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#1
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
It is still doing its same thing. Here a bit from the current online mag:
Rune Skov shows off the new Nordost Valhalla 2 interconnect ($9799/2m pair) next to his sweet Nordost tattoo. On Tuesday May 28th, 2013, Nordost premiered the Valhalla 2 cable lineup at Lyric Hi-Fi in New York City. Rune Skov, International Product Training & Sales Support Manager for Nordost, gave a demonstration to a garrulous group of audiophiles who joyfully suggested what differences they heard as Skov switched out each old Valhalla cable for the new one. Wow, what a scientific approach. Just as the editor some years ago demonstrated in his "debate" about objective testing, if one puts oneself into a context known to produce false subjective results; one will get self same subjective results. |
#3
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
On Wednesday, May 29, 2013 4:38:39 PM UTC-7, wrote:
It is still doing its same thing. Here a bit from the current online mag: Rune Skov shows off the new Nordost Valhalla 2 interconnect ($9799/2m pair) next to his sweet Nordost tattoo. On Tuesday May 28th, 2013, Nordost premiered the Valhalla 2 cable lineup at Lyric Hi-Fi in New York City. Rune Skov, International Product Training & Sales Support Manager for Nordost, gave a demonstration to a garrulous group of audiophiles who joyfully suggested what differences they heard as Skov switched out each old Valhalla cable for the new one. Wow, what a scientific approach. Just as the editor some years ago demonstrated in his "debate" about objective testing, if one puts oneself into a context known to produce false subjective results; one will get self same subjective results. Scientific approach? Stereophile doesn't do scientific research, they are an audio magazine. They report on audio. The guy was reporting on an event. |
#4
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
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#5
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
In article ,
Andrew Haley wrote: wrote: It is still doing its same thing. Here a bit from the current online mag: Rune Skov shows off the new Nordost Valhalla 2 interconnect ($9799/2m pair) next to his sweet Nordost tattoo. On Tuesday May 28th, 2013, Nordost premiered the Valhalla 2 cable lineup at Lyric Hi-Fi in New York City. Rune Skov, International Product Training & Sales Support Manager for Nordost, gave a demonstration to a garrulous group of audiophiles who joyfully suggested what differences they heard as Skov switched out each old Valhalla cable for the new one. Wow, what a scientific approach. Just as the editor some years ago demonstrated in his "debate" about objective testing, if one puts oneself into a context known to produce false subjective results; one will get self same subjective results. I think you're being a bit mean to Stereophile. Of course I admit that there is some woo-woo stuff like this, but a lot of it isn't, and there doesn't seem to be a strong party line one way or the other. Some of their writers spend hours comparing cables, some don't. Andrew. The main point here is that Stereophile was merely reporting on an event that took place. They made no comment, either about the ridiculousness of a pair of $10,000 interconnects, or the assembled audience's reaction except to say it was "garrulous". and that opinions were "joyfully given". What those opinions might have been wasn't even hinted at. --- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: --- |
#6
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
It is still doing its same thing. Here a bit from the current online mag:
Rune Skov shows off the new Nordost Valhalla 2 interconnect ($9799/2m pair) next to his sweet Nordost tattoo. On Tuesday May 28th, 2013, Nordost premiered the Valhalla 2 cable lineup at Lyric Hi-Fi in New York City. Rune Skov, International Product Training & Sales Support Manager for Nordost, gave a demonstration to a garrulous group of audiophiles who joyfully suggested what differences they heard as Skov switched out each old Valhalla cable for the new one. Wow, what a scientific approach. Just as the editor some years ago demonstrated in his "debate" about objective testing, if one puts oneself into a context known to produce false subjective results; one will get self same subjective results. I think you're being a bit mean to Stereophile. Of course I admit that there is some woo-woo stuff like this, but a lot of it isn't, and there doesn't seem to be a strong party line one way or the other. Some of their writers spend hours comparing cables, some don't. The doctrine of the validity of the subjective listening experience permeates all editoral policy. The only "party line" I have ever seen is exactly that. The excesses in the religion of wire is but a product of same. |
#7
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
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#8
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
In article , wrote:
It is still doing its same thing. Here a bit from the current online mag: Rune Skov shows off the new Nordost Valhalla 2 interconnect ($9799/2m pair) next to his sweet Nordost tattoo. On Tuesday May 28th, 2013, Nordost premiered the Valhalla 2 cable lineup at Lyric Hi-Fi in New York City. Rune Skov, International Product Training & Sales Support Manager for Nordost, gave a demonstration to a garrulous group of audiophiles who joyfully suggested what differences they heard as Skov switched out each old Valhalla cable for the new one. Wow, what a scientific approach. Just as the editor some years ago demonstrated in his "debate" about objective testing, if one puts oneself into a context known to produce false subjective results; one will get self same subjective results. I think you're being a bit mean to Stereophile. Of course I admit that there is some woo-woo stuff like this, but a lot of it isn't, and there doesn't seem to be a strong party line one way or the other. Some of their writers spend hours comparing cables, some don't. The doctrine of the validity of the subjective listening experience permeates all editoral policy. The only "party line" I have ever seen is exactly that. The excesses in the religion of wire is but a product of same. Whether they do or don't test things scientifically, their policy in no way changes the fact this is just a retrospective report on an event. It has no "editorial policy" in it. In fact, no opinion by the author was given at all. To the previous poster (before outsor). I don't think any reviewers spend hours comparing cables. That would be like comparing table-salt grains under a microscope looking for differences. A useless and futile procedure at best. --- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: --- |
#9
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
In article ,
Tixe wrote: On 1 Jun 2013 14:53:49 GMT, in article , stated: It is still doing its same thing. Here a bit from the current online mag: Rune Skov shows off the new Nordost Valhalla 2 interconnect ($9799/2m pair) next to his sweet Nordost tattoo. On Tuesday May 28th, 2013, Nordost premiered the Valhalla 2 cable lineup at Lyric Hi-Fi in New York City. Rune Skov, International Product Training & Sales Support Manager for Nordost, gave a demonstration to a garrulous group of audiophiles who joyfully suggested what differences they heard as Skov switched out each old Valhalla cable for the new one. Wow, what a scientific approach. Just as the editor some years ago demonstrated in his "debate" about objective testing, if one puts oneself into a context known to produce false subjective results; one will get self same subjective results. I think you're being a bit mean to Stereophile. Of course I admit that there is some woo-woo stuff like this, but a lot of it isn't, and there doesn't seem to be a strong party line one way or the other. Some of their writers spend hours comparing cables, some don't. The doctrine of the validity of the subjective listening experience permeates all editoral policy. The only "party line" I have ever seen is exactly that. The excesses in the religion of wire is but a product of same. Your general point is well-taken. The current editorial staff of Stereophile has not merely found objective testing unnecessary, but has gone out of its way to denigrate it. And the basic argument has been, once you cut through the thicket of words, is: "objective testing methods are invalid because they say that components that sound different to me sound the same." (Disclosu I let my subscription to Stereophile lapse a long time ago based on dissatisfaction with their product, but their objection to objective listening tests was not the main reason). Having said that, if someone wants to spend $10,000 on some speaker wire, let them. Nordost is not acting fraudulently. Whoever the buyer is feels better owning that wire, and having the purchase and service experience that goes with it, than having an incremental $10,000 in the bank or having other things that cost that much. None of us is in a position to say that that preference is invalid. Oh, and to anyone who thinks that it is "wasteful to society" for that much money to be spent on speaker wire, you might benefit from taking an economics course. (Or, given the state of higher education today, you very well might not). My beef is not with Nordost selling 12 ft of wire and 4 phono plugs for $10,000, nor is it with the rich fools who fall for the Nordost scam. It was with the OP who said that the demonstration report was an example of Stereophile's flawed editorial policy. I say again, that piece has NO editorial content. The reporter merely described the event and the product, and said that the enthusiastic audiophile audience happily gave their opinions. Unless there was more to the report than the OP posted, the reporter gave no opinion about the cables' performance. --- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: --- |
#10
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
Audio_Empire wrote:
I don't think any reviewers spend hours comparing cables. That would be like comparing table-salt grains under a microscope looking for differences. A useless and futile procedure at best. I have always wondered how they could claim to hear differences among cables, amplifiers, and CD players when they still haven't been able to hear and correlate differences among speakers and their causes. They are in a wonderland of mystery when it comes to speakers and their use and what causes various effects, effects that are very audible compared to the imaginary ones between cables. I think the high-end (expensive hobbyinst class) industry will die out before any of them get a clue. Gary Eickmeier |
#11
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
In article ,
"Gary Eickmeier" wrote: Audio_Empire wrote: I don't think any reviewers spend hours comparing cables. That would be like comparing table-salt grains under a microscope looking for differences. A useless and futile procedure at best. I have always wondered how they could claim to hear differences among cables, amplifiers, and CD players when they still haven't been able to hear and correlate differences among speakers and their causes. They are in a wonderland of mystery when it comes to speakers and their use and what causes various effects, effects that are very audible compared to the imaginary ones between cables. I think the high-end (expensive hobbyinst class) industry will die out before any of them get a clue. Gary Eickmeier I assume that most of us who post here on a regular basis are Old Farts. Certainly, I've known of several names here for decades. I'm more than reasonably sure that interest in high-end radio will die out with the current over-fifty crowd. I hope I'm wrong, but interest in good sound doesn't seem to be an interest that attracts many youngsters. Everytime I go to a hi-fi show or event at a local hi-fi salon, all I see is old guys. Not a healthy situation. --- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: --- |
#12
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
Audio_Empire wrote:
I assume that most of us who post here on a regular basis are Old Farts. Certainly, I've known of several names here for decades. I'm more than reasonably sure that interest in high-end radio will die out with the current over-fifty crowd. I hope I'm wrong, but interest in good sound doesn't seem to be an interest that attracts many youngsters. Everytime I go to a hi-fi show or event at a local hi-fi salon, all I see is old guys. Not a healthy situation. I pointed this out to my 15 yr old daughter. She said sure we're interested in technical stuff - we've got our computers, pads, pods, phones, Facetime & Skype, and above all Minecraft (just kidding, but it's true). In other words, they are no longer impressed by the presentation, just the information. I have no doubt they would be just as happy watching Fast & Furious on an iPad than on Imax 3D Surround Sound. They will buy a larger screen TV and "Home Theater in a Box" and maybe even a 3D player, but they don't quite know how to set them up. They will put 5 twelve inch woofers in their cars to play Rap & catch girls, but they don't care about the home system or realism, just bass output and loudness. So what becomes of live concerts? They are more interested in Rock concerts than real music, classical or jazz, in a good hall. The schools do still have jazz bands and my daughter is going to strings camp again this summer, taught by the symphony people from the LSO. It is mainly the reproducing part they aren't interested in. When I take pictures, I like to see them BIG, whether it is on paper or on screen. They look at them on their phones. I just shot my daughter's recital in Hi Def and stereo sound and offered to make one for them, but the parents there are happy with their iPhone footage of their kid. I would rather have a CD and hear it on my big system, they are happy with an MP3 download on their earbuds. I can't even teach my kid anything about all I have learned about photography, video, and sound. Gary Eickmeier |
#13
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
On 6/3/2013 3:48 AM, Audio_Empire wrote:
In article , "Gary Eickmeier" wrote: Audio_Empire wrote: snip I assume that most of us who post here on a regular basis are Old Farts. Hey, I resemble that remark! Certainly, I've known of several names here for decades. I'm more than reasonably sure that interest in high-end radio will die out with the current over-fifty crowd. I hope I'm wrong, but interest in good sound doesn't seem to be an interest that attracts many youngsters. Everytime I go to a hi-fi show or event at a local hi-fi salon, all I see is old guys. Not a healthy situation. I don't know anyone, personally, under 40 that cares about high end sound outside of HT. When all boomers head for the long dirt nap, I think high end audio will go with us. Keith |
#14
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
KH wrote:
On 6/3/2013 3:48 AM, Audio_Empire wrote: In article , "Gary Eickmeier" wrote: Audio_Empire wrote: snip I assume that most of us who post here on a regular basis are Old Farts. Hey, I resemble that remark! Certainly, I've known of several names here for decades. I'm more than reasonably sure that interest in high-end radio will die out with the current over-fifty crowd. I hope I'm wrong, but interest in good sound doesn't seem to be an interest that attracts many youngsters. Everytime I go to a hi-fi show or event at a local hi-fi salon, all I see is old guys. Not a healthy situation. I don't know anyone, personally, under 40 that cares about high end sound outside of HT. When all boomers head for the long dirt nap, I think high end audio will go with us. Keith Im 49, and I do care a hell of a lot about audio quality. Its sad to see that nobody else does anymore. Mats -- Mats Peterson http://alicja.homelinux.com/~mats/ |
#15
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereophile, don't worry
On Monday, June 3, 2013 10:37:59 AM UTC-4, KH wrote:
I don't know anyone, personally, under 40 that cares about high end sound outside of HT. Please note that Ariel Bitran, who write the report on the Nordost demonstration, is 23, and that Stereophile's assistant editor, Stephen Mejias, who is now one of the magazine's most popular writers, is 34. John Atkinson Editor, Stereophile |
#16
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Stereophile, don't worry
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