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#161
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Directed Amplifiers
1 megawatt for $79.99? I want one! Will I need to add a stiffening cap to
my system? How about a new alternator and extra battery? Sorry TG, had to do it ;-) "Tha Ghee" wrote in message ... "Captain Howdy" wrote in message ... Maybe Audiobahn is a little better then you think, i don't know I have never used any of their gear. No one is foced to bid on amps that they don't want on Ebay. If Audiobahn is the biggest seller on Ebay, then their is a reason for it. What is your point? In article , "Mark Zarella" wrote: Checkout Ebay and you'll see what people are paying for old Orion and PPI amps compared to the new ones. Ah yes, ebay. Where Audiobahn is the biggest seller. one reason that Audiobahn sells well on eBay is because it looks pretty, most people buy car audio comp. based on looks printed specs. when they get a little knowledge they learn to buy the used McIn amp and not the 1000kws for $79.95 |
#162
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Directed Amplifiers
I'll give him this, he's nothing if not consistent.
Paul Vina "Tha Ghee" wrote in message ... "Paul Vina" wrote in message news:t0PGb.481653$275.1379414@attbi_s53... If by "season" you mean "since his retarded ass started posting here" then yes, I agree with you! Paul Vina PV you have to give him credit many persons have piled on him and he's standing his position I like that. The best way for him to learn similarities and differences he needs to see the circuit boards and layout/heatsink of the amp and the debt will be settled. If any one can put the pics inside and out of all the amps in question this thread may die |
#163
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Directed Amplifiers
Why don't you do your own legwork and post it here, instead of stooping
to childish namecalling? It's not like I have anything to prove, but clearly YOU have an agenda. Don't expect me to do your research for you... You could also quit changing the subject and go back to what started this, your erroneous jumping to concusions about the commonality of older Orion and PPI designs... or have you finally figured out how far off base you were? JD Captain Howdy wrote: Call the the Federal Trade Commission and ask for the International Division of Consumer Protection about that, or in Canada call the Competition Bureau, Industry Canada. You moron In article , John Durbin wrote: I don't know about spelling it out for Paul, but you should go check your facts... warranty laws don't cross national borders. |
#164
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Directed Amplifiers
Don't put words in my mouth, pal... what I said was I didn't know the
inner details about the companies in question during that part of their history. I know the products a lot better than you, which is no surprise given I worked with many of them over the 17 years I spent working in retail before moving to Directed. My first exposure was with a/d/s/ products starting in 1977, at Howard Sound's Denver and Boulder locations. We sold and installed the a/d/s/ 2002/Nakamichi 250 systems, also the passive 200C and 300C. I own a couple of those systems still... also worked with more of that early stuff including the 2001 version with outboard power amp, the first-gen P100 PowerPlate, 300i's, pretty much all of their mobile products in the period of 1981-1993 here in San Diego while working at Radioman, and again after founding La Jolla Audio where we carried the entire mobile line. We were also an authorized Orion dealer, and as I mentioned elsewhere, dabbled in Precision Power. We also had a good friend that built competition vehicles with PPI at the time, and spent sometime playing with their larger surfboard models as a result. I've installed and repaired all of the above, along the way. It's not clear to me what your expertise on these products stems from, other than being confused by a similar heat sink shape. And, you seem very willing to ignore the comments by John Andreen, all of which rebutted your claims and which demonstrated a very expert knowledge of the companies and their products back then. What's wrong, you only go after people you think can't defend themselves? Whatever, you picked the wrong target this time... but go on insulting me if it makes you feel better about yourself. It's a lousy excuse for knowing what you're talking about though... I'm sure some of the other "morons" that have listened to what I have said here about DEI products over the past few years will enjoy your opinion of them, too. JD Captain Howdy wrote: Like I said, make a phone call, you'll see just what a moron you really are. The only thing that you know is how to talk out your ass about your products. Trying to tell people how good your new products are while you openly admitted that you don't know **** about the products that companies such Orion, PPI and ADS produced before DEI bought them out. Only a moron would believe anything that you have to say about DEI related products. We both know that the truth would be against your best interest. Where did you dig this theory up? You're almost as clueless about trade law as you are about amplifiers... JD seems to me that everyone and his cousin here at RAC has been sweeping the floor with you, frankly |
#165
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Directed Amplifiers
JD, lets break this down. This all started with my comment about Directed 2003 amplifier line looking like the old Alpine V12 line. I do admit that I did push the issue a little far because you started getting fired up about it, only to be a prick. This brings me to topic number 2, PPI amplifier cloning. I not know for a fact that their was cloning going on with the early PPI amp line, But I do feel that they do/did "look" like Orion GX knock offs with only the black paint missing, and a hell of a lot more then the Directed 2003 amplifier line looking like the old Alpine V12 line. Not that it even matters 20 years later, give or take a few years. Better yet, not that it ever mattered at any time. Topic number 3, Overpriced DEI alarms. Comparing my Viper and Audiovox, I don't see anything that justifies the extra $200. They both have same options. They both still work. The viper is 5 years old and the audiovox is 6 years old, both on their second car. Topic number 4, Older is better. I truly do believe that older PPI, Orion gear is better then their new gear. Their other people that feel that same including John Andreen on the PPI part anyways, I know that you read the post in question and ignored his comments on that issue, just as I did regarding cloning. I also believe that Ebay sales and final bid prices speak for themselves. You don't see the same clueless people paying more for 15- 20 year old Hu. Topic number 5, DEI's poor Canadian product support. This is what two dealers had to say when asked why they dropped DEI products. Why would they both lie, they have nothing to gain by saying this. Topic 6, Warranty support, who is responsible, the suppler or manufacturer. The law simply states that the supplier is fully responsible if the supplier does not identify the manufacturer, at which point the supplier will be seen as the manufacturer. In fact they are both responsible. If you were to sue, you could sue both. Trade laws don't stop at any boarders, not anymore. The same stands for Family law and Ecommerce law. But like I said, the truth is only a phone call away. Who do I go after? You, Mark and Paul? You all can defend yourselves just fine, well maybe not Paul never the less he tries. LOL. John, I can truly say that I enjoy and agree with most of your posts, as I do with Mark's and Paul's posts. I just feel that your posts regarding DEI are a little one-sided. This is the only reason I rattled your cage about DEI. I also know that this post wouldn't of went as far as it did , if it wasn't regarding DEI. And, you seem very willing to ignore the comments by John Andreen, all of which rebutted your claims and which demonstrated a very expert knowledge of the companies and their products back then. What's wrong, you only go after people you think can't defend themselves? Whatever, you picked the wrong target this time... but go on insulting me if it makes you feel better about yourself. It's a lousy excuse for knowing what you're talking about though... I'm sure some of the other "morons" that have listened to what I have said here about DEI products over the past few years will enjoy your opinion of them, too. JD |
#166
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Directed Amplifiers
It's easy to take shots at successful companies like Directed... when
they're justified by the facts, assuming any facts are presented, I typically ignore them. When things written about us or our products are misrepresented or outright untrue, I am more likely to respond. I try to avoid taking a purely company line in the process, as it makes what I write less credible. Sticking to facts is the better approach. If everyone on the internet would avoid posting their speculations, myths, and gossip as fact, it would be a much better place. Less entertaining maybe, but better... I will comment on one part of your last post, although again I have nothing personally to do with our alarm business these days: the overwhelming majority of dealers and customers in the US does not agree with your assessment. The survey results that track opinions of our security products and their value vs. other brands like Audiovox emphatically show that people do recognize the difference and are willing to pay for it. We've earned that position through years of consistent quality, and a lot of hard work in engineering, product and customer support areas. If you don't agree, that's your prerogative - but you're in the minority. On the ebay subject, a casual looksuggests that pricing is not driven by "old is better" but by simple supply and demand. Old products are scarcer, and no longer available in quantity at wholesale prices by dealers - or from manufacturers that dump goods that way sometimes. That means the products being sold are mostly by end users, that paid more for them than a dealer would have. I would expect them to sell for more than current product which by comparison is relatively available and in the hands of dealers that paid less for them in the first place. Throw in the predisposition of a certain class of consumers to buy into the "older is better" mythology (not that it isn't true some times, but never as often as the auction market would have you believe), and the model is complete. JD Captain Howdy wrote: JD, lets break this down. This all started with my comment about Directed 2003 amplifier line looking like the old Alpine V12 line. I do admit that I did push the issue a little far because you started getting fired up about it, only to be a prick. This brings me to topic number 2, PPI amplifier cloning. I not know for a fact that their was cloning going on with the early PPI amp line, But I do feel that they do/did "look" like Orion GX knock offs with only the black paint missing, and a hell of a lot more then the Directed 2003 amplifier line looking like the old Alpine V12 line. Not that it even matters 20 years later, give or take a few years. Better yet, not that it ever mattered at any time. Topic number 3, Overpriced DEI alarms. Comparing my Viper and Audiovox, I don't see anything that justifies the extra $200. They both have same options. They both still work. The viper is 5 years old and the audiovox is 6 years old, both on their second car. Topic number 4, Older is better. I truly do believe that older PPI, Orion gear is better then their new gear. Their other people that feel that same including John Andreen on the PPI part anyways, I know that you read the post in question and ignored his comments on that issue, just as I did regarding cloning. I also believe that Ebay sales and final bid prices speak for themselves. You don't see the same clueless people paying more for 15- 20 year old Hu. Topic number 5, DEI's poor Canadian product support. This is what two dealers had to say when asked why they dropped DEI products. Why would they both lie, they have nothing to gain by saying this. Topic 6, Warranty support, who is responsible, the suppler or manufacturer. The law simply states that the supplier is fully responsible if the supplier does not identify the manufacturer, at which point the supplier will be seen as the manufacturer. In fact they are both responsible. If you were to sue, you could sue both. Trade laws don't stop at any boarders, not anymore. The same stands for Family law and Ecommerce law. But like I said, the truth is only a phone call away. Who do I go after? You, Mark and Paul? You all can defend yourselves just fine, well maybe not Paul never the less he tries. LOL. John, I can truly say that I enjoy and agree with most of your posts, as I do with Mark's and Paul's posts. I just feel that your posts regarding DEI are a little one-sided. This is the only reason I rattled your cage about DEI. I also know that this post wouldn't of went as far as it did , if it wasn't regarding DEI. And, you seem very willing to ignore the comments by John Andreen, all of which rebutted your claims and which demonstrated a very expert knowledge of the companies and their products back then. What's wrong, you only go after people you think can't defend themselves? Whatever, you picked the wrong target this time... but go on insulting me if it makes you feel better about yourself. It's a lousy excuse for knowing what you're talking about though... I'm sure some of the other "morons" that have listened to what I have said here about DEI products over the past few years will enjoy your opinion of them, too. JD |
#167
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Directed Amplifiers
I will comment on one part of your last post, although again I have nothing personally to do with our alarm business these days: the overwhelming majority of dealers and customers in the US does not agree with your assessment. The survey results that track opinions of our security products and their value vs. other brands like Audiovox emphatically show that people do recognize the difference and are willing to pay for it. We've earned that position through years of consistent quality, and a lot of hard work in engineering, product and customer support areas. If you don't agree, that's your prerogative - but you're in the minority. I totally believe that to be true. As a matter of fact both of the dealers that I have talked with (the same ones from my previous posts) said nothing but positive things regarding DEI and Clifford alarms. One of them went as far as saying that, I quote" We do not reinstall used alarms with the exception of Viper alarms, due to their low failure rate". From my own experience, I have had no problems over the past 5 years with my Viper 300+, the only thing that I don't like about this model is the built in shock sensor, which is turned off anyways, since I find them to be a pain in the butt with any alarm built in or not. Both the Viper and Audiovox we own have a proximity sensor in place of the shock sensor. This far I have installed 6 or 7 audiovox alarms (never any all-in-ones) for friends and family over the past 15 years and never had any negative results or need for warranty repairs, unlike a crimestopper alarm I used to own. We also have a pair of Valet car starters that work great, both of them are in their second car and are used all year around, since both cars have AC. On the ebay subject, a casual looksuggests that pricing is not driven by "old is better" but by simple supply and demand. Old products are scarcer, and no longer available in quantity at wholesale prices by dealers - or from manufacturers that dump goods that way sometimes. That means the products being sold are mostly by end users, that paid more for them than a dealer would have. I would expect them to sell for more than current product which by comparison is relatively available and in the hands of dealers that paid less for them in the first place. Throw in the predisposition of a certain class of consumers to buy into the "older is better" mythology (not that it isn't true some times, but never as often as the auction market would have you believe), and the model is complete. JD Let me ask you this, Why are older products in demand at all? There is no shortage of new products to place a high or higher demand on old products. Unlike cars, car amplifiers have no classic or vintage value only a higher chance of failure due to age. If you could buy a brand new amplifier of equal or better quality for less money or just a little more money with a warranty, why buy a used one? |
#168
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Directed Amplifiers
I will comment on one part of your last post, although again I have nothing personally to do with our alarm business these days: the overwhelming majority of dealers and customers in the US does not agree with your assessment. The survey results that track opinions of our security products and their value vs. other brands like Audiovox emphatically show that people do recognize the difference and are willing to pay for it. We've earned that position through years of consistent quality, and a lot of hard work in engineering, product and customer support areas. If you don't agree, that's your prerogative - but you're in the minority. I totally believe that to be true. As a matter of fact both of the dealers that I have talked with (the same ones from my previous posts) said nothing but positive things regarding DEI and Clifford alarms. One of them went as far as saying that, I quote" We do not reinstall used alarms with the exception of Viper alarms, due to their low failure rate". From my own experience, I have had no problems over the past 5 years with my Viper 300+, the only thing that I don't like about this model is the built in shock sensor, which is turned off anyways, since I find them to be a pain in the butt with any alarm built in or not. Both the Viper and Audiovox we own have a proximity sensor in place of the shock sensor. This far I have installed 6 or 7 audiovox alarms (never any all-in-ones) for friends and family over the past 15 years and never had any negative results or need for warranty repairs, unlike a crimestopper alarm I used to own. We also have a pair of Valet car starters that work great, both of them are in their second car also and are used all year around, since both cars have AC. On the ebay subject, a casual looksuggests that pricing is not driven by "old is better" but by simple supply and demand. Old products are scarcer, and no longer available in quantity at wholesale prices by dealers - or from manufacturers that dump goods that way sometimes. That means the products being sold are mostly by end users, that paid more for them than a dealer would have. I would expect them to sell for more than current product which by comparison is relatively available and in the hands of dealers that paid less for them in the first place. Throw in the predisposition of a certain class of consumers to buy into the "older is better" mythology (not that it isn't true some times, but never as often as the auction market would have you believe), and the model is complete. JD Let me ask you this, Why are older products in demand at all? There is no shortage of new products to place a high or higher demand on old products. Unlike cars, car amplifiers have no classic or vintage value only a higher chance of failure due to age. If you could buy a brand new amplifier of equal or better quality for less money or just a little more money with a warranty, why buy a used one? |
#169
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Directed Amplifiers
That's an excellent question :-)
JD Captain Howdy wrote: Let me ask you this, Why are older products in demand at all? There is no shortage of new products to place a high or higher demand on old products. Unlike cars, car amplifiers have no classic or vintage value only a higher chance of failure due to age. If you could buy a brand new amplifier of equal or better quality for less money or just a little more money with a warranty, why buy a used one? |
#170
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Directed Amplifiers
Which Class T amps are you refering to? If you mean the ones with th
plastic cases, those were dropped from the lineup for reliabilit issues quite a while ago in fact, that is why you see them gettin blown out. Juan Captain Howdy wrote: *I just like the fact that MTX is doing their own thing in regards t building amplifiers. Sort of like Blaupunkt and their new class T amplifiers. In article , "Joh Spagnolo MMXpress.com" wrote: Oh. OK then. Thought ya meant something that made em sound better. :-) I always liked MTX as a great bang for the buck brand. I even had system with MTX amps for a while. The old Thunder 2300 and a Thunder 2175. - OldOneEy ----------------------------------------------------------------------- CarAudioForum.com - Usenet Gateway w/over one million posts online View this thread: http://www.caraudioforum.com/showthr...threadid=16757 |
#171
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Directed Amplifiers
Me a noob? Funny
Rec.Audio.Car Post from about 8 years ago: http://tinyurl.com/37tt Febuary 1996. Had only recently discovered the internet at that poin really. Did a search in Google for my email (had it for about 8 years as well tons of junkmail at this point) http://tinyurl.com/37tt 2000 plus results. Car Audio Forum: http://tinyurl.com/3cqov 450 posts, 4/2000 register date Elite Car Audio Forums: http://tinyurl.com/yvd2h 1100 posts, Ultimate Member. 8/99 register date SoundDomain Forums: http://tinyurl.com/2rzvz 924 posts, Admin/Mod. 1/2000 Register Date TermPro forums http://tinyurl.com/2cwhy 426 posts, Member # 127 (14000+ members at this point), 6/1999 registe date. CarSound Forum http://tinyurl.com/395d2 1500+ Posts, 6/2000 register date, Ultra Member. Canadian Car Audio Forum http://tinyurl.com/25mq9 150+ posts, 12/2000 register date. About 6500+ posts on several car audio related forums. Seems to me that OldOneEye Captain Obvious. Juan Captain Howdy wrote: *What is your point other then being a noob? In article m OldOneEye wrote: It seems at this point that I should be setting my calendar i Outlook for a reminder in December 2004 to reply to a post "2004 Directe amps look like Brand X" from Howdy Doody. Juan - OldOneEy ----------------------------------------------------------------------- CarAudioForum.com - Usenet Gateway w/over one million posts online View this thread: http://www.caraudioforum.com/showthr...threadid=16757 |
#172
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Directed Amplifiers
"Kevin Murray" wrote in message
t.cable.rogers.com... 1 megawatt for $79.99? I want one! Will I need to add a stiffening cap to my system? How about a new alternator and extra battery? Sorry TG, had to do it ;-) that's funny, but a lot of people think like this and when I try to tell them that Helix is good they look at me crazy, "I've never heard of it how can it be any good, is it better than JL?" |
#173
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Directed Amplifiers
"Paul Vina" wrote in message
news:tT%Gb.206224$_M.912380@attbi_s54... I'll give him this, he's nothing if not consistent. Paul Vina yes he is, I just think you need to let a him find it out for himself |
#174
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Directed Amplifiers
"Captain Howdy" wrote in message
... Topic number 4, Older is better. I truly do believe that older PPI, Orion gear is better then their new gear. Their other people that feel that same including John Andreen on the PPI part anyways, I know that you read the post in question and ignored his comments on that issue, just as I did regarding cloning. I also believe that Ebay sales and final bid prices speak for themselves. You don't see the same clueless people paying more for 15- 20 year old Hu. I think you have to take each amp and company on it's own merits, what used to be good, doesn't always work for now times. |
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