard drive which can be upgraded
>> with about an hour's effort and some luck.
>>
>> The RAM is soldered in and can not be upgraded, at
>> least not by me.
>>
>> I've wanted to switch to Mac for a long time, but
>> I have never owned one before now.┬* My current PC
>> has an AMD Phenom(tm) II X4 910 Processor, 8Gig
>> and Windows 10.┬* I don't want to take a noticeable
>> performance hit.┬* How much is 4Gig going to hamper
>> things on a Mac?┬* I do use some large Kontakt libraries.
>>
>> I also need to upgrade the monitor since only the
>> HDMI output will drive the resolution I'm after.
>> I wanted to do that anyway, but that's another $350.
>>
>> I can get about $300 for this thing on eBay.
>> If I were to upgrade, are the Mini's the way to
>> go?┬* I understand the towers are thousands of
>> dollars.
>>
>> I've never been able to bridge the gap to get to
>> a Mac.┬* I would miss being able to get my hands
>> into the machine and replace/upgrade parts of it.
>> Maybe hackintosh?┬* What are serious Mac users using
>> for tracking and production?
>>
>> Sorry for rambling.

>
>
> The thing that jumps out at me from all this is ......"Why ?".
>
> geoff


Probably because of the popular misbelief, that one "needs" to use a
Mac, if you want to make music with a computer. Personally, I think that
is rather all about an expensive status symbol for snobs, but nothing else.
Having used friends┬┤ Macs during recording and mixing sessions with them
many times for years, I have learned, that the grass is *not* greener on
either side - Macs are just more expensive and introduce at least the
same amount of everyday computer problems than a Windows-based system.
Besides that, think of the problems introduced by Apple changing
something for audio about every year, which leads to problems with audio
interface drivers, plug-ins, ... if one happens to use an audio
interface, which does not get annual driver updates (=most models by
most manufacturers) to keep up with Apple┬┤s latest changes, you can also
collect a pile of interfaces because of that, because old drivers won┬┤t
work anymore usually.
In my opinion, that is pretty contrary to having a system, that "just
works", so you can keep making music and not need to worry about keeping
the system running - which is pretty much the myth, that most Mac buyers
want to believe.

For example, my Windows-based system still uses the same M-Audio PCI
Delta Audio interface as in the last 17 years with the latest drivers
for Windows Vista/7 still working on Windows 10 nowadays. Yes, I know,
that┬┤s rather luck than anything else, but my Mac friends need to spend
a few hundred EUR every 3-4 years because of lacking drivers for the
latest MacOS, which they need to upgrade to to run other programs.

So, either sell or keep that Mac mini, but if you invest any money, it┬┤s
better spent on upgrades for your Windows-based system, which is a lot
more flexible for upgrading single aspects like RAM, CPU, drives.


Phil
  #5  
Old June 4th 20, 08:34 AM posted to rec.audio.pro
John Williamson
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Posts: 1,690
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

On 04/06/2020 06:33, Phil W wrote:

> For example, my Windows-based system still uses the same M-Audio PCI
> Delta Audio interface as in the last 17 years with the latest drivers
> for Windows Vista/7 still working on Windows 10 nowadays. Yes, I know,
> that┬┤s rather luck than anything else, but my Mac friends need to spend
> a few hundred EUR every 3-4 years because of lacking drivers for the
> latest MacOS, which they need to upgrade to to run other programs.
>

Many years ago, when they introduced Vista, Microsloshed introduced the
Windows Driver Model, which gave all drivers a stable, documented way to
interact with the operating system.

Any WDM compatible driver will work with any version later than XP. The
only problem is that Windows 10 likes to see a "signed" driver, which
early ones are no, but this is easily circumvented.

I'm not going to admit to using a couple of XP drivers for obscure
Windows 98 stuff which just happened to work under Vista, because I got
rid of that interface a while ago.

I am still running a PC which was originally delivered with XP
installed, then updated to Vista, and when I finally installed Windows
10, and told it to accept unsigned drivers, all the Vista ones worked,
even the fingerprint sensor.

Nor am I going to brag about finding a way to run some games that were
originally written to run under Windows 3.0.

> So, either sell or keep that Mac mini, but if you invest any money, it┬┤s
> better spent on upgrades for your Windows-based system, which is a lot
> more flexible for upgrading single aspects like RAM, CPU, drives.
>

This. You also won't have to learn how to work a computer all over again.


--
Tciao for Now!

John.
  #6  
Old June 4th 20, 08:52 AM posted to rec.audio.pro
geoff
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Posts: 1,632
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

On 4/06/2020 4:23 pm, Tobiah wrote:
>> The thing that jumps out at me from all this is ......"Why ?".
>>
>> geoff
>>

>
> Why what?



Why do you feel the need change change your computer (a downgrade in
this particular model instance) that may render your current software
unusable, or at least complicated to get it to work.

geoff
  #7  
Old June 4th 20, 03:53 PM posted to rec.audio.pro
Tobiah
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Posts: 644
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

> Why do you feel the need change change your computer (a downgrade in
> this particular┬* model instance) that may render your current software
> unusable, or at least complicated to get it to work.


Mostly because it's a Unix system. I'm a programmer
by trade, and I spend a lot of time on the command
line. I dual boot Linux and live there for anything
except music. I banged my heart at Linux audio for
enough years. I spent all my time configuring and
none creating. Also my favorite interface is not
yet supported.

So I use Cygwin on Windows to get a decent shell,
but it's a band-aid on a band-aid. I wanted to
be on a Unix OS where I'm comfy, with real audio
support.

Also, a couple of fellow developers at work are
Mac heads and I've seen them use them for years.
I found that it looked like an attractive alternative.

Now, I also wanted a seamless audio production
experience. I'll take into account some of the comments
that have been made here.





  #8  
Old June 4th 20, 04:09 PM posted to rec.audio.pro
John Williamson
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Posts: 1,690
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

On 04/06/2020 15:53, Tobiah wrote:
>> Why do you feel the need change change your computer (a downgrade in
>> this particular model instance) that may render your current software
>> unusable, or at least complicated to get it to work.

>
> Mostly because it's a Unix system. I'm a programmer
> by trade, and I spend a lot of time on the command
> line. I dual boot Linux and live there for anything
> except music. I banged my heart at Linux audio for
> enough years. I spent all my time configuring and
> none creating. Also my favorite interface is not
> yet supported.


Apple software is based on a *nix kernel. That's about as close as it
gets to being a *nix system, as the UI and other stuff is pure Apple.
The hardware is now mostly Intel based, so you can, in theory, use any
x86 compatible operating system.

> Now, I also wanted a seamless audio production
> experience. I'll take into account some of the comments
> that have been made here.
>


In my friends' experience, Macs are great as long as you want to things
their way, and a nightmare if you don't. This even applies to their
phones, which, for example, use a photo file format that nobody else can
read.

The Walled Garden approach makes them reliable within their limits,
which are precisely defined. Outside that garden you are on your own...

If what you want is a seamless production environment, take the hit to
your wallet and get Protools. It "just works", and projects can be
worked on in just about any studio or mastering suite that uses it.

Alternatively, many people use the Adobe suite, where the audio and
video tools work very well together. It is now "Software As A Service",
though, so unless you keep subscribing, it stops working.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.
  #9  
Old June 4th 20, 04:21 PM posted to rec.audio.pro
Mike Rivers[_2_]
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Posts: 2,123
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

On 6/4/2020 10:53 AM, Tobiah wrote:
>> Why do you feel the need change change your computer


> Mostly because it's a Unix system.┬* I'm a programmer
> by trade, and I spend a lot of time on the command
> line.┬* I dual boot Linux and live there for anything
> except music.


I have about 7 active computers around here, some for music, some for
other stuff. Nobody has to have just one.




--
For a good time, call http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com
  #10  
Old June 4th 20, 05:16 PM posted to rec.audio.pro
Tobiah
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Posts: 644
Default Keep the Mac or eBay it?

> Apple software is based on a *nix kernel. That's about as close as it
> gets to being a *nix system, as the UI and other stuff is pure Apple.


From what I can tell, it's a Unix system with a proprietary kernel,
POSIX compliant and certified by The Open Group. The UI is really
just a program that runs in that environment.

I get bash and all of the Unixy command line tools and it feels
like an old pair of blue jeans.

> In my friends' experience, Macs are great as long as you want to things
> their way, and a nightmare if you don't. This even applies to their
> phones, which, for example, use a photo file format that nobody else can
> read.
>
> The Walled Garden approach makes them reliable within their limits,
> which are precisely defined. Outside that garden you are on your own...


Yeah, I'm naturally repelled by their isolated eco-system. I recognize
that even if I made this machine work, eventually, it would be time
to upgrade and they tend to make computers as a unit, rather like
phones. The fact that I can't upgrade the RAM in this machine is
representative of the product. I would miss being able to go down
to Fry's and come back with a new mobo, cpu and ram for a small
assortment of Franklins.

> If what you want is a seamless production environment, take the hit to
> your wallet and get Protools.


I happen to dig Reaper. It's not my gripe. I'm tired of Windows and am
probably looking at OS X through rosy lenses. I like to write programs
that make music, with csound and other tools. I think it would be nice
to do that in a Unix-like environment and have a solid recording
environment available at the same time.





 




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