I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

question 2, ceiling and wall treatments?

Thanks for you input

Craig

Craig Ruggels wrote:

I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, ...

question 3. Why such a huge desk in such a small room?

Craig Ruggels wrote:

I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, ...

question 3. Why such a huge desk in such a small room?

Craig Ruggels wrote:

I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

I'd build a 1' high isolation riser with a wood top. Then I'd cut a piece
of carpet to fit & keep it rolled up closeby, just in case. (Try standing
the roll in a corner & see if it traps any bass.)


question 2, ceiling and wall treatments?

Ethan?

Craig Ruggels wrote:

I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

I'd build a 1' high isolation riser with a wood top. Then I'd cut a piece
of carpet to fit & keep it rolled up closeby, just in case. (Try standing
the roll in a corner & see if it traps any bass.)


question 2, ceiling and wall treatments?

Ethan?

"Craig Ruggels" wrote in message
...
I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

Like Agent86 suggested I'd do wood with an optional piece or carpet standing
by. I personally tend to like the way drums sound over hard/reflective
surfaces as opposed to soft/absorptive surfaces.

You may find a short page I did on building a drum isolation floor
interesting. ( although Auralex has a premade product not that might work as
well with lass hassle. ) :
http://www.imjohn.com/DrumFloor/index.htm

Best of luck!

John L Rice

"Craig Ruggels" wrote in message
...
I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

Like Agent86 suggested I'd do wood with an optional piece or carpet standing
by. I personally tend to like the way drums sound over hard/reflective
surfaces as opposed to soft/absorptive surfaces.

You may find a short page I did on building a drum isolation floor
interesting. ( although Auralex has a premade product not that might work as
well with lass hassle. ) :
http://www.imjohn.com/DrumFloor/index.htm

Best of luck!

John L Rice

although Auralex has a premade product not that might work as
well with lass hassle.

Holy crap, I guess drummers can't spell! Correction :
"although Auralex has a premade product now that might work as
well with less hassle."

John L Rice

although Auralex has a premade product not that might work as
well with lass hassle.

Holy crap, I guess drummers can't spell! Correction :
"although Auralex has a premade product now that might work as
well with less hassle."

John L Rice

Craig Ruggels wrote:
I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

Wood. Usually absorption is applied to the walls and ceiling, and the
floor is left reflective.

question 2, ceiling and wall treatments?

There's no single answer to this question. It depends on what
reverberation time you want the whole room to have.

Your room dimensions are in the ratio of 1:1.45:3.72 (H:W:L) which will
have some fairly strong resonant modes at various bass frequencies
(133Hz, 146Hz, 151Hz, 159Hz, 180Hz to name but a few). I assume that
you will not have the whole room open plan, but want subdivide it in
some way?

I have written a spreadsheet that will calculate many of the acoustic
properties of a rectilinear room. You can download this from
http://www.rmmpnet.org/members/ChrisW/index.html then click on "Control
Room Calculator".

You need to enter the room ratios for your room, and then you can fiddle
around with different floor, wall and ceiling materials and see how the
reverberation time changes

Please read the instructions otherwise you could find the spreadsheet
difficult to operate.

Regards

Chris W

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--

Craig Ruggels wrote:
I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

Wood. Usually absorption is applied to the walls and ceiling, and the
floor is left reflective.

question 2, ceiling and wall treatments?

There's no single answer to this question. It depends on what
reverberation time you want the whole room to have.

Your room dimensions are in the ratio of 1:1.45:3.72 (H:W:L) which will
have some fairly strong resonant modes at various bass frequencies
(133Hz, 146Hz, 151Hz, 159Hz, 180Hz to name but a few). I assume that
you will not have the whole room open plan, but want subdivide it in
some way?

I have written a spreadsheet that will calculate many of the acoustic
properties of a rectilinear room. You can download this from
http://www.rmmpnet.org/members/ChrisW/index.html then click on "Control
Room Calculator".

You need to enter the room ratios for your room, and then you can fiddle
around with different floor, wall and ceiling materials and see how the
reverberation time changes

Please read the instructions otherwise you could find the spreadsheet
difficult to operate.

Regards

Chris W

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--

Craig,

sound proofing from outside noise does not apply, but acoustics do

Have a look at the Acoustics FAQ, second in the list on my Articles page:

www.ethanwiner.com/articles.html

It explains acoustic treatment in depth, room ratios, the pros and cons of
carpet versus wood floors, and a lot more.

--Ethan

Craig,

sound proofing from outside noise does not apply, but acoustics do

Have a look at the Acoustics FAQ, second in the list on my Articles page:

www.ethanwiner.com/articles.html

It explains acoustic treatment in depth, room ratios, the pros and cons of
carpet versus wood floors, and a lot more.

--Ethan

thanks Chris,

I am thinking of dividing it roughly in half for it is very boomy
Thanks for the link
Craig

"Chris Whealy" wrote in message
...
Craig Ruggels wrote:
I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

Wood. Usually absorption is applied to the walls and ceiling, and the
floor is left reflective.

question 2, ceiling and wall treatments?

There's no single answer to this question. It depends on what
reverberation time you want the whole room to have.

Your room dimensions are in the ratio of 1:1.45:3.72 (H:W:L) which will
have some fairly strong resonant modes at various bass frequencies
(133Hz, 146Hz, 151Hz, 159Hz, 180Hz to name but a few). I assume that
you will not have the whole room open plan, but want subdivide it in
some way?

I have written a spreadsheet that will calculate many of the acoustic
properties of a rectilinear room. You can download this from
http://www.rmmpnet.org/members/ChrisW/index.html then click on "Control
Room Calculator".

You need to enter the room ratios for your room, and then you can fiddle
around with different floor, wall and ceiling materials and see how the
reverberation time changes

Please read the instructions otherwise you could find the spreadsheet
difficult to operate.

Regards

Chris W

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--

thanks Chris,

I am thinking of dividing it roughly in half for it is very boomy
Thanks for the link
Craig

"Chris Whealy" wrote in message
...
Craig Ruggels wrote:
I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

Wood. Usually absorption is applied to the walls and ceiling, and the
floor is left reflective.

question 2, ceiling and wall treatments?

There's no single answer to this question. It depends on what
reverberation time you want the whole room to have.

Your room dimensions are in the ratio of 1:1.45:3.72 (H:W:L) which will
have some fairly strong resonant modes at various bass frequencies
(133Hz, 146Hz, 151Hz, 159Hz, 180Hz to name but a few). I assume that
you will not have the whole room open plan, but want subdivide it in
some way?

I have written a spreadsheet that will calculate many of the acoustic
properties of a rectilinear room. You can download this from
http://www.rmmpnet.org/members/ChrisW/index.html then click on "Control
Room Calculator".

You need to enter the room ratios for your room, and then you can fiddle
around with different floor, wall and ceiling materials and see how the
reverberation time changes

Please read the instructions otherwise you could find the spreadsheet
difficult to operate.

Regards

Chris W

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--

John L Rice wrote:


"Craig Ruggels" wrote in message
...
I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

Like Agent86 suggested I'd do wood with an optional piece or carpet
standing
by. I personally tend to like the way drums sound over hard/reflective
surfaces as opposed to soft/absorptive surfaces.

Wood for sound. Carpet to keep the distance between the bass drum & the
drummer constant.

And speaking of which...

You may find a short page I did on building a drum isolation floor
interesting.

The closet rod brackets are pure genius. But might not work as well if you
had to record a variety of kits & drummers.

John L Rice wrote:


"Craig Ruggels" wrote in message
...
I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

Like Agent86 suggested I'd do wood with an optional piece or carpet
standing
by. I personally tend to like the way drums sound over hard/reflective
surfaces as opposed to soft/absorptive surfaces.

Wood for sound. Carpet to keep the distance between the bass drum & the
drummer constant.

And speaking of which...

You may find a short page I did on building a drum isolation floor
interesting.

The closet rod brackets are pure genius. But might not work as well if you
had to record a variety of kits & drummers.

agent86 wrote in message ...
Craig Ruggels wrote:

I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

I'd build a 1' high isolation riser with a wood top. Then I'd cut a piece
of carpet to fit & keep it rolled up closeby, just in case. (Try standing
the roll in a corner & see if it traps any bass.)


Why an isolation riser - for the neighbors or acoustics?

agent86 wrote in message ...
Craig Ruggels wrote:

I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

I'd build a 1' high isolation riser with a wood top. Then I'd cut a piece
of carpet to fit & keep it rolled up closeby, just in case. (Try standing
the roll in a corner & see if it traps any bass.)


Why an isolation riser - for the neighbors or acoustics?

Mike Caffrey wrote:

agent86 wrote in message
...
Craig Ruggels wrote:

I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

I'd build a 1' high isolation riser with a wood top. Then I'd cut a
piece
of carpet to fit & keep it rolled up closeby, just in case. (Try
standing the roll in a corner & see if it traps any bass.)


Why an isolation riser - for the neighbors or acoustics?

Either & both.

Mike Caffrey wrote:

agent86 wrote in message
...
Craig Ruggels wrote:

I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

I'd build a 1' high isolation riser with a wood top. Then I'd cut a
piece
of carpet to fit & keep it rolled up closeby, just in case. (Try
standing the roll in a corner & see if it traps any bass.)


Why an isolation riser - for the neighbors or acoustics?

Either & both.

agent86 wrote in message ...
Mike Caffrey wrote:

agent86 wrote in message
...
Craig Ruggels wrote:

I am converting a 11'7" x 29'9" space into a project studio, 11' mixing
desk, seven piece drum kit. sound proofing from outside noise does not
apply, but acoustics do. under the desk approx 73 sq ft of Brazilian
cheery
the rest 277' is concrete. the ceiling is 8ft high.

question 1. would you put wood under the kit or carpet

I'd build a 1' high isolation riser with a wood top. Then I'd cut a
piece
of carpet to fit & keep it rolled up closeby, just in case. (Try
standing the roll in a corner & see if it traps any bass.)


Why an isolation riser - for the neighbors or acoustics?

Either & both.

What are the acoustical benefits of raising the drums off the floor?

Mike Caffrey wrote:

What are the acoustical benefits of raising the drums off the floor?

Drums are capable of putting out a large amount of energy & particularly a
lot of LF energy. Wood frame walls, floors & ceilings are (typically)
quite resonant. Masonry walls & floors, while not very resonant, are
pretty good conductors of sound waves & (usually) are solidly connected to
frame walls & ceilings at some point not too far away from the drums.

I've always operated on the assumption that uncontrolled resonances in the
recording environment are not a good thing. (The expert acousticians can
keep me honest here.) In a perfect world, you might have the walls &
ceiling isolated from the floor, a floating floor, or even a completely
isolated "Room within a room". But for a project studio in a pre-existing
structure, it's usually easier & cheaper to isolate the drums (or
amplifiers) instead of knocking down & rebuilding walls.

YMMV.

agent86 wrote in message ...
Mike Caffrey wrote:

What are the acoustical benefits of raising the drums off the floor?

Drums are capable of putting out a large amount of energy & particularly a
lot of LF energy. Wood frame walls, floors & ceilings are (typically)
quite resonant. Masonry walls & floors, while not very resonant, are
pretty good conductors of sound waves & (usually) are solidly connected to
frame walls & ceilings at some point not too far away from the drums.

I've always operated on the assumption that uncontrolled resonances in the
recording environment are not a good thing. (The expert acousticians can
keep me honest here.) In a perfect world, you might have the walls &
ceiling isolated from the floor, a floating floor, or even a completely
isolated "Room within a room". But for a project studio in a pre-existing
structure, it's usually easier & cheaper to isolate the drums (or
amplifiers) instead of knocking down & rebuilding walls.

YMMV.

Thanks. I isolated my drums from the floor a while back to cut down on
the noise for my downstairs neighbor. I did it by putting a drum rise
on 4 car tire. - it took about 15 minutes. It worked well.

I did notice less resonance coming through the control room walls, but
I don't think it's made much of a difference on tape.