[[email protected]]

I have a question out of general interest. I am a guitar player and
own a Boss gt-6 guitar effects processor. It provides distortions and
a host of other effects for guitar. It's a physical box that sits of
the floor that you plug your guitar into (I'm trying to keep this
simple). However, there are software guitar effects available as well
that you can use on your pc. The same effects are available.
Distortions, amp models, eq, etc... Boss doesn't provide the GT-6 as
pure pc software that I know of. So, my question is:

Is there a sound advantage to using the physical GT-6 as opposed to pc/
software guitar effects? I only use the GT-6 here an an example. I'm
curious if hardware/physical effects systems provide better sound than
software, or provide any audio advantage.

I realize you can use software in a very flexible way, especially for
recording purposes. But, I want to compare this in terms of sound
quality. If I am recording in a home studio, does the GT-6 (or other
hardware effects) provide better sound than I would get from software
effects? I'm guessing the computer sound card will be a factor in this
too, but in general can anyone shed light on this topic? Pros/cons?

[Randy Yates]

writes:

I have a question out of general interest. I am a guitar player and
own a Boss gt-6 guitar effects processor. It provides distortions and
a host of other effects for guitar. It's a physical box that sits of
the floor that you plug your guitar into (I'm trying to keep this
simple). However, there are software guitar effects available as well
that you can use on your pc. The same effects are available.
Distortions, amp models, eq, etc... Boss doesn't provide the GT-6 as
pure pc software that I know of. So, my question is:

Is there a sound advantage to using the physical GT-6 as opposed to pc/
software guitar effects? I only use the GT-6 here an an example. I'm
curious if hardware/physical effects systems provide better sound than
software, or provide any audio advantage.

I realize you can use software in a very flexible way, especially for
recording purposes. But, I want to compare this in terms of sound
quality. If I am recording in a home studio, does the GT-6 (or other
hardware effects) provide better sound than I would get from software
effects? I'm guessing the computer sound card will be a factor in this
too, but in general can anyone shed light on this topic? Pros/cons?

Hi,

There are lots of issues associated with your question and it is
impossible to answer generally one way or the other.

Conversion from analog to digital and back is one potential factor,
but these days converters are pretty much flawless, whether in the
pedal or in a PC soundcard.

Another unknown is the algorithm and its implementation. Generally there
are two ways to implement DSP effects digitally: floating point or fixed
point. Depending on how savvy (or un-savvy) the algorithm designer /
implementer is, you can screw things up one way or the other, and either
one can be used in either a standalone system like the GT-6 or in the
PC. However, low-power systems often use fixed-point algorithms, and
these are typically harder to get "right."

Why do you ask? Are you having problems with the sound quality of the
GT-6?
--
% Randy Yates % "And all that I can do
%% Fuquay-Varina, NC % is say I'm sorry,
%%% 919-577-9882 % that's the way it goes..."
%%%% % Getting To The Point', *Balance of Power*, ELO
http://www.digitalsignallabs.com

[Mike Rivers]

wrote:

Is there a sound advantage to using the physical GT-6 as opposed to pc/
software guitar effects?

Yeah. You can plug it in between your guitar and amplifier and play your
guitar. No PC needed. Where the computer effects are useful is for
recording, where you record a dry track (usually with a DI straight off
the guitar) that you can fiddle with as well as a track with a mic on
the amplifier so you can have something that sounds like a guitar to
listen to while you're building up the song. Then you can start dropping
software effects on that dry track to get just the guitar sound that you
need to best fit the other tracks in the song.

It's wonderful for engineers who charge by the hour because it takes so
much longer to get the guitar sound, but people who never seem to want
to stop tweaking love the approach.

If I am recording in a home studio, does the GT-6 (or other
hardware effects) provide better sound than I would get from software
effects?

Geez, it's a distorted guitar. How can you say what's "better sound?"
You might end up with a little less noise going the software route, but
basically they do the same thing to the same signal source (the guitar
pickup). It's just that with software you have more sounds and
variation, and even more virtual effect processors, that you can
experiment with.

--
If you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring and reach
me he
double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo -- I'm really Mike Rivers
)

[[email protected]]

On Dec 4, 11:08 am, Randy Yates wrote:
writes:
I have a question out of general interest. I am a guitar player and
own a Boss gt-6 guitar effects processor. It provides distortions and
a host of other effects for guitar. It's a physical box that sits of
the floor that you plug your guitar into (I'm trying to keep this
simple). However, there are software guitar effects available as well
that you can use on your pc. The same effects are available.
Distortions, amp models, eq, etc... Boss doesn't provide the GT-6 as
pure pc software that I know of. So, my question is:

Is there a sound advantage to using the physical GT-6 as opposed to pc/
software guitar effects? I only use the GT-6 here an an example. I'm
curious if hardware/physical effects systems provide better sound than
software, or provide any audio advantage.

I realize you can use software in a very flexible way, especially for
recording purposes. But, I want to compare this in terms of sound
quality. If I am recording in a home studio, does the GT-6 (or other
hardware effects) provide better sound than I would get from software
effects? I'm guessing the computer sound card will be a factor in this
too, but in general can anyone shed light on this topic? Pros/cons?

Hi,

There are lots of issues associated with your question and it is
impossible to answer generally one way or the other.

Conversion from analog to digital and back is one potential factor,
but these days converters are pretty much flawless, whether in the
pedal or in a PC soundcard.

Another unknown is the algorithm and its implementation. Generally there
are two ways to implement DSP effects digitally: floating point or fixed
point. Depending on how savvy (or un-savvy) the algorithm designer /
implementer is, you can screw things up one way or the other, and either
one can be used in either a standalone system like the GT-6 or in the
PC. However, low-power systems often use fixed-point algorithms, and
these are typically harder to get "right."

Why do you ask? Are you having problems with the sound quality of the
GT-6?
--
% Randy Yates % "And all that I can do
%% Fuquay-Varina, NC % is say I'm sorry,
%%% 919-577-9882 % that's the way it goes..."
%%%% % Getting To The Point', *Balance of Power*, ELOhttp://www.digitalsignallabs.com

No, I'm not having any issues with the sound. I work with web
applications and have been toying with ideas of Java apps that
communicate with music devices via midi (like the gt-6, keyboards,
etc..). I'm just wondering if anything useful can emerge from a device
like the gt-6 being networked via a web site or software, where people
can connect to it remotely. Are there any useful services that can be
built from this scenario, or is it not practical? I'm comparing the
sound quality of pure software to the device just because, if there
are no real advantages with having a separate box, then pure software
seems to be much more efficient and cost effective.

I'm no expert in this area, so I'm just possibilitizing. I've seen a
few web sites where they offer musician collaboration online. Each
person is in a different location, but they collaborate to record
music. Not sure if or how well this idea has be realized yet. What
about a virtual studio where something like remote guitar effects can
be provided as a service? Or, does this already exist?

[Walter Harley]

wrote in message
...
Is there a sound advantage to using the physical GT-6 as opposed to pc/
software guitar effects? I only use the GT-6 here an an example. I'm
curious if hardware/physical effects systems provide better sound than
software, or provide any audio advantage.

You've got to get the guitar into the computer somehow. If you plug the
guitar straight into the sound card, the low input impedance of the sound
card will make the guitar sound like crap. Likewise if you plug into the
line input of a mixer. So, in a simple boneheaded sense, the Boss makes the
guitar sound better because it handles two tasks, not just one: it handles
impedance and level matching, as well as tone shaping. Of course, that
problem can be solved. Just sayin'.

[Michael R. Kesti[_3_]]

wrote:

I have a question out of general interest. I am a guitar player and
own a Boss gt-6 guitar effects processor. It provides distortions and
a host of other effects for guitar. It's a physical box that sits of
the floor that you plug your guitar into (I'm trying to keep this
simple). However, there are software guitar effects available as well
that you can use on your pc. The same effects are available.
Distortions, amp models, eq, etc... Boss doesn't provide the GT-6 as
pure pc software that I know of. So, my question is:

Is there a sound advantage to using the physical GT-6 as opposed to pc/
software guitar effects? I only use the GT-6 here an an example. I'm
curious if hardware/physical effects systems provide better sound than
software, or provide any audio advantage.

I realize you can use software in a very flexible way, especially for
recording purposes. But, I want to compare this in terms of sound
quality. If I am recording in a home studio, does the GT-6 (or other
hardware effects) provide better sound than I would get from software
effects? I'm guessing the computer sound card will be a factor in this
too, but in general can anyone shed light on this topic? Pros/cons?

In general, I prefer making sounds in the analog domain. Deliberate
distortion, chorus, delay, and reverb just seem to sound better to me
when produced using analog techniques. I often find that the best
guitar effect is a cable between a good guitar and a great amp, but
this usually requires an excellent player, too.

OTOH, I prefer the digital domain's transparency and accuracy for
recording and editing.

Mixing can go either way, depending on the project and the available
gear.

--
================================================== ======================
Michael Kesti | "And like, one and one don't make
| two, one and one make one."
mrkesti at hotmail dot com | - The Who, Bargain

[RD Jones]

On Dec 4, 11:05*am, wrote:

Is there a sound advantage to using the physical GT-6 as opposed to pc/
software guitar effects? I only use the GT-6 here an an example. I'm
curious if hardware/physical effects systems provide better sound than
software, or provide any audio advantage.

If I understand your PC scenario correctly, no sound is actually being
created. The electrical impulses leave the guitar routed through the
GT6 (or not) and are converted to digital in the A/D and live in the
computer hence-forth. No air has moved yet and no sound has been
created or heard. The data stored in the PC is a synthetic
approximation
of an electric guitar with (or without) effects.

So, by definition, it cannot be better sound if it's not "sound".
Yes, I understand that sound is a byproduct of realtime monitoring
and subsequent playback. But it's not the same as playing a guitar,
not in my book.

Part of the nature of the audible sound created by an electric guitar
is the amplifier's circuitry, the character of the speaker (very
important)
and the "human servo" part of the loop which allows one to adjust
one's playing according to the sound being created in realtime and
space. The recognized signature of most recorded electric guitar
also includes the character of the recording microphone (also very
important).

My opinion is that most modelers, synthesizers and plugins are
cheezy aproximations. Some are decent and come surprisingly
close, none are completely convincing.

I realize you can use software in a very flexible way, especially for
recording purposes. But, I want to compare this in terms of sound
quality. *If I am recording in a home studio, does the GT-6 (or other
hardware effects) *provide better sound than I would get from software
effects? I'm guessing the computer sound card will be a factor in this
too, but in general can anyone shed light on this topic? Pros/cons?

The effectivness of a lot of the effects used on guitar are determined
by where in the chain they are implemented. A chorus used inline
before distortion stages will never sound the same as one used later
in the chain, the ultimate example being a Leslie cab.

You should decide for yourself how important "tone" really is.
Most guitarists are obsessive about their tone. If you're not
and just want something that's "OK", (or if you really can't hear
the difference) I think you might be better served by working
alongside someone with a higher standard.
Your "sound" will thank you later.

rd

[Randy Yates]

"Michael R. Kesti" writes:
[...]
I often find that the best guitar effect is a cable between a good
guitar and a great amp, but this usually requires an excellent player,
too.

AMEN, brother!
--
% Randy Yates % "...the answer lies within your soul
%% Fuquay-Varina, NC % 'cause no one knows which side
%%% 919-577-9882 % the coin will fall."
%%%% % 'Big Wheels', *Out of the Blue*, ELO
http://www.digitalsignallabs.com