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#1
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Bose vs Cerwin Vega & Bang and Olafsen (sp) speakers
Right now I have a friend who wants to sell his speakers to get some Bose as
they are Tre Gay! Right now he has 2 pair of speakers, one pair of Cerwin Vega CV-SE Series. And the other a pair of Bang and Olafsen (sp?) RL60.2 - Type 6513. Of the two pair that he has which is the better and what do you think he could get for them if he wants to sell them? Also, how good are the Bose compared to these? He thinks the ones he has now are too big for his condo, but I've been there and he does have a large living room, it's just that he's so into style. HELP! Best, Mark Allen Zimmerman * Chicago |
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#2
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MarkZimmerman wrote:
Right now I have a friend who wants to sell his speakers to get some Bose as they are Tre Gay! Right now he has 2 pair of speakers, one pair of Cerwin Vega CV-SE Series. And the other a pair of Bang and Olafsen (sp?) RL60.2 - Type 6513. Of the two pair that he has which is the better and what do you think he could get for them if he wants to sell them? Also, how good are the Bose compared to these? He thinks the ones he has now are too big for his condo, but I've been there and he does have a large living room, it's just that he's so into style. HELP! Best, Mark Allen Zimmerman * Chicago I have not listened to too many Bose's or B&O's. However, based on my limited experience B&O is much better than Bose sound-wise (in fact, I do not think it is fair to compare them), and B&O's have much better styling IMHO. Rakesh |
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#3
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#4
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On 9 Nov 2004 00:51:18 GMT, Rakesh Vidyadharan
wrote: MarkZimmerman wrote: Right now I have a friend who wants to sell his speakers to get some Bose as they are Tre Gay! Right now he has 2 pair of speakers, one pair of Cerwin Vega CV-SE Series. And the other a pair of Bang and Olafsen (sp?) RL60.2 - Type 6513. Of the two pair that he has which is the better and what do you think he could get for them if he wants to sell them? Also, how good are the Bose compared to these? He thinks the ones he has now are too big for his condo, but I've been there and he does have a large living room, it's just that he's so into style. HELP! Best, Mark Allen Zimmerman * Chicago I have not listened to too many Bose's or B&O's. However, based on my limited experience B&O is much better than Bose sound-wise (in fact, I do not think it is fair to compare them), and B&O's have much better styling IMHO. If it is a matter of style, then B&O are quite incomparable, whereas Bose are flashy and trashy. Additionally, B&O make some of the finest hi-fi components around, their 'Dalek' styled Lab 5 speakers being remarkable devices even by the highest of high-end standards. -- Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering |
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#6
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Are you sure you've listened to them? I have and I couldn't again thaey are
that bad. Really, they are BAD. "Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message ... On 9 Nov 2004 00:51:18 GMT, Rakesh Vidyadharan wrote: MarkZimmerman wrote: Right now I have a friend who wants to sell his speakers to get some Bose as they are Tre Gay! Right now he has 2 pair of speakers, one pair of Cerwin Vega CV-SE Series. And the other a pair of Bang and Olafsen (sp?) RL60.2 - Type 6513. Of the two pair that he has which is the better and what do you think he could get for them if he wants to sell them? Also, how good are the Bose compared to these? He thinks the ones he has now are too big for his condo, but I've been there and he does have a large living room, it's just that he's so into style. HELP! Best, Mark Allen Zimmerman * Chicago I have not listened to too many Bose's or B&O's. However, based on my limited experience B&O is much better than Bose sound-wise (in fact, I do not think it is fair to compare them), and B&O's have much better styling IMHO. If it is a matter of style, then B&O are quite incomparable, whereas Bose are flashy and trashy. Additionally, B&O make some of the finest hi-fi components around, their 'Dalek' styled Lab 5 speakers being remarkable devices even by the highest of high-end standards. -- Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering |
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#7
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Nousaine wrote:
Of course, you jest. I've used and measured both of these manufacturers products and the complaints you make about Bose are as well represented by the alternate manufacturer you nominate. Maybe a bit, afterall it is Nousaine (grin), but Compared to a nice pair or KEF or Tannoy (higher-end)speakers, it's no comparison which sounds better. |
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#8
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On 11 Nov 2004 00:37:54 GMT, "John Matheson"
wrote: About B&O Lab 5 speakers: Are you sure you've listened to them? I have and I couldn't again thaey are that bad. Really, they are BAD. To have formed such an opinion, something must have been seriously wrong with the setup. They are among the best five speakers I have *ever* heard, and pretty much a bargain at £10k. -- Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering |
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#9
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#11
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Stewart Pinkerton wrote in message ...
On 11 Nov 2004 00:37:54 GMT, "John Matheson" wrote: About B&O Lab 5 speakers: Are you sure you've listened to them? I have and I couldn't again thaey are that bad. Really, they are BAD. To have formed such an opinion, something must have been seriously wrong with the setup. Or perhaps you two simply have different preferences. No one of us is a reference standard. bob |
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#13
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"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
... On 11 Nov 2004 00:37:54 GMT, "John Matheson" wrote: About B&O Lab 5 speakers: Are you sure you've listened to them? I have and I couldn't again thaey are that bad. Really, they are BAD. To have formed such an opinion, something must have been seriously wrong with the setup. They are among the best five speakers I have *ever* heard, and pretty much a bargain at £10k. And what are the other four? Just to put things in perspective. I might be able to get a like new pair for about half that price or less. Those were traded for MBL 111's which aren't all that great, especially in the bass. Margaret |
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#14
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On 20 Nov 2004 15:47:08 GMT, "Margaret von Busenhalter-Butt"
wrote: "Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message ... On 11 Nov 2004 00:37:54 GMT, "John Matheson" wrote: About B&O Lab 5 speakers: Are you sure you've listened to them? I have and I couldn't again thaey are that bad. Really, they are BAD. To have formed such an opinion, something must have been seriously wrong with the setup. They are among the best five speakers I have *ever* heard, and pretty much a bargain at £10k. And what are the other four? Just to put things in perspective. I might be able to get a like new pair for about half that price or less. Those were traded for MBL 111's which aren't all that great, especially in the bass. JMLab Utopia, B&W N800, Apogee Diva and Avalon Eidolon. Of course, there are lots of excellent speakers I have *not* heard.......... :-) -- Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering |
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#15
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"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
... On 20 Nov 2004 15:47:08 GMT, "Margaret von Busenhalter-Butt" wrote: "Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message ... On 11 Nov 2004 00:37:54 GMT, "John Matheson" wrote: About B&O Lab 5 speakers: Are you sure you've listened to them? I have and I couldn't again thaey are that bad. Really, they are BAD. To have formed such an opinion, something must have been seriously wrong with the setup. They are among the best five speakers I have *ever* heard, and pretty much a bargain at £10k. And what are the other four? Just to put things in perspective. I might be able to get a like new pair for about half that price or less. Those were traded for MBL 111's which aren't all that great, especially in the bass. JMLab Utopia, B&W N800, Apogee Diva and Avalon Eidolon. Of course, there are lots of excellent speakers I have *not* heard.......... :-) That is a formidable group of loudspeakers. It kind of makes me sad Apogee got there so long before the others. Well the Divas are big though. I know a pair driven by a battery of Krell MDA-500's. If you haven't already done so, you should make an effort to hear the Talon Firebirds and Rockport Antares. I'm tempted to include the Avantgarde Trios with the Basshorns too, but I'm hugely partial :-) But I'll definitely try to swing a deal on those used B&O's. I have a weird space in need of great music. Hopefully the Lab 5's DSP and overall design will compensate for the anomalies I get with traditional speakers. I might even get the one-in-all wall-hanging 6 disc source component to drive them... Cheers, Margaret |
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#16
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On 21 Nov 2004 16:05:30 GMT, "Margaret von Busenhalter-Butt"
wrote: I'm tempted to include the Avantgarde Trios with the Basshorns too, but I'm hugely partial :-) I've heard the Duo, very dynamic but poor imaging IMHO. But I'll definitely try to swing a deal on those used B&O's. I have a weird space in need of great music. Hopefully the Lab 5's DSP and overall design will compensate for the anomalies I get with traditional speakers. I might even get the one-in-all wall-hanging 6 disc source component to drive them... Cool piece of kit, isn't it? :-) -- Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering |
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#17
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#18
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Stewart Pinkerton wrote:
On 20 Nov 2004 15:47:08 GMT, "Margaret von Busenhalter-Butt" wrote: "Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message ... They are among the best five speakers I have *ever* heard, and pretty much a bargain at £10k. And what are the other four? Just to put things in perspective. I might be able to get a like new pair for about half that price or less. Those were traded for MBL 111's which aren't all that great, especially in the bass. JMLab Utopia, B&W N800, Apogee Diva and Avalon Eidolon. Of course, there are lots of excellent speakers I have *not* heard.......... The Quad ESL-63/988/989 and Yamaha NS-1000M don't make your top 5? |
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#19
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"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
... On 21 Nov 2004 16:05:30 GMT, "Margaret von Busenhalter-Butt" wrote: I'm tempted to include the Avantgarde Trios with the Basshorns too, but I'm hugely partial :-) I've heard the Duo, very dynamic but poor imaging IMHO. It is definitely the Achilles heel of the line. However, rather good imaging is possible from this design with the following: 1. very large room with 12 foot ceilings (or more) that allows speaker placement away from side and front walls, 5-6 feet, in my experience 2. addition of a good subwoofer, preferably the Avantgarde Subhorns, but Martin-Logan and Talon work well too Given the above placement and the size of the system the room needs to be REALLY large. OTOH the Trios have absolutely no problem filling it with music :-) I don't know what subwoofer has to do with imaging, but in this case it is at least as important as placement. There is a huge difference, IME. Unfortunately most Avantgarde installations I've encountered have not met the prerequisites above and have sounded less than thrilling. Most people appear to think it is a corner horn :-( In fact, based on two show demos, I thought these speakers were a joke until I heard a properly installed pair in Germany. And bought them! But all that said, they are still no Avalon Eidolons when it comes to imaging! But I'll definitely try to swing a deal on those used B&O's. I have a weird space in need of great music. Hopefully the Lab 5's DSP and overall design will compensate for the anomalies I get with traditional speakers. I might even get the one-in-all wall-hanging 6 disc source component to drive them... Cool piece of kit, isn't it? :-) -- Sometimes cool is exactly what the doctor, er, interior decorator ordered! Cheers, Margaret |
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#20
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On 21 Nov 2004 23:28:36 GMT, Tat Chan
wrote: Stewart Pinkerton wrote: On 20 Nov 2004 15:47:08 GMT, "Margaret von Busenhalter-Butt" wrote: "Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message ... They are among the best five speakers I have *ever* heard, and pretty much a bargain at £10k. And what are the other four? Just to put things in perspective. I might be able to get a like new pair for about half that price or less. Those were traded for MBL 111's which aren't all that great, especially in the bass. JMLab Utopia, B&W N800, Apogee Diva and Avalon Eidolon. Of course, there are lots of excellent speakers I have *not* heard.......... The Quad ESL-63/988/989 and Yamaha NS-1000M don't make your top 5? No, and I've owned both of them. While classic speakers in their own right, the ESL-63 has somewhat 'beamy' treble, and can't play at realistic levels (although the 989 is better in this regard), while the Yamaha is superbly dynamic and exciting, but a little ragged at the top end - a sheet of Kleenex over the tweeter is quite effective, but that and some noticeable 'boxiness' are enough to exclude it. Neither of those compare to my current Apogee Duetta Signatures, and the Diva is better than those. -- Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering |
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#21
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Stewart Pinkerton wrote:
On 21 Nov 2004 23:28:36 GMT, Tat Chan wrote: The Quad ESL-63/988/989 and Yamaha NS-1000M don't make your top 5? No, and I've owned both of them. While classic speakers in their own right, the ESL-63 has somewhat 'beamy' treble, and can't play at realistic levels (although the 989 is better in this regard), well, not everyone wants the sound levels of a full blown orchestra in their listening room (neighbours, spouse, etc)! Having said that, my stereo setup is compromised at the moment, as I do not have the space (and resources!) for a separate home theatre and music setup. As such, my music system also serves as the audio equipment for watching DVDs in 2 channel mode. I don't think the Quads would do well as the front channels in a home theatre setup (and it would be sacrilegious, wouldn't it?)  while the Yamaha is superbly dynamic and exciting, Sounds like it will fit well into my current setup. I take it the Yamaha plays rock music well? but a little ragged at the top end - a sheet of Kleenex over the tweeter is quite effective, it doesn't come with speaker grilles? but that and some noticeable 'boxiness' are enough to exclude it. it is after all a box speaker! Neither of those compare to my current Apogee Duetta Signatures, and the Diva is better than those. The Quad ESLs regularly get mentioned in "Hall of Fames" and as bits of "Classic Audio Equipment". I haven't seen much press for Apogee (though they have stopped making speakers). |
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