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#1
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Schoeps CMC6 vs. CMC6XT - any audible sound difference ?
I have CMC6 preamps with MK4V, MK21 and MK2 capsules. I wonder – would
there any (beneficial) audible sound difference between CMC6 and CMC6XT ? Anyone tried to compare directly ? Ivo www.savita.cz |
#2
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Ivo wrote:
I have CMC6 preamps with MK4V, MK21 and MK2 capsules. I wonder – would there any (beneficial) audible sound difference between CMC6 and CMC6XT ? Anyone tried to compare directly ? I found the CMC6XT to sound substantially worse than the regular CMC6 bodies. Though I tried it only with the omni capsule, I found the top end on the XT to be both exaggerated and harsh in a way that makes me suspect top end distortion issues. That may just be me, but I thought they were an enormous step down in sound quality from the regular electronics. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#3
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Ivo wrote:
I have CMC6 preamps with MK4V, MK21 and MK2 capsules. I wonder – would there any (beneficial) audible sound difference between CMC6 and CMC6XT ? Anyone tried to compare directly ? I found the CMC6XT to sound substantially worse than the regular CMC6 bodies. Though I tried it only with the omni capsule, I found the top end on the XT to be both exaggerated and harsh in a way that makes me suspect top end distortion issues. That may just be me, but I thought they were an enormous step down in sound quality from the regular electronics. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#4
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Ivo wrote:
I have CMC6 preamps with MK4V, MK21 and MK2 capsules. I wonder ? would there any (beneficial) audible sound difference between CMC6 and CMC6XT ? Anyone tried to compare directly ? Ivo, You posted this question on Klaus Heyne's microphone forum, too; I answered it in detail over there. --best regards |
#5
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Ivo wrote:
I have CMC6 preamps with MK4V, MK21 and MK2 capsules. I wonder ? would there any (beneficial) audible sound difference between CMC6 and CMC6XT ? Anyone tried to compare directly ? Ivo, You posted this question on Klaus Heyne's microphone forum, too; I answered it in detail over there. --best regards |
#6
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David,
thanks, I read it. I usually put the same question around to get more opinions. I wonder - what about a difference between CMC6 and CMC5 ? I remember that somebody once mentioned I should get CMC5 for a smoother HF response ... Would there be a real sound difference or it is just a question of different phantom power? Ivo (David Satz) wrote in message . com... Ivo wrote: I have CMC6 preamps with MK4V, MK21 and MK2 capsules. I wonder ? would there any (beneficial) audible sound difference between CMC6 and CMC6XT ? Anyone tried to compare directly ? Ivo, You posted this question on Klaus Heyne's microphone forum, too; I answered it in detail over there. --best regards |
#7
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David,
thanks, I read it. I usually put the same question around to get more opinions. I wonder - what about a difference between CMC6 and CMC5 ? I remember that somebody once mentioned I should get CMC5 for a smoother HF response ... Would there be a real sound difference or it is just a question of different phantom power? Ivo (David Satz) wrote in message . com... Ivo wrote: I have CMC6 preamps with MK4V, MK21 and MK2 capsules. I wonder ? would there any (beneficial) audible sound difference between CMC6 and CMC6XT ? Anyone tried to compare directly ? Ivo, You posted this question on Klaus Heyne's microphone forum, too; I answered it in detail over there. --best regards |
#8
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#9
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Ivo wrote:
I wonder - what about a difference between CMC6 and CMC5 ? I remember that somebody once mentioned I should get CMC5 for a smoother HF response ... Would there be a real sound difference or it is just a question of different phantom power? It's interesting that you brought this up at this particular moment, since I'm just now working with the people at Schoeps on how to describe the exact differences among the different models of Colette-series (CMC) microphone amplifiers and related products. Some new publications are in development, I'm happy to say. I don't know of any basis for someone to hear a difference in the high- frequency response between the CMC 5 and CMC 6. There isn't supposed to be any such difference. I've used CMC 3 and 5 amplifiers (the same circuit) for nearly as long as the Colette series has existed; the CMC 6 hadn't been invented when I bought my two pairs. But a couple of years ago I borrowed a pair of CMC 64V for a while, and I didn't notice any sonic difference that I could attribute to the CMC 6 amplifiers. On the other hand I wasn't specifically listening for any such differences. If I were buying new Schoeps microphones today I would buy the CMC 6 because that circuit has better immunity to RFI. In thirty years and thousands of recordings with my CMC 3 or 5 amplifiers, I have only had one severe RFI problem that I can recall, but I live in New York City and with cell phones, pagers, etc. the problem is only increasing. There are other technical differences relating to the low-frequency limit of the amplifiers and the output impedance of the two circuits. These are mentioned in the catalog or on www.schoeps.de, so I won't list them here--I want to encourage people to consult the primary source. One thing which should be made clear is that the CMC 6 amplifier is not a "12 to 48 Volt" phantom-powered microphone amplifier; it is, rather, a "12 _or_ 48 Volt" amplifier. The power supply must conform to one or the other standard version of phantom powering. That's a potentially serious issue. Once I tested a small preamp with a CMC 6 amplifier. The preamp had a poorly designed "48 Volt" supply with about 2 - 3 kOhms of extra resistance (part of its filtering) before the two 6.8 kOhm phantom resistors per channel. The voltage drop across that extra resistance (4 mA x 2.5 kOhms = 10 Volts!) caused the output voltage to fall far enough so that the CMC 6 amplifier switched into its 12 Volt mode, where it draws 10 mA. The result was a complete collapse of the preamp's phantom power supply. Note that a supply like that would be no good for use with any modern, transformerless condenser microphone. Typically such microphones draw at least 3 mA and some draw as much as 8 or even 10 mA, which would be completely impossible with substantial extra series resistance and not enough thermal dissipation built into the supply. There is a small price difference--the CMC 6 costs a little more--and I suspect that this is why the CMC 3 and 5 are still available. If the factory were to price all four amplifier models the same, I don't know who would buy the CMC 3 or 5 any more. And "T" powering has been in decline for so long that I don't think many people would mourn the loss of the CMC 4 amplifier, either. All in all this is a fairly typical small company situation--Schoeps is still family-owned and -operated, and has many more products than it has employees. --best regards |
#11
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#12
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David and Mike,
thank you very much for your detailed thoughts. A friend of mine is about to buy a pair of Schoeps and looking for a good deal. So I was thinking to offer him one pair of my CMC6 and get CMC6 XT as a sonic upgrade. But I think that in the end I will keep what I have :-) Best regards, Ivo (M. Im) wrote in message . com... Ivo, There are audible differences between all the preamp bodies. These differences are sometimes very small. However, my philosophy is that these small increments in each stage of your recording chain eventually grow into big differences. You could say, "Well.. this capsule is almost as good as the other and this mic body sounds almost as good as the other and this mic preamplifier is really quite close to that one and this AD converter... etc etc. By the time you get to end, the difference is no longer very small. The decision as to which is better for you depends on what results you are looking for. This is where a great deal of subjectivity comes into play. There is also the concept of how familiar you are with the tools and getting results in a particular recording venue. That is to say, it is not the best camera that takes the best pictures... Mike (Ivo) wrote in message . com... David, thanks, I read it. I usually put the same question around to get more opinions. I wonder - what about a difference between CMC6 and CMC5 ? I remember that somebody once mentioned I should get CMC5 for a smoother HF response ... Would there be a real sound difference or it is just a question of different phantom power? Ivo (David Satz) wrote in message . com... Ivo wrote: I have CMC6 preamps with MK4V, MK21 and MK2 capsules. I wonder ? would there any (beneficial) audible sound difference between CMC6 and CMC6XT ? Anyone tried to compare directly ? Ivo, You posted this question on Klaus Heyne's microphone forum, too; I answered it in detail over there. --best regards |
#13
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I did a careful comparison between the two preamp bodies. I used
several different matched capsules.Tto my ear, there was no comparison. The "XT" preamp sounded worse in all respects. Not a lot worse, but noticeable. I agree with Scott. A few more things to consider: the XT electronics in the models I have seen are of the "everything shrunk to a chip" school, as opposed to "lots of discrete". Generally, the latter sound better to me. I haven't seen the newest CMC6 so I can't say if they are all like that now. Next, consider that the FR curve according to Schoeps website is different in the 20-20 range. Ideally, this crucial range should exhibit the same FR. The XT with some capsules gives a presence peak--not what I want; some people like a little extra in the treble. Lastly, my own tests have shown that the CMC6 has enough sound above 20k. It is rolled off but sounds good. At least the audible part sounds good You can, of course, listen to it at half speed to compare the two. jj |
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