Physically, I mean. Cone material, dispersion, etc? What exactly makes a
titanium tweeter sound harsher than a silk?

Pretty vague question, I know...but anyone understand what I mean?

Tony


--


What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence? Or, that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

Titanium speakers are not always harsher than silk. I've heard some silk
tweeters that sounded like ass and some metal domes that were wonderful. It
can be a lot of things. It can be the shape of the dome, the type, material
and shape of the phase plug, hell, sometimes it's not even the tweeter but a
nasty breakup in the upper midrange.


Paul Vina




"Tony Fernandes" wrote in message
...
Physically, I mean. Cone material, dispersion, etc? What exactly makes a
titanium tweeter sound harsher than a silk?

Pretty vague question, I know...but anyone understand what I mean?

Tony


--


What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence? Or,
that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we
wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

Paul is correct IMHO.
IN addition, is the speakers resonance characteristics. Some
tweeters/mids have natural resonancs at 3-4000Hz. This just so happens
to be the resonant frequency of many (but not all) human eardrums.
These tones are the most easily picked up and amplified by by the
eardrum and ear cannal.

So a harsh sounding speaker may also be exciting resonant peaks and
oscillations in the ear. IMHO a good installer will try and spend some
time understanding the customers sense of hearing first before
prescribing components, and keep that readily at hand when designing a
system layout for a client.

After 15 years of guitar playing I tend to be a little deaf above
4000Hz, so I have kick panel JBL tweeters and Image dynamics horns under
my dash. I use a parametric EQ to fine tune tones around 3000Hz.

Garrett




in addition, it depends on the individuals sense of hearing and
perception of sound.

Tony Fernandes wrote:
Physically, I mean. Cone material, dispersion, etc? What exactly makes a
titanium tweeter sound harsher than a silk?

Pretty vague question, I know...but anyone understand what I mean?

Tony


--


What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence? Or, that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

I would add to what's been said. That's 2 other reasons, bad x-over design,
and eng. making them stong in the up tweet range to "etch" out more detail
or better soundstage, which is a bad move.

Some great home and car designs use TI, so it's more design then actual
materail

dunno.... ask the folks over at MBpint.

FHLH.... hertz my ears....


"Tony Fernandes" wrote in message
...
Physically, I mean. Cone material, dispersion, etc? What exactly makes a
titanium tweeter sound harsher than a silk?

Pretty vague question, I know...but anyone understand what I mean?

Tony


--


What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence? Or,
that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we
wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

I actually like the Quart tweets. And I usually don't care for metal domes.


Paul



"FogHornLegHorn" wrote in message
...
dunno.... ask the folks over at MBpint.

FHLH.... hertz my ears....


"Tony Fernandes" wrote in message
...
Physically, I mean. Cone material, dispersion, etc? What exactly makes
a
titanium tweeter sound harsher than a silk?

Pretty vague question, I know...but anyone understand what I mean?

Tony


--


What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence? Or,
that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we
wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

hell yeah, I like em too!
when they are too bright its simple to just put your fingers in your ears...

I dont know what all the hubbub is....??

ha ha

Paul Vina wrote:

I actually like the Quart tweets. And I usually don't care for metal domes.

Paul

"FogHornLegHorn" wrote in message
...
dunno.... ask the folks over at MBpint.

FHLH.... hertz my ears....


"Tony Fernandes" wrote in message
...
Physically, I mean. Cone material, dispersion, etc? What exactly makes
a
titanium tweeter sound harsher than a silk?

Pretty vague question, I know...but anyone understand what I mean?

Tony


--


What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence? Or,
that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we
wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

When it comes to material the ideal cone is one that is super light,
absolutely rigid, and is well damped (don't want the speaker to act like a
bell and continue to emanate sound well after the signal has gone). Between
these three criteria every material and manufacturer has to deal with some
tradeoffs. Titanium or aluminum are light and rigid but care must be taken
to get them to not act like a bell and ring (use of ferro fluid to dampen
oscillations helps). Done right the metal domes are very accurate and airy.
Silk domes are more easily damped and it is easier to make them sound "warm"
but with a less rigid membrane forming the sound wave they may not deliver
quite the accuracy. Again, it's all about tradeoffs and how well each
manufacturer deals with or doesn't deal with the limitations of each cone
material.

When it comes to sounding harsh or too bright, I'd agree most of the time
it's the fault of the cross over. First, tweeters are more efficient than
woofers so you may need a Lpad (voltage divider) to lower the signal sent to
the tweeter. Second, if the cross-over point and slope of the cross-over is
wrong and allows either the woofer or tweeter to extend into ranges where
there is cone breakup then all sorts of nasty peaks are created. I think
any reasonable quality manufacturer of separate components would design the
crossovers well enough to prevent this, but in factory systems, like for
instance Toyota's JBL system the woofer has no crossover so any high
frequency attenuation is dependant on the driver's natural hi frequency roll
off so I'm sure it gets into cone break up, and the tweeter has a single
electroyltic capacitor as the crossover - brutal.

Hope this sheds some light on the subject.

Derek

"Eddie Runner" wrote in message
...
hell yeah, I like em too!
when they are too bright its simple to just put your fingers in your
ears...

I dont know what all the hubbub is....??

ha ha

Paul Vina wrote:

I actually like the Quart tweets. And I usually don't care for metal
domes.

Paul

"FogHornLegHorn" wrote in message
...
dunno.... ask the folks over at MBpint.

FHLH.... hertz my ears....


"Tony Fernandes" wrote in message
...
Physically, I mean. Cone material, dispersion, etc? What exactly
makes
a
titanium tweeter sound harsher than a silk?

Pretty vague question, I know...but anyone understand what I mean?

Tony


--


What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence?
Or,
that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we
wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

Derek,

THAT'S what I was looking for!

Thanks,

Tony


--


What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence? Or, that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

So is that why my Toyota with the factory tweeters sounds like crap? I
put a set of pioneer 3 ways in the doors with the factory tweeters still
there, and its so bright and shrill its just nasty. Had to turn the
treble all the way down, and it still bothers me. Time for some decent
components.
--
Unreal
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Could be the fact y you have 2 sets of tweeters playing. You probably have
loads of cancellation screwing up the sound. Just disconnect the factory
tweeters and see what it sounds like.

Paul Vina




"Unreal" wrote in message
s.com...
So is that why my Toyota with the factory tweeters sounds like crap? I
put a set of pioneer 3 ways in the doors with the factory tweeters still
there, and its so bright and shrill its just nasty. Had to turn the
treble all the way down, and it still bothers me. Time for some decent
components.
--
Unreal
------------------------------------------------------------------------
CarAudioForum.com - Usenet Gateway w/over one million posts online!
View this thread:
http://www.caraudioforum.com/vbb2/sh...hreadid=162433