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#161
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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ATTENTION: ARNIE KREUGER-evaluate this BIC T-4M cassette deck3.75 IPS
jailhouserock wrote:
if there were no holes, we'd still have 44/16 like back in 1983 why did they make 96/24 and 192/24 ? Same reason they made 3.75 ips cassettes. To extend the frequency response and reduce the noise floor. Then the marketing people grabbed onto it to try and make everyone feel that their stuff was obsolete and inferior, and by spending some more money, they could once again be state-of-the-art. That's what marketing people do. |
#162
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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ATTENTION: ARNIE KREUGER-evaluate this BIC T-4M cassette deck 3.75 IPS
jailhouserock wrote:
On Mar 28, 8:40 am, (Scott Dorsey) wrote: Arny Krueger wrote: The RIAA sez that LP sales dropped by about half in the second half of 2006, so something is going on. That's less than CD sales dropped, though, isn't it? --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." CD sales dropped by 60 % in recent years. Because it's being replaced in the marketplace by anotehr DIGITAL format -- downloadable files. Not because people are going back to analog, and CERTANLY not because they're buying more LPs. .. ___ -S "As human beings, we understand the world through simile, analogy, metaphor, narrative and, sometimes, claymation." - B. Mason |
#163
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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ATTENTION: ARNIE KREUGER-evaluate this BIC T-4M cassette deck 3.75 IPS
William Sommerwerck wrote:
good analog will equal/surpass the 192/24 digital resolution. Okay. Name the machine. Not just "analog", a specific machine. This will be fun -- such a machine doesn't and can't exist, at least in the real world. Maybe on some spec sheet, but in the listening room and on the test bench, it can't exist. But Arny, you're the one who's always throwing specs in people's faces. No matter how good the specs are, one eventually has to listen and judge. I seem to recall Arny at least once or twice advocating ABX comparisons, which certainly involve listening and judging. Or am I misremembering? Fact is that the best high speed analog tape doesn't have as much resolution of the lowly audio CD, and again that's something that can and has also been proven in the listening room and on the test bench. I'm not sure what you mean by "resolution", or even if the term has any meaning with respect to subjective quality. It has a defined meaning digital audio. As I've said many times, I prefer digital to analog. But that isn't because it has better paper specs (though it does) -- or that because analog tape has some pretty obvious flaws (though it does) -- it's because I've made recordings, and judge digital to be generally superior to (more accurate than) analog. And that *is* borne out by the specs. ___ -S "As human beings, we understand the world through simile, analogy, metaphor, narrative and, sometimes, claymation." - B. Mason |
#164
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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ATTENTION: ARNIE KREUGER-evaluate this BIC T-4M cassette deck 3.75 IPS
Arny Krueger wrote:
"jailhouserock" wrote in message In bandwidth it is, but not in content- when you take an analog music signal, break it into 1/0's, then make a computer program out of it, then reassemble it with a D/A converter, you are not getting the same thing back again. Well, that's MP3, but its not .wav. and even then, a high-bitrate MP3 made with a decently perfected encoder (e.g. LAME) is going to be tough for the vast majority of people, including 'audiophiles', to differentiate from .wav in a blind test. All this digital stuff, it's pretty robust by now.... ___ -S "As human beings, we understand the world through simile, analogy, metaphor, narrative and, sometimes, claymation." - B. Mason |
#165
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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ATTENTION: ARNIE KREUGER-evaluate this BIC T-4M cassette deck 3.75 IPS
William Sommerwerck wrote:
No matter how good the specs are, one eventually has to listen and judge. You're preaching to the choir. BTW what's www.pcabx.com about if not listening and judging? Because it's not the way one normally listens. abx is _a_ way of judging, not _the only_. But importantly, it's a way that's free of the biases that inhere to the way 'one normally listens'. Now, before you retort with a list of biases it supposedly *introduces*, please confine the list to those that are *inherent* in ABX. This excludes 'the samples are too brief', 'the gear/music is unfamiliar', 'it's fatiguing' and, I suspect, the rest of the list. ___ -S "As human beings, we understand the world through simile, analogy, metaphor, narrative and, sometimes, claymation." - B. Mason |
#166
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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ATTENTION: ARNIE KREUGER-evaluate this BIC T-4M cassette deck 3.75 IPS
jailhouserock wrote:
On Mar 28, 10:45 am, "Mike Rivers" wrote: Is that a promise? Or can we ask you politely to take your case over to rec.audio.opinion and rest it there for a while? you'd need a moderated group, to do that- perhaps you should start one ? then you can be self-proclaimed dictator, and demand CD only members The one moderated NG I know of -- rec.audio.high-end -- regularly includes contributions from 'LP lovers' as well as 'CD only' members. Usually they're arguing with each other, within the rules of the newsgroup. ___ -S "As human beings, we understand the world through simile, analogy, metaphor, narrative and, sometimes, claymation." - B. Mason |
#167
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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ATTENTION: ARNIE KREUGER-evaluate this BIC T-4M cassette deck 3.75 IPS
jailhouserock wrote:
On Mar 28, 11:08 am, "Mike Rivers" wrote: On Mar 28, 10:53 am, "jailhouserock" wrote: Darn! You know, you're right. I recorded the Arlington Philharmonic on Sunday using 44.1 kHz, 16-bits. I listened to the CD in my car on the way home, and it sounded just like Blood, Sweat and Tears. Then I realized that I had selected the wrong CD in the changer. agreed- CD is a great car format Actually, CD's terrible in the sense that if exploited to full, music with quiet sections will sound worse in a car than almost any other medium. However, the geniuses behind the sliders have found ways to 'fix' that, by digitally compressing the dynamic range to a fare-thee-well. So now those CDs sound great in a car! But not so great at home. Unless you're having a party. See, I DID say it. SACD would sound better- unless now, rez doesn't mean much to you ? Only if I can hear it. I doubt my hearing and listening environments were ever good enough to need 'resolution' beyond the ~94ish dB available to dithered Redbook. I doubt yours ever were either. I'm happy that bitdepths 16 are being used in production though, to prevent nasty rounding artifacts from becoming audible. Ditto frequency response above 20 kHz. If it's not 44.1 kHz 16-bit, it's not a CD. well hells bells, digital has progressed a bit beyond that now, hasn't it In some senses, in others, it's just the marketing that has progressed. 16/44.1 is just beyond the the margin of acceptable, where getting something 'wrong' could produce an audible hit; thus to exploit it flawlessly required excellent engineering (in both the hardware and software realms). "Higher rez" formats leave a bigger margin for error, making it in some ways *easier* to achieve the excellent sound CD can offer. ___ -S "As human beings, we understand the world through simile, analogy, metaphor, narrative and, sometimes, claymation." - B. Mason |
#168
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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ATTENTION: ARNIE KREUGER-evaluate this BIC T-4M cassette deck 3.75 IPS
jailhouserock wrote:
On Mar 28, 11:30 am, "Arny Krueger" wrote: Well, that's MP3, but its not .wav. yes, I know that- I've transferred in both on MusicMatch Jukebox Ever made your own MP3s, and compared them to your sources, using ABX software? You might be surprised at the result. ___ -S "As human beings, we understand the world through simile, analogy, metaphor, narrative and, sometimes, claymation." - B. Mason |
#169
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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ATTENTION: ARNIE KREUGER-evaluate this BIC T-4M cassette deck 3.75 IPS
jailhouserock wrote:
On Mar 28, 12:10 pm, "Arny Krueger" wrote: wrote in message jailhouserock wrote: On Mar 28, 8:59 am, "Mike Rivers" wrote: And once you're using 24 bits, that's all the resolution and dynamic range that you can possibly use. If you were comparing 22 kHz 8-bit recording with cassette, I'd say it would be a good idea to move up in digital sample rate and resolution. But 192/24 is overkill. then why did the digital gurus, with engineering degrees, make it ? Because the marketing gurus with MBAs told them it would sell. Agreed. However there has to be some element of "Since we can do it, why not?" in the picture. Also, when the 24/96 chip designs were being contemplated, probably in the mid-1990s, digital was not as well-understood as it is now. For example, the wide availability of good 24/96 chips at reasonable prices greatly facilitated production people finding out for themselves whether higher sample rates were practically advantageous or not. you can never have too much resolution in a recording Is your hearing infinitely resolving? If not, your statement is beyond silly. ___ -S "As human beings, we understand the world through simile, analogy, metaphor, narrative and, sometimes, claymation." - B. Mason |
#170
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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ATTENTION: ARNIE KREUGER-evaluate this BIC T-4M cassette deck 3.75 IPS
jailhouserock wrote:
you want a quick "good-no good" answer ? ask your wife to listen their ears don't lie, and are quick OK, never mind. I think I know what to do with your posts from here on. (Hint: it's not 'reply to them') ___ -S "As human beings, we understand the world through simile, analogy, metaphor, narrative and, sometimes, claymation." - B. Mason |
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