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#1
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the
crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? I suspect this may do interesting things to impedance, but it seems like it ought to be possible with some fiddling (and a lot cheaper than reamping). BTW, it's a 2002 BMW 3 series coupe with the Harmon Kardon 12 speaker abomination. Thanks, Randy |
#2
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
Randy wrote:
I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? No. geoff |
#3
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
I've heard that the newer BMWs are incredibly difficult to upgrade specific
items, like the speakers. I'm not sure to what extent and which years and models are affected. I believe there are some aftermarket products out there that specifically cater to all the newer cars out there that are similarly stubborn when it comes to factory integration. Sorry I'm not much help, maybe someone else can chime in? Tony -- 2001 Nissan Maxima SE Anniversary Edition Clarion DRZ9255 Head Unit, Phoenix Gold ZX475ti, ZX450 and Xenon X1200.1 Amplifiers, Dynaudio System 360 Tri-Amped In Front and Focal 130HCs For Rear Fill, Image Dynamics IDMAX10 D4 v.3 Sub 2001 Chevy S10 ZR2 Pioneer DEH-P9600MP Head Unit, Phoenix Gold Ti500.4 Amp, Focal 165HC Speakers & Image Dynamics ID8 D4 v.3 Sub 2006 Mustang GT Coupe |
#4
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"Geoff@home" wrote in message ... Randy wrote: I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? No. Not directly connect the wires maybe, but it's quite easy to mix the two signals and feed them into a single amp. At it's simplest, a couple of 5 cent resistors would work as a mixer. It should be easier to derive a complete signal direct from the head unit though. If the OP told us exactly what is wrong with the current system and what he hopes to achieve with the "upgrade", it would be possible to speculate further. It seems to me that the original system is designed to be better than standard fare for car systems, so doing anything on the cheap is unlikely to be an improvement. Remember also that a large part of the expense quoted is probably for the labor involved. Remember also that all two way or three way car speakers require a frequency split anyway, and it's usually a simple matter to remove the crossover capacitor if you just want to replace speakers and use the current amps. Of course checking for a suitable crossover frequency for the new drivers would be required. MrT. |
#5
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"Randy" wrote in message
news I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. There are probably some equalizers in the system, someplace. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. You might have to replace the head unit, too if you want to erase all the vestiges of your OEM car system. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. It is all about costs and benefits. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? Anything can be done with enough money and time. In this case it seems like futility. I suspect this may do interesting things to impedance, but it seems like it ought to be possible with some fiddling (and a lot cheaper than reamping). OEM car systems aren't necessarily simple any more. BTW, it's a 2002 BMW 3 series coupe with the Harmon Kardon 12 speaker abomination. Well, in their way they tried. However, consider the cost of the car to you. If you're a real music lover a car with a bad stereo is a broken car. |
#6
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
Geoff@home wrote:
Randy wrote: I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? No. This question gets asked in various forms all of the time. The answer was no to the last guy who asked. He asked again. The answer was no. It's still 'NO'! To the OP: the best you can hope for--without replacing almost everything--is to upgrade the speakers themselves. You have to do some research in order to be successful. You'll have to know the crossover points for the existing system, and the power output of each amplifier in the system, as well as the sizes and impedances of the existing drivers. Then you'll have to find drivers (speakers) which match those specifications; only of higher quality. You may also be able to 'massage' the placement and acoustic environment of the enclosures. Your best bet is to find an autosound contractor who is familiar with the system and the car. This is not a DIY situation, unless you have a lot of knowledge about cars, about audio...and are willing to research and experiment (and spend money). jak geoff |
#7
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
Mr.T wrote:
"Geoff@home" wrote in message ... Randy wrote: I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? No. Not directly connect the wires maybe, but it's quite easy to mix the two signals and feed them into a single amp. At it's simplest, a couple of 5 cent resistors would work as a mixer. It should be easier to derive a complete signal direct from the head unit though. Randy said that the crossovers are internal to the amps - the signal is apparently already summed going into the amps. And a word of warning, adding resistors AFTER the amp, the mixing would work IN THEORY but they'd burn up in about 10 seconds once you actually put any power through them. --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0618-0, 05/02/2006 Tested on: 5/2/2006 10:14:48 AM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#8
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
Matt Ion wrote:
Mr.T wrote: "Geoff@home" wrote in message ... Randy wrote: I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? No. Not directly connect the wires maybe, but it's quite easy to mix the two signals and feed them into a single amp. At it's simplest, a couple of 5 cent resistors would work as a mixer. It should be easier to derive a complete signal direct from the head unit though. Randy said that the crossovers are internal to the amps - the signal is apparently already summed going into the amps. And a word of warning, adding resistors AFTER the amp, the mixing would work IN THEORY but they'd burn up in about 10 seconds once you actually put any power through them. Not to mention; what a crappy kludge! Amplifying and splitting a signal to problably 100's of watts, then attenuating and recombining it again...only to amplify and (probably) split it again. Madness... jak --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0618-0, 05/02/2006 Tested on: 5/2/2006 10:14:48 AM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#9
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
Matt Ion wrote: Mr.T wrote: Randy said that the crossovers are internal to the amps - the signal is apparently already summed going into the amps. And a word of warning, adding resistors AFTER the amp, the mixing would work IN THEORY but they'd burn up in about 10 seconds once you actually put any power through them. Uh, no they would not.. Let's say the amps are, oh, 100 watts a piece into 4 ohms. And let's say your sum,ing network has an effective input impedance of 1 kOhm. That means at clipping, those poor resistors will have to withstand a mighty torrent of power totalling 0.4 watts. ! watt resistors would remain cool to the touch at full power. This is apart from whether or not such a project makes sense in other ways. |
#10
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
I'm sorry, but for the life of me I just don't understand what the Sam hill
is going on here. Everybody has been chiming in like this is a really basic question, and maybe I'm going to feel like a real dummy afterwards, but the best Professor I ever had used to say the only dumb questions are the ones that don't get asked. If the signal is full-bandwidth before it goes into one of these X-overs, why don't you just use THAT signal. I am COMPLETELY unclear as to why COMBINING is necessary AT ALL! Is there something I missed? I reread the OP four times just to be sure. MOSFET "Randy" wrote in message news I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? I suspect this may do interesting things to impedance, but it seems like it ought to be possible with some fiddling (and a lot cheaper than reamping). BTW, it's a 2002 BMW 3 series coupe with the Harmon Kardon 12 speaker abomination. Thanks, Randy |
#11
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
MOSFET spake thus:
I'm sorry, but for the life of me I just don't understand what the Sam hill is going on here. Everybody has been chiming in like this is a really basic question, and maybe I'm going to feel like a real dummy afterwards, but the best Professor I ever had used to say the only dumb questions are the ones that don't get asked. If the signal is full-bandwidth before it goes into one of these X-overs, why don't you just use THAT signal. I am COMPLETELY unclear as to why COMBINING is necessary AT ALL! Is there something I missed? I reread the OP four times just to be sure. Maybe you missed that part right near the top: "But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps." So what he has is a bi-amp (or tri-amp) situation. Obviously, there's nothing to be gained by messsing around with crossovers at all. He doesn't want to scrap the amps; what the guy seems to need are new speakers to replace what he feels are ****ty ones. Why would that be so difficult? Speakers are made in about a zillion variations. -- Pierre, mon ami. Jetez encore un Scientologiste dans le baquet d'acide. - from a posting in alt.religion.scientology titled "France recommends dissolving Scientologists" |
#12
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"MOSFET" wrote in message ... I'm sorry, but for the life of me I just don't understand what the Sam hill is going on here. Everybody has been chiming in like this is a really basic question, and maybe I'm going to feel like a real dummy afterwards, but the best Professor I ever had used to say the only dumb questions are the ones that don't get asked. If the signal is full-bandwidth before it goes into one of these X-overs, why don't you just use THAT signal. I am COMPLETELY unclear as to why COMBINING is necessary AT ALL! Is there something I missed? I reread the OP four times just to be sure. MOSFET often one has to read between the lines (make assumptions) when not enough information is given. in this case my assumption is that poster dosent like the sound of his biamplified speakers and wants to replace them with full range speakers. he wants to hook the amplifier outputs together instead of properly enginering the system. he dosent want to hear that this will probably blow the amplifiers up. the other assumption is that the full range signal is low level and would require another amp to drive the speakers (which the poster doesn't want to buy, install / retrofit into his vehicle somehow. "Randy" wrote in message news I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? I suspect this may do interesting things to impedance, but it seems like it ought to be possible with some fiddling (and a lot cheaper than reamping). BTW, it's a 2002 BMW 3 series coupe with the Harmon Kardon 12 speaker abomination. Thanks, Randy |
#14
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
MOSFET wrote:
I'm sorry, but for the life of me I just don't understand what the Sam hill is going on here. Everybody has been chiming in like this is a really basic question, and maybe I'm going to feel like a real dummy afterwards, but the best Professor I ever had used to say the only dumb questions are the ones that don't get asked. If the signal is full-bandwidth before it goes into one of these X-overs, why don't you just use THAT signal. I am COMPLETELY unclear as to why COMBINING is necessary AT ALL! Is there something I missed? I reread the OP four times just to be sure. It's right there in his second sentence: "...the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps." Apparently these amps provide only the band-split output. One would gather that the head unit only outputs line-level. He could possibly tap into that, but that would require additional amps, and I get the impression he's trying to do this with the existing amps. --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0618-0, 05/02/2006 Tested on: 5/2/2006 9:14:51 PM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#15
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
David Nebenzahl wrote:
MOSFET spake thus: I'm sorry, but for the life of me I just don't understand what the Sam hill is going on here. Everybody has been chiming in like this is a really basic question, and maybe I'm going to feel like a real dummy afterwards, but the best Professor I ever had used to say the only dumb questions are the ones that don't get asked. If the signal is full-bandwidth before it goes into one of these X-overs, why don't you just use THAT signal. I am COMPLETELY unclear as to why COMBINING is necessary AT ALL! Is there something I missed? I reread the OP four times just to be sure. Maybe you missed that part right near the top: "But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps." So what he has is a bi-amp (or tri-amp) situation. Obviously, there's nothing to be gained by messsing around with crossovers at all. He doesn't want to scrap the amps; what the guy seems to need are new speakers to replace what he feels are ****ty ones. Why would that be so difficult? Speakers are made in about a zillion variations. That's what I'm thinking... I don't see why a set of two-way components wouldn't do the trick, or even a set of coaxials, and just remove the built-in capacitor crossover and wire the woofer and tweeter directly. --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0618-0, 05/02/2006 Tested on: 5/2/2006 9:17:16 PM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#16
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
TimPerry spake thus:
"MOSFET" wrote in message ... I'm sorry, but for the life of me I just don't understand what the Sam hill is going on here. Everybody has been chiming in like this is a really basic question, and maybe I'm going to feel like a real dummy afterwards, but the best I ever had used to say the only dumb questions are the ones that don't get asked. If the signal is full-bandwidth before it goes into one of these X-overs, why don't you just use THAT signal. I am COMPLETELY unclear as to why COMBINING is necessary AT ALL! Is there something I missed? I reread the OP four times just to be sure. often one has to read between the lines (make assumptions) when not enough information is given. in this case my assumption is that poster dosent like the sound of his biamplified speakers and wants to replace them with full range speakers. No need to read "between the lines" at all. Just read his last sentence: "BTW, it's a 2002 BMW 3 series coupe with the Harmon Kardon 12 speaker abomination." Obviously, he doesn't like the *speakers*. -- Pierre, mon ami. Jetez encore un Scientologiste dans le baquet d'acide. - from a posting in alt.religion.scientology titled "France recommends dissolving Scientologists" |
#17
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
BINGO!! This is the solution. Is the problem poster still here after this
long discussion. "Matt Ion" wrote in message news:reW5g.109660$7a.23856@pd7tw1no... | That's what I'm thinking... I don't see why a set of two-way components | wouldn't do the trick, or even a set of coaxials, and just remove the | built-in capacitor crossover and wire the woofer and tweeter directly. | | | --- | avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. | Virus Database (VPS): 0618-0, 05/02/2006 | Tested on: 5/2/2006 9:17:16 PM | avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. | http://www.avast.com |
#18
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"Matt Ion" wrote in message news:nxM5g.106758$7a.73218@pd7tw1no... Mr.T wrote: "Geoff@home" wrote in message ... Randy wrote: I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? No. Not directly connect the wires maybe, but it's quite easy to mix the two signals and feed them into a single amp. At it's simplest, a couple of 5 cent resistors would work as a mixer. It should be easier to derive a complete signal direct from the head unit though. Randy said that the crossovers are internal to the amps - the signal is apparently already summed going into the amps. I think he meant it was split *before* going into the existing amps. And a word of warning, adding resistors AFTER the amp, the mixing would work IN THEORY but they'd burn up in about 10 seconds once you actually put any power through them. Where did I say you are putting any power through them? Notice I said "mix the two signals and feed them into a single amp". Best to read what was actually written. MrT. |
#19
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"jakdedert" wrote in message .. . Not to mention; what a crappy kludge! Amplifying and splitting a signal to problably 100's of watts, then attenuating and recombining it again...only to amplify and (probably) split it again. I agree, and already said as much. But why on earth combine the signals if you wanted to split them again? I stated how to avoid that, or didn't you read that far? MrT. |
#20
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"Matt Ion" wrote in message news:reW5g.109660$7a.23856@pd7tw1no... That's what I'm thinking... I don't see why a set of two-way components wouldn't do the trick, or even a set of coaxials, and just remove the built-in capacitor crossover and wire the woofer and tweeter directly. That was suggested by me already. Presumably the OP hadn't thought of it, or lacks sufficient knowledge. I guess that's why he asked for help! Unfortunately expecting a useful answer, when you don't tell people exactly what you are trying to achieve, is expecting too much IMO. MrT. |
#21
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
Matt Ion wrote:
snip That's what I'm thinking... I don't see why a set of two-way components wouldn't do the trick, or even a set of coaxials, and just remove the built-in capacitor crossover and wire the woofer and tweeter directly. One would have to know the xover frequencies of both the original system and the replacement drivers. If they do not match, it's not going to sound any better than the original drivers...which were designed (or at least matched) for the system. Given that the OP can *afford* a BMW (unless daddy bought it for him), he can probably either afford to live with the system as is, or hire a professional to retro it. jak --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0618-0, 05/02/2006 Tested on: 5/2/2006 9:17:16 PM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#22
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
Mr.T wrote:
"Matt Ion" wrote in message news:reW5g.109660$7a.23856@pd7tw1no... That's what I'm thinking... I don't see why a set of two-way components wouldn't do the trick, or even a set of coaxials, and just remove the built-in capacitor crossover and wire the woofer and tweeter directly. That was suggested by me already. Presumably the OP hadn't thought of it, or lacks sufficient knowledge. I guess that's why he asked for help! Unfortunately expecting a useful answer, when you don't tell people exactly what you are trying to achieve, is expecting too much IMO. MrT. You have absolutely no guarantee that the above will work with any give set of replacement speakers. The crossover point is important! Get it too low or high, and the individual drivers in the speaker will not be happy...resulting in blown speakers or just crappy sound. jak |
#23
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
jakdedert wrote:
Mr.T wrote: "Matt Ion" wrote in message news:reW5g.109660$7a.23856@pd7tw1no... That's what I'm thinking... I don't see why a set of two-way components wouldn't do the trick, or even a set of coaxials, and just remove the built-in capacitor crossover and wire the woofer and tweeter directly. That was suggested by me already. Presumably the OP hadn't thought of it, or lacks sufficient knowledge. I guess that's why he asked for help! Unfortunately expecting a useful answer, when you don't tell people exactly what you are trying to achieve, is expecting too much IMO. MrT. You have absolutely no guarantee that the above will work with any give set of replacement speakers. The crossover point is important! Get it too low or high, and the individual drivers in the speaker will not be happy...resulting in blown speakers or just crappy sound. The sound may not be ideal, but I doubt the crossover point is going to be so far off as to blow up components. Obviously finding out what the actual crossover points are and choosing matching drivers would be ideal, but if that's not possible, it should work fine with most sets of drivers. At worst, it'll turn out not sounding any better than before he started. --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0618-1, 05/03/2006 Tested on: 5/3/2006 11:53:37 AM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#24
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
jakdedert wrote:
Given that the OP can *afford* a BMW (unless daddy bought it for him), he can probably either afford to live with the system as is, or hire a professional to retro it. This is true... --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0618-1, 05/03/2006 Tested on: 5/3/2006 11:54:12 AM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#25
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
Mr.T wrote:
"Matt Ion" wrote in message news:nxM5g.106758$7a.73218@pd7tw1no... Mr.T wrote: "Geoff@home" wrote in message ... Randy wrote: I need to upgrade the crappy component speakers in my car. But the crossovers lie within the front and rear amps. I really don't want to have to replace the amps. The quotes I've seen thus far are about $2000 to replace just the front speakers and amp, and a front/rear solution $3000 or more. That's nuts. Is it possible to connect the two wires for the tweeter and woofer in order to regenerate the original unsplit signal? No. Not directly connect the wires maybe, but it's quite easy to mix the two signals and feed them into a single amp. At it's simplest, a couple of 5 cent resistors would work as a mixer. It should be easier to derive a complete signal direct from the head unit though. Randy said that the crossovers are internal to the amps - the signal is apparently already summed going into the amps. I think he meant it was split *before* going into the existing amps. Well if that's what he MEANT, he didn't SAY it very well. The exact words were, "But the crossovers lie WITHIN (emphasis mine) the front and rear amps." Best to read what was actually written. *ahem* --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0618-1, 05/03/2006 Tested on: 5/3/2006 11:55:31 AM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#26
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"jakdedert" wrote in message . .. That's what I'm thinking... I don't see why a set of two-way components wouldn't do the trick, or even a set of coaxials, and just remove the built-in capacitor crossover and wire the woofer and tweeter directly. That was suggested by me already. Presumably the OP hadn't thought of it, or lacks sufficient knowledge. I guess that's why he asked for help! Unfortunately expecting a useful answer, when you don't tell people exactly what you are trying to achieve, is expecting too much IMO. You have absolutely no guarantee that the above will work with any give set of replacement speakers. The crossover point is important! Which is why I *already* said he should check the crossover frequencies first. MrT. |
#27
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"Matt Ion" wrote in message news:3476g.114006$7a.100117@pd7tw1no... You have absolutely no guarantee that the above will work with any give set of replacement speakers. The crossover point is important! Get it too low or high, and the individual drivers in the speaker will not be happy...resulting in blown speakers or just crappy sound. The sound may not be ideal, but I doubt the crossover point is going to be so far off as to blow up components. Could happen if the crossover point is too low. Easy to blow a tweeter with too much midrange. Obviously finding out what the actual crossover points are and choosing matching drivers would be ideal, but if that's not possible, it should work fine with most sets of drivers. At worst, it'll turn out not sounding any better than before he started. No, at worst it will sound worse than before he started and cost him money to boot. MrT. |
#28
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"Matt Ion" wrote in message news:Q576g.114677$WI1.71373@pd7tw2no... Randy said that the crossovers are internal to the amps - the signal is apparently already summed going into the amps. I think he meant it was split *before* going into the existing amps. Well if that's what he MEANT, he didn't SAY it very well. Agreed. The exact words were, "But the crossovers lie WITHIN (emphasis mine) the front and rear amps." Yes, but what do you think that means? The only way I can read it is to assume the "amps" have an active crossover inbuilt. In other words the signal is split BEFORE being separately amplified, NOT "summed" before being amplified as you stated. In any case the signal from the head unit will already be full range, and the OP obviously has no clue what he is doing, or even trying to achieve. That is probably why he hasn't come back I guess. MrT. |
#29
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"Matt Ion" wrote in message news:Aig6g.118014$7a.106976@pd7tw1no... Mr.T wrote: "Matt Ion" wrote in message news:Q576g.114677$WI1.71373@pd7tw2no... Randy said that the crossovers are internal to the amps - the signal is apparently already summed going into the amps. I think he meant it was split *before* going into the existing amps. Well if that's what he MEANT, he didn't SAY it very well. Agreed. The exact words were, "But the crossovers lie WITHIN (emphasis mine) the front and rear amps." Yes, but what do you think that means? The only way I can read it is to assume the "amps" have an active crossover inbuilt. In other words the signal is split BEFORE being separately amplified, NOT "summed" before being amplified as you stated. You misread. I meant it's a summed signal that's being piped into the amps. No, it's just a full band signal that has not been split *OR* summed. The amps may contain either active or passive crossovers (probably the former, but either way, it's immaterial to this problem). A crossover prior to amplification is an active crossover by definition. What it comes down to is, if he want's to merely swap out speakers, he needs to use coaxials or components; anything else means adding and/or replacing amps, since the existing amps don't provide a full-range output. Why on earth would he want to use a single cone speaker anyway? Let's face it, he has no idea what he is doing, and uninformed speculation serves no purpose.. MrT. |
#30
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speakerwires?
Mr.T spake thus:
"Matt Ion" wrote in message news:Aig6g.118014$7a.106976@pd7tw1no... Mr.T wrote: "Matt Ion" wrote in message news:Q576g.114677$WI1.71373@pd7tw2no... Randy said that the crossovers are internal to the amps - the signal is apparently already summed going into the amps. I think he meant it was split *before* going into the existing amps. Well if that's what he MEANT, he didn't SAY it very well. Agreed. The exact words were, "But the crossovers lie WITHIN (emphasis mine) the front and rear amps." Yes, but what do you think that means? The only way I can read it is to assume the "amps" have an active crossover inbuilt. In other words the signal is split BEFORE being separately amplified, NOT "summed" before being amplified as you stated. You misread. I meant it's a summed signal that's being piped into the amps. No, it's just a full band signal that has not been split *OR* summed. The amps may contain either active or passive crossovers (probably the former, but either way, it's immaterial to this problem). A crossover prior to amplification is an active crossover by definition. What it comes down to is, if he want's to merely swap out speakers, he needs to use coaxials or components; anything else means adding and/or replacing amps, since the existing amps don't provide a full-range output. Why on earth would he want to use a single cone speaker anyway? Let's face it, he has no idea what he is doing, and uninformed speculation serves no purpose.. Where on earth are you getting this? I thought the O.P.'s message was pretty clear. He has a bi-amped (or possibly tri-amped) system, with the crossovers in the amplifier. He doesn't like what he feels are crappy speakers, which he seems perfectly well aware are separate woofers, tweeters (and maybe midranges). He wants to replace the speakers. What part of that don't you get? Sheesh, the smug superiority level in here is almost as high as the reading comprehension level seems to be low. -- Pierre, mon ami. Jetez encore un Scientologiste dans le baquet d'acide. - from a posting in alt.religion.scientology titled "France recommends dissolving Scientologists" |
#31
Posted to rec.audio.tech,rec.audio.car
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Possible to recombine crossed over (split) component speaker wires?
"Matt Ion" wrote in message news:ueq6g.122523$7a.64204@pd7tw1no... What it comes down to is, if he want's to merely swap out speakers, he needs to use coaxials or components; anything else means adding and/or replacing amps, since the existing amps don't provide a full-range output. Why on earth would he want to use a single cone speaker anyway? Are you just being obtuse for the sake of being obtuse? Obviously he wanted a single wire he could connect to a set of coaxials because he didn't realize he could remove the built-in crossover. Who's being obtuse, it was me who first suggested he do just that, prior to your first reply. My sarcastic comment above is a pefectly apt response to your statement : "anything else means adding and/or replacing amps, since the existing amps don't provide a full-range output" Tell us again why he would require a full range output, and please take into account *ALL* that I posted in my first reply to the OP prior to your "contribution" to the discussion. I think that one stated that two summing resistors prior to an amplifier, would "burn up in about 10 seconds" :-) MrT. |
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