[mcp6453[_2_]]

While I use a CarDeluxe and an M-Audio DIO-2448 on my two primary computers, I
have sound on each computer for non-critical applications. My primary work
computer is one that uses the on-board Intel/Soundmax card through a decent set
of PC speakers. While listening to some FLAC files of songs from the early 70s,
I noticed what sounded like tape hiss. Long story short, upon investigation, I
determined that the hiss is actually some sort of digital crap coming from the
card. It's pretty constant.

Of course no one has ever suggested that the on-board sound cards were even
respectable, but I have never before heard a problem like this one that makes
the card virtually unusable even for non-critical listening. Thinking maybe the
the card was bad, I tried a couple of other computers here that I never use the
sound. Same issue. These on-board audio cards are REALLY bad.

To solve the problem, I hooked up my Griffin iMic as an output device. The
difference is night and day. I'll probably go ahead and get another DIO-2496 or
at least install a Creative Audigy that's in a box around here somewhere.

[Arny Krueger]

"mcp6453" wrote in message

While I use a CarDeluxe and an M-Audio DIO-2448 on my two
primary computers, I have sound on each computer for
non-critical applications. My primary work computer is
one that uses the on-board Intel/Soundmax card through a
decent set of PC speakers. While listening to some FLAC
files of songs from the early 70s, I noticed what sounded
like tape hiss. Long story short, upon investigation, I
determined that the hiss is actually some sort of digital
crap coming from the card. It's pretty constant.

Of course no one has ever suggested that the on-board
sound cards were even respectable, but I have never
before heard a problem like this one that makes the card
virtually unusable even for non-critical listening.
Thinking maybe the the card was bad, I tried a couple of
other computers here that I never use the sound. Same
issue. These on-board audio cards are REALLY bad.

Consider for a second that the particular on-board interface is not exactly
SOTA, even among on-board audio interfaces. Soundmaxes are usually not
*that* bad. It could be a bad sample or it could be a bad implementation by
the system board maker.

Have you tried downloading the latest driver?

To solve the problem, I hooked up my Griffin iMic as an
output device. The difference is night and day. I'll
probably go ahead and get another DIO-2496 or at least
install a Creative Audigy that's in a box around here
somewhere.

The easy fix is a Behringer UCA 202 - more than good enough for your
purpose, about $30, and installs without added software in mainstream OSs.

[Ethan Winer[_3_]]

On Sep 8, 5:54 pm, mcp6453 wrote:
I noticed what sounded like tape hiss. Long story short, upon investigation, I
determined that the hiss is actually some sort of digital crap coming from the
card. It's pretty constant.

Call up the Windows sound card software mixer, then mute or turn down
all sources you don't need. Be sure to go to Properties ... Playback
and tell the mixer to display *all* of the input volume controls.
Sometimes they're active, and adding computer whine type noise, but
hidden from view.

--Ethan

[gjsmo]

On Sep 8, 5:54*pm, mcp6453 wrote:
While I use a CarDeluxe and an M-Audio DIO-2448 on my two primary computers, I
have sound on each computer for non-critical applications. My primary work
computer is one that uses the on-board Intel/Soundmax card through a decent set
of PC speakers. While listening to some FLAC files of songs from the early 70s,
I noticed what sounded like tape hiss. Long story short, upon investigation, I
determined that the hiss is actually some sort of digital crap coming from the
card. It's pretty constant.

Of course no one has ever suggested that the on-board sound cards were even
respectable, but I have never before heard a problem like this one that makes
the card virtually unusable even for non-critical listening. Thinking maybe the
the card was bad, I tried a couple of other computers here that I never use the
sound. Same issue. These on-board audio cards are REALLY bad.

To solve the problem, I hooked up my Griffin iMic as an output device. The
difference is night and day. I'll probably go ahead and get another DIO-2496 or
at least install a Creative Audigy that's in a box around here somewhere.

This sounds a bit like the thing with video cards and how the on-board
ones are always crap. But I'm wondering how bad it really is. Mine
sounds fine, though admittedly it's only a set of JBL's (not anything
expensive). I'm wondering if the sound card's "hiss" could be getting
picked up from various PCB paths on the motherboard. Because I'm not
really sure an iMic would be so much better.

[Jay Ts[_2_]]

Arny Krueger wrote:
"mcp6453" wrote
While I use a CarDeluxe and an M-Audio DIO-2448 on my two primary
computers, I have sound on each computer for non-critical applications.
My primary work computer is one that uses the on-board Intel/Soundmax
card through a decent set of PC speakers. While listening to some FLAC
files of songs from the early 70s, I noticed what sounded like tape
hiss. Long story short, upon investigation, I determined that the hiss
is actually some sort of digital crap coming from the card. It's pretty
constant.

Of course no one has ever suggested that the on-board sound cards were
even respectable, but I have never before heard a problem like this one
that makes the card virtually unusable even for non-critical listening.
Thinking maybe the the card was bad, I tried a couple of other
computers here that I never use the sound. Same issue. These on-board
audio cards are REALLY bad.

Consider for a second that the particular on-board interface is not
exactly SOTA, even among on-board audio interfaces. Soundmaxes are
usually not *that* bad. It could be a bad sample or it could be a bad
implementation by the system board maker.

I think most likely the last. I have an old Toshiba laptop with
Avance AC97 Audio built-in. It also suffers from noise similar to
what the OP described. "Tape hiss" describes it pretty well.

I tried changing settings in the mixer to disable all other sound
sources, but it didn't help at all.

The lesson for me is that it's pretty easy to lose "hi fidelity"
audio quality if things like low price and low power consumption
are given priority over good sound quality.

The easy fix is a Behringer UCA 202

Or something like it. I used an M-Audio Transit USB interface.

Jay Ts

[Arny Krueger]

"gjsmo" wrote in message


On Sep 8, 5:54 pm, mcp6453 wrote:

To solve the problem, I hooked up my Griffin iMic as an
output device. The difference is night and day. I'll
probably go ahead and get another DIO-2496 or at least
install a Creative Audigy that's in a box around here
somewhere.

While the input side of the iMic leaves a lot to be desired, the output side
is approximately CD quality.

This sounds a bit like the thing with video cards and how
the on-board ones are always crap.

Depends on your needs and point of reference. Given that off-board graphics
cards can run like $500 each and some motherboards support 2 of them with
their coprocessers siamesed, on board graphic interfaces can't possibly
compete. OTOH, if all you want to do is business graphics or even playing a
few Blu Rays, on-board interfaces can get the job done.

But I'm wondering how bad it really
is. Mine
sounds fine, though admittedly it's only a set of JBL's
(not anything
expensive). I'm wondering if the sound card's "hiss"
could be getting
picked up from various PCB paths on the motherboard.
Because I'm not
really sure an iMic would be so much better.

Download the Audio Rightmark program freeware measurement program and run
it. It produces a fairly complete technical report in a few minutes. All you
need is a jumper cable from the output to the input of your audio interface.

[Arny Krueger]

"Jay Ts" wrote in message
om

Consider for a second that the particular on-board
interface is not exactly SOTA, even among on-board audio
interfaces. Soundmaxes are usually not *that* bad. It
could be a bad sample or it could be a bad
implementation by the system board maker.

I think most likely the last. I have an old Toshiba
laptop with Avance AC97 Audio built-in. It also suffers
from noise similar to what the OP described. "Tape hiss"
describes it pretty well.

I have some experiences with Avance audio chips on PCI cards. Most of these
are built using the chip vendor's reference design. It was among the
noisiest audio interfaces I've ever heard. Maybe 55 dB dynamic range if you
optimized the level settings. Shortly after this Avance was bought out by
Realtek, who are pretty sharp. The next generation parts were branded
Realtek, and they were at least halfways decent.

[gjsmo]

On Sep 10, 7:25*am, "Arny Krueger" wrote:
"gjsmo" wrote in message



On Sep 8, 5:54 pm, mcp6453 wrote:
To solve the problem, I hooked up my Griffin iMic as an
output device. The difference is night and day. I'll
probably go ahead and get another DIO-2496 or at least
install a Creative Audigy that's in a box around here
somewhere.

While the input side of the iMic leaves a lot to be desired, the output side
is approximately CD quality.

This sounds a bit like the thing with video cards and how
the on-board *ones are always crap.

Depends on your needs and point of reference. Given that off-board graphics
cards can run like $500 each and some motherboards support *2 of them with
their coprocessers siamesed, on board graphic interfaces can't possibly
compete. OTOH, if all you want to do is business graphics or even playing a
few Blu Rays, on-board interfaces can get the job done.

$500??? I got a Radeon 5830 (good gamer card) for $179, you can get a
good 4350 for around $40. But even so, it seems that no matter how
cheap they make a good graphics card (a 4350 is just about the best
for non-gaming), they can't seem to put a good one on the motherboard.

But I'm wondering how bad it really
is. Mine
sounds fine, though admittedly it's only a set of JBL's
(not anything
expensive). I'm wondering if the sound card's "hiss"
could be getting
picked up from various PCB paths on the motherboard.
Because I'm not
really sure an iMic would be so much better.

Download the Audio Rightmark program freeware measurement program and run
it. It produces a fairly complete technical report in a few minutes. All you
need is a jumper cable from the output to the input of your audio interface.

I'll do that...

[Arny Krueger]

"gjsmo" wrote in message

On Sep 10, 7:25 am, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:
"gjsmo" wrote in message



On Sep 8, 5:54 pm, mcp6453 wrote:
To solve the problem, I hooked up my Griffin iMic as an
output device. The difference is night and day. I'll
probably go ahead and get another DIO-2496 or at least
install a Creative Audigy that's in a box around here
somewhere.

While the input side of the iMic leaves a lot to be
desired, the output side is approximately CD quality.

This sounds a bit like the thing with video cards and
how the on-board ones are always crap.

Depends on your needs and point of reference. Given that
off-board graphics cards can run like $500 each and some
motherboards support 2 of them with their coprocessers
siamesed, on board graphic interfaces can't possibly
compete. OTOH, if all you want to do is business
graphics or even playing a few Blu Rays, on-board
interfaces can get the job done.

$500??? I got a Radeon 5830 (good gamer card) for $179,
you can get a good 4350 for around $40. But even so, it
seems that no matter how cheap they make a good graphics
card (a 4350 is just about the best for non-gaming), they
can't seem to put a good one on the motherboard.

Please check out the NVIDIA GeForce GTX 480 cards out there, which are SLI
(multiple cards per motherboard) capable.

[gjsmo]

On Sep 10, 5:07*pm, "Arny Krueger" wrote:
"gjsmo" wrote in message





On Sep 10, 7:25 am, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:
"gjsmo" wrote in message



On Sep 8, 5:54 pm, mcp6453 wrote:
To solve the problem, I hooked up my Griffin iMic as an
output device. The difference is night and day. I'll
probably go ahead and get another DIO-2496 or at least
install a Creative Audigy that's in a box around here
somewhere.

While the input side of the iMic leaves a lot to be
desired, the output side is approximately CD quality.

This sounds a bit like the thing with video cards and
how the on-board ones are always crap.

Depends on your needs and point of reference. Given that
off-board graphics cards can run like $500 each and some
motherboards support 2 of them with their coprocessers
siamesed, on board graphic interfaces can't possibly
compete. OTOH, if all you want to do is business
graphics or even playing a few Blu Rays, on-board
interfaces can get the job done.

$500??? I got a Radeon 5830 (good gamer card) for $179,
you can get a good 4350 for around $40. But even so, it
seems that no matter how cheap they make a good graphics
card (a 4350 is just about the best for non-gaming), they
can't seem to put a good one on the motherboard.

Please check out the NVIDIA GeForce GTX 480 cards out there, which are SLI
(multiple cards per motherboard) capable.

And my Radeon 5830 is Crossfire capable. It's not as good a GPU as the
GTX480 (I don't think), but it's still a gamer card - I can run Crysis
on max (no AA) at 1600x1200, if that means anything to you. It's a
great card - but it's not the best. Still, this is like comparing a
Behringer 202 to the Apogee Duet - they're totally different. My
Radeon is not top-of-the-line. That GTX480 is close.