[RF]

Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with
one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors to
the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical motions
but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output wires to an
amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound - and then
directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no sound. I
connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the amplifier and
then to the rear of my computer and there was sound, so the problems is
with the turntable.

I checked the continuity of the output cables by connecting a multimeter
to each RCA connector and the corresponding contact on the arm - with
the cartridge removed. Each was continuous. I checked the continuity of
the two inner ground contacts at the rear of the cartridge with the
Dual's ground connector, which was attached to the shell of a Sony
amplifier. Continuity was present.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the unit
was in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage is very
unlikely.

Opinions appreciated.

TIA

RF

[Richard Crowley]

"RF" wrote..
I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with
one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors
to the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical
motions but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output
wires to an amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound -
and then directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no
sound. I connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the
amplifier and then to the rear of my computer and there was sound, so
the problems is with the turntable.....

If you didn't try plugging your turntable into to the "phono"
input of a suitable audio component (preamp, receiver,
integrated amplifier, etc.) then you don't really know that
it doesn't work.

The output of a turntable is extremely low and requires
an RIAA phono preamp. Else it will seem to be "dead".

[RF]

Richard Crowley wrote:
"RF" wrote..
I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with
one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors
to the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical
motions but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output
wires to an amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound -
and then directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no
sound. I connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the
amplifier and then to the rear of my computer and there was sound, so
the problems is with the turntable.....

If you didn't try plugging your turntable into to the "phono"
input of a suitable audio component (preamp, receiver,
integrated amplifier, etc.) then you don't really know that
it doesn't work.

The output of a turntable is extremely low and requires
an RIAA phono preamp. Else it will seem to be "dead".

Thank you Richard for your comment.

The Sony receiver/amplifier does have an input marked Phono and that's
what I used.

RF

[Serge Auckland]

"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Richard Crowley wrote:
"RF" wrote..
I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with
one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors to
the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical motions
but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output wires to an
amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound - and then
directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no sound. I
connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the amplifier and
then to the rear of my computer and there was sound, so the problems is
with the turntable.....

If you didn't try plugging your turntable into to the "phono"
input of a suitable audio component (preamp, receiver,
integrated amplifier, etc.) then you don't really know that
it doesn't work.

The output of a turntable is extremely low and requires
an RIAA phono preamp. Else it will seem to be "dead".

Thank you Richard for your comment.

The Sony receiver/amplifier does have an input marked Phono and that's
what I used.

RF

You need to approach this problem logically:-

1) Although the input of the amplifier is marked "phono", do you know if it
in fact works? If the amplifier is recent, it may have sockets marked phono,
but no RIAA preamp fitted, it could be an optional extra, not fitted to
yours. If you're not sure if there actually is an RIAA pre-amp, to test if
it does, the easiest in the absence of test equipment is to poke a paper
clip, or thin screwdriver into one of the two "phono" sockets, and with the
VOLUME CONTROL TURNED WELL DOWN, select "phono" as a source and do you get a
hum from the 'speakers. Try this on one of the other inputs. If the hum is
much louder on the "phono" input, then that gives a reasonable indication
that there is a pre-amp on that input.

2) Once you are sure the amp works, then are you sure the replacement phono
cable is correctly connected? I would be surprised if with two circuits
(L&R) both were similarly faulty, but it could be. With your multimeter and
with cartridge fitted, what resistance reading do you get if you measure
across the phono plugs coming out of the turntable? For a typical moving
magnet cartridge, you should read somewhere between 500-1000ohms. If you get
substantially zero, then you have a short-circuit in your wiring, or
possibly (less likely) the cartridge. I say less likely, as altough
cartridges can go short-circuit, you have two independant windings in a
cartridge, and it seems pretty unlikely for them both to go SC. If you get
substantially infinity, then you have an open circuit somewhere. I am
assuming you have a modern digital multimeter that will put out little
current. If you have an old analogue multimeter, I wouldn't like to use it
for this test unless you know that it will only put out less than 1mA when
measuring resistance.

3) You can measure the cartridge directly and see if you get a clear
measurement of 500-1000ohms without the turntable wiring.

There's no reason why the turntable won't work after storage, so you should
be able to trace the problem.

S.


--
http://audiopages.googlepages.com

[Richard Crowley]

"RF" wrote ...
The Sony receiver/amplifier does have an input marked Phono and that's
what I used.

So what did you hear when using the phono inputs?
Hum? Noise? Dead quiet?

Silly question, but assuming the receiver/amp works properly,
otherwise? What happens if you just poke a paper-clip
wire into the phono jack? It should produce lots of loud hum
and noise.

[Trevor Wilson[_2_]]

"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of recording
a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with one
that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors to the
wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical motions
but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output wires to an
amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound - and then directly
to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no sound. I connected the
output wires of a tape unit first to the amplifier and then to the rear of
my computer and there was sound, so the problems is with the turntable.

I checked the continuity of the output cables by connecting a multimeter
to each RCA connector and the corresponding contact on the arm - with the
cartridge removed. Each was continuous. I checked the continuity of the
two inner ground contacts at the rear of the cartridge with the Dual's
ground connector, which was attached to the shell of a Sony amplifier.
Continuity was present.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the unit was
in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage is very
unlikely.

Opinions appreciated.

**As has been stated, ensure you have plugged the thing into a phono input.
Place meter leads, on 'Ohms' position across the phono plugs. You will
either read a measurement of between 500 Ohms and 2kOhms OR close to zero
Ohms. The Dual has a muting system, which shorts the phono cartridge, if the
tone arm is on the rest. This is when you will measure zero Ohms. Watch for
this.

The 1219 is a nice old TT and, if you have some mechanical ability, able to
be resurrected.

Trevor Wilson

[RF]

Serge Auckland wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Richard Crowley wrote:
"RF" wrote..
I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with
one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors to
the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical motions
but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output wires to an
amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound - and then
directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no sound. I
connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the amplifier and
then to the rear of my computer and there was sound, so the problems is
with the turntable.....
If you didn't try plugging your turntable into to the "phono"
input of a suitable audio component (preamp, receiver,
integrated amplifier, etc.) then you don't really know that
it doesn't work.

The output of a turntable is extremely low and requires
an RIAA phono preamp. Else it will seem to be "dead".
Thank you Richard for your comment.

The Sony receiver/amplifier does have an input marked Phono and that's
what I used.

RF

Thank you Serge for the great response.

You need to approach this problem logically:-

Yup!

1) Although the input of the amplifier is marked "phono", do you know if it
in fact works? If the amplifier is recent, it may have sockets marked phono,
but no RIAA preamp fitted, it could be an optional extra, not fitted to
yours. If you're not sure if there actually is an RIAA pre-amp, to test if
it does, the easiest in the absence of test equipment is to poke a paper
clip, or thin screwdriver into one of the two "phono" sockets, and with the
VOLUME CONTROL TURNED WELL DOWN, select "phono" as a source and do you get a
hum from the 'speakers. Try this on one of the other inputs. If the hum is
much louder on the "phono" input, then that gives a reasonable indication
that there is a pre-amp on that input.

I used this Phono input many times in the past and it worked fine.

2) Once you are sure the amp works, then are you sure the replacement phono
cable is correctly connected? I would be surprised if with two circuits
(L&R) both were similarly faulty, but it could be. With your multimeter and
with cartridge fitted, what resistance reading do you get if you measure
across the phono plugs coming out of the turntable? For a typical moving
magnet cartridge, you should read somewhere between 500-1000ohms. If you get
substantially zero, then you have a short-circuit in your wiring, or
possibly (less likely) the cartridge. I say less likely, as altough
cartridges can go short-circuit, you have two independant windings in a
cartridge, and it seems pretty unlikely for them both to go SC. If you get
substantially infinity, then you have an open circuit somewhere. I am
assuming you have a modern digital multimeter that will put out little
current. If you have an old analogue multimeter, I wouldn't like to use it
for this test unless you know that it will only put out less than 1mA when
measuring resistance.

Now I have a problem. I moved recently and can't find my digital meter.
I do have an analog one (GB Instruments) but it doesn't give the max
current
while measuring resistance. I sent them an email asking for the figure.

3) You can measure the cartridge directly and see if you get a clear
measurement of 500-1000ohms without the turntable wiring.

Will do that, when I get the current info or my digital meter.

There's no reason why the turntable won't work after storage, so you should
be able to trace the problem.

I have been moving around a bit, which I'm sure didn't help. However,
the turntable was
well fixed down to the case so the movements should not have bothered it
much.

S.

I'll be back as soon as I find out more.

Thanks again

RF

[RF]

Richard Crowley wrote:
"RF" wrote ...
The Sony receiver/amplifier does have an input marked Phono and that's
what I used.

So what did you hear when using the phono inputs?
Hum? Noise? Dead quiet?

Very quiet.

Silly question, but assuming the receiver/amp works properly,
otherwise? What happens if you just poke a paper-clip
wire into the phono jack? It should produce lots of loud hum
and noise.

I think you have your finger on one possibility. There is no hum or noise.

Thanks Richard.

I have some follow-up work to do.

RF

[RF]

Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of recording
a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with one
that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors to the
wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical motions
but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output wires to an
amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound - and then directly
to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no sound. I connected the
output wires of a tape unit first to the amplifier and then to the rear of
my computer and there was sound, so the problems is with the turntable.

I checked the continuity of the output cables by connecting a multimeter
to each RCA connector and the corresponding contact on the arm - with the
cartridge removed. Each was continuous. I checked the continuity of the
two inner ground contacts at the rear of the cartridge with the Dual's
ground connector, which was attached to the shell of a Sony amplifier.
Continuity was present.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the unit was
in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage is very
unlikely.

Opinions appreciated.

**As has been stated, ensure you have plugged the thing into a phono input.
Place meter leads, on 'Ohms' position across the phono plugs. You will
either read a measurement of between 500 Ohms and 2kOhms OR close to zero
Ohms. The Dual has a muting system, which shorts the phono cartridge, if the
tone arm is on the rest. This is when you will measure zero Ohms. Watch for
this.

The 1219 is a nice old TT and, if you have some mechanical ability, able to
be resurrected.

Trevor Wilson

Thank you Trevor.

I can't do anything at present. I have mislaid my digital meter and
don't know the max current,
when measuring resistance, for my analog meter.

Still working on it.

RF

[Trevor Wilson[_2_]]

"RF" wrote in message
...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with
one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors to
the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical motions
but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output wires to an
amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound - and then
directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no sound. I
connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the amplifier and
then to the rear of my computer and there was sound, so the problems is
with the turntable.

I checked the continuity of the output cables by connecting a multimeter
to each RCA connector and the corresponding contact on the arm - with
the cartridge removed. Each was continuous. I checked the continuity of
the two inner ground contacts at the rear of the cartridge with the
Dual's ground connector, which was attached to the shell of a Sony
amplifier. Continuity was present.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the unit
was in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage is very
unlikely.

Opinions appreciated.

**As has been stated, ensure you have plugged the thing into a phono
input. Place meter leads, on 'Ohms' position across the phono plugs. You
will either read a measurement of between 500 Ohms and 2kOhms OR close to
zero Ohms. The Dual has a muting system, which shorts the phono
cartridge, if the tone arm is on the rest. This is when you will measure
zero Ohms. Watch for this.

The 1219 is a nice old TT and, if you have some mechanical ability, able
to be resurrected.

Trevor Wilson

Thank you Trevor.

I can't do anything at present. I have mislaid my digital meter and don't
know the max current,
when measuring resistance, for my analog meter.

Still working on it.

**I suspect you don't have much to worry about. Put it on RX10 range and you
should be pretty safe. What is the mid-scale resistance reading on your
meter? What is the minimum current range?

Trevor Wilson

[RF]

Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with
one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors to
the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical motions
but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output wires to an
amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound - and then
directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no sound. I
connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the amplifier and
then to the rear of my computer and there was sound, so the problems is
with the turntable.

I checked the continuity of the output cables by connecting a multimeter
to each RCA connector and the corresponding contact on the arm - with
the cartridge removed. Each was continuous. I checked the continuity of
the two inner ground contacts at the rear of the cartridge with the
Dual's ground connector, which was attached to the shell of a Sony
amplifier. Continuity was present.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the unit
was in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage is very
unlikely.

Opinions appreciated.
**As has been stated, ensure you have plugged the thing into a phono
input. Place meter leads, on 'Ohms' position across the phono plugs. You
will either read a measurement of between 500 Ohms and 2kOhms OR close to
zero Ohms. The Dual has a muting system, which shorts the phono
cartridge, if the tone arm is on the rest. This is when you will measure
zero Ohms. Watch for this.

The 1219 is a nice old TT and, if you have some mechanical ability, able
to be resurrected.

Trevor Wilson
Thank you Trevor.

I can't do anything at present. I have mislaid my digital meter and don't
know the max current,
when measuring resistance, for my analog meter.

Still working on it.

**I suspect you don't have much to worry about. Put it on RX10 range and you
should be pretty safe. What is the mid-scale resistance reading on your
meter? What is the minimum current range?

Trevor Wilson

Thank you Trevor.
That was a quick response

The resistance has only one scale - 0 to infinity. The section 0-1000
ohms measures about 3/8" and has 5 divisions.
Midscale resistance is about 5,000 ohms. The DC mA range is 0.5 to 250.

RF.

[Trevor Wilson[_2_]]

"RF" wrote in message
et...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with
one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors
to the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical
motions but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output
wires to an amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound -
and then directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no
sound. I connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the
amplifier and then to the rear of my computer and there was sound, so
the problems is with the turntable.

I checked the continuity of the output cables by connecting a
multimeter to each RCA connector and the corresponding contact on the
arm - with the cartridge removed. Each was continuous. I checked the
continuity of the two inner ground contacts at the rear of the
cartridge with the Dual's ground connector, which was attached to the
shell of a Sony amplifier. Continuity was present.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the unit
was in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage is
very unlikely.

Opinions appreciated.
**As has been stated, ensure you have plugged the thing into a phono
input. Place meter leads, on 'Ohms' position across the phono plugs.
You will either read a measurement of between 500 Ohms and 2kOhms OR
close to zero Ohms. The Dual has a muting system, which shorts the
phono cartridge, if the tone arm is on the rest. This is when you will
measure zero Ohms. Watch for this.

The 1219 is a nice old TT and, if you have some mechanical ability,
able to be resurrected.

Trevor Wilson
Thank you Trevor.

I can't do anything at present. I have mislaid my digital meter and
don't know the max current,
when measuring resistance, for my analog meter.

Still working on it.

**I suspect you don't have much to worry about. Put it on RX10 range and
you should be pretty safe. What is the mid-scale resistance reading on
your meter? What is the minimum current range?

Trevor Wilson

Thank you Trevor.
That was a quick response

The resistance has only one scale - 0 to infinity. The section 0-1000 ohms
measures about 3/8" and has 5 divisions.
Midscale resistance is about 5,000 ohms. The DC mA range is 0.5 to 250.

**Sounds like a very old, very cheap meter. My oldest meter (35 years old)
uses a 50uA movement (yours appears to use a 500uA one). Either way, you
should be able to use it for the measurement you need to make. OTOH, you
could spend the 10 Bucks on a new digital meter. They never go astray. I
have one in each car and tool box I own. There's a few left over.

Trevor Wilson

[RF]

Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
et...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with
one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors
to the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical
motions but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output
wires to an amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound -
and then directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no
sound. I connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the
amplifier and then to the rear of my computer and there was sound, so
the problems is with the turntable.

I checked the continuity of the output cables by connecting a
multimeter to each RCA connector and the corresponding contact on the
arm - with the cartridge removed. Each was continuous. I checked the
continuity of the two inner ground contacts at the rear of the
cartridge with the Dual's ground connector, which was attached to the
shell of a Sony amplifier. Continuity was present.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the unit
was in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage is
very unlikely.

Opinions appreciated.
**As has been stated, ensure you have plugged the thing into a phono
input. Place meter leads, on 'Ohms' position across the phono plugs.
You will either read a measurement of between 500 Ohms and 2kOhms OR
close to zero Ohms. The Dual has a muting system, which shorts the
phono cartridge, if the tone arm is on the rest. This is when you will
measure zero Ohms. Watch for this.

The 1219 is a nice old TT and, if you have some mechanical ability,
able to be resurrected.

Trevor Wilson
Thank you Trevor.

I can't do anything at present. I have mislaid my digital meter and
don't know the max current,
when measuring resistance, for my analog meter.

Still working on it.
**I suspect you don't have much to worry about. Put it on RX10 range and
you should be pretty safe. What is the mid-scale resistance reading on
your meter? What is the minimum current range?

Trevor Wilson
Thank you Trevor.
That was a quick response

The resistance has only one scale - 0 to infinity. The section 0-1000 ohms
measures about 3/8" and has 5 divisions.
Midscale resistance is about 5,000 ohms. The DC mA range is 0.5 to 250.

**Sounds like a very old, very cheap meter. My oldest meter (35 years old)
uses a 50uA movement (yours appears to use a 500uA one). Either way, you
should be able to use it for the measurement you need to make. OTOH, you
could spend the 10 Bucks on a new digital meter. They never go astray. I
have one in each car and tool box I own. There's a few left over.

Trevor Wilson

This meter is a Gardner Bender that I bought at Home depot about 2 years
ago.
Cost about $18. What model digital would you recommend?

[Trevor Wilson[_2_]]

"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
et...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it
with one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade
connectors to the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical
motions but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output
wires to an amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound -
and then directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no
sound. I connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the
amplifier and then to the rear of my computer and there was sound,
so the problems is with the turntable.

I checked the continuity of the output cables by connecting a
multimeter to each RCA connector and the corresponding contact on
the arm - with the cartridge removed. Each was continuous. I checked
the continuity of the two inner ground contacts at the rear of the
cartridge with the Dual's ground connector, which was attached to
the shell of a Sony amplifier. Continuity was present.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the
unit was in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage
is very unlikely.

Opinions appreciated.
**As has been stated, ensure you have plugged the thing into a phono
input. Place meter leads, on 'Ohms' position across the phono plugs.
You will either read a measurement of between 500 Ohms and 2kOhms OR
close to zero Ohms. The Dual has a muting system, which shorts the
phono cartridge, if the tone arm is on the rest. This is when you
will measure zero Ohms. Watch for this.

The 1219 is a nice old TT and, if you have some mechanical ability,
able to be resurrected.

Trevor Wilson
Thank you Trevor.

I can't do anything at present. I have mislaid my digital meter and
don't know the max current,
when measuring resistance, for my analog meter.

Still working on it.
**I suspect you don't have much to worry about. Put it on RX10 range
and you should be pretty safe. What is the mid-scale resistance reading
on your meter? What is the minimum current range?

Trevor Wilson
Thank you Trevor.
That was a quick response

The resistance has only one scale - 0 to infinity. The section 0-1000
ohms measures about 3/8" and has 5 divisions.
Midscale resistance is about 5,000 ohms. The DC mA range is 0.5 to 250.

**Sounds like a very old, very cheap meter. My oldest meter (35 years
old) uses a 50uA movement (yours appears to use a 500uA one). Either way,
you should be able to use it for the measurement you need to make. OTOH,
you could spend the 10 Bucks on a new digital meter. They never go
astray. I have one in each car and tool box I own. There's a few left
over.

Trevor Wilson

This meter is a Gardner Bender that I bought at Home depot about 2 years
ago.
Cost about $18. What model digital would you recommend?

**No sensible answer for that one. I have a couple of Flukes, but they're
expensive and I'm a professional, so I can easily justify it. One of my very
favourite meters (I have at least 10 of the suckers) has a SPL meter, light
level meter, thermometer, humidity meter, transistor tester, etc. All for
less than AUS$100.00. If you're a 'weekend warrior' then just spend 30 or 40
Bucks. You'll get something pretty decent. Assess your needs and buy the one
that suits you.

Trevor Wilson

[Mr. Land]

On Dec 4, 1:38 am, RF wrote:
Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it with
one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade connectors to
the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical motions
but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output wires to an
amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound - and then
directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no sound. I
connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the amplifier and
then to the rear of my computer and there was sound, so the problems is
with the turntable.

I checked the continuity of the output cables by connecting a multimeter
to each RCA connector and the corresponding contact on the arm - with
the cartridge removed. Each was continuous. I checked the continuity of
the two inner ground contacts at the rear of the cartridge with the
Dual's ground connector, which was attached to the shell of a Sony
amplifier. Continuity was present.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the unit
was in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage is very
unlikely.

Opinions appreciated.

TIA

RF

Just to be sure the table's muting function isn't screwing up your
continuity measurements, with the volume set very low, can you get
a buzz from either speaker if you touch any unconnected cartridge
pin connector? There's a lot of gain involved so if you try this be
sure to set the volume very low.

[Richard Crowley]

"Mr. Land" wrote ...
Just to be sure the table's muting function isn't screwing up your
continuity measurements, with the volume set very low, can you get
a buzz from either speaker if you touch any unconnected cartridge
pin connector? There's a lot of gain involved so if you try this be
sure to set the volume very low.

I asked him that a couple days ago and he said that he heard nothing.
Sounds like something is wrong with his receiver. The turntable may
be perfectly fine. I don't really understand why he is pursuing any
investigation of the turntable when his phono input appears to be dead.
He seems to be off on some side-road looking for a meter or something.

[Mr. Land]

On Dec 6, 1:34 pm, "Richard Crowley" wrote:
"Mr. Land" wrote ...

Just to be sure the table's muting function isn't screwing up your
continuity measurements, with the volume set very low, can you get
a buzz from either speaker if you touch any unconnected cartridge
pin connector? There's a lot of gain involved so if you try this be
sure to set the volume very low.

I asked him that a couple days ago and he said that he heard nothing.
Sounds like something is wrong with his receiver. The turntable may
be perfectly fine. I don't really understand why he is pursuing any
investigation of the turntable when his phono input appears to be dead.
He seems to be off on some side-road looking for a meter or something.

Whoops! I am sorry. I did miss that reply.

[Richard Crowley]

"Mr. Land" wrote ...
"Richard Crowley" wrote:
"Mr. Land" wrote ...

Just to be sure the table's muting function isn't screwing up your
continuity measurements, with the volume set very low, can you get
a buzz from either speaker if you touch any unconnected cartridge
pin connector? There's a lot of gain involved so if you try this be
sure to set the volume very low.

I asked him that a couple days ago and he said that he heard nothing.
Sounds like something is wrong with his receiver. The turntable may
be perfectly fine. I don't really understand why he is pursuing any
investigation of the turntable when his phono input appears to be dead.
He seems to be off on some side-road looking for a meter or something.

Whoops! I am sorry. I did miss that reply.

No problem. Lean back and enjoy the show! :-)

[Mr. Land]

On Dec 6, 1:56 pm, "Richard Crowley" wrote:
"Mr. Land" wrote ...



"Richard Crowley" wrote:
"Mr. Land" wrote ...

Just to be sure the table's muting function isn't screwing up your
continuity measurements, with the volume set very low, can you get
a buzz from either speaker if you touch any unconnected cartridge
pin connector? There's a lot of gain involved so if you try this be
sure to set the volume very low.

I asked him that a couple days ago and he said that he heard nothing.
Sounds like something is wrong with his receiver. The turntable may
be perfectly fine. I don't really understand why he is pursuing any
investigation of the turntable when his phono input appears to be dead.
He seems to be off on some side-road looking for a meter or something.

Whoops! I am sorry. I did miss that reply.

No problem. Lean back and enjoy the show! :-)

Still, I can't help but wonder what the OP exactly meant by the
following:

I had to solder two spade connectors to
the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

....sounds suspicious to me...

[Richard Crowley]

"Mr. Land" wrote ...
Still, I can't help but wonder what the OP exactly meant by the
following:

I had to solder two spade connectors to
the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

...sounds suspicious to me...

I thought it likely refered to the ground wire.

[RF]

Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
et...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
...
Trevor Wilson wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
. net...
Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead. The
connector on the end of the output wires was an
old antique, and the cord was looking doubtful, so I replaced it
with one that had two RCA connectors. I had to solder two spade
connectors to the wires to connect into the turntable socket.

I loaded a record and it went through all the correct mechanical
motions but there was no sound out. I connected the DUAL's output
wires to an amplifier that had speakers attached - still no sound -
and then directly to the Audio In on the back of my computer - no
sound. I connected the output wires of a tape unit first to the
amplifier and then to the rear of my computer and there was sound,
so the problems is with the turntable.

I checked the continuity of the output cables by connecting a
multimeter to each RCA connector and the corresponding contact on
the arm - with the cartridge removed. Each was continuous. I checked
the continuity of the two inner ground contacts at the rear of the
cartridge with the Dual's ground connector, which was attached to
the shell of a Sony amplifier. Continuity was present.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the
unit was in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage
is very unlikely.

Opinions appreciated.
**As has been stated, ensure you have plugged the thing into a phono
input. Place meter leads, on 'Ohms' position across the phono plugs.
You will either read a measurement of between 500 Ohms and 2kOhms OR
close to zero Ohms. The Dual has a muting system, which shorts the
phono cartridge, if the tone arm is on the rest. This is when you
will measure zero Ohms. Watch for this.

The 1219 is a nice old TT and, if you have some mechanical ability,
able to be resurrected.

Trevor Wilson
Thank you Trevor.

I can't do anything at present. I have mislaid my digital meter and
don't know the max current,
when measuring resistance, for my analog meter.

Still working on it.
**I suspect you don't have much to worry about. Put it on RX10 range
and you should be pretty safe. What is the mid-scale resistance reading
on your meter? What is the minimum current range?

Trevor Wilson
Thank you Trevor.
That was a quick response

The resistance has only one scale - 0 to infinity. The section 0-1000
ohms measures about 3/8" and has 5 divisions.
Midscale resistance is about 5,000 ohms. The DC mA range is 0.5 to 250.
**Sounds like a very old, very cheap meter. My oldest meter (35 years
old) uses a 50uA movement (yours appears to use a 500uA one). Either way,
you should be able to use it for the measurement you need to make. OTOH,
you could spend the 10 Bucks on a new digital meter. They never go
astray. I have one in each car and tool box I own. There's a few left
over.

Trevor Wilson
This meter is a Gardner Bender that I bought at Home depot about 2 years
ago.
Cost about $18. What model digital would you recommend?

**No sensible answer for that one. I have a couple of Flukes, but they're
expensive and I'm a professional, so I can easily justify it. One of my very
favourite meters (I have at least 10 of the suckers) has a SPL meter, light
level meter, thermometer, humidity meter, transistor tester, etc. All for
less than AUS$100.00. If you're a 'weekend warrior' then just spend 30 or 40
Bucks. You'll get something pretty decent. Assess your needs and buy the one
that suits you.

Trevor Wilson

Thanks Trevor. Will look into that some more.

[RF]

Richard Crowley wrote:
"Mr. Land" wrote ...
"Richard Crowley" wrote:
"Mr. Land" wrote ...

Just to be sure the table's muting function isn't screwing up your
continuity measurements, with the volume set very low, can you get
a buzz from either speaker if you touch any unconnected cartridge
pin connector? There's a lot of gain involved so if you try this be
sure to set the volume very low.
I asked him that a couple days ago and he said that he heard nothing.
Sounds like something is wrong with his receiver. The turntable may
be perfectly fine. I don't really understand why he is pursuing any
investigation of the turntable when his phono input appears to be dead.
He seems to be off on some side-road looking for a meter or something.
Whoops! I am sorry. I did miss that reply.

No problem. Lean back and enjoy the show! :-)

OK, Mr L and R.C. and thanks for the humor :-)

I removed the cover from the amplifier and had a close look to see if
anything
looked burnt or blown. Everything looked ok but of course, with a 1.25
mv input
a lot could have happened without any visible marks.

When I bought this unit, it had a plug of around 1/2" diameter with
about 5 pins in it.
That would not fit my amplifier, which was 15 years younger, so I
removed the cable with
that plug and replaced it with a new one with a pair of RCA connectors.
The other end of the old cable
was connected into the little open metal box which, I believe, also
contains the muting switch.
I applied spade connectors to the new cable and then soldered them to
the spots I had
removed the old cables from.

The cost of repairing the amplifier is likely to be more than the cost
of a mini-
amplifier for this job. Any recommendations?

Thanks to all for your support.

RF

[Richard Crowley]

"RF" wrote ...
The cost of repairing the amplifier is likely to be more than the cost of
a mini-amplifier for this job. Any recommendations?

I think you are correct. Better to just get a little standalone
RIAA phono preamp box and get on with the show.

[RF]

Richard Crowley wrote:
"RF" wrote ...
The cost of repairing the amplifier is likely to be more than the cost of
a mini-amplifier for this job. Any recommendations?

I think you are correct. Better to just get a little standalone
RIAA phono preamp box and get on with the show.

Thanks Richard.

I got nowhere with my searches until I replaced you "box" with "kit'" Then I
had loads of hits but I don't recognize any manufacturer, like Shure, Sony,
Panasonic, etc.

I saw an Omegastar RIAA Phono Preamp for a mere $649 gulp!

Can you recommend a unit of the quality of a Shure or Sony for turntables?

TIA

RF

[Richard Crowley]

"RF" wrote ...
Richard Crowley wrote:
"RF" wrote ...
The cost of repairing the amplifier is likely to be more than the cost
of a mini-amplifier for this job. Any recommendations?

I think you are correct. Better to just get a little standalone
RIAA phono preamp box and get on with the show.

Thanks Richard.

I got nowhere with my searches until I replaced you "box" with "kit'" Then
I
had loads of hits but I don't recognize any manufacturer, like Shure,
Sony,
Panasonic, etc.

I saw an Omegastar RIAA Phono Preamp for a mere $649 gulp!

Can you recommend a unit of the quality of a Shure or Sony for turntables?

I would be strongly tempted to buy one of those boxes they are
selling now with an RIAA phono preamp and a USB "sound card"
all in the same unit. For example...
http://www.markertek.com/SearchProdu...29&sort =prod

But others here who have a higher opinion of black-vinyl than I
do would likely scoff at the notion. :-)

[RF]

Richard Crowley wrote:
"RF" wrote ...
Richard Crowley wrote:
"RF" wrote ...
The cost of repairing the amplifier is likely to be more than the cost
of a mini-amplifier for this job. Any recommendations?
I think you are correct. Better to just get a little standalone
RIAA phono preamp box and get on with the show.
Thanks Richard.

I got nowhere with my searches until I replaced you "box" with "kit'" Then
I
had loads of hits but I don't recognize any manufacturer, like Shure,
Sony,
Panasonic, etc.

I saw an Omegastar RIAA Phono Preamp for a mere $649 gulp!

Can you recommend a unit of the quality of a Shure or Sony for turntables?

I would be strongly tempted to buy one of those boxes they are
selling now with an RIAA phono preamp and a USB "sound card"
all in the same unit. For example...
http://www.markertek.com/SearchProdu...29&sort =prod

But others here who have a higher opinion of black-vinyl than I
do would likely scoff at the notion. :-)

Thanks Richard.

Ouchhh!!!! that's $100 + tax + shipping, which is more than half what I
originally
paid for the complete receiver/amplifier and that doesn't even include a
power supply.

Is there no plug-in card for a computer that can do this job? What about
using the microphone
port on the motherboard or does the audio signal input have very
different characteristics from a
turntable ?

TIA

RF

[Richard Crowley]

"RF" wrote ...
Ouchhh!!!! that's $100 + tax + shipping, which is more
than half what I originally paid for the complete receiver/
amplifier

Then fix the receiver/amplifier. There can't be that much
wrong with it.

and that doesn't even include a power supply.

Because it doesn't need one. Powered by USB.

Is there no plug-in card for a computer that can do this job?

I've never seen one with RIAA preamp.

What about using the microphone port on the motherboard
or does the audio signal input have very different characteristics
from a turntable ?

Well, first off, the mic input is mono. We were assuming that
you wanted stereo? Second, the gain of the mic input is most
likely not enough for the output of a typical moving-magnet
phono cartridge. Not to mention that the input impedance of
the mic jack is way too low for a phono cartridge. And then
even if you could get everything else working, RIAA needs a
very radical EQ curve which you can't get from the mic input.

[RF]

Richard Crowley wrote:
"RF" wrote ...
Ouchhh!!!! that's $100 + tax + shipping, which is more than half what
I originally paid for the complete receiver/
amplifier

Then fix the receiver/amplifier. There can't be that much
wrong with it.

and that doesn't even include a power supply.

Because it doesn't need one. Powered by USB.

Is there no plug-in card for a computer that can do this job?

I've never seen one with RIAA preamp.

What about using the microphone port on the motherboard or does the
audio signal input have very different characteristics from a turntable ?

Well, first off, the mic input is mono. We were assuming that
you wanted stereo? Second, the gain of the mic input is most
likely not enough for the output of a typical moving-magnet
phono cartridge. Not to mention that the input impedance of
the mic jack is way too low for a phono cartridge. And then
even if you could get everything else working, RIAA needs a
very radical EQ curve which you can't get from the mic input.

Thank you Richard for that education :-)

It's great to have helpful experts around.

Will look for a wiring diagram for the STR-AV260
and a good technician.

Thanks again for all your help and have a great weekend :-)

RF

[Peter Larsen[_2_]]

RF wrote:

Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.

I skim-read the thread. None said the first advice: get a new cartrige!

Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead.
..
On face value the prime suspect is the internal mute switch. There should be
some kind of audible something, just weak treblish like, even when
connecting it to a line input. There are obvious caveats when turning up to
hear weak stuff .... the next suspect is the rewiring you did instead of
getting an adapter for the DIN plug, take a close look so as to ensure that
there are no unintended connections made.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the unit
was in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage is
very unlikely.

Damage from storage is certain, rubber parts are likely to have stiffened.
Get a new cartridge.

Opinions appreciated.

Also, as lots of folks said: verify the stuff you connect to.


RF


Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[Mark D. Zacharias[_2_]]

"Peter Larsen" wrote in message
...
RF wrote:

Hi All,

I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.

I skim-read the thread. None said the first advice: get a new cartrige!

Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead.
.
On face value the prime suspect is the internal mute switch. There should
be some kind of audible something, just weak treblish like, even when
connecting it to a line input. There are obvious caveats when turning up
to hear weak stuff .... the next suspect is the rewiring you did instead
of getting an adapter for the DIN plug, take a close look so as to ensure
that there are no unintended connections made.

Is it reasonable to assume that the cartridge has gone belly up? The
stylus appears to be ok. The transparent cover that came with the unit
was in place for years, so damage to the cartridge from storage is
very unlikely.

Damage from storage is certain, rubber parts are likely to have stiffened.
Get a new cartridge.

Opinions appreciated.

Also, as lots of folks said: verify the stuff you connect to.


RF


Kind regards

Peter Larsen


Except the guy worked on it himself. All bets are off.

Mark Z.

[Richard Crowley]

"Peter Larsen" wrote ...
RF wrote:
I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.

I skim-read the thread. None said the first advice: get a new
cartrige!

Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead.
.
On face value the prime suspect is the internal mute switch.

That might be one of the problems. But so far, "RF" does not
have a functional RIAA phono input to even detect whether
the turntable is alive or dead. From my POV, all bets are off
until he gets a fuctional phono preamp input.

[RF]

Richard Crowley wrote:
"Peter Larsen" wrote ...
RF wrote:
I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.

I skim-read the thread. None said the first advice: get a new cartrige!

Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead.
.
On face value the prime suspect is the internal mute switch.

That might be one of the problems. But so far, "RF" does not
have a functional RIAA phono input to even detect whether
the turntable is alive or dead. From my POV, all bets are off
until he gets a fuctional phono preamp input.


A belated Thank You to Peter, Mark, and Richard for your comments.
I have been distracted from this project for a variety of reasons but I
will come back to it
again soon.

About the soldering job I did, there were exactly two wires to be
soldered and
at a place that was fairly easy to reach, once I extracted the unit from
the case and
turned it upside down. I removed one cable and soldered in a new one.
Next I removed
the other and repeated for the second cable. A monkey could have done
that without error.

Back soon hopefully.

RF

[Mark D. Zacharias[_2_]]

"RF" wrote in message
news
Richard Crowley wrote:
"Peter Larsen" wrote ...
RF wrote:
I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.

I skim-read the thread. None said the first advice: get a new cartrige!

Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead.
.
On face value the prime suspect is the internal mute switch.

That might be one of the problems. But so far, "RF" does not
have a functional RIAA phono input to even detect whether
the turntable is alive or dead. From my POV, all bets are off
until he gets a fuctional phono preamp input.


A belated Thank You to Peter, Mark, and Richard for your comments.
I have been distracted from this project for a variety of reasons but I
will come back to it
again soon.

About the soldering job I did, there were exactly two wires to be soldered
and
at a place that was fairly easy to reach, once I extracted the unit from
the case and
turned it upside down. I removed one cable and soldered in a new one. Next
I removed
the other and repeated for the second cable. A monkey could have done that
without error.

Back soon hopefully.

RF

There should be four wires, two for each channel, plus a separate ground
wire.

Mark Z.

[RF]

Mark D. Zacharias wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
news
Richard Crowley wrote:
"Peter Larsen" wrote ...
RF wrote:
I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
I skim-read the thread. None said the first advice: get a new cartrige!

Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead.
.
On face value the prime suspect is the internal mute switch.
That might be one of the problems. But so far, "RF" does not
have a functional RIAA phono input to even detect whether
the turntable is alive or dead. From my POV, all bets are off
until he gets a fuctional phono preamp input.

A belated Thank You to Peter, Mark, and Richard for your comments.
I have been distracted from this project for a variety of reasons but I
will come back to it
again soon.

About the soldering job I did, there were exactly two wires to be soldered
and
at a place that was fairly easy to reach, once I extracted the unit from
the case and
turned it upside down. I removed one cable and soldered in a new one. Next
I removed
the other and repeated for the second cable. A monkey could have done that
without error.

Back soon hopefully.

RF

There should be four wires, two for each channel, plus a separate ground
wire.

Mark Z.

Ouch! Mark, that 5th one fooled me. I have a copy of the
vinylengine_dual_1219_service.pdf and it
has a schematic of the 5 pin plug that was originally attached to the
tone arm lead. The middle pin of
that plug appears to be grounded. The other 4 pins attach to the two
audio channels. When I replaced
the 5 pin plug and its cable with the two RCA connectors, it seems that
the ground lead was missing.
I did not see a 5th cable coming out of the other end of the old tone
arm lead with the other pair.
The question now is how to compensate for that missing ground.

There are two other ground cables coming from the turntable and they end
in a spade connector,
which attaches to a single screw connection at the back of the amplifier.

I just came across a lead with a 5 pin plug on one end and 4 RCA
connectors on the other. That's 8 wires??
This plug fits a phono socket on an old radio I have and I would like to
experiment with a connection from the
turntable to it, which might spare the amplifier some abuse, until I get
this system running properly. The
turntable worked very well with this radio a few decades back.

Thanks for the help.

RF

[Peter Larsen[_2_]]

RF wrote:

There should be four wires, two for each channel, plus a separate
ground wire.

Mark Z.

Ouch! Mark, that 5th one fooled me. I have a copy of the
vinylengine_dual_1219_service.pdf and it
has a schematic of the 5 pin plug that was originally attached to the
tone arm lead. The middle pin of
that plug appears to be grounded. The other 4 pins attach to the two
audio channels. When I replaced
the 5 pin plug and its cable with the two RCA connectors, it seems
that the ground lead was missing.

It wasn't.

I did not see a 5th cable coming out of the other end of the old tone
arm lead with the other pair.

It didn't. It is likely to be a connector on the arm base.

The question now is how to compensate for that missing ground.

Turntable chassis!

There are two other ground cables coming from the turntable and they
end in a spade connector,
which attaches to a single screw connection at the back of the
amplifier.

You need to appreciate that a cartridge outputs a balanced audio signal. So
what you have is L and R hot and L and R return and Ground. Ground and
return should preferably first meet at the amp phono input, but in real life
it also works to connect the ground to the cable shield of the two connector
shield cable that is used with the DIN plug.

I just came across a lead with a 5 pin plug on one end and 4 RCA
connectors on the other. That's 8 wires??

It is DIN tape connector lead, but yes ... you can use it.

This plug fits a phono socket on an old radio I have and I would like
to experiment with a connection from the
turntable to it, which might spare the amplifier some abuse, until I
get this system running properly.

One of the pairs of RCA connectors will work, the other pair will be
unconnected.

The
turntable worked very well with this radio a few decades back.

It is unfortunate that you didn't get an adapter lead back then.

Thanks for the help.

You need to get it back to exactly how it was when it left the factory. I
wish I could give better directions, but I can't without having the actual
grammophone - or its schematic - in front of me. You need to obtain to
connect L and R warm to respective inputs, and to connect L and R return to
ground at those inputs on the amp and to connect the grounding lead from the
deck to the amp's ground terminal. The fact that is is about proper
bal-unbal wiring is what confuses many people, the concept "ground" does not
apply for the cartridge, it is about hot and return. Ground is in this
context about chassis.

RF


Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[RF]

Mark D. Zacharias wrote:
"RF" wrote in message
news
Richard Crowley wrote:
"Peter Larsen" wrote ...
RF wrote:
I have taken my 1219 Dual out of a closet with the intention of
recording a few hundred 33rpm records.
I skim-read the thread. None said the first advice: get a new cartrige!

Mechanically it works fine but electrically is sems to be dead.
.
On face value the prime suspect is the internal mute switch.
That might be one of the problems. But so far, "RF" does not
have a functional RIAA phono input to even detect whether
the turntable is alive or dead. From my POV, all bets are off
until he gets a fuctional phono preamp input.

A belated Thank You to Peter, Mark, and Richard for your comments.
I have been distracted from this project for a variety of reasons but I
will come back to it
again soon.

About the soldering job I did, there were exactly two wires to be soldered
and
at a place that was fairly easy to reach, once I extracted the unit from
the case and
turned it upside down. I removed one cable and soldered in a new one. Next
I removed
the other and repeated for the second cable. A monkey could have done that
without error.

Back soon hopefully.

RF

There should be four wires, two for each channel, plus a separate ground
wire.

Mark Z.

Ouch! Mark, that 5th one fooled me. I have a copy of the
vinylengine_dual_1219_service.pdf and it
has a schematic of the 5 pin plug that was originally attached to the
tone arm lead. The middle pin of
that plug appears to be grounded. The other 4 pins attach to the two
audio channels. When I replaced
the 5 pin plug and its cable with the two RCA connectors, it seems that
the ground lead was missing.
I did not see a 5th cable coming out of the other end of the old tone
arm lead with the other pair.
The question now is how to compensate for that missing ground.

There are two other ground cables coming from the turntable and they end
in a spade connector,
which attaches to a single screw connection at the back of the amplifier.

I just came across a lead with a 5 pin plug on one end and 4 RCA
connectors on the other. That's 8 wires??
This plug fits a phono socket on an old radio I have and I would like to
experiment with a connection from the
turntable to it, which might spare the amplifier some abuse, until I get
this system running properly. The
turntable worked very well with this radio a few decades back.

Thanks for the help.

RF

[RF]

Peter Larsen wrote:
RF wrote:

There should be four wires, two for each channel, plus a separate
ground wire.

Mark Z.

Ouch! Mark, that 5th one fooled me. I have a copy of the
vinylengine_dual_1219_service.pdf and it
has a schematic of the 5 pin plug that was originally attached to the
tone arm lead. The middle pin of
that plug appears to be grounded. The other 4 pins attach to the two
audio channels. When I replaced
the 5 pin plug and its cable with the two RCA connectors, it seems
that the ground lead was missing.

It wasn't.

I did not see a 5th cable coming out of the other end of the old tone
arm lead with the other pair.

It didn't. It is likely to be a connector on the arm base.

The question now is how to compensate for that missing ground.

Turntable chassis!

There are two other ground cables coming from the turntable and they
end in a spade connector,
which attaches to a single screw connection at the back of the
amplifier.

You need to appreciate that a cartridge outputs a balanced audio signal. So
what you have is L and R hot and L and R return and Ground. Ground and
return should preferably first meet at the amp phono input, but in real life
it also works to connect the ground to the cable shield of the two connector
shield cable that is used with the DIN plug.

I just came across a lead with a 5 pin plug on one end and 4 RCA
connectors on the other. That's 8 wires??

It is DIN tape connector lead, but yes ... you can use it.

This plug fits a phono socket on an old radio I have and I would like
to experiment with a connection from the
turntable to it, which might spare the amplifier some abuse, until I
get this system running properly.

One of the pairs of RCA connectors will work, the other pair will be
unconnected.

The
turntable worked very well with this radio a few decades back.

It is unfortunate that you didn't get an adapter lead back then.

Thanks for the help.

You need to get it back to exactly how it was when it left the factory. I
wish I could give better directions, but I can't without having the actual
grammophone - or its schematic - in front of me. You need to obtain to
connect L and R warm to respective inputs, and to connect L and R return to
ground at those inputs on the amp and to connect the grounding lead from the
deck to the amp's ground terminal. The fact that is is about proper
bal-unbal wiring is what confuses many people, the concept "ground" does not
apply for the cartridge, it is about hot and return. Ground is in this
context about chassis.

RF


Kind regards

Peter Larsen

Thank you very much Peter.

My monkey told me this morning I had made mistakes that he would not
have ;-)

As it is right now, the two RCA leads are connected to two of the 4 leads
that are now connected via the DIN plug to the radio. I ignore those 2
empty leads
and connect a ground wire between the chassis and the ground of the
radio. In addition, the
other two ground leads (they pair with the red and white leads) that
come from the chassis
are also to be attached to the radio's ground?

If this is all, I should be able to try it today.

Thanks again

RF

[Peter Larsen[_2_]]

RF wrote:

As it is right now, the two RCA leads are connected to two of the 4
leads that are now connected via the DIN plug to the radio. I ignore
those 2 empty leads
and connect a ground wire between the chassis and the ground of the
radio. In addition, the
other two ground leads (they pair with the red and white leads) that
come from the chassis
are also to be attached to the radio's ground?

I don't have a 1219 and I don't have a manual, I can't help you more.
Stringent logic well applied should get it operational.

If this is all, I should be able to try it today.

Best of luck with the project.

RF


Kind regards

Peter Larsen