[Ed Wicks[_3_]]

Our acoustic duet uses a Yamaha EMX512SC Powered Mixer. We remain seated at
all times, dont wander around. After disastrous feedback experience,
partner will not use monitors. What relatively inexpensive in-ear monitor or
other device, wired or wireless, in conjunction with the Yamaha (if these
things work in conjunction with the mixer), would enable me to hear what we
are doing? I know nothing about this subject, which is probably apparent.
Thanks. Ed

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

On 11/27/2016 6:30 PM, Ed Wicks wrote:

Our acoustic duet uses a Yamaha EMX512SC Powered Mixer. We remain seated at
all times, dont wander around. After disastrous feedback experience,
partner will not use monitors. What relatively inexpensive in-ear monitor or
other device, wired or wireless, in conjunction with the Yamaha (if these
things work in conjunction with the mixer), would enable me to hear what we
are doing?

Your mixer has a monitor output that's an independent mix from the main
mix. You could connect that to a headphone amplifier and then plug your
headphones into that. You'll want to use a headphone amplifier that has
a few specific features (there are all sorts of headphone amplifiers):

- At least two outputs (most have at least four)
- A volume control for each output
- The ability to feed all outputs with the same input signal
- A mono switch would be convenient since you have only a single monitor
output from the mixer (not stereo) but you can do this with a simple "Y"
cable.

Everybody has earphones of some sort, so start with what you already
have and see how it sounds.

A Behringer HA-400 is about as cheap as you can get and it will probably
do the job. The PreSonus HP4 is a little nicer.




--

For a good time, call http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

One thing I should add about using headphones or in-ear phones for stage
monitoring is that it will be difficult to hear the audience and the
room when you're isolated like that. Some people set up a mic pointing
out to the audience that's off in the main (house) mix but goes to the
earphone system. At least you can hear if they're booing you, know when
they stop applauding so you can go on to the next song, or take requests.

Getting a headphone stage monitor system to work right is kind of
tricky. You really don't want to have feedback since it'll go right into
your ears at a very loud level, and monitors aren't the only feedback
generators in a sound system.


--

For a good time, call http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com

[Phil Allison[_4_]]

Ed Wicks wrote:


Our acoustic duet uses a Yamaha EMX512SC Powered Mixer. We remain seated at
all times, dont wander around. After disastrous feedback experience,
partner will not use monitors. What relatively inexpensive in-ear monitor or
other device, wired or wireless, in conjunction with the Yamaha (if these
things work in conjunction with the mixer), would enable me to hear what we
are doing?


** You have a decent enough PA system and say you cannot hear yourselves.

How come ?

Noisy audiences ?


I know nothing about this subject, which is probably apparent.


** Then you are on a very steep learning curve.

Using IEMs make be like going from the frying pan into the fire for you.


...... Phil

[geoff]

On 28/11/2016 12:30 PM, Ed Wicks wrote:

Our acoustic duet uses a Yamaha EMX512SC Powered Mixer. We remain seated at
all times, dont wander around. After disastrous feedback experience,
partner will not use monitors. What relatively inexpensive in-ear monitor or
other device, wired or wireless, in conjunction with the Yamaha (if these
things work in conjunction with the mixer), would enable me to hear what we
are doing? I know nothing about this subject, which is probably apparent.
Thanks. Ed



Alternative would be to master the use of regular stage monitors. It's
not rocket-surgery. Is it just acoustic instruments, or vocals as well ?

In-ears , in my experience, take quite a bit of getting used to, and at
a minimum need (maybe an omni mic) on the stage, mixed back solely into
the monitor mix, to pick up the ambience and stopping the sensation of
being totally 'removed' from the performance and environment.

If you do go the in-ear way, get some practice to the point of being
totally comfortable before doing it a real performance situation.

geoff

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

On 28-11-2016 00:30, Ed Wicks wrote:

Our acoustic duet uses a Yamaha EMX512SC Powered Mixer. We remain seated at
all times, dont wander around. After disastrous feedback experience,
partner will not use monitors. What relatively inexpensive in-ear monitor or
other device, wired or wireless, in conjunction with the Yamaha (if these
things work in conjunction with the mixer), would enable me to hear what we
are doing? I know nothing about this subject, which is probably apparent.

I would have expected the first choice to be to put the loudspeakers on
sticks behind and to the side of you and not need any monitors. Do you
have extreme loudness requirements? ... for a duo of what instruments?

Thanks. Ed

Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[Scott Dorsey]

Ed Wicks wrote:

Our acoustic duet uses a Yamaha EMX512SC Powered Mixer. We remain seated at
all times, dont wander around. After disastrous feedback experience,
partner will not use monitors. What relatively inexpensive in-ear monitor or
other device, wired or wireless, in conjunction with the Yamaha (if these
things work in conjunction with the mixer), would enable me to hear what we
are doing? I know nothing about this subject, which is probably apparent.
Thanks. Ed

So, explain this disasterous feedback experience?

In-ear monitors take a lot of getting used to because suddenly you aren't
playing in the real world, you're playing in your head.

I suggest going to a local rental place and asking what they have to rent
so that you can get an idea of what the things sound like and how they work.
Some people love them, some people hate them. Most systems consist of
wireless receivers, wireless transmitters, in-ear phones, and some
electronics that limit levels to prevent ear damage. You or your sound guy
will still have to create a mix from the console auxes to the monitors.

You'll just be hearing yourselves... not the audience... not the room.
You'll have no idea what the PA sounds like and you'll be putting everything
in the hands of the PA operator. This may or may not be a good thing for you.
Try it and see.

There are differences between in-ear systems but they are minimal compared
with the enormous difference between wedges and in-ears.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

Just to be clear and appear to go against the advice of the crowd here -
I, too, think he should solve his disastrous monitor feedback problems.
A duo shouldn't be that hard.

But he DID ask about an IEM setup, so I gave him something he can
experiment with at low cost. He could be trading his feedback problems
for other problems, but if that's what he wants to try, he should try
it. A headphone mix for a duo isn't that hard, and making changes to the
'phones mix won't introduce feedback.

--

For a good time, call http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com

[Scott Dorsey]

In article , Mike Rivers wrote:
Just to be clear and appear to go against the advice of the crowd here -
I, too, think he should solve his disastrous monitor feedback problems.
A duo shouldn't be that hard.

Add a conga player, then. That makes everything better.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

On 11/28/2016 1:54 PM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Add a conga player, then. That makes everything better.

But then they'll want to add a ukulele.

--

For a good time, call http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com

[Mike Rivers[_2_]]

On 11/28/2016 1:18 PM, Mike Rivers (that's me!) wrote:
Just to be clear and appear to go against the advice of the crowd here

Well, that sentence didn't come out right. What I meant was that I
didn't intend to go against the advice of most everyone else in this
thread.


--

For a good time, call http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com

[Scott Dorsey]

In article , Mike Rivers wrote:
On 11/28/2016 1:54 PM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Add a conga player, then. That makes everything better.

But then they'll want to add a ukulele.

Escalation is like that. "Sir, we have a ukulele gap."
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Trevor]

On 28/11/2016 11:46 PM, Peter Larsen wrote:
On 28-11-2016 00:30, Ed Wicks wrote:

Our acoustic duet uses a Yamaha EMX512SC Powered Mixer. We remain
seated at
all times, dont wander around. After disastrous feedback experience,
partner will not use monitors. What relatively inexpensive in-ear
monitor or
other device, wired or wireless, in conjunction with the Yamaha (if these
things work in conjunction with the mixer), would enable me to hear
what we
are doing? I know nothing about this subject, which is probably apparent.

I would have expected the first choice to be to put the loudspeakers on
sticks behind and to the side of you and not need any monitors.


If he already has feedback problems, that isn't going to solve it.

Trevor.

[gareth magennis]

"Trevor" wrote in message news
On 28/11/2016 11:46 PM, Peter Larsen wrote:
On 28-11-2016 00:30, Ed Wicks wrote:

Our acoustic duet uses a Yamaha EMX512SC Powered Mixer. We remain
seated at
all times, dont wander around. After disastrous feedback experience,
partner will not use monitors. What relatively inexpensive in-ear
monitor or
other device, wired or wireless, in conjunction with the Yamaha (if these
things work in conjunction with the mixer), would enable me to hear
what we
are doing? I know nothing about this subject, which is probably apparent.

I would have expected the first choice to be to put the loudspeakers on
sticks behind and to the side of you and not need any monitors.


If he already has feedback problems, that isn't going to solve it.

Trevor.








I took the OP to mean that when they attempted using monitors, it was then
they had the feedback problems.

I would think this would be true of most inexperienced people. The first
time they tried to set up monitors with the crude graphic incorporated in
this unit, and little idea how to use it in monitor world, is not likely to
go well.
I would urge the OP to have another go and learn how to do it properly, plus
take Peter's advice.



Cheers,



Gareth.

[Trevor]

On 29/11/2016 7:54 PM, Gareth Magennis wrote:
"Trevor" wrote in message news On 28/11/2016 11:46 PM, Peter Larsen wrote:
On 28-11-2016 00:30, Ed Wicks wrote:
Our acoustic duet uses a Yamaha EMX512SC Powered Mixer. We remain
seated at
all times, dont wander around. After disastrous feedback experience,
partner will not use monitors. What relatively inexpensive in-ear
monitor or
other device, wired or wireless, in conjunction with the Yamaha (if
these
things work in conjunction with the mixer), would enable me to hear
what we
are doing? I know nothing about this subject, which is probably
apparent.

I would have expected the first choice to be to put the loudspeakers on
sticks behind and to the side of you and not need any monitors.


If he already has feedback problems, that isn't going to solve it.


I took the OP to mean that when they attempted using monitors, it was
then they had the feedback problems.

I would think this would be true of most inexperienced people. The
first time they tried to set up monitors with the crude graphic
incorporated in this unit, and little idea how to use it in monitor
world, is not likely to go well.
I would urge the OP to have another go and learn how to do it properly,
plus take Peter's advice.


Well IME putting FOH speakers behind the microphones is more likely to
cause problems than solve them, especially for "inexperienced people".
And that's ignoring the fact that performers often want a different mix
anyway. But whatever works.

Trevor.

[John Williamson]

On 30/11/2016 03:37, Trevor wrote:

Well IME putting FOH speakers behind the microphones is more likely to
cause problems than solve them, especially for "inexperienced people".
And that's ignoring the fact that performers often want a different mix
anyway. But whatever works.

It usually helps to use directional microphones and put the monitor
speakers in the nulls. But that requires care in setting up, and I'm
wondering whether the person setting up the system in question has the
skills needed to do it correctly.

maybe they need to hire a real sound engineer to show them how to set it
up to avoid problems?

It's possible they are as skilful as the guy that set up the gains on
the console at a gig I attended recently who pushed the preamp gains up
until the overload lights started flashing, so clipping the vocals,
then controlled the volume with the master fader. It was also way over
the 100dB mark, and for some reason, they were getting feedback
problems. Can't think why. ;-)


--
Tciao for Now!

John.

[Phil Allison[_4_]]

John Williamson wrote:



maybe they need to hire a real sound engineer to show them how to set it
up to avoid problems?



** An acoustic duo working in a noisy environment has got real problems from the get go.

Smartest thing they can do is have a some recordings made of their song sets and MIME to them.

The loud drunks in the audience will never guess, or care.


.... Phil