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  #81   Report Post  
Paul Vina
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Talk about the wrong thread to have a typo in.......man oh man........




Paul Vina




"Soundfreak03" wrote in message
...
10 watts IS 100 watts.


Paul, I will take 10 of those amps off of your hands Your going to be a
millionaire, don't forget us little people



  #82   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Is there such a thing as a passive amplier?

Actually yes! But that's another discussion for another time.

Hint: it uses reactance to provide a narrowband boost with passive
elements...


  #83   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

No, it would make it a Pyramid amp.

What happens if you remove the little "100 watt" emblem from the amp and put
"10000 watts" on it? Would that then make it a 10000 watt amp?


  #85   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

You can argue that at your next stereo competition when someone enters a
400watt power class with a pair of Orion 2100hcca's or a Us Amps VLX-400 and
you're sitting there with a 400 watt Profile amp in the same class. Feel free
to tell them that only noobs go by the label on the amp.




In article ,
othanks (Soundfreak03) wrote:
My point is stated below, Lester are challenged also?


Your point is pointless. You stated;


"What I am saying is that a watt
is not a watt between any two amplifiers."

A watt is a watt is a watt. A watt in one amp is the same as a watt in another
amp. Does that confuse you? What a watt is does not change between amps as you
seem to think. The label on the amp is meaningless, only noobs go by the label
on the amp. Hmmm that doesn't shock me that you do rely on that meaningless
stickers on the amp.

Les




  #86   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Hey Paul, How many customers walk in to your shop with test equipment in hand?
How do you feel about bench testing amps for all of your customers that walk
in looking to buy an amp?



In article CrlOb.90575$na.49255@attbi_s04, "Paul Vina"
wrote:
So?
You can't look at ratings, only at ACTUAL power output when making
comparisons.



Paul Vina




"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
I totally understand that a watt is a watts. What I am saying is that a

watt
is not a watt between any two amplifiers. You can have two brand new
amplifiers that are both the same make and model and one will put out more
wattage then the other.

In article , "Tha Ghee"
wrote:
"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
With all of the different options between amps such as x-overs,
bass-boost,
compression, it's hard to get any two amps to sound the same. Another
problem
is that 100watts is not the same between any two amps. Although I see

what
you
a watt, is a watt, no matter what.




  #87   Report Post  
Soundfreak03
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

You can argue that at your next stereo competition when someone enters a
400watt power class with a pair of Orion 2100hcca's or a Us Amps VLX-400 and
you're sitting there with a 400 watt Profile amp in the same class. Feel free

to tell them that only noobs go by the label on the amp.


Why do you think they choose the amp? True pros recognize that there are more
important things to worry about than SQ. We have been through the list before.
If the Profile could do what I wanted it too then I would consider using it,
simple as that. I choose my amps on several criteria, and SQ is not one of
them.

Les

  #88   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Mark already used that excuse. lol


In article AvlOb.89538$xy6.161852@attbi_s02, "Paul Vina"
wrote:
I didn't think Optimus was still making amps. Besides, they don't have any
that fit my needs when they did make them.



Paul Vina




"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
But yet, none of them use Radio Shack Optimus amplifiers.


In article , "Tony Fernandes"
wrote:
Brian wrote: "I haven't tried PG yet. What model (or series) can you
suggest? Whats their best stuff?"

The ZX series is now called their Titanium series I believe. I'm not

sure
there's much of a difference. However, if you've been reading all the
posts, then there's not much difference between the Titanium series and a
Radio Shack Optimus amplifer. LOL

All kidding aside, Mark, Paul, Soundfreak and Eddie really know their

stuff.
Maybe I'm just not ready to believe them yet (denial is wonderful). I
believe my ears...which is connected to my brain...and if my brain is
deceiving me then oh well. It's all good. I appreciate and respect

their
advice.

I myself have been pondering Brax amplifiers. But I can't justify the

money
and honestly, I love my PG amps.

Tony




  #89   Report Post  
Paul Vina
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

None, but if I know for a fact an amp that's rated at 100 watts does 250
watts, I'm not going to stand there and tell the customer it's a 100 watt
amp because that's what the manufacturer rates it at, I'm going to tell him
that it's a 250 watt amp. I'm not there to pander to my customers, they'll
learn something while they're in there whether they like it or not.



Paul Vina



"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
Hey Paul, How many customers walk in to your shop with test equipment in

hand?
How do you feel about bench testing amps for all of your customers that

walk
in looking to buy an amp?



In article CrlOb.90575$na.49255@attbi_s04, "Paul Vina"
wrote:
So?
You can't look at ratings, only at ACTUAL power output when making
comparisons.



Paul Vina




"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
I totally understand that a watt is a watts. What I am saying is that a

watt
is not a watt between any two amplifiers. You can have two brand new
amplifiers that are both the same make and model and one will put out

more
wattage then the other.

In article , "Tha Ghee"
wrote:
"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
With all of the different options between amps such as x-overs,
bass-boost,
compression, it's hard to get any two amps to sound the same.

Another
problem
is that 100watts is not the same between any two amps. Although I

see
what
you
a watt, is a watt, no matter what.






  #90   Report Post  
Paul Vina
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

That doesn't make it untrue.



Paul Vina




"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
Mark already used that excuse. lol


In article AvlOb.89538$xy6.161852@attbi_s02, "Paul Vina"
wrote:
I didn't think Optimus was still making amps. Besides, they don't have

any
that fit my needs when they did make them.



Paul Vina




"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
But yet, none of them use Radio Shack Optimus amplifiers.


In article , "Tony Fernandes"
wrote:
Brian wrote: "I haven't tried PG yet. What model (or series) can you
suggest? Whats their best stuff?"

The ZX series is now called their Titanium series I believe. I'm not

sure
there's much of a difference. However, if you've been reading all the
posts, then there's not much difference between the Titanium series

and a
Radio Shack Optimus amplifer. LOL

All kidding aside, Mark, Paul, Soundfreak and Eddie really know their

stuff.
Maybe I'm just not ready to believe them yet (denial is wonderful). I
believe my ears...which is connected to my brain...and if my brain is
deceiving me then oh well. It's all good. I appreciate and respect

their
advice.

I myself have been pondering Brax amplifiers. But I can't justify the

money
and honestly, I love my PG amps.

Tony








  #91   Report Post  
Soundfreak03
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!


Excuse? HA, that is one of the main reasons to buy an amp. Buy the amp that
fits your needs, does not particularly matter the name, as long as it meets the
criteria. Still having trouble with that concept aren't you? If you want I can
list the reasons to buy an amp.

Les


Mark already used that excuse. lol


In article AvlOb.89538$xy6.161852@attbi_s02, "Paul Vina"
wrote:
I didn't think Optimus was still making amps. Besides, they don't have any
that fit my needs when they did make them.



Paul Vina




"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
But yet, none of them use Radio Shack Optimus amplifiers.


  #92   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

You can argue that at your next stereo competition when someone enters a
400watt power class with a pair of Orion 2100hcca's or a Us Amps VLX-400

and
you're sitting there with a 400 watt Profile amp in the same class. Feel

free
to tell them that only noobs go by the label on the amp.


Why do you think some manufacturers underrate their amplifiers? I think you
answered your question above.


  #93   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Mark already used that excuse. lol

And you still haven't countered my "excuse". What amps should I have bought
instead? I think I made the best decision based on
price/features/reliability/support. Nowhere did the notion tof "sonic
signatures" come into play.


  #94   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Proves my point that no two (in this case) 400watt amps are the same. That is
why I stated that a 100watts is not a 100 watts between any two amps.

In article , "Mark Zarella"
wrote:
You can argue that at your next stereo competition when someone enters a
400watt power class with a pair of Orion 2100hcca's or a Us Amps VLX-400

and
you're sitting there with a 400 watt Profile amp in the same class. Feel

free
to tell them that only noobs go by the label on the amp.


Why do you think some manufacturers underrate their amplifiers? I think you
answered your question above.


  #95   Report Post  
Tony Fernandes
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Paul Vina wrote :"I'm not there to pander to my customers, they'll learn
something while they're in there whether they like it or not."

I like your style. I wish more business people were like that!

Tony



--



What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence? Or, that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

"Paul Vina" wrote in message
news:AHpOb.90717$I06.404220@attbi_s01...
None, but if I know for a fact an amp that's rated at 100 watts does 250
watts, I'm not going to stand there and tell the customer it's a 100 watt
amp because that's what the manufacturer rates it at, I'm going to tell

him
that it's a 250 watt amp. I'm not there to pander to my customers,

they'll
learn something while they're in there whether they like it or not.



Paul Vina



"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
Hey Paul, How many customers walk in to your shop with test equipment in

hand?
How do you feel about bench testing amps for all of your customers that

walk
in looking to buy an amp?



In article CrlOb.90575$na.49255@attbi_s04, "Paul Vina"
wrote:
So?
You can't look at ratings, only at ACTUAL power output when making
comparisons.



Paul Vina




"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
I totally understand that a watt is a watts. What I am saying is that

a
watt
is not a watt between any two amplifiers. You can have two brand new
amplifiers that are both the same make and model and one will put out

more
wattage then the other.

In article , "Tha Ghee"
wrote:
"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
With all of the different options between amps such as x-overs,
bass-boost,
compression, it's hard to get any two amps to sound the same.

Another
problem
is that 100watts is not the same between any two amps. Although I

see
what
you
a watt, is a watt, no matter what.










  #96   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

No it doesn't make it untrue, But from what you, Mark and Lester are saying it
sounds that the low end amps are simply not as functional as high grade amps.
Since none of them seem to do anything that anyone wants them to do.



In article YHpOb.92184$na.50054@attbi_s04, "Paul Vina"
wrote:
That doesn't make it untrue.



Paul Vina




"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
Mark already used that excuse. lol


In article AvlOb.89538$xy6.161852@attbi_s02, "Paul Vina"
wrote:
I didn't think Optimus was still making amps. Besides, they don't have

any
that fit my needs when they did make them.



Paul Vina




"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
But yet, none of them use Radio Shack Optimus amplifiers.


In article , "Tony Fernandes"
wrote:
Brian wrote: "I haven't tried PG yet. What model (or series) can you
suggest? Whats their best stuff?"

The ZX series is now called their Titanium series I believe. I'm not
sure
there's much of a difference. However, if you've been reading all the
posts, then there's not much difference between the Titanium series

and a
Radio Shack Optimus amplifer. LOL

All kidding aside, Mark, Paul, Soundfreak and Eddie really know their
stuff.
Maybe I'm just not ready to believe them yet (denial is wonderful). I
believe my ears...which is connected to my brain...and if my brain is
deceiving me then oh well. It's all good. I appreciate and respect
their
advice.

I myself have been pondering Brax amplifiers. But I can't justify the
money
and honestly, I love my PG amps.

Tony






  #98   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

In article , "Mark Zarella" wrote:
Mark already used that excuse. lol


And you still haven't countered my "excuse". What amps should I have bought
instead? I think I made the best decision based on
price/features/reliability/support.\


Price sure, I'll even agree with the features of the amps that you have, but
reliability I just can't agree on in regards to the ADS along with support.
Who supports ESX amps now days ?

Nowhere did the notion tof "sonic
signatures" come into play.


I donno
  #99   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Proves my point that no two (in this case) 400watt amps are the same. That
is
why I stated that a 100watts is not a 100 watts between any two amps.


Your definition of a 400 watt amplifier is faulty. You could put a sign on
a cat that says "dog", but it doesn't make it a dog!


  #100   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

No it doesn't make it untrue, But from what you, Mark and Lester are
saying it
sounds that the low end amps are simply not as functional as high grade

amps.
Since none of them seem to do anything that anyone wants them to do.


Add the "higher end" amps to the list too. McIntosh, Brax, Helix, Genesis,
etc don't do what I want either.




  #101   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Mark already used that excuse. lol

And you still haven't countered my "excuse". What amps should I have

bought
instead? I think I made the best decision based on
price/features/reliability/support.\


Price sure, I'll even agree with the features of the amps that you have,

but
reliability I just can't agree on in regards to the ADS along with

support.

I've gotten superb support from Directed on my a/d/s/ stuff. If you're
interested, I'll email you the details of the support I've received.

Who supports ESX amps now days ?


Oh I don't know. That was a factor in the a/d/s/ purchase but not the ESX
purchase. That's part of the reason why I sold my 4-ch ESX. Now I've just
got a 2-ch running my sub, but if it fails and I can't fix it for some
reason, I won't buy another one. I'd probably stick with Directed actually.


  #102   Report Post  
Paul Vina
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

I'm tellin' ya! I hated it when I'd get some "thugs" in there asking "is
this their competition stuff?".



Paul Vina



"Tony Fernandes" wrote in message
...
Paul Vina wrote :"I'm not there to pander to my customers, they'll learn
something while they're in there whether they like it or not."

I like your style. I wish more business people were like that!

Tony



--



What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence? Or,

that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we

wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

"Paul Vina" wrote in message
news:AHpOb.90717$I06.404220@attbi_s01...
None, but if I know for a fact an amp that's rated at 100 watts does 250
watts, I'm not going to stand there and tell the customer it's a 100

watt
amp because that's what the manufacturer rates it at, I'm going to tell

him
that it's a 250 watt amp. I'm not there to pander to my customers,

they'll
learn something while they're in there whether they like it or not.



Paul Vina



"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
Hey Paul, How many customers walk in to your shop with test equipment

in
hand?
How do you feel about bench testing amps for all of your customers

that
walk
in looking to buy an amp?



In article CrlOb.90575$na.49255@attbi_s04, "Paul Vina"
wrote:
So?
You can't look at ratings, only at ACTUAL power output when making
comparisons.



Paul Vina




"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
I totally understand that a watt is a watts. What I am saying is

that
a
watt
is not a watt between any two amplifiers. You can have two brand

new
amplifiers that are both the same make and model and one will put

out
more
wattage then the other.

In article , "Tha Ghee"
wrote:
"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
With all of the different options between amps such as x-overs,
bass-boost,
compression, it's hard to get any two amps to sound the same.

Another
problem
is that 100watts is not the same between any two amps. Although

I
see
what
you
a watt, is a watt, no matter what.










  #103   Report Post  
Soundfreak03
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Sure, please do.



Here are reasons to buy an amp for Howdy. If you disagree with any of them then
please speak up.

Price, features, reliability, resale value, actual power output, customer
support, size, looks, and price.

Those are not in any particular order, as it changes for each person. And I am
aware that price is there twice, I think it is too easy to overpay for an amp
for the brand name. Notice that SQ does not even factor into the equation, with
all the other stuff that should be considered who has time to worry about SQ
when there is no difference?

Les
  #104   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

That's right, because no one will accept that labeled cat as a dog. But they
will accept the sign on the amplifier without question.


In article , "Mark Zarella"
wrote:
Proves my point that no two (in this case) 400watt amps are the same. That

is
why I stated that a 100watts is not a 100 watts between any two amps.


Your definition of a 400 watt amplifier is faulty. You could put a sign on
a cat that says "dog", but it doesn't make it a dog!


  #105   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Why is everyone in here so hung up on features, I hate the though of internal
crap line x-over and bass boost. When I look at an amp I make sure the amp is
stable to whatever is needed and the it has more then enough output, other
then that less of other crap the better.

Reliability, how can you tell from one amp to another? Look at the nasty
surprise PPI fans got when they upgraded from the PC line to the newer PCX
line, who seen that coming.

Price and resale value goes hand and hand, if you pay next to nothing for an
amp you'll get next to nothing on the resale market. More often then not you
get what you paid for with just about any amp.


In article ,
othanks (Soundfreak03) wrote:
Sure, please do.



Here are reasons to buy an amp for Howdy. If you disagree with any of them then
please speak up.

Price, features, reliability, resale value, actual power output, customer
support, size, looks, and price.

Those are not in any particular order, as it changes for each person. And I am
aware that price is there twice, I think it is too easy to overpay for an amp
for the brand name. Notice that SQ does not even factor into the equation, with
all the other stuff that should be considered who has time to worry about SQ
when there is no difference?

Les



  #106   Report Post  
Soundfreak03
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Why is everyone in here so hung up on features, I hate the though of internal

crap line x-over and bass boost.


The internal crossovers on most amps are fine, if they do the job and do not
introduce noise then I use them. You are more likely to introduce noise by
adding extra components like external EQs and crossovers.

Reliability, how can you tell from one amp to another? Look at the nasty
surprise PPI fans got when they upgraded from the PC line to the newer PCX
line, who seen that coming.


If a company has consistently put out a solid product the chances are that they
will continue to do so. Though there are instances where that is not the case.
You also have amps that have established themselves that you can buy used.


Price and resale value goes hand and hand, if you pay next to nothing for an
amp you'll get next to nothing on the resale market.


Some amps hold resale value better than others, some have virtually no resale
value. That is why you have to weigh the costs on each.

You cannot have the best in all of the catergories. Choosing an amp has many
facets and noone needs the myth of Sound Quality mucking it up.

What are your reasons/thoughts when buying an amp?

Les
  #107   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

That's right, because no one will accept that labeled cat as a dog. But
they
will accept the sign on the amplifier without question.


That's due solely to their ignorance though.


  #108   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Why is everyone in here so hung up on features, I hate the though of
internal
crap line x-over and bass boost.


What's wrong with internal crossovers? The crossovers in my a/d/s/
amplifiers are more versatile than most, if not all, external crossovers.
Oh yeah, and a lot simpler, cheaper, and less prone to noise.

When I look at an amp I make sure the amp is
stable to whatever is needed and the it has more then enough output, other
then that less of other crap the better.


Those are two other features that Les mentioned.

Reliability, how can you tell from one amp to another? Look at the nasty
surprise PPI fans got when they upgraded from the PC line to the newer PCX
line, who seen that coming.

Price and resale value goes hand and hand, if you pay next to nothing for

an
amp you'll get next to nothing on the resale market. More often then not

you
get what you paid for with just about any amp.


If you buy used, you're almost guaranteed your money back when you resell
it. But I personally don't use resale value as a criteria, as I don't plan
on selling my gear.


  #109   Report Post  
Tony Fernandes
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Captain Howdy wrote: "Why is everyone in here so hung up on features"

Wow. Really a serious question?

My PG ZX amps are extrememly flexible. Continuously variable LP/HP xovers.
Selectible LP/HP/BP RCA outputs. Dash-mount sub control. Digital
diagnostics port (never used these personally, but maybe one day). Variable
speed cooling fans. Small size. Bass boost (never used this very much
either, but I can totally see why a LOT of people would need this based on
their personal preference). And complete connectivity to a lot of other PG
amp accessories. I love my amps. Features go a LONG way for me.

Tony


--



What's more likely? That an all-powerful mysterious god created the
universe and then decided not to give any proof of his existence? Or, that
he simply doesn't exist at all? And that we created him so that we wouldn't
have to feel so small and alone. -Eleanor Arroway, Contact

"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
Why is everyone in here so hung up on features, I hate the though of

internal
crap line x-over and bass boost. When I look at an amp I make sure the amp

is
stable to whatever is needed and the it has more then enough output, other
then that less of other crap the better.

Reliability, how can you tell from one amp to another? Look at the nasty
surprise PPI fans got when they upgraded from the PC line to the newer PCX
line, who seen that coming.

Price and resale value goes hand and hand, if you pay next to nothing for

an
amp you'll get next to nothing on the resale market. More often then not

you
get what you paid for with just about any amp.


In article ,
othanks (Soundfreak03) wrote:
Sure, please do.



Here are reasons to buy an amp for Howdy. If you disagree with any of

them then
please speak up.

Price, features, reliability, resale value, actual power output, customer
support, size, looks, and price.

Those are not in any particular order, as it changes for each person. And

I am
aware that price is there twice, I think it is too easy to overpay for an

amp
for the brand name. Notice that SQ does not even factor into the

equation, with
all the other stuff that should be considered who has time to worry about

SQ
when there is no difference?

Les



  #110   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

In article , othanks (Soundfreak03) wrote:
Why is everyone in here so hung up on features, I hate the though of internal

crap line x-over and bass boost.


The internal crossovers on most amps are fine, if they do the job and do not
introduce noise then I use them. You are more likely to introduce noise by
adding extra components like external EQs and crossovers.


There is nothing that I hate more then built-in x-overs especially when it
comes to bi-amping subwoofers. There is nothing that I hate more then trying
to tune a pair of amps with an oscilloscope and a tone generator, because on
average it takes me a better part of a week to tune a system with just a
single amps per each sound range. With an external x-over I can run 10
amplifiers to power my subs and I know that all of them are running at the
same frequencies. I have an Audiocontrol 4xs x-over that I hold very dear,
with this thing no matter what plain-jane amp I happen to come across has a
2/3/4 way x-over with a selectable 18 dB/24 db roll-off. Along with an
adjustable subsonic filter, Adjustable, balanced or unbalanced inputs, and
selectable ground loop isolation (isolated, grounded or 200ohm). That's all
the x-over that I have ever needed.

Reliability, how can you tell from one amp to another? Look at the nasty
surprise PPI fans got when they upgraded from the PC line to the newer PCX
line, who seen that coming.


If a company has consistently put out a solid product the chances are that they
will continue to do so. Though there are instances where that is not the case.
You also have amps that have established themselves that you can buy used.


Price and resale value goes hand and hand, if you pay next to nothing for an
amp you'll get next to nothing on the resale market.


Some amps hold resale value better than others, some have virtually no resale
value. That is why you have to weigh the costs on each.

You cannot have the best in all of the catergories. Choosing an amp has many
facets and noone needs the myth of Sound Quality mucking it up.

What are your reasons/thoughts when buying an amp?

Les


I'm not overly picky about the amps that I use to power mid/highs with, but
when it comes to powering low end that's a different story. I like amps that
are totally featureless in the way of x-overs, bass boost, and overload
protection. I look for amps that will run at low impedance. Amps that have a
high fuse rating vs rated wattage. Although I wouldn't pass on a good amp
without a built in cooling fan, I definitely much rather have an amp that has
one. I also tend to buy big sled amps not only because of the cooling factor,
I just like the pure size of them. As for class a/b vs class d when looking at
sub amps, I have too many mixed emotions on the issue.


  #111   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

In article , "Mark Zarella" wrote:

See my other post. If you use cheap crap, you might get noise, in fact my
x-over eliminated noise with a few amps.



What's wrong with internal crossovers? The crossovers in my a/d/s/
amplifiers are more versatile than most, if not all, external crossovers.
Oh yeah, and a lot simpler, cheaper, and less prone to noise.

  #112   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

The bass boost is a totally waste, most hu's have that built-in. If it was
bass restoration that would be a diiferent story such as the epicenter. If i'm
not mistaken PG had something like it called a basscube, it just never became
as popular as the epicenter for some reason.


In article , "Tony Fernandes"
wrote:
Captain Howdy wrote: "Why is everyone in here so hung up on features"

Wow. Really a serious question?

My PG ZX amps are extrememly flexible. Continuously variable LP/HP xovers.
Selectible LP/HP/BP RCA outputs. Dash-mount sub control. Digital
diagnostics port (never used these personally, but maybe one day). Variable
speed cooling fans. Small size. Bass boost (never used this very much
either, but I can totally see why a LOT of people would need this based on
their personal preference). And complete connectivity to a lot of other PG
amp accessories. I love my amps. Features go a LONG way for me.

Tony


  #113   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

The internal crossovers on most amps are fine, if they do the job and do
not
introduce noise then I use them. You are more likely to introduce noise

by
adding extra components like external EQs and crossovers.


There is nothing that I hate more then built-in x-overs especially when it
comes to bi-amping subwoofers.


What other solution is there, if you insist on biamping a subwoofer? Head
unit filtered outputs? Not all heads have them.

There is nothing that I hate more then trying
to tune a pair of amps with an oscilloscope and a tone generator, because

on
average it takes me a better part of a week to tune a system with just a
single amps per each sound range.


That's why I never biamp a sub. I can't think of many reasons why you would
have to, unless you're into some really exotic dB drag stuff.

With an external x-over I can run 10
amplifiers to power my subs and I know that all of them are running at the
same frequencies. I have an Audiocontrol 4xs x-over that I hold very

dear,
with this thing no matter what plain-jane amp I happen to come across has

a
2/3/4 way x-over with a selectable 18 dB/24 db roll-off.


I had to get rid of my 4xs because it didn't provide as much adjustability
as my a/d/s/ amp's xovers.

Along with an
adjustable subsonic filter, Adjustable, balanced or unbalanced inputs, and
selectable ground loop isolation (isolated, grounded or 200ohm). That's

all
the x-over that I have ever needed.


The subsonic filter is a nice touch.


Reliability, how can you tell from one amp to another? Look at the nasty
surprise PPI fans got when they upgraded from the PC line to the newer

PCX
line, who seen that coming.


If a company has consistently put out a solid product the chances are

that they
will continue to do so. Though there are instances where that is not the

case.
You also have amps that have established themselves that you can buy

used.


Price and resale value goes hand and hand, if you pay next to nothing

for an
amp you'll get next to nothing on the resale market.


Some amps hold resale value better than others, some have virtually no

resale
value. That is why you have to weigh the costs on each.

You cannot have the best in all of the catergories. Choosing an amp has

many
facets and noone needs the myth of Sound Quality mucking it up.

What are your reasons/thoughts when buying an amp?

Les


I'm not overly picky about the amps that I use to power mid/highs with,

but
when it comes to powering low end that's a different story. I like amps

that
are totally featureless in the way of x-overs, bass boost, and overload
protection. I look for amps that will run at low impedance. Amps that

have a
high fuse rating vs rated wattage. Although I wouldn't pass on a good amp
without a built in cooling fan, I definitely much rather have an amp that

has
one. I also tend to buy big sled amps not only because of the cooling

factor,
I just like the pure size of them. As for class a/b vs class d when

looking at
sub amps, I have too many mixed emotions on the issue.


Where does the airy nature of the sub amp, the high damping factor, the
warmth of the sound, and the precision of the control of the cone come into
play?


  #114   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

See my other post. If you use cheap crap, you might get noise, in fact my
x-over eliminated noise with a few amps.


How can an additional device reduce noise? If it did, then that noise could
have been reduced by much simpler (and cheaper) means.


  #115   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

True, but never the less, it sells amps.


In article , "Mark Zarella"
wrote:
That's right, because no one will accept that labeled cat as a dog. But

they
will accept the sign on the amplifier without question.


That's due solely to their ignorance though.




  #116   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

Sure does, but that wasn't really the topic at hand.

"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...
True, but never the less, it sells amps.


In article , "Mark Zarella"
wrote:
That's right, because no one will accept that labeled cat as a dog. But

they
will accept the sign on the amplifier without question.


That's due solely to their ignorance though.




  #117   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!


What other solution is there, if you insist on biamping a subwoofer? Head
unit filtered outputs? Not all heads have them.


There isn't one.


That's why I never biamp a sub. I can't think of many reasons why you would
have to, unless you're into some really exotic dB drag stuff.


I'll give you a very good reason, Price unless you are lucky enough to buy
everything new. If you buy your amps used as I do, you will find that a pair
of 500watt amps are a lot cheaper and easier to find then a single 1000watt
amp. For that reason I am bi-amping a pair of mtx801d's to four 12" subs at
this time.

Where does the airy nature of the sub amp, the high damping factor, the
warmth of the sound, and the precision of the control of the cone come into
play?


When bridging, although I have never found it to be that noticeable to the
ear.
  #118   Report Post  
Captain Howdy
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!


Simply by changing my ground loop isolation in my x-over. Yeah there are
cheaper ways, if you don't already own one. all I was saying is that is has
helped reduce noise a few times, not once did it ever create noise.

In article , "Mark Zarella"
wrote:
See my other post. If you use cheap crap, you might get noise, in fact my
x-over eliminated noise with a few amps.


How can an additional device reduce noise? If it did, then that noise could
have been reduced by much simpler (and cheaper) means.


  #119   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

That's why I never biamp a sub. I can't think of many reasons why you
would
have to, unless you're into some really exotic dB drag stuff.


I'll give you a very good reason, Price unless you are lucky enough to buy
everything new. If you buy your amps used as I do, you will find that a

pair
of 500watt amps are a lot cheaper and easier to find then a single

1000watt
amp. For that reason I am bi-amping a pair of mtx801d's to four 12" subs

at
this time.


I don't find that to be true when I look at ebay.


  #120   Report Post  
Mark Zarella
 
Posts: n/a
Default your Car Amplifier advice, please!

After browsing around this NG for a few years, I've found that many people
have had trouble with noise from external xovers and eqs. I personally
haven't encountered a noise problem with them that I couldn't overcome. I
used to use a 3xs and 4xs back when my system consisted of five makeshift
2-ch amplifiers that I had either bought broken or used. Back then I didn't
have the luxury of being able to pick and choose (at least I thought I
didn't).

"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
...

Simply by changing my ground loop isolation in my x-over. Yeah there are
cheaper ways, if you don't already own one. all I was saying is that is

has
helped reduce noise a few times, not once did it ever create noise.

In article , "Mark Zarella"
wrote:
See my other post. If you use cheap crap, you might get noise, in fact

my
x-over eliminated noise with a few amps.


How can an additional device reduce noise? If it did, then that noise

could
have been reduced by much simpler (and cheaper) means.




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