[darrelldklein]

The top (smallest) tom on my 1972 Ludwig studio kit (inherited) has
developed an overtone-rattle. I have checked all of the hardware and
tightened/retuned both the top and bottom heads. I could not localize
the offending sound well, except it seems - slightly - to be louder on
the side closest to the other rack tom. I would have thought that
maybe the rattle was coming from inside my head, but my friend heard
it too.

I put in Etymotic ER6I noise-isolating earphones and covered my ears
further with some Howard Leight "ear muffs" to further isolate my
hearing, and used a hypercardiod to try to find the sound.

Can such an overtone/rattle develop from the shell itself? Nothing new
or bad has happened to the kit: it has been in my climate controlled
studio since 1998.

In a full mix, the sound is probably inaudible to a casual listener,
but now for me, it's like Poe's Telltale Heart.

Any wizened studio guru and/or veteran drummer with a silver bullet
cure-all? I do have a bigger tom I could put up, but I just want to
try to fix this.

Thanks.

[Eggbert]

Here are some procedures for chasing rattles and buzzes:

Isolate the drum from the rest of the set or take it into another
room. Hold it by hooking a finger under one of the tension rods and
hang it while striking the drum head. (tighten or remove any mounting
hardware still attached) Does it still rattle? If no, then the noise
is not from that drum but from some other part of the set. If yes,
then there are only a few possible sources for the noise. Mounting
hardware is the most common problem, sometimes it just buzzes and
needs an overhaul or replacement (check any tiny allen screws). Lug
bolts/screws can loosen inside the drum and there is a spring inside
most lugs which needs to be properly damped. The lug must be removed
to check the spring. Sometimes the head itself can rattle if in need
of replacement. The shell could rattle if cracked but rarely. A bad
bearing edge could produce a buzz.


darrelldklein wrote:
The top (smallest) tom on my 1972 Ludwig studio kit (inherited) has
developed an overtone-rattle. I have checked all of the hardware and
tightened/retuned both the top and bottom heads. I could not localize
the offending sound well, except it seems - slightly - to be louder on
the side closest to the other rack tom. I would have thought that
maybe the rattle was coming from inside my head, but my friend heard
it too.

I put in Etymotic ER6I noise-isolating earphones and covered my ears
further with some Howard Leight "ear muffs" to further isolate my
hearing, and used a hypercardiod to try to find the sound.

Can such an overtone/rattle develop from the shell itself? Nothing new
or bad has happened to the kit: it has been in my climate controlled
studio since 1998.

In a full mix, the sound is probably inaudible to a casual listener,
but now for me, it's like Poe's Telltale Heart.

Any wizened studio guru and/or veteran drummer with a silver bullet
cure-all? I do have a bigger tom I could put up, but I just want to
try to fix this.

Thanks.

[darrelldklein]

On Mar 5, 2:26 am, "Eggbert" wrote:
Here are some procedures for chasing rattles and buzzes:

Isolate the drum from the rest of the set or take it into another
room. Hold it by hooking a finger under one of the tension rods and
hang it while striking the drum head. (tighten or remove any mounting
hardware still attached) Does it still rattle? If no, then the noise
is not from that drum but from some other part of the set. If yes,
then there are only a few possible sources for the noise. Mounting
hardware is the most common problem, sometimes it just buzzes and
needs an overhaul or replacement (check any tiny allen screws). Lug
bolts/screws can loosen inside the drum and there is a spring inside
most lugs which needs to be properly damped. The lug must be removed
to check the spring. Sometimes the head itself can rattle if in need
of replacement. The shell could rattle if cracked but rarely. A bad
bearing edge could produce a buzz.



darrelldklein wrote:
The top (smallest) tom on my 1972 Ludwig studio kit (inherited) has
developed an overtone-rattle. I have checked all of the hardware and
tightened/retuned both the top and bottom heads. I could not localize
the offending sound well, except it seems - slightly - to be louder on
the side closest to the other rack tom. I would have thought that
maybe the rattle was coming from inside my head, but my friend heard
it too.

I put in Etymotic ER6I noise-isolating earphones and covered my ears
further with some Howard Leight "ear muffs" to further isolate my
hearing, and used a hypercardiod to try to find the sound.

Can such an overtone/rattle develop from the shell itself? Nothing new
or bad has happened to the kit: it has been in my climate controlled
studio since 1998.

In a full mix, the sound is probably inaudible to a casual listener,
but now for me, it's like Poe's Telltale Heart.

Any wizened studio guru and/or veteran drummer with a silver bullet
cure-all? I do have a bigger tom I could put up, but I just want to
try to fix this.

Thanks.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Thanks. The bearing edge is something I wondered about. I will do
everything you mentioned and put new heads on. What's the treatment
for the bearing edge: check it to see if it's smooth and sand it if it
is not?

Thanks again.

[John L Rice]

"darrelldklein" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Mar 5, 2:26 am, "Eggbert" wrote:
Here are some procedures for chasing rattles and buzzes:

Isolate the drum from the rest of the set or take it into another
room. Hold it by hooking a finger under one of the tension rods and
hang it while striking the drum head. (tighten or remove any mounting
hardware still attached) Does it still rattle? If no, then the noise
is not from that drum but from some other part of the set. If yes,
then there are only a few possible sources for the noise. Mounting
hardware is the most common problem, sometimes it just buzzes and
needs an overhaul or replacement (check any tiny allen screws). Lug
bolts/screws can loosen inside the drum and there is a spring inside
most lugs which needs to be properly damped. The lug must be removed
to check the spring. Sometimes the head itself can rattle if in need
of replacement. The shell could rattle if cracked but rarely. A bad
bearing edge could produce a buzz.


Thanks. The bearing edge is something I wondered about. I will do
everything you mentioned and put new heads on. What's the treatment
for the bearing edge: check it to see if it's smooth and sand it if it
is not?

Thanks again.

Eggbert gave you a lot of great advice but I'd caution you to avoid trying
to make any changes to the bearing edge unless you are really sure you know
what you are doing. It's easier to make a bearing edge worse than better by
trying to 'fix' it.

Like Eggbert said, it's most likely the lug bolts/washers or the spring.

Best of luck!

John L Rice

[Mark]

On Mar 5, 9:50 am, "John L Rice" wrote:
"darrelldklein" wrote in message

oups.com...





On Mar 5, 2:26 am, "Eggbert" wrote:
Here are some procedures for chasing rattles and buzzes:

Isolate the drum from the rest of the set or take it into another
room. Hold it by hooking a finger under one of the tension rods and
hang it while striking the drum head. (tighten or remove any mounting
hardware still attached) Does it still rattle? If no, then the noise
is not from that drum but from some other part of the set. If yes,
then there are only a few possible sources for the noise. Mounting
hardware is the most common problem, sometimes it just buzzes and
needs an overhaul or replacement (check any tiny allen screws). Lug
bolts/screws can loosen inside the drum and there is a spring inside
most lugs which needs to be properly damped. The lug must be removed
to check the spring. Sometimes the head itself can rattle if in need
of replacement. The shell could rattle if cracked but rarely. A bad
bearing edge could produce a buzz.

Thanks. The bearing edge is something I wondered about. I will do
everything you mentioned and put new heads on. What's the treatment
for the bearing edge: check it to see if it's smooth and sand it if it
is not?

Thanks again.

Eggbert gave you a lot of great advice but I'd caution you to avoid trying
to make any changes to the bearing edge unless you are really sure you know
what you are doing. It's easier to make a bearing edge worse than better by
trying to 'fix' it.

Like Eggbert said, it's most likely the lug bolts/washers or the spring.

Best of luck!

John L Rice- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Instead of repeatedly hitting the drum, you might try setting up a
speaker nearby and sending a tone, sweeping to get the resonance
frequency that excites the buzz in a steady fashion, then you might be
able to localize the source easier, by pressing one various parts etc.

You may want to wear hearing protection ...

Mark

[darrelldklein]

On Mar 5, 12:17 pm, "Mark" wrote:
On Mar 5, 9:50 am, "John L Rice" wrote:





"darrelldklein" wrote in message

roups.com...

On Mar 5, 2:26 am, "Eggbert" wrote:
Here are some procedures for chasing rattles and buzzes:

Isolate the drum from the rest of the set or take it into another
room. Hold it by hooking a finger under one of the tension rods and
hang it while striking the drum head. (tighten or remove any mounting
hardware still attached) Does it still rattle? If no, then the noise
is not from that drum but from some other part of the set. If yes,
then there are only a few possible sources for the noise. Mounting
hardware is the most common problem, sometimes it just buzzes and
needs an overhaul or replacement (check any tiny allen screws). Lug
bolts/screws can loosen inside the drum and there is a spring inside
most lugs which needs to be properly damped. The lug must be removed
to check the spring. Sometimes the head itself can rattle if in need
of replacement. The shell could rattle if cracked but rarely. A bad
bearing edge could produce a buzz.

Thanks. The bearing edge is something I wondered about. I will do
everything you mentioned and put new heads on. What's the treatment
for the bearing edge: check it to see if it's smooth and sand it if it
is not?

Thanks again.

Eggbert gave you a lot of great advice but I'd caution you to avoid trying
to make any changes to the bearing edge unless you are really sure you know
what you are doing. It's easier to make a bearing edge worse than better by
trying to 'fix' it.

Like Eggbert said, it's most likely the lug bolts/washers or the spring.

Best of luck!

John L Rice- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Instead of repeatedly hitting the drum, you might try setting up a
speaker nearby and sending a tone, sweeping to get the resonance
frequency that excites the buzz in a steady fashion, then you might be
able to localize the source easier, by pressing one various parts etc.

You may want to wear hearing protection ...

Mark- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Thanks Mark. Good idea. I have hearing protection. Thanks John: I
don't want to turn a minor iritation into a ruined drum.

[John L Rice]

Instead of repeatedly hitting the drum, you might try setting up a
speaker nearby and sending a tone, sweeping to get the resonance
frequency that excites the buzz in a steady fashion, then you might be
able to localize the source easier, by pressing one various parts etc.

You may want to wear hearing protection ...

Mark

Good idea Mark!

Another simpler thing to try would be to hit the drum softly with a concert
bass drum mallet or gong mallet to create a lot of vibration with no real
high end. should be easier to hear the rattle. If you don't have concert
percussion mallets handy (doesn't everyone??? ;-) you can use the beater off
of the bass drum pedal. Wrap a sock or two around it, especially if it's
wood or plastic!

John L Rice

[darrelldklein]

On Mar 5, 11:03 pm, "John L Rice" wrote:
Instead of repeatedly hitting the drum, you might try setting up a
speaker nearby and sending a tone, sweeping to get the resonance
frequency that excites the buzz in a steady fashion, then you might be
able to localize the source easier, by pressing one various parts etc.

You may want to wear hearing protection ...

Mark

Good idea Mark!

Another simpler thing to try would be to hit the drum softly with a concert
bass drum mallet or gong mallet to create a lot of vibration with no real
high end. should be easier to hear the rattle. If you don't have concert
percussion mallets handy (doesn't everyone??? ;-) you can use the beater off
of the bass drum pedal. Wrap a sock or two around it, especially if it's
wood or plastic!

John L Rice

Another good idea. I have a couple extra Speed King pedals, I'll use
the beater off of one.

I actually had some mallets at one time. I can't seem to find them.

Thanks again.

[ChristopheRonald]

drummer geek here. sounds like a pain in the ass. a good way to check
the bearing edge is to take the heads off and sit it on a very very
very VERY flat surface, such as like a kitchen table, and shine a
light around inside it and look outside and see if you see it under
the edge. leave bearing edge work to pros though. easy to schmuck
everything up. check with your local drum shop.

check the lugs and hardware too like everyone said. if you get some
rattles, you might need to pack your lugs with some dampening
material. itll take a day, but itll be worth it in the long run if
these sorta sounds bother you.

isolating it from the room is good too like they said, and a good ole
quiet press roll, or a frequency sweep should find your noise.

good luck! if you continue to have probs email me.

[[email protected]]

On Mar 4, 11:54 pm, "darrelldklein" wrote:
The top (smallest) tom on my 1972 Ludwig studio kit (inherited) has
developed an overtone-rattle.
(snip)

Don here,
I had the identical problem, although since your kit is approx 30
years older than mine it may very well be something loose.

But...

My rattle came from the overhead light fixture. Made me nuts until I
found it. Good luck.

Don O.

[Steven R. Rochlin]

Darrell,

Sorry i missed the beginning of the thread and can't 'get it back' per
se. The rattle may be caused by the small spring inside each lug holder on
the tom. Listen for where the rattle is. A set that old can easily be in
need of some TLC, especially all the drumhead lug holders. Another
possibility is the inner screws that hold the lug holder to the wooden drum
or (maybe but doubtful) the mounting system. Hope this helps, as was a drum
technician for years and still play my personal set often.

Enjoy the Music,

Steven R. Rochlin
http://www.EnjoyTheMusic.com

Where you can find:
Superior Audio, The Absolute Sound,
Review Magazine, The $ensible Sound,
The Audiophile Voice... and MUCH more!

wrote in message
oups.com...
On Mar 4, 11:54 pm, "darrelldklein" wrote:
The top (smallest) tom on my 1972 Ludwig studio kit (inherited) has
developed an overtone-rattle.
(snip)

Don here,
I had the identical problem, although since your kit is approx 30
years older than mine it may very well be something loose.

But...

My rattle came from the overhead light fixture. Made me nuts until I
found it. Good luck.

Don O.

[darrelldklein]

On Mar 7, 4:38 pm, wrote:
On Mar 4, 11:54 pm, "darrelldklein" wrote: The top (smallest) tom on my 1972 Ludwig studio kit (inherited) has
developed an overtone-rattle.

(snip)

Don here,
I had the identical problem, although since your kit is approx 30
years older than mine it may very well be something loose.

But...

My rattle came from the overhead light fixture. Made me nuts until I
found it. Good luck.

Don O.

Thanks to you and everyone else who helped. I am taking the kit apart
this weekend and will post results.