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is PWM properly analog?



 
 
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  #1  
Old November 22nd 18, 02:28 PM posted to rec.audio.high-end
Justin Mathews
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Default is PWM properly analog?

Firstly -- I discovered this group after looking up a thread about the "Analog Compact Disc" from 1995. Incredibly, there are participats on that thread that appear to be *still* post here.

I too have been bitten by the "better analog" bug, fascinated by Laserdiscs, CED and other potential improvements on vinyl.

I don't hate digital music at all. I work in production, mixing and mastering music and I understand its utility. But as a musician I do notice that something sometimes seems to be lost in A/D.

I'm aware Laserdiscs used some form of pulse width modulation to render analog audio. Is PWM a real continuous signal?

Is it still a fool's errand to hold out for a high resolution analog format? The vinyl resurgence could generate more interest. I know my peers are waiting.

Thanks for reading.
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  #2  
Old November 24th 18, 07:24 PM posted to rec.audio.high-end
[email protected]
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Default is PWM properly analog?

Justin Mathews > wrote:

> Firstly -- I discovered this group after looking up a thread about
> the "Analog Compact Disc" from 1995. Incredibly, there are
> participats on that thread that appear to be *still* post here.
>
> I too have been bitten by the "better analog" bug, fascinated by
> Laserdiscs, CED and other potential improvements on vinyl.
>
> I don't hate digital music at all. I work in production, mixing and
> mastering music and I understand its utility. But as a musician I do
> notice that something sometimes seems to be lost in A/D.
>
> I'm aware Laserdiscs used some form of pulse width modulation to
> render analog audio.


Yes, sometimes, but LaserDiscs got PCM digital audio in 1985.

> Is PWM a real continuous signal?


I think you're mixing up two different things. PWM is analog, but it
is not continuous: these are different things. The trouble with PWM
audio is that it's not an efficient way of storing a high-quality
signal.

> Is it still a fool's errand to hold out for a high resolution analog
> format? The vinyl resurgence could generate more interest. I know my
> peers are waiting.


There are several high-resolution audio formats, but none of them ever
became popular. I doubt that we're going to see any more.

Andrew.
  #3  
Old November 26th 18, 11:17 AM posted to rec.audio.high-end
Justin Mathews
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Posts: 2
Default is PWM properly analog?

On Thursday, November 22, 2018 at 8:28:52 AM UTC-5, Justin Mathews wrote:
> Firstly -- I discovered this group after looking up a thread about the "Analog Compact Disc" from 1995. Incredibly, there are participats on that thread that appear to be *still* post here.
>
> I too have been bitten by the "better analog" bug, fascinated by Laserdiscs, CED and other potential improvements on vinyl.
>
> I don't hate digital music at all. I work in production, mixing and mastering music and I understand its utility. But as a musician I do notice that something sometimes seems to be lost in A/D.
>
> I'm aware Laserdiscs used some form of pulse width modulation to render analog audio. Is PWM a real continuous signal?
>
> Is it still a fool's errand to hold out for a high resolution analog format? The vinyl resurgence could generate more interest. I know my peers are waiting.
>
> Thanks for reading.


Hey, thanks for the answer. I don't fully understand why PWM in audio is considered analog, though. I understand that DSD (for example) uses sigma-delta modulation (a kind of PWM) at an extremely high rate -- the averages between duty cycles create a reconstruction which is indistinguishable from the input. (as seen here? https://www.analogictips.com/pulse-w...odulation-pwm/)

Based on what I'm reading about PWM, it still seems inappropriate to call it "analog." I'm not sure what I'm missing...
  #4  
Old November 27th 18, 10:18 PM posted to rec.audio.high-end
[email protected]
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Posts: 3
Default is PWM properly analog?

Justin Mathews > wrote:

> I don't fully understand why PWM in audio is considered analog,
> though. I understand that DSD (for example) uses sigma-delta
> modulation (a kind of PWM) at an extremely high rate -- the averages
> between duty cycles create a reconstruction which is
> indistinguishable from the input.


That's the idea. 1-bit sigma-delta aka DSD is as far from analog as it
is possible to get.

> (as seen here?
> https://www.analogictips.com/pulse-w...odulation-pwm/)


That's PWM, not DSD. PWM can be digitally or analog modulated. PWM has
been used in electronic control circuits for at least 50 years: no
digital control required.

> Based on what I'm reading about PWM, it still seems inappropriate to
> call it "analog." I'm not sure what I'm missing...


From the dictionary definition,

adjective: analog

relating to or using signals or information represented by a
continuously variable physical quantity such as spatial position,
voltage, etc.

The width of the pulse can be continuously variable in proportion to
the voltage, and in that case it is alalog.

Andrew.
 




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