[[email protected]]

I've got a 2002 Civic EX Sedan that's getting a serious audio boost.
I'm wiring it for two amps, one 4 channel for interior speakers and I'm
also wiring a hot drop for a sub amp to come later. My question is in
two parts.

First, someone with some solid wiring experience; where would be the
best spot to run the 4 gauge main amp power through the firewall?
Battery's on the right side of the car, and the right side doesn't
appear to have many good spots to punch through into the cabin,
especially with the vent system fan right in front of the glove box. I
might have enough 4 gauge to reach the trunk even if I route across the
engine bay and through the driver's side of the firewall, but not sure.
The 4 gauge has to make it to the trunk because the power's going into
a fused distribution block and going down to 8 gauge into the amps
themselves. Any tips/tricks to save time and misery? I did a basic
install about 6 years ago on an old car, but didn't really care how it
looked. This car's a little different, I want to make it look fairly
professional.

Secondly, what's the approx max amperage output on a Civic alternator?
The Alpine MRP-F250 I've got for the 4 channels draws up to 30 amps.
One guy told me the Civic made about 60 amps, but I don't know this for
sure and I don't have a big enough amp meter to driveway test it. I
want to get a second amp that's got power but that won't overload my
charging system. I'd like to stick with Alpine amps but they don't
seem to make a sub amp in my price/wattage range that draws less than
40 amps.

[Tony F]

To answer your first question, you can drill a hole in your firewall if you
are very careful to make sure there's nothing on the other side. I believe
a 1/4-inch drill bit should be about the right size. Just juse a grommet
for 4-guage wire to keep it from being cut by the firewall's sharp edge and
shorting out. Grommets can be purchased online at Cardomain or
Partsexpress. If you don't want to drill a hole, and you have an existing
hole on your driver's side, then that's fine too. A lot of times those
holes already have rubber grommets built-in and you can cut holes or slits
in them to accomodate your power wire. If you have to buy more 4-guage, do
it. Or, you could put the fused distribution box near the front of the car
and run two 8-guages to the trunk.

I have no idea what the output of your Civic alternator is. If your amps
have 30 and 40-amp fuses (70-amp draw), and your alternator puts out 60
amps, then you should be fine. Those draw ratings are max draw, meaning
that during peak musical outputs on both amps at the same time, they'll draw
up to 70 amps. Keep in mind that you'd have to have the volume knob on your
stereo turned up all the way, your gains on your amps turned up all the way,
and all the while playing some demanding peice of music. Assuming your
alternator is 60 amps, you should be fine.

Tony


--
2001 Chevy S10 ZR2
Pioneer DEH-P9600MP Head Unit, Phoenix Gold Ti500.4 Amp, Focal 165HC
Speakers & Image Dynamics ID8 D4 v.3 Sub

2006 Mustang GT Coupe
Alpine IVA-D310 DVD Head Unit, Alpine MRA-550 Digital 5.1 Amp, Boston
Acoustics Z-Series Speakers, Alpine SBS-05DC Center Channel Speaker,
Amplified MTX Thunderform Sub

[mfreak]

you can drill a hole in your firewall if you
are very careful to make sure there's nothing on the other side. I believe
a 1/4-inch drill bit should be about the right size. Just juse a grommet
for 4-guage wire to keep it from being cut by the firewall's sharp edge and
shorting out.

I have 4g powering my system, I think it's a lot larger than 1/4"..
With the insulation, it's gotta be 3/8", then add the grommet, the
firewall hole is probably gonna be more like 1/2". I found a
AWG-inch table that says 4g is .2043", I guess I beleive it, but in
my mind it looks a whole lot bigger..

The 8g wire I have coming out of my distro block, THAT looks more like
1/4", with the insulation of course..

[[email protected]]

Thanks for the quick response, and I'll keep that amperage draw in
mind. I'm not too worried about pulling max power, I don't listen to
my music cranked all the way, and I've settled on a Boston GT-20 amp
for a single 12" sub, and the amp's max draw is only 25A anyway so I'm
in under 60 amps combined anyway.

I picked up a waterproof firewall passthrough "bushing" when I made my
order from Crutchfield so I should be set with that, but the hole looks
like it'll have to be around 5/8ths to fit with the O/D of the bushing.

My only other concern is where to drill on the firewall, and I've got a
couple possible spots but everything is very tightly packed in the dash
of this car so it's tough to find a place. Anybody know of a "sweet
spot" for the 4 gauge coming through the firewall into the cabin?

Thanks again for the help, much appreciated!


Tony F wrote:
To answer your first question, you can drill a hole in your firewall if you
are very careful to make sure there's nothing on the other side. I believe
a 1/4-inch drill bit should be about the right size. Just juse a grommet
for 4-guage wire to keep it from being cut by the firewall's sharp edge and
shorting out. Grommets can be purchased online at Cardomain or
Partsexpress. If you don't want to drill a hole, and you have an existing
hole on your driver's side, then that's fine too. A lot of times those
holes already have rubber grommets built-in and you can cut holes or slits
in them to accomodate your power wire. If you have to buy more 4-guage, do
it. Or, you could put the fused distribution box near the front of the car
and run two 8-guages to the trunk.

I have no idea what the output of your Civic alternator is. If your amps
have 30 and 40-amp fuses (70-amp draw), and your alternator puts out 60
amps, then you should be fine. Those draw ratings are max draw, meaning
that during peak musical outputs on both amps at the same time, they'll draw
up to 70 amps. Keep in mind that you'd have to have the volume knob on your
stereo turned up all the way, your gains on your amps turned up all the way,
and all the while playing some demanding peice of music. Assuming your
alternator is 60 amps, you should be fine.

Tony


--
2001 Chevy S10 ZR2
Pioneer DEH-P9600MP Head Unit, Phoenix Gold Ti500.4 Amp, Focal 165HC
Speakers & Image Dynamics ID8 D4 v.3 Sub

2006 Mustang GT Coupe
Alpine IVA-D310 DVD Head Unit, Alpine MRA-550 Digital 5.1 Amp, Boston
Acoustics Z-Series Speakers, Alpine SBS-05DC Center Channel Speaker,
Amplified MTX Thunderform Sub

[brianlanning]

wrote:
Thanks for the quick response, and I'll keep that amperage draw in
mind. I'm not too worried about pulling max power, I don't listen to
my music cranked all the way, and I've settled on a Boston GT-20 amp
for a single 12" sub, and the amp's max draw is only 25A anyway so I'm
in under 60 amps combined anyway.

I have an 89 toyta camry with a stock alternator. I have two 4x30 JBL
amps driving the corner speakers. (I'm only using 2 channels on each
at the moment). I also have a hifonics 2x100 watt amp driving two
rockford tens. No matter how hard I make it hit, my lights don't dim
and everything works fine. I don't know what the specs are on your
alternator. But it can't be much less than what I have in my car.

I picked up a waterproof firewall passthrough "bushing" when I made my
order from Crutchfield so I should be set with that, but the hole looks
like it'll have to be around 5/8ths to fit with the O/D of the bushing.

5/8" sounds more like it for 4 gauge, maybe even more once you include
the grommet. To drill this, the tool of choice is a step-drill. It's
a drill bit for working in metal that looks like a cone. You may have
to drill a smaller pilot hole first, or at least center-punch it to
keep the bit from walking.

You may also want to have a good look at the underside of the car. It
might be easier to run the 4-gauge wire on the outside of the car, then
find a hole in the trunk to come in.

brian

[Tony F]

I have 4g powering my system, I think it's a lot larger than 1/4".. With the
insulation, it's gotta be 3/8", then add the grommet, the firewall hole is
probably gonna be more like 1/2"."

You're absolutely right. I wrote this last night when I couldn't sleep. I
meant to say 1/2 inch.

Tony

[JMUBrahma06]

I have an 03 Civic LX sedan and just recently ran knuconceptz 4AWG to
the trunk. I breached mine through the firewall on the passenger side,
up a bit further from where a persons feet would rest, towards the
center console. Just pull back the carpet a little bit. There is
already a rubber grommet with wires running through it there on my car
(and yours as well most likely since its the same generation). I took
a metal coathanger, straightened it out, taped the end of the wire to
the end of the hanger, and punched it through the grommet from the
inside of the car into the engine bay. I then just reached down into
the engine bay and grabbed it where it poked out, then pulled it
through. I know my alternator is a 70 amp (yours is most likely as
well). With about 16 feet of the 4 AWG power and about 3 feet of 4
AWG ground im getting about 14.3volts no sound and it only drops to
about 13.6 with the roughest bass music that I have dared put to it (I
run a cheapy sony amp 400W RMS by 4 ohm for the moment with a 12d2
Brahma in a 1.3 Cube sealed box). The amp I have is rated with a 30
amp fuse and my headlights only dimm when I play the music loud enough
to kill small animals.

Some things to remember: 1)That 70 amp rating on the alternator is a
max rating, just like the fuse ratings on your amps. There is also
rating for when the car is idle and it will be certainly lower thatn
the max. So keep this in mind if you are sitting somewhere listening
to music with the car on and some power hungry amps. 2)Lights dimming
can be a symptom of a couple things, most likely the cars altrnator is
being choked and cannot keep up, causing voltage drops, or the computer
is not reacting fast enough to "answer" the demand for more energy so
3)In a 2 or more amp set up UPGRADE YOUR BIG 3-this will give your
electrical system a little more breathing room because regardless of
how you listen to music, some amps can suck power fast. Itll help to
smoth out those voltage drops when the musics hits and itll also give
you a better voltage overall at the amps.


--
JMUBrahma06

[moksha]

I've owned three Honda Civics so far. An '83 and a '92, and my current
one is 2002 4-dr Civic. I can tell you from first hand experience that
getting things professionally wired is the best route unless you are
experienced, are working with someon experienced, or money is tight.

I've tried to wire my car twice. I managed to pull it off both times,
but I ended up damaging the interior of my car (nothing too bad, but
still not worth it), and the job was not professional by any means. To
me, it is worth the peace of mind to pay someone an extra $75 to run
all the wires you want and then you can hook up whatever you want to
them yourself. Plus, a lot of places give you a lifetime gurantee on
their job so you can always go back and have them solve any wiring
issues that may come up.

It's just all about peace of mind to me. Sometimes, you can even ask a
guy who does it professionally to do it for you "outside of his work"
if you just offer him some cash. This way, he'll be able to charge you
less and you'll get the same job done as you would at a car audio
place.


--
moksha

[JMUBrahma06]

I would agree with Moksha, professional is the way to go. The only
problem is that "professional" for most people is a CC or BB.....in
other words not very "professional." I would rather have an aids
infested hooker crap in my mouth than to have my car worked on by some
of those morons. They like to play fast and loose with screw drivers
and other pointy objects, not to mention you never know how well they
are putting everything back together. Everything in a civic is held
together by 2 screws and some panel clips, believe me. Check this out
for that Civic:
http://www.7thgencivic.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=210136 . This site
has all kinds of easy do it yourselfs with pictures, and believe me, it
is worth it to do it yourself if possible. I just wired my civic not
too long ago for the first time, and I am no pro...not by a long shot.
Took me about 30 minutes or so, with all the wire stripping. If you do
end up taking it to a CC or a BB, WATCH them do the install. Too many
times ive seen them in there crank peoples sytems to the point where I
can here the distortion from 20 feet away through the speakers, all
while wireing up an amp...yes, leaving the electircal system connected
while installing electrical components=stupid way to fry something.


--
JMUBrahma06

[D.Kreft]

On Nov 3, 7:37 am, wrote:

My only other concern is where to drill on the firewall, and I've got a
couple possible spots but everything is very tightly packed in the dash
of this car so it's tough to find a place. Anybody know of a "sweet
spot" for the 4 gauge coming through the firewall into the cabin?

In my days as an installer, one of my most invaluable tools was a
Unibit
(http://www.amazon.com/IRWIN-10234-UN...dp/B00004THZ0).
The great thing about uni-bits is that they've got relatively "dull"
(as in non-pointy or even flat) tips, they work well at low speeds and
their stair-stepped profile makes it really easy not to
over-drill--which comes in handy when you find out that you've picked
the wrong spot on your firewall. Nothing beats a Unibit for firewall
(or antenna hole) drilling!

Depending upon your spot, you may have to make use of a right-angle
drill (e.g.
http://www.amazon.com/Makita-DA391DW...dp/B0000226A4).

However, if you don't have the right combination of tools and either
bravado or experience, I would not recommend taking on this task
without some guidance. Your best bet might be to just pay a local
dealer to drill the hole for you. I can't imagine they'd charge you any
more than about $10-$15 for it, if that. When in doubt, it's usually
best to fork over a tiny bit of cash to avoid the monumental expense of
replacing a brake line or something of that ilk.

-dan