[Patrick Turner]

A burglar broke in silently to a house of one of my customers,
and began quietly removing the KT88 from
his favourite amplifier.
While beavering away with a tiny torch, he hears a voice..
"Jesus is watching you."

Thinking its his imagination at 3am, he ignores the voice.

"Jesus is watching you."

No, its not his imagination, so he turns up the torch
to see who is there, and he sees a parrot in a cage in the corner.

"Jesus is watching you."

So he asks the parrot quietly,
"Wots your name?"

The parrot relies,
"Satan"

The burglar asks,
"What kinda guy calls a parrot 'Satan'?"

The parrot replies,
"The kinda guy who names hs rottweiler 'Jesus'"

So ****in don't steal my KT88, OK.

[Peter Wieck]

On May 2, 7:43 am, Patrick Turner wrote:
A burglar broke in silently to a house of one of my customers,
and began quietly removing the KT88 from
his favourite amplifier.
While beavering away with a tiny torch, he hears a voice..
"Jesus is watching you."

Thinking its his imagination at 3am, he ignores the voice.

"Jesus is watching you."

No, its not his imagination, so he turns up the torch
to see who is there, and he sees a parrot in a cage in the corner.

"Jesus is watching you."

So he asks the parrot quietly,
"Wots your name?"

The parrot relies,
"Satan"

The burglar asks,
"What kinda guy calls a parrot 'Satan'?"

The parrot replies,
"The kinda guy who names hs rottweiler 'Jesus'"

So ****in don't steal my KT88, OK.

The first intelligent, tube related post of the last five.

Peter Wieck
Wyncote, PA

[bassett[_2_]]

"Peter Wieck" wrote in message
ups.com...
On May 2, 7:43 am, Patrick Turner wrote:
A burglar broke in silently to a house of one of my customers,
and began quietly removing the KT88 from
his favourite amplifier.
While beavering away with a tiny torch, he hears a voice..
"Jesus is watching you."

Thinking its his imagination at 3am, he ignores the voice.

"Jesus is watching you."

No, its not his imagination, so he turns up the torch
to see who is there, and he sees a parrot in a cage in the corner.

"Jesus is watching you."

So he asks the parrot quietly,
"Wots your name?"

The parrot relies,
"Satan"

The burglar asks,
"What kinda guy calls a parrot 'Satan'?"

The parrot replies,
"The kinda guy who names hs rottweiler 'Jesus'"

So ****in don't steal my KT88, OK.

The first intelligent, tube related post of the last five.

Peter Wieck
Wyncote, PA

I think you left "YEARS " of the end of your post

[Phil Allison]

"Peter Wieck"


The first intelligent, tube related post of the last five.


** How would an autistic, DEMENTED YANK ****HEAD

like * YOU * know ?


BTW

Gotta be one of the dumbest jokes out, just slightly reworded.




........ Phil

[TT]

"Phil Allison" wrote in message
...

Gotta be one of the dumbest jokes out.......
....... Phil

No Philthy, that would be you!

TT

[MarkS]

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...
A burglar broke in silently to a house of one of my customers,
and began quietly removing the KT88 from
his favourite amplifier.
While beavering away with a tiny torch, he hears a voice..
"Jesus is watching you."

Thinking its his imagination at 3am, he ignores the voice.

"Jesus is watching you."

No, its not his imagination, so he turns up the torch
to see who is there, and he sees a parrot in a cage in the corner.

"Jesus is watching you."

So he asks the parrot quietly,
"Wots your name?"

The parrot relies,
"Satan"

The burglar asks,
"What kinda guy calls a parrot 'Satan'?"

The parrot replies,
"The kinda guy who names hs rottweiler 'Jesus'"

So ****in don't steal my KT88, OK.

LOL; but when Jesus attacks (that feels weird to write), 'dem KT88's are
gonna hit the floor! Sheeeit!!!
Mark

[Patrick Turner]

MarkS wrote:

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...
A burglar broke in silently to a house of one of my customers,
and began quietly removing the KT88 from
his favourite amplifier.
While beavering away with a tiny torch, he hears a voice..
"Jesus is watching you."

Thinking its his imagination at 3am, he ignores the voice.

"Jesus is watching you."

No, its not his imagination, so he turns up the torch
to see who is there, and he sees a parrot in a cage in the corner.

"Jesus is watching you."

So he asks the parrot quietly,
"Wots your name?"

The parrot relies,
"Satan"

The burglar asks,
"What kinda guy calls a parrot 'Satan'?"

The parrot replies,
"The kinda guy who names hs rottweiler 'Jesus'"

So ****in don't steal my KT88, OK.

LOL; but when Jesus attacks (that feels weird to write), 'dem KT88's are
gonna hit the floor! Sheeeit!!!
Mark

PPL think it duzen madder about the KT atey bloody ates if they are all
broken.
Insurance will cover that OK. Time they were replaced anyways.

Just as long as the guy stealing them leaves nearly dead,
but with a minumum of blood spillage, its a fine outcome.
He won't be back.

After the dog has his way, maybe someone wakes up,
and there's Uncle Gabriel also watching the guy as he hobbles out,
and of course UG is a 44.....

Parrot shrieks

"UG is watching you, UG is watching you.."

Before the Police call around to do the report to back up the insurance
claim,
and without disturbing the broken glass, or Jesus,
these people move the parrot to the garage; they don't want to hear
"UG not licensed"


Patrick Turner.

[TT]

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...
,
these people move the parrot to the garage; they don't
want to hear
"UG not licensed"


Patrick Turner.

"UG" = 'uge Gun? Or should that be Uzi?

TT

PS Patrick what is the latest on the ERA ESLs?? I am very
interested in knowing if you fixed them or not.

[Patrick Turner]

TT wrote:

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...
,
these people move the parrot to the garage; they don't
want to hear
"UG not licensed"


Patrick Turner.

"UG" = 'uge Gun? Or should that be Uzi?

UG = Uncle Gabriel; he was a or still is a major Angel in the Department
of the
Supernatural, like Jesus and Satan.

You really should attend Bible studies on Sunday more often.



TT

PS Patrick what is the latest on the ERA ESLs?? I am very
interested in knowing if you fixed them or not.

A couple of folks have asked about them.

I spent part of last week applying 4 coats of paint to the stators made
from thinned down
silicone sealant using white spirits.
The silicone is standard clear natural cure, not acid cure, so no smell
or effects
or corrosion from the acetic acid used in some silicones, especially
when wanting to adhere glass.
I used the $5 per tube 'Zeal' brand made in China for roof and gutter
silicone.
About 50ml is squirted from the tube into a clean old tuna fish can,
and a small brush used to mix in white spirit of about twice the
silicone volume
until the mix has a consistency of thick honey, with no lumps present.
It was applied by dabbing action with the cheap 30mm brush with brush
laid flattish
so brush strokes would not make the goop drip through the holes in the
perforated metal stators. Where drips did happen, a brush at the outside
of the stator
removed them. It spreads out OK on the stator.
About 12 hours minimum was allowed between silicone paint coats, and
during this time the white spirit quickly evaporates, leaving the
silicone to
to cure, and become rubbery.
For one 1.2M x 0.55M ESL panel with silicone applied to just one side of
the stator
I used about 400ml of silicone, or around 1.25 tubes, and about 1/2 a
litre
of white spirits.

After 4 coats, the average total thickness of silicone plus the
preceding two coats of anti-corona
paint put on months ago and the non insulating powder coat as supplied
is about 0.8mm.
The distance from membrane to stator metal surface is 2.4mm,
so the distance the membrane can now travel without hitting anything
is 1.6mm.

I think this amount of travel should be large enough for bass levels
intended.

Because I have been contracted to build these kits commercially by a guy
who
spent over 2 grand on the kit, it's my duty to get one to work without
the problems of the membrane sticking to the stator once the speaker is
driven past what
seem to be very low levels of ac signals.

Now that I have a physical barrier erected to prevent the membrane
getting
closer than 0.8mm from the stator metal, perhaps the large sudden
increase in electrostatic force which is proportional to 1/distance
squared
won't occur when signal levels at LF provoke large membrane movement.

And I hope that when I stretch the membrane again for this panel, ( the
fifth attempt ),
I will be able to apply 2Kg per 60mm of side length to give over twice
the
recommended membrane tension, 0.8Kg /60mm or just less than as used in
Quad ESL63 speakers,
and this will be enough to pull the membrane free if it tries to become
stuck to a stator.
When the EHT is raised above 2kV, the membranes tend to become stuck to
a stator, and
no amount of applied signal will dislodge them when very close to a
stator, because the
the ac electrostatic force is always going to be smaller than the dc
electrostatic force.

Of course despite over 50 hours work so far, and considerable expense,
and I've not yet claimed
a cent for my efforts which have so far have been in vain to get a
working panel
anywhere near as easily as what the ER Audio website suggests i should
be able to achieve.

I have a about 5 other clients waiting for jobs with amplifiers,
and have had no cash income, so while the silicone cures for a
fortnight,
I have been doing other work, because I need to pay bills.

I am hoping to get a membrane stretched out next monday, and glue on the
frame with stator, and maybe have a test on thursday.

If the method I have addopted fails to prevent the membrane becoming
glued to the stators, I will
will have to either give up the project, or create stators myself of
similar
type as used in Quad ESL57; these are perforated PVC sheets of 2mm
thickness, and instead of
the metal sheets, the conductive stator coating is simply applied
conductive paint on the outside of the stator.
Thus I could have 2mm of travel disatance, and 2mm of statr thickness.
This also means the distance between membrane and conductive stator
surface is
4mm each side, so a large amount of EHT should be able to be applied,
and indeed MUST
be applied to get the sensitivity above the woeful levels of the
existing kits.
It means to get the same SPL as ESL57, I'd need the same applied ac
voltages, and since the
ERA step up tranny is only 1:93, and ESL 57 have 1:290, then 3 times the
input voltage
is needed by the ERA to give the same SPL as a Quad ESL57.
The ERAudio tranny is rather a dim affair, with far too small a core and
far too few
turns per volt, and far too much self capacitance, so driving it harder
than one would than ESL57
isn't going to be very satisfactory compared with the ESL57, or ESL63
either.
People have said they sold their Quad ESL in favour of the ERAudio
panels, to me this seems
idotic; Quad make the better speakers by far.
However, perhaps if such ppl found they had defective ancient old ESL57
which hadn't been restored fully for the common cost of $3,500 a pair,
then one can see why someone might take a punt on an alternative
cheaper solution. ESL57 panels eventually die, like all old speakers
from 1957.
The become less sensitive as years go by, and folks apply more signal,
and often without
regard to the input voltage limitations, and poof, a treble panel arcs,
the complete rebuild with all new membranes is never cheap.
I have two old ESL57 here, one has a stuffed treble panel that caused a
Quad II amp
to fail not once but twice before the owner and I found out why.
The other panel seems OK, but has very peaked bass at 85Hz, and so
probably the membranes have lost tension.
I would NEVER pay anyone more than $400 for an old pair of ESL57
which have never been totally rebuilt by an expert, and they are thin on
the ground.
If unrestored samples of '57 appear to work ok now, they may in fact be
on the verge of failure
sooner or later, and not give a proper response between no than then.

I suspect there would be many owners of the ER Audio speakers who have
stiction problems with membranes, and
because it mainly only affects the bass F many would not realise it.
I like music with a full flat response, not with missing bass, and nor
with missing treble.

If my stator coating process is a success, and I can apply a desired 4kV
of EHT to the ER panels
without membrane stiction and without arcing and BS performance, I will
have achieved
what is possible with this kit, and I have done my job, and should get
paid.
I expect to get a reasonably reliabe speaker for my efforts; the
silicone will
also help prevent any arcing in addition to the other material painted
on.
The panels are NOT enclosed in a secondary stretched membrane used by
Quad to
keep out dust. So the insulation on the bare panels as supplied needs to
be
very very good, lest dust entry build up and cause troubles.

I can't help thinking that in future both sides of the stator should be
coated
thickly like I have done to prevent people getting a shock if they have
a signal present
between each stator of up to about 2,700Vrms from stator to stator
based on a 30Vrms input voltage from an amplifier.
Without the cloth covers over the panels, touching both stators at once
with signal
would give new meaning to ESL excitement.
It could easily cause a heart attack in an older person.

The technique I have selected is similar in effect to what a guy has
done in the US
where his perforated steel sheet stators were coated with molten
polythene.
He does not describe the process by which he places a 1mm thick
polythene layer on the metal
and not resulting in closing perforated holes.

If I find that bass performance and troubles with the transformer
saturating at too high an F are impossible to overcome, then perhaps I
will
use a 200mm dia cone woofer for below 250Hz, and just have the panels
for above 250Hz.
Frankly, I don't have confidence that these kits will be good for bass,
because of the problems, but for the higher F the should be OK where
there is
in fact very little membrane movement.
There has to be an enclosure at the bottom of the panel to contain the
tranny and EHT supply
and the crossover resistors and caps, and it could easily be a size
large enough for
a 200mm woofer. Martin logan use a similar method to get loud levels
so beloved by the US market who expects speakers to go loud, especially
when they cost
$12,000. Customers baulk and buying quietspeakers; they like
loudspeakers.
I am not aiming for ML levels; that would appear to be technically
beyond the ER panel capability.

If there is magic sound with ESL, perhaps I will find it.

People should be very wary with any kit they buy, and beware
of claims made about the time it takes to build them.

Its a classic old bull**** story by kit produces to try to convince the
buyers that the kit won't
take very long to put together, but one should always allow 10 times the
time stated for completion.
There will never be any problems they say, but there are, and its on the
buyer to sort them out.

Patrick Turner.

[TT]

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...

PS Patrick what is the latest on the ERA ESLs?? I am
very
interested in knowing if you fixed them or not.

A couple of folks have asked about them.

I spent part of last week applying 4 coats of paint to the
stators made
from thinned down
silicone sealant using white spirits.

That sounds like a lot of hard work. Have you thought of a
product like this?

http://www.crcind.com.au/catalogue.n...e?openDocument

Spray on and it would work well with something like the
stators. Note: it says for armatures.


Of course despite over 50 hours work so far, and
considerable expense,
and I've not yet claimed
a cent for my efforts which have so far have been in vain
to get a
working panel
anywhere near as easily as what the ER Audio website
suggests i should
be able to achieve.

This was what I was expecting *IF* I had bought these kits.
The dead give away was the manufacturer's reluctance to
construct them.

I can't help thinking that in future both sides of the
stator should be
coated
thickly like I have done to prevent people getting a shock
if they have
a signal present

Hence my suggestion about the CRC product

between each stator of up to about 2,700Vrms from stator
to stator
based on a 30Vrms input voltage from an amplifier.
Without the cloth covers over the panels, touching both
stators at once
with signal
would give new meaning to ESL excitement.
It could easily cause a heart attack in an older person.

The technique I have selected is similar in effect to what
a guy has
done in the US
where his perforated steel sheet stators were coated with
molten
polythene.

That is what made me remember the CRC product.

I am not aiming for ML levels; that would appear to be
technically
beyond the ER panel capability.

More would be actually better ;-)

If there is magic sound with ESL, perhaps I will find it.

People should be very wary with any kit they buy, and
beware
of claims made about the time it takes to build them.

That is a very, very important point.


Its a classic old bull**** story by kit produces to try to
convince the
buyers that the kit won't
take very long to put together, but one should always
allow 10 times the
time stated for completion.

Only a factor 10? ;-) Read any good Chinglish manuals
lately? ;-)

There will never be any problems they say, but there are,
and its on the
buyer to sort them out.

Quite frankly I would have expected a lot more help from Rob
MacKinlay.


Patrick Turner.

Please keep us informed with your progress on these as I am
sure many others are finding it fascinating as well. You
really have no idea how close I came to buying these kits.


Cheers TT